United front?


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You said something that struck me and I’ve heard this before from a counselor. Sometimes we do things for us. That’s why I do it. And for her, so she can survive.


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Sweet Friend, I get it. In case you don't know my story, I was so afraid Kay would get hurt, be homeless, hate us more than she claimed to and feel unloved that we bought her a house, a mobile home, three older cars, paid rent several times and we even bought her groceries, more than she needed. After she had her son, whom she neglected but would not give up, we did even more.

She destroyed the house, and her husband Lee who was working as a pizza driver gave us not even some money. All we asked for was what he could afford. Nothing. We had to clean the house. They would not try to pay utility bills either (ln our name) and finally we were going broke so we had to sell the house. First we had to fix up their mess. Strike One.

Next we thought maybe a house had been too much for our troubled child so we actually bought them a small mobile home and paid it in cash. We did.not have the extra money we once did so we said they had to pay the small lot fee. It was only $250 month and Lee made enough for that. We paid the utility bills again. They were not bad in a small mobile home. But....Lee and Kay paid nothing. Not a dollar. Plus they started having physical fights and screaming matches outdoors. A lot. Neighbors complained. Next thing we knew, the owner of the property told us was that we had ××× days to move the.mobile home or that he would start calling the police on both of them. Strangely so far police calls about them had mostly ended in warnings only.They had drugs there so either nobody checked or they hid them well. I really don't know, will never know. Pfffft. We told them they had to let us sell the mobile home and they waved their fists at us, threatening us, and left in very angry states of mind.

I still could.not allow my little girl to be homeless. She already always told us that she knew we didnt love her because she was adopted and added that we were not her real parents. While this literally broke me in half, my husband was becoming hardened to her nasty speeches/behavior and wanted to tell her to do it herself...that we would not support her all her life. He wanted to stop anyone flow. Strike two.

Going against my husband's wishes, I paid for a few apartments that she got evicted from for fighting and threatening other tenants. I bought her cars in case she had to live in them. She totaled ALL THREE and got two DUIs. I got her lawyers. Our money, which had once been.plentiful, was disappearing. Literally.

My husband left me for another woman but made it clear that he loved ME but that I would have to stop this with Kay or he would divorce me. It was up to me. It was uncomfortable because we saw each other every day at our business. And it was tense, both of us angry.

My two other kids spoke to me privately. Neither were happy with me. Both cried. They 100% thought Dad was right. Now my kids are level headed and kind and I did not take what they said lightly. Actually husband is a wonderful man too. Who isnt wonderful? Who is mean and even abusive? Kay.

Never once did Kay thank us for all we did which was a lot. Never did she apologize for anything SHE did. It was our fault for taking her to this country where she did not belong. She also told us many other stories about her childhood that had never happened. Abuse, hitting her (we did not spank), how we left her at home as a small.child while we chased the almighty dollar at our business...Kay was not left alone even in her teens. We were afraid of what she would do to the house when she was alone. A relative was always there and my auntie moved in for a while.

Finally, "you sent me away!" We did. On the advice of school staff we sent her to a nice, clean, highly recommended boarding school for troubled teens. She actually did well there but after she came home it was the same as before.

My mother heart was/is huge. I had wanted a big family! Kay was loved as much as the other kids. My other two kids still say she was given most of the attention.

After my husband left and my two other kids spoke to me, I finally saw a bit of the light. I promised to go both to NarAnon and therapy and my beloved husband came back. He had already told his other woman that he only loved me.

The rest is history. My advice is based on my story and we all have a different story.

Kay is not thriving and lives in an old motorhome out West. She sill won't work. Lee still has his pizza job only in a new place. Their son is in permanant custody of.my other daughter as they gave him to her after threats to call CPS and other issues. Kay and Lee both collect SSDI now and with that they get foodshare and Medicare and I believe also Medicaid. They would not try for any benefits as we gave them money. Kay said she isn't a welfare person because we her parents were rich. We were/are not rich by the way. We did.make a good.living from our business but are not Bill Gates like she tells us we are. Also.."my parents are rich?" Unless convenient we were Bob and Sue (not our real names) and not her real parents.

I learned to let go with love in therapy and NarAnon. Our family is at peace. As long as we kept feeding our daughters dysfunction, we had no peace. We were always waiting for the.next crisis that would cost us.. Money doesn't make Kay feel we love her. She.knows we do. Money just makes her feel entitled to more money.

She is doing better now because she.needed to get government services and now she has them. She can apply for a low rent apartment too. I think she doesn't because she knows she won't be able to follow the rules. Including no drugs.

Well, this is our story. It gets easier to share more and more of it the longer she is out NW. Time is a great healer. So is getting help for yourself. It is a.loving to do for yourself. I was afraid to go.. Now I have. Nar Anon meeting every Thursday on Zoom and I love everyone.. it is not a place to complain.. it is a place to be heard and to heal.. if anyone is interested look up Nar Anon Zoom online and you will see times and the numbers to get in.. We have people from the South to Northwest on our Midwestern group.. Doesn't matter where you live. It's Zoom!!! This is.not in my opinion a do it yourself project.

Love and blessings to all.


