VERY UPSET. Now I'm Trying to Control Her

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by susiestar, Jul 12, 2011.

  1. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    My parents just cancelled seeing us on J's birthday (today). Why? because they have to tell gfgbro not to show up. My mother called and said I am trying to control her household and who she can have over. I don't agree. I just don't want to spend a week of nights wtih my kids having panic attacks and nightmares. Is that so unreasonable? WHat an ogre I am.

    We MUST call before coming over. That has been the rule since I got married and moved out. Even when we lived wtih them while husband was in grad school - at THEIR invitation and idea, NOT our request - we had a few nights a month that we all left and called before we came home. Gfgbro NEVER calls. He just "pops in" if they have company he wants to see.

    ONE time about four years ago I told my mom we would not celebrate holidays with gfgbro - ONLY because SHE TOLD ME it would be the best thing. A month later seh was hysterical and my dad was furious and how dare we not be with the whole family.

    Ever since I first went to college I have had tdocs telling me to cut ties with him totally. I NEVER did it because it would hurt my parents. NOt until last year when he terrified my kids did I do it. EVERY time I spoke about him with a dv counselor they said it was abuse - not letting you get away until he has ranted and raved until he is a bit calmer is abuse. But not to my parents.

    I am DONE WITH THEM. IT HURTS. I WISH THEY CARED AS MUCH ABOUT MY KIDS AS THEY DO MY ALCOHOLIC AHOLE BROTHER! How come WE are not as important as he i? He can do any danm thing he wants, give them the litany of his problems day after day with NO consequences. They are raising his child this year because he married a crazy person and woldn't report HER abuse of his daughter but gave her enough rope to report him even though the reports are spurious.

    NOw gfgbro just tried to call here. The kids hung up on him. I don't give a shoot if he calls. NO ONE in my house will speak to him. IF ANYONE tries to interrogate my kids over this I WILL refuse all access to ALL of them. I have NOT restricted their access to my parents other than making it crystal clear that if gfgbro comes over then they are to leave even if they have to go to the corner store and call for a ride home. Or lock themselves in a bathroom until one of us gets there.

    WHY do they have to choose J's birthday to do this? I would just as soon have handled this ANY other day. I know my mom invited us over to try to do a big family celebration with gfgbro there as a "reconciliation for J's birthday gift" because she thinks this "rift" is hurting my kids. They have been happier this year than any before - fewer nightmates, panic attacks, etc.... Jess at least is opening up about things that gfgbro and his ho of a wife have done. I hope as she opens up and works with me and her therapist she will keep healing. But she is still very angry at gfgbro, as I am, and she is FURIOUS that my mother did this on her birthday. I don't think seh will even speak Occupational Therapist (OT) my momfor a while - and that is HUGELY angry for her.
  2. CrazyinVA

    CrazyinVA Well-Known Member Staff Member

    :( I'm so sorry.
  3. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    Susie - HUGS. Lots of gentle hugs.

    I think you're right to be done with it. I cannot imagine having to live with people TRYING to make you reconcile with him.

    More hugs... LOTS more.
  4. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    The super hard part for me is that she keeps sayign that I am either doing it to hurt her or to get at him. i ignored my pain, discomfort and fury for most of my LIFE no matter what happened. It was only when I saw the toll on my kids that I did ANYTHING at all.
  5. TeDo

    TeDo Guest

    I am so sorry Susie. This is just not right. I had a therapist tell me years ago that you can't help the family you are born in to but you CAN help the family you choose, meaning good friends and the family I created. I hope J continues to heal and that you do as well. It hoovers when our parents "play favorites". My mom has done the same thing. We are no longer speaking and, yes my kids miss seeing her, but she does more emotional damage than emotional boosting. It isn't fair to the kids. {{{{(((HUGS)))}}}} to you and J.

