Well, Well, Well...
- Thread starter WSM
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- signs of drug abuse
crabby erin
New Member
It's all very sad BUT, sometimes it takes a while for us as parents to come around to the truth, and it seems like husband finally is. I understand his fear about them taking his daughter as well, but they won't. That was my huge fear too, when I had to have my difficult child taken out of the home.
I hope all goes well and he is placed where he needs to be and that you guys will get some peace ( and peace for difficult child too, it can't be easy to be him).
I hope all goes well and he is placed where he needs to be and that you guys will get some peace ( and peace for difficult child too, it can't be easy to be him).
WOW! So much has gone on lately. It seems husband is on the side of reality once again. I really hope and pray that your difficult child gets a good Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and they can help him. Not much else is available that might help him.
Expect your husband to flipflop a few more times between now and when you actually pick up difficult child. If at all possible ride in another car. The risk of difficult child pulling on the steering wheel so that he won't have to go to court is huge. Also the risk of the two of them turning on you, saying it is all your fault, with-o you the neighbor and CPS ladies would ahve no clue, etc....
Make SURE you continue to tell your daughter to tell people - if she is abused again she needs to tell every adult in her life until they believe her. Make sure that she knows that it is OK to call you if you are not home (or you move out cause things go wrong) and to tell you, her teachers, every adult in her life except Daddy. Let her know that if Daddy wants her to keep it a secret then she needs to tell. If it is a fun secret like a birthday present she can keep it, but if it is a big secret about if someone hurt her or touched her in a bad place (anywhere a swimsuit would cover is the rule of thumb I use) then she MUST tell you, her teachers, the principal and/or guidance counselor at her school, etc....
I say this because your husband is a blamer and will be searching for someone to blame for what happens in court. Chances are high it will be you. After he drives you away (or if he sees he is driving you away and changes focus to his daughter) he is going to blame your stepdau. She MUST know how to protect herself and that you love her no matter what daddy says.
I hope you have a fun time in Orlando and then a safe trip home and safety until court on Mon. In court I hope htey send him to an Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and take him away immediately.
Are you planning on going to court? Does husband want you to go?
Is husband still searching for who reported to DHS? He needs to be very careful and tread very lightly. In my state trying to find out who reported you, esp after you admitted to DHS that the report was truthful, can carry heavy penalties. It also holds a lifetime of having any and every report to DHS brought to you with police backing up the social worker. It is NOT a good experience. DHS and the police WANT people to make reports, so anyone who tries to keep a report from being made, or tries to intimidate someone who has made a report is in BIG trouble. It can make difficult child's trouble look mild.
If he finds the person they will report him too. So he should best just stay away from the entire situation.
hugs to you and your kids (including stepdau).
Expect your husband to flipflop a few more times between now and when you actually pick up difficult child. If at all possible ride in another car. The risk of difficult child pulling on the steering wheel so that he won't have to go to court is huge. Also the risk of the two of them turning on you, saying it is all your fault, with-o you the neighbor and CPS ladies would ahve no clue, etc....
Make SURE you continue to tell your daughter to tell people - if she is abused again she needs to tell every adult in her life until they believe her. Make sure that she knows that it is OK to call you if you are not home (or you move out cause things go wrong) and to tell you, her teachers, every adult in her life except Daddy. Let her know that if Daddy wants her to keep it a secret then she needs to tell. If it is a fun secret like a birthday present she can keep it, but if it is a big secret about if someone hurt her or touched her in a bad place (anywhere a swimsuit would cover is the rule of thumb I use) then she MUST tell you, her teachers, the principal and/or guidance counselor at her school, etc....
I say this because your husband is a blamer and will be searching for someone to blame for what happens in court. Chances are high it will be you. After he drives you away (or if he sees he is driving you away and changes focus to his daughter) he is going to blame your stepdau. She MUST know how to protect herself and that you love her no matter what daddy says.
I hope you have a fun time in Orlando and then a safe trip home and safety until court on Mon. In court I hope htey send him to an Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and take him away immediately.
Are you planning on going to court? Does husband want you to go?
Is husband still searching for who reported to DHS? He needs to be very careful and tread very lightly. In my state trying to find out who reported you, esp after you admitted to DHS that the report was truthful, can carry heavy penalties. It also holds a lifetime of having any and every report to DHS brought to you with police backing up the social worker. It is NOT a good experience. DHS and the police WANT people to make reports, so anyone who tries to keep a report from being made, or tries to intimidate someone who has made a report is in BIG trouble. It can make difficult child's trouble look mild.
If he finds the person they will report him too. So he should best just stay away from the entire situation.
hugs to you and your kids (including stepdau).
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crabby erin
New Member
I agree. And a 12 year old is in no position to decide how to handle it anyway. It is what it is, and he has to deal with whatever consequences come his way now. husband is still thinking the ball is in his and difficult child's court and I don't think it is. (Which is GOOD news for you and the rest of the family)
Good luck !
I never worried about difficult child jumping out of the car or grabbing the wheel. difficult child is very passive. He has this blank, emotionless look and will only say, yes, no, i dunno, I didn't do it, ok, that sort of thing. Then when no one is looking he does something crappy.
THe closest he's ever come to being even a little openly aggressive is he recently told his father to shut up. That was pretty surprising, he's just massively passive aggressive.
We picked him up from military boot camp, the director was glowing and couldn't say enough nice things about him. difficult child was bursting with pride. husband said he felt weird, he said: "What do you say? That he's going to court tomorrow for his fourth felony and probably going to be taken by the state and put into a juvvy detention and the best thing we can hope for is he goes to a mental health facility?"
