Update on sober living....

[toughlovin]

Decided it was time for a new thread since I am not so sick at heart at the moment.

So I talked to the sober living place and I feel much better. They told me that because he is coming from detox rather than the treatment program that changes things a bit. Their experience is that people coming straight from detox to their normal sober living did not usually do well. 7 out of 10 relapsed because they were still experiencing a lot of the cravings and were not ready. So they created a different program where for 2 weeks they were in a separate location with intensive meetings etc. This had much better results. Even though my son might drug test clean at this point (spice might not show up) it still would be a good idea. Of course there is an extra cost for this but given what programs cost it is very very reasonably priced.

I feel better about this concept because I am pretty leery of him being ready to go straight to sober living after what just happened. So he was going to call the person at the detox and preesnt this option to my son....he has to be willing and want to do this for us to be willing to pay for it.

TL

 

[DammitJanet]

I have to say I was really wondering how your son was paying for all his detox and rehab stuff. I was not surprised when you found out his insurance ran out. It actually lasted longer than most I have heard about. Of course I dont have a lot of experience with that just what I read on here. It would be nice if there was something available through the county or something to help.

I do think with his history it seems he needs something very intensive and without that he isnt likely to succeed without some very hard work on his part. Question is if he has the gumption to put in the hard work. Guess time will tell. I really hope so.

 

[toughlovin]

I really hope so too.... I have to admit I have my doubts... but I know he is capable of doing it and I also believe a big part of him wants it.... but then there is that other part that stops caring, gets depressed and gets paralyzed and doesn't know what to do except to use. I am hoping that with the added structure he will do better. He does tend to do best when there is structure in place, but at some point he is going to have to stay sober without that.

Yeah we were not surprised the insurance ran out either.... of course it is december but I hope this is it... and gosh thank goodness with the new health care system he can still be on our insurance.

TL

 

[DammitJanet]

yeah true.

 

[Nancy]

TL that's exactly what I said the other day, that even though they go through detox they still have the cravings and need to be in a very protective environment before going to sober living. I am thrilled that this treatment program has taken that into account. He stands a much better chance staying sober with this plan. I am very optimistic.

Nancy

 

[toughlovin]

I don't know if he did enough to have physical cravings.... but I do know that he hasn't yet gotten through whatever led him to do the stuff he did and that is what worried me. The impulse to go find spice or whatever he could get to deal with is feelings is still there strongly. So I agree I am thrilled that this place has an affordable option.... just hope that today he still wants it.

TL

 

[DammitJanet]

I know I keep popping into these threads where I dont know a darned thing but I just enjoy the company...lol. Tell me to get lost if you want to and I will.

I have been watching a lot of the program Lockup lately (boredom) and something just struck me as I was reading through your post TL. In several of the episodes substance abuse is featured strongly...especially in those that are filmed at jails. Many of the inmates have been locked up for well over a year or even longer and they still consider themselves to be addicted to whatever substance they used. They want that substance badly and if let out of jail that day they would go out and use it. These are people who are awaiting trial. They want to ask the judges for rehab treatment because they have been in and out of jail many times.

It seems to me that if simply time could cure addiction then being in jail or prison would certainly do it because they are away from drugs. For the most part. Obviously you have to deal with the mind to get over it or you wouldnt have people who have been in jail for 10 years who want to use again.

 

[klmno]

I think it's a matter of giving up and caving to it or becoming determined to find a better way, life without them....but that requires motivation. Not punishment type of motivation, but something like having a dream or really wanting something better and then having hope and believing that you can do better and 'get there', with appropriate help.

 

[toughlovin]

Yeah I don't think it is time that helps.... otherwise people who are in recovery would not still consider themselves addicts... I know one person who was a very serious drug addict at one point in time. She is still an addict but she is in recovery and has been sober for 4 years. She is inspiring to me because I know recovery is possible but it does take a lot of hard work and determination..... and yeah you have to want it and sometimes the motivation has to come from outside yourself but you have to be willing to do the work. That is what worries me about my son, I think he may still be looking for an easy way out and he is not going to find that. However I hope his fear of ending up on the street with no place to go will be a strong motivator.... and I also know that he really is tired of being miserable and he wants help to figure out how not to be miserable anymore. His way has been to use drugs to cover up and numb the misery and i think he does sincerely want to find a better way.... but I don't know if that want is strong enough.