    Happy Birthday J!!!! :bdayparty:
  6. Mattsmom277

    Mattsmom277 Active Member

    I'm also so sorry. This situation never seems to resolve, merely gives periods in between drama created by gfgbro refusing to respect your wishes for no contact. yes your parents should respect your decisions and how simple would it be to just visit separately with gfgbro family and you and your husband and kids? Yet, parents sometimes have this unrealistic belief that they must fix problems between their adult children. I see it so much with mother in law regarding drug addict sister in law. In the end, I would be hurt by your parents too, I can't pretend otherwise. yet what the hades will it take for your brother to back the H off? He KNOWS your stand. He manipulates your parents over and over to get them to try to fix "the rift" and he KNOWS they will fall in line with it beecause they want that so badly themselves for the two of you. And he KNOWS this will drive a wedge with you and your parents and leave you hurting and leave your parents seeing HIM as the reasonable one willing to play "happy families" while painting you as the unreasonable one who supposedly is tainting your children against him etc. He's a sick sick human being because if he truly wasn't a sick person, even if he didn't understand somehow WHY you are DONE with him, he'd realized long ago that you MEAN this and are sticking to it and he'd back the hades off!

    The unmitigated GALL of the man to then CALL your house AGAIN? My feeling? Enough is enough. It is HARASSMENT. Period. Your parents will NOT be in the middle if/when you have a no contact order or restraining order in place as he'll not be allowed near you even at your parents house.

    I know police hate this family stuff. Well tough. This guy is twisted and has zero comprehension that no means no and it does NOT matter that he is "blood" or "kin". He is a grown man and you are a grown woman. You have repeatedly told him to NOT contact you via post or telephone and to NOT trespass on your property. He repeatedly breaches all of the above. it is TIME to march your behind to the police station and tell them it is time for them to INSIST and to ACT with a written warning and one on one conversation on THE RECORD with your brother that he is to CEASE AND DESIST ALL CONTACT. That if he does it again following that warning, he will be charged with harassment and a restraining order will be issued. Period. If this was not your brother but was an ex or a neighbor or a old friend from college or whatever, he would be warned and then prosecuted if necessary. Do not let some hokey cop tell you that because your mother birthed you both that you don't have the same rights regarding protection from him that you have regarding every other human being on earth.

    When it gets back to your parents, tell them THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU AND WE ARE NOT DISCUSSING IT. Period. If they walk away, or if you walk away, this is a combination of your brothers actions and your parents do-good mentality that created this all. Not you or your children.

    I'm very very sorry to hear this isn't stopping, I know how hard you've worked to have a relationship with your parents. This situation however is creating a dynamic that nothing of your relationship with them sounds like its healthy right now anyhow. So maybe it is time to stand firm with the police about your brother and refuse to speak about it to your parents. If that leads to a estrangement with them for a period of time, so be it. Not that it won't hurt, but it certainly can't hurt to finally take a bottom line stand as opposed to continous hurt over and over with their inaction or reactions or steering events in gfgbro's favor. It might not last forever if you end contact with them. One thing I do know though is that this pattern just worsens and that is something that WILL last forever unless and until you take a much firmer stance. Gfgbro should have heard you loud and clear LONG ago and you've done all within your power to make it work for all involved while protecting yourselves from being around him. but it isn't working so its time to take that final step. Even if this means losing contact with your parents, even for a period of time, it has to be better than this ongoing drama from your brother and the pain and upset.

    hang in there but truly please consider taking police action. Dont back down if the police try to play it off as a family spat. it is MUCH more than that. (((hugs))) families can sometimes hoover.
  7. keista

    keista New Member

    (((HUGS))) I've got nothing to say that hasn't been already said, so I'll just offer support and strength in breaking ties.
  8. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    It gets even WORSE!!! When I posted I was told that Wiz was coming to take J and T out for pizza. J just called him at my folks. seems my mother told him that I was not allowing him to take them out so he was just sitting there bummed and upset with me for cancelling on him!!!!


    Jess just asked what was wrong with HER that her Gma would do this?????? I told her it was Gma, NOT HER, but she believes that about as much as she believes the sky is brown. I am in tears because this just keeps hurting my kids. I could handle it if it was just me, not like it, cry some, but it would be this bad if my kdis were not hurting so much too.

    husband wishes he could fix this, but I told him you cannot make crazy into sane except in your own mind/behavior.
  9. Star*