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Hubs and I are having a somewhat related discussion. I almost always held the line with daughter. Logical consequences and all that. Well into the teens. I was not excessive, but normal things like if she was abusive on the phone …she can’t use the phone for a day. Things like this. I found her exhausting. As she got older, things got much more stressful and consequential. I did my best to think of meaningful , appropriate and logical consequences without them being too harsh. on the other hand, hubby rarely did this. At some point, my autoimmune illnesses flared as well. He , at the very least subconsciously, felt this logical consequences “stuff” was a waste of time in her case AND exhausting. So he often did not do anything of the sorts and of course she ended up thinking he was great snd me the devil. She was calling (no exaggeration ) 15 times a day snd he would not put a boundary on that and occasionally would mess up work related matters. I would tell her stop calling me…you can call after 5. If she called before 5 , I would block her until 5. She would cuss at him and he would barely react. Then five minutes later she would ask for $10 for something and he would send it to her because he was about to go into a meeting and didn’t want to be bothered. I understand why he did some of these things. He is over retirement age and still working. It’s too tiring. In a certain way…he was also afraid of her. Afraid of not only the destruction she would reign upon him, but herself snd maybe others. Maybe he knew her better than I did. A friend suggested to me since I had pulled back significantly from her care, I was in no position to say much. However…her behavior seems to have worsened. And now she is totally and completely abusive. Any Hope of understanding cause snd effect reasoning is gone. He thinks the hope was bordering on zero anyway. And he might be right. As a mom…I would of liked that teeny tiny bit of “hope..”. Ugh. She thinks she can get away with anything. Her mental illness seems to have escalated and she is scary. She texted fir Christmas “I hope your tree burns down.” It’s a nightmare. (We turned the ohone off and had a good Christmas anyway). It’s all understandable. We love our kids and don’t want them to suffer. The meet me halfway situation I’ve described here before might be a good compromise when do-able. But their ability to understand cause snd effect reasoning and boundaries ….ultra important.

Busy…omg. ((((Hugs)))
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Thank you for your stories. At this point I don’t want to stop helping. She’d be on the streets with my two granddaughters. In Colorado! She now is saying she’s going to do online teaching. Maybe, maybe not! We’ll see. Keeping a job is difficult. Right now she works at Walmart and likes it. So it goes! I’m too tired!


100% better than I was but not at 100% yet
Wow what stories. Gosh Busy you have been through the mill! Never knew your whole story!

Men don't think like we do. It's that simple. I am going through something with my family in Chicago - my sister who is estranged from me five years and she is 79. Long story but it was something my husband said when my son was in his hellraising stage and took her pain pills that she left out. Her oldest son has complete liver failure due to drinking - I never knew he was that bad - and he was my playmate as a child. We were very close and he is my favorite nephew and a wonderful person. My sister, a former nurse, is taking pain medications for back etc. and overmedicating, falling etc. I'm beside myself with worry and my husband doesn't "get it" either. Can't understand why I'm so upset since we are estranged. It doesn't take away my love and concern for her!!

Anyway didn't mean to hijack thread but made me think of how annoyed I am with him for not understanding!

Much love and hugs to all. Self-compassion is what we all need more of here!!
Thanks everyone for your replies and expansions on the thread! I think we should have a forum called Venus and Mars or something about partners issues... they can have conduct disorders too lol xx:fightings:
Thanks everyone for your replies and expansions on the thread! I think we should have a forum called Venus and Mars or something about partners issues... they can have conduct disorders too lol xx:fightings:
Not much to report, air has not been fully cleared between us, I haven't replied to son but have felt reasonably detached and unconcerned for him since Christmas Day. I'm in a halfway house between Busy and Mamacat. I won't rescue again, but a little help here and there may keep his head above water/ keep him at arm's length from me, (so that part's for ME)! I am yet to face the big boundary of if he ever wants to return here, which is when I tell him the options are a bedsit in the town or a tent in the woods...
Another point is, he is not adopted, or has addiction issues. Nomad, you mentioned your daughter may be a little bit entitled, but mixed with ADHD and mental illness , addressing this is difficult. I think my son is the same. Except I think he is HUGELY entitled. But he is also VERY similar to my own brother. My brother wet the bed a lot when he was a child. They put it down to the divorce, and trauma from my (possibly) schizophrenic mother. But my son was the same.My brother always blamed others for his troubles. Scowled in all family photos.Made holidays and days out a misery. Most of the family find him a pain in the butt. Same with my son.
Don't know quite what my point is...except some folks are just LIKE that, and there's nothing anyone can do about it! Happy New Year to you all!


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Afraid of not only the destruction she would reign upon him, but herself snd maybe others. Maybe he knew her better than I did. A friend suggested to me since I had pulled back significantly from her care, I was in no position to say much.
Wasn't the person your husband protected, you? Isn't he still doing this, to the extent he can?

I disagree totally with your friend. Like you said a marriage is a sacred trusting partnership in its ideal form, at least. Your husband was picking up the slack for you. This was not a renegotiation or redistribution of power and voice. That's insane, to me. You didn't lose your position to have your say.


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Copa…it was awful. It was in the end, bad advice. She even said I was right and he was wrong. But basically “shut up.” It made me feel degraded. Unprotected. No doubt my son felt like that often as well. I think the therapists didn’t know how to cope with this. Friends..certainly not. It was not in their ability to understand. It’s so far “out there.” Honestly..I don’t know how we survived. I know the negative effectstt are HUGE.We are not the same people. I try to focus on the positives when I can. But…holy xxxx. A HUGE amount of collateral damage.