And Janet as far as i am concerned you are welcome in this discussion.... I like hearing different points of view and input and questions.

TL

 

[Nancy]

I can tell you from my difficult child's perspective it's about learning how to live in her own skin and learning how to live in a sober world. She really really is an alcoholic. She can't just drink one drink or smoke one pot. When she drank she drank a case a night. I know when she told me that and I told people how miuch she drank they said it was impossible. I found out from her rehab that it is very often the case. The first time she drank she drank a ton and threw up. The she threw up every other time she drank. Once she starts she cannot stop and she craves it and will stop at nothing to get it. Her counselor told the group that if there was a half glass of wine on a table the counselor would wonder why it wasn't being drank and would drink it herself if it was left there. She cannot even be in a room with alcohol. That's what I believe my difficult child is like. Years ago when she was 15 and at her friends house she got drunk and her friend told her she didn't know how to stop. This coming from another 15 year old. So even they knew she had a problem.

She has never been comfortable in her own skin. She needs to be drunk of high to feel like she fits in or that people like her. She has to have sober friends and learn how to have fun and live sober. She has a lot of issues that go way back but her genes gave her an addictive personality. Which came first the chicken or the egg. Just because she didn't drink at age 5 didn't mean she wasn't an addict. An addict is an addict is an addict. Just because they haven't used in years doesn't mean they are no longer an addict. It just means that the addiction doesn't control them.

For my difficult child it isn't a matter of having a dream. An active alcoholic/drug addict has to be sober and have a clear head for a good long time before dreams are even a possibility. Otherwise it's just a bunch of talk.

Nancy

 

[toughlovin]

One thing I found really interesting in a conversation I had yesterday with my sons new therapist who is also an addictions counselor and a recovering addict. He said it is only the first step in AA that mentions alcohol or drugs. Addiction is not really about the substance, it is about the faulty thinking. My son is admitting he has addiction issues and I keep focusing on the drug addiction.... but I think my son is right in one way that it is broader than that. He gets obsessive abour relationships too... and that is also an addiction. I think though part of my sons faulty thinking is that he has some control over his drug use and that is faulthy thinking, no question about it....

Anyway I think my son is similar to your difficult child he has trouble living in his own skin... doesn't feel he fits in anywhere and drugs make him feel better, or he thinks they do anyways.

TL

 

[DammitJanet]

That makes a whole lot of sense to me.

 

[toughlovin]

OK my son went to the new sober living place last night. I like this place over the phone. They seem professional, caring and they seem to know what they are doing. I talked to the guy today and my difficult child has settled in and his pee test turned up clean. They sent the more detailed test to the lab and will get the results tonight. If that also turns up clean they they will see.... they may let him move to the regular sober house after a week.... but we have paid for the outpatient intensive program and he will go to that for 6 weeks.... so they are going to see how he is doing in a week... if he is obeying the rules (a big IF) and seems to be doing well they may let him move over. I am leaving it to their discretion.

Then difficult child called me... just to let me know he was there. He said he has no complaints which is always a very good sign with him.

We will be doing grocery money throug a store gift card, and they are taken together in a van to do shopping. We will be giving him no cash.

It sounds like the place gives good leads on jobs and really pushes the residents to get a job so that is good too.

So I am feeling a bit more hopeful today..... cautiously of course.

TL

 

[Nancy]

All positive signs. I have come to realize some sober homes are much better run than others. Sounds like your difficult child is in a good one. I'm glad that he called you. He does want to stay connected and that's good.

Nancy

 

[DammitJanet]

This sounds good. I like that they take them in a van to shop and also that they push them to find a job. I always have found that Cory is much better off when he is doing something productive. As the saying goes...idle hands...