    Star* call 911


    First off hon? HUGS....Now......(exhale) Lots of questions about your family and mostly again WHYS? Well I guess most of us here could sum it up with the fact that your family is very dysfunctional. You've had the answer given to you over and over, choose to ignore it hoping that something changes, it doesn't, it hurts you over and over, upsets you over and over, it's affected your kids over and over, and still there you sit wondering WHY. Doctors have told you for years - break away from your family they are dysfunctional, they are abusive. Your friends HERE, people that have NEVER EVER met you, and ONLY heard your side have told you, let them alone. They are never EVER going to change. They are not going to change because THEY DO NOT WANT TO. When or IF they had wanted to? They would have, and that ship has sailed. No matter HOW good of a girl you are, no matter HOW attentive you are to them, no matter what lottery you win, award you get, how sweet you are, forgiving you ever will be, EVEN IF YOU GO DOWN ON YOUR HANDS AND KNEES in front of your Mom and WERE to forgive (or do her version) of forgive your alcoholic ahole brother? DO YOU NOT KNOW that it would never be enough? Because THEY DO NOT KNOW what it is - that would BE enough. NOT YOUR MOM, CERTAINLY NOT YOUR BROTHER....and if that were to happen? He would so take advantage of that situation. It wouldn't play out in his mind - well sis forgave me, all is well in the family.....NO. He'd find NEW things daily to torment YOU with, and still like a CHILD would run back to your MOTHER and tattle and squeel because he's a sick man, and he's poisoned your Mom's mind and SHE FEELS GUILTY THAT SHE CAN NOT FIX WHATEVER IS WRONG WITH HIM BUT SHE IS STILL TRYING and she has gotten into a cycle of trying to FIX A difficult child and NEVER tough loved him and NEVER DONE DETACHMENT 101 to the point SO LONG, SO MUCH ------that NOW? She's not only loosing her daughter, BUT she's RAISING a SECOND GENERATION that she will ULTIMATELY raise JUST LIKE HIM. Her GRANDDAUGHTER.....

    Look at what she has ALLOWED .......ALLOWED to happen to J and T.....under her OWN nose......nightmares, and seizures, and all the other ABUSE........SHE ALLOWED have GOT to start allowing yourself to say those things- SHE DID NOT protect your childen. SHE ALLOWED these things to happen and when the stuff hit the fan over and over - DID SHE SEND HIM AWAY OR PROTECT HIM? OVER AND OVER? EITHER.........SHE is Crazy - OR You're not telling it straight. I know you. I believe you. I've known you for danged near 11 years. So you're here......trying so hard it breaks my heart to stick up for a crazy person that WILL NOT ABSOLUTELY defend her GRANDCHILDREN. AND YOU CONTINUALLY FORGIVE THAT....and CONTINUALLY WANT a relationship of SOMEKIND with her. WHY IS THAT SO IMPORTANT TO YOU? THE WOMAN IS NOT WORTH YOUR SANITY AND THE SANITY OF YOUR KIDS HONEY! I've NEVER seen such LOYALTY.......LET IT GO. It's like you've got to pick a Susie*....Your Mom who is an enabler, or your kids who need their wonderful Mother to know - that NO MATTER WHAT? Mom has their back. Even if it means telling Grandma that she's got to take a break from her madness for a while cause Grandma can't have it both ways....and even though it breaks Moms heart? It's a done deal. Grandma had her choice and made it plain as the nose on my face - GFGBRO.....HER CHOICE.

    Deal with the pain, move on. Talk to a therapist. Cause it's real pain. Deep pain.....and it HURTS.

    As far as your mom RUINING J's BD? Well - YOU KNOW WHAT????? I'm not sure WHEN exactly I was born.....But I think this would be a cool year for Jess to have a neat thing called a D.O.V.E. birthday.
    Do Over Very Exciting......means Tomorrow.....since today is such a bust..and everyone is so emotional.......Tomorrow is her SURPRISE DOVE party? Her being so lovely like a dove - won't it surprise her to have another cake (small one) and a special gift? We did this with Dude one year and it tickled him to pieces. Don't let her OWN this day------she's already gotten part of it - SO the surprise party tomorrow iwth a surprise cake, and a neat present - promise it will thrill J to death! And heck who doesn't like two cakes? Maybe a special outing too - toes nails? Just you and her?

    I'm so sorry honey ----It's not REALLY that your Mom is picking here. I think she tried to do the best she could, you were stronger - went on, and difficult child bro being weaker? Got a lot more of her attention and never should have. The down side of that is - HE CAN'T funciton and he's a full grown man. That's sad. He has NO CLUE how to be a man, take care of himself, his kids, have a spouse, and home, a job, live without his Mommy fixing everything for him AND the bottle. He got her attention more than he should have. There should have been a lot more there for you and there never was.......that's sad. Very sad, and it hurts you deeply. Everyone and anyone can see that. It would have been nice for her to throw you a bone once in a while or appreciate you for you. He took a lot of your thunder and you never got the recognition that you deserved for being such a wonderful, fantastically gifted, great hearted, loving smart person. Her validation for all your good and great qualities fell very short. ((((Hugs for that)))) Lots of us here see those every day. EVERY day.
    The UPSIDE to the sickness that your MOm perpetuated with your Brother by enmeshing herself with him and not you? Okay - now this is going to seem kinda harsh - and hard....but it's true. Took me years to understand and appreciate it as the oldest and a sibling of an alcoholic....a gifted genius alcolholic but here goes. YOU? You're stronger. YOU have abilities that he will never have, YOU have a spouse, YOU can have a relationship that is wonderful with a husband that while not perfect loves you, and you love. YOU know how to do things. And sister I don't know anyone better and squeeking a nickle than you or I. You're clever, crafty, inventive. YOU MAKE SOAP....YOu make the absolute best cream I've ever tried. You gave birth to three kids that are wonderful. I love them with all my heart. (Oka I dont' know Wiz, but still) YOU are supportive, appreciative, you see things in the world that others don't, you are a beautiful woman, a lovely and kind person, a great friend. GREAT FRIEND. You care, you care so much it made me cry those silly little OH no she did not tears when I got that box with those patches in it. It was like - I've never had anyone care like that and I didn't even say just read, and said - HEy...I mean how did I get so lucky to have such a great person in MY life? I thank God every day for YOU.....So no matter WHAT...there are a LOT of us out here that see - a FUNNY, SUPER, AWESOME, WARRIOR MOM for her kids, that is such a little girl still inside jumping up and down yelling MOM? MOM do you see me? Do you? How about now? SEE ME? Do you see me now? LOOK IT.....See what I did? And I don't know Susie if she ever will...she's sick.....she may never ever get unsick...and that's what you have to get away from. It's not abandoning her -it IS saving yourself and your kids. Because THERE IS SO MUCH GOOD IN YOU..THERE IS SO MUCH GREATNESS IN YOU......SO MUCH LOVE IN YOU......THere is not enough space here ..YOU are a wondrous Soul! ..and if I'm frustrated about how your Mom treats you......I can NOT imagine how much it hurts you and how badly it makes YOU feel - but I DO KNOW ----you have to get away from it or it's going to be your ruin. Because all the gifts that you possess that I mentioned above? One by one over the years? They start to disappear....when you stay around people that chip away at your soul and eventually you feel .....Just. Like. Them.

    Don't let that happen Susie. Be the person that you are gifted to be.....I like the friend I have now. I love her very much. I'm so sorry she's hurting. Sending huge hugs for you. (and tissues)
    Starbie the long winded barbie....but she's just one little person sitting in a chair, here in SC wishing she could be in OK to hug you.
  10. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Susie, you can't control her household, true, but you can control yours. Next time, asked her and your Dad to come to your house. If they want to come fine, if they don't come , fine, but your gfgbro won't be invited. Her house, her terms; your house, your terms. Period. Clear boundary set.
  11. KTMom91

    KTMom91 Well-Known Member

    I'm so sorry, Susie. I like Star's idea of the do-over birthday. Hugs and Happy Birthday to Jess.
  12. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Sending some gentle hugs your way.
  13. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Oh Susie...Im so very sorry. Tell J I said Happy Birthday. Is her birthday today or yesterday? Jamie's was yesterday.

    I so very much liked what Star said. I would like to echo it. She has said much the same to me over various issues relating to family things. It is very hard isnt it?
  14. 1905

    1905 Well-Known Member

    I totally agree with everything Star said...and love the do- over birthday. You MUST save those kids form any more of this. You are DONE. I know how much it hurts. Save yourself and kids. THEY are everything.
  15. HaoZi

    HaoZi Guest

    I'll add my vote to Star's lovely post. That DOVE birthday sounds like wonderful idea, and I hope her DOVE is her best birthday ever. Can you talk to Wiz privately and also make sure he knows to always check with you on these things and NOT just take her word for anything having to do with y'all?
  16. ready2run

    ready2run New Member

    If my mom acted like that i wouldn't allow my kids to even go to her house anymore. i'd let her know that she is welcome to visit them in my home as long as she phones first and doesn't bring gfgbro. i would probably set up an ongoing invitation for 'family day' once a week or something along those lines and then it is up to her to come or not come. then, with it being your house and all i would put a ban on even discussing gfgbro and his issues and make it clear that any pressure to pursue an unwanted relationship with him will not be tolerated and if the kids want to do so they will be free to make that choice once they are grown and on their own. i am not that close to my mom but i don't really like visiting her house because she applies the same rules to me as she did when i was younger and has the same expectations of me now at 30 as she did at 12 or 13, she also expects my kids to behave as we did when we were children which is unrealistic. do what is right for you, don't put yourself in the position to have to deal with it. tell the kids if they want to see gma invite her over.
  17. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful


    I know your focus seems to be on difficult child bro being abusive and dysfunctional. But from my point of view, you're parents are right there with him. When you can let yourself accept that, you'll not have much trouble letting go and setting up your boundaries so they can't hurt you or the kids again.

    Enough with the pain already. You've given it your best warrior mom shot and they just refuse to stop. Your parents mind games are as bad as bro's abusiveness, same thing different format is all. If it were me, I'd be done with the lot of them. Let them have their craziness and wallow in it. I would no longer expose my kids to it either. It's a shame their grandparents are that way but it's not your fault. Better to keep them apart than having grandma messing with their heads making them think it's somehow their fault. When their older and wiser and if grandparents are still around and they want to attempt a relationship, it's their choice. But right now your job is to keep them safe from the craziness and manipulation.

    You do what you need to do for yourself and your kids welfare and stop feeling guilty about it. Bro calls again file harassment charges. Same for your parents. Bro comes onto the property, file trespassing charges. Draw those firm boundaries and do whatever is necessary to keep them in place. No guilt.

    You can't reason with crazy, hon.

    I'm so sorry. I blows out the wazoo. I hope you do decide to do a birthday do over for J. She deserves better.

  18. Star*

    Star* call 911


    I was just thinking about you today. Hope things are at least calm and peaceful for your day. You have a lot to consider in the rest of your life department that isn't going to be easy for you IF you want to establish peace under your roof. My suggestion after thinking on it overnight would be to talk to someone- a therapist or a good pastoral counselor. What I would NOT do is sit on this for a while, or make plans to do a break gradually. In this case? I think the ax has fallen, and the choice was made - you've already drawn your boundaries, set your limits with your Mother regarding difficult child bro, and she continues to cross them time and again. Your reaction if you want peace and not turmoil can only be one thing; sadly that's a complete break.

    Hopefully however once you do that? It will send a message to your Mother and Father ONCE AND FOR ALL that Susie* has had ABSOLUTELY ENOUGH of the BS, and despite her enormous attempts at fixing rifts, mending fences, repairing damage, and trying to keep it together? SHE. IS. DONE. FINI! For once in your life do something ----FOR YOURSELF. And see how it turns out. Otherwise? Continue the madness, and I guess we'll continue to sit idly by and watch it destroy, sadden, and take away bit by bit someone we love. (we won't like it just so you know, and some won't be able to handle it -just so you know) But we'll do our best as always to support and uplift cause it is what we do for each other.

    Hugs & Love

    ps. extra hugs
  19. trinityroyal

    trinityroyal Well-Known Member

    What Star said.

    You've established boundaries -- firm and fair ones. And your parents have shown you repeatedly that they won't respect them. I think the decision has been made, and you're not the one who made it. They did by not adhering to your wishes. They've left you no choice. Your children, your husband and you need to be protected from any further trauma caused by this toxic relationship. I think the time has come to break ties.

    It's now been 6 years since I broke ties with my difficult child-parents and difficult child-brother. Interestingly, although I expected to miss them, to feel the lack of them, I don't. Not at all. Their absence from my life hasn't left a gap at all. My wonderful therapist helped me work through the pain, and now all that's left is a mild sense of indifference. No love, no hatred, no missing, no hurt. Just...nothing. Except infinite relief from the absence of stress and drama that they brought.

    Sending many hugs, lots of support, and birthday wishes for Jess.