So husband and I smiled and nodded. After we got in the car and drove for a while and then husband said,"You know after you left the fun didn't end for me. We had a visitor after you went to camp, who left this document." And he handed it back for difficult child to read.
difficult child was very quiet. He asked what a delinquent was. We told him.
Then husband handed him the police report. difficult child read it and said that the part about him having drugs in his pocket before was wrong, he didn't get them at school, he got them at home and he launched into an explanation which husband and I cut off: the charges weren't about him 'finding' drugs in his pocket at him, the judge is only going to care about if on that day at camp did he or did he not have five pills in his pocket. difficult child said, "Yes." I said, "And the judge is going to want to know if did you or did you not have a prescription for those pills?" difficult child said "No".
We said the judge can ask any question he wants about anything in your life, but he will only rule on whether you broke the law by taking five pills to the school summer camp on that day and if you had a legal right to possess those pills or not.
difficult child didn't say anything. We explained that difficult child had 3 choices, to say if he was guilty, or not guilty, or no contest which means HE doesn't think he's guilty but he knows there's enough evidence to prove him guilty, so he's not going to fight it.
difficult child looked out the window and tears came down his cheeks. About 15 minutes later he fell asleep. When we got home he went into his room, and a little later confided to husband that I had stolen his 'ranger beads'. So the games start again already.
Also he told husband he didn't want to live here and wouldn't husband send him to the associated military school (which costs 45,000).
THe closest he's ever come to being even a little openly aggressive is he recently told his father to shut up. That was pretty surprising, he's just massively passive aggressive.
We picked him up from military boot camp, the director was glowing and couldn't say enough nice things about him. difficult child was bursting with pride. husband said he felt weird, he said: "What do you say? That he's going to court tomorrow for his fourth felony and probably going to be taken by the state and put into a juvvy detention and the best thing we can hope for is he goes to a mental health facility?"
So husband and I smiled and nodded. After we got in the car and drove for a while and then husband said,"You know after you left the fun didn't end for me. We had a visitor after you went to camp, who left this document." And he handed it back for difficult child to read.
difficult child was very quiet. He asked what a delinquent was. We told him.
Then husband handed him the police report. difficult child read it and said that the part about him having drugs in his pocket before was wrong, he didn't get them at school, he got them at home and he launched into an explanation which husband and I cut off: the charges weren't about him 'finding' drugs in his pocket at him, the judge is only going to care about if on that day at camp did he or did he not have five pills in his pocket. difficult child said, "Yes." I said, "And the judge is going to want to know if did you or did you not have a prescription for those pills?" difficult child said "No".
We said the judge can ask any question he wants about anything in your life, but he will only rule on whether you broke the law by taking five pills to the school summer camp on that day and if you had a legal right to possess those pills or not.
difficult child didn't say anything. We explained that difficult child had 3 choices, to say if he was guilty, or not guilty, or no contest which means HE doesn't think he's guilty but he knows there's enough evidence to prove him guilty, so he's not going to fight it.
difficult child looked out the window and tears came down his cheeks. About 15 minutes later he fell asleep. When we got home he went into his room, and a little later confided to husband that I had stolen his 'ranger beads'. So the games start again already.
Also he told husband he didn't want to live here and wouldn't husband send him to the associated military school (which costs 45,000).
WSM - As the mother of a child with ODD, along with many other behavioral problems, I can certainly sympathize with your plight. However, I have to say, in reading through all of your posts, the thing that stood out for me the most wasn't all the things your husband's difficult child is doing or even the things your husband is doing... it was the seeming lack of unity or family your situation seems to have. It almost seems like an "us" versus "them" or a "me/mine" versus "him/his" situation, which can't be good for anyone involved, especially your husband's difficult child. It seems you've tried various therapy options for your husband's difficult child, but I'm wondering, have you ever tried family counseling? If not, that may be an option for you.
It seems like you have a lot of hostility and resentment built up toward your stepson, something I completely understand. However, it doesn't seem like your husband feels those things towards his difficult child, at least not yet. He can still tolerate his difficult child's behavior, which is why, in my opinion, he is still trying to find ways to get him help in home. You, on the other hand, seem not to be able to tolerate his behavior any longer, which is why, in my opinion, you want him to get help away from home. That is where the difference/problem is, in my opinion. I think that is a wall many of us run into at some point or the other. In fact, it is the one my husband and I are up against now. I think our solution will end up being him leaving for a while to have a much needed break from our difficult child. I don't know... maybe that is what you need from your husband's too.
ETA: Oh, by the way, you mentioned what you would do if *you* were parenting your husband's difficult child in one of your posts. Well, if you've been with him for the last four or five years, I'd say you have been!
It seems like you have a lot of hostility and resentment built up toward your stepson, something I completely understand. However, it doesn't seem like your husband feels those things towards his difficult child, at least not yet. He can still tolerate his difficult child's behavior, which is why, in my opinion, he is still trying to find ways to get him help in home. You, on the other hand, seem not to be able to tolerate his behavior any longer, which is why, in my opinion, you want him to get help away from home. That is where the difference/problem is, in my opinion. I think that is a wall many of us run into at some point or the other. In fact, it is the one my husband and I are up against now. I think our solution will end up being him leaving for a while to have a much needed break from our difficult child. I don't know... maybe that is what you need from your husband's too.
ETA: Oh, by the way, you mentioned what you would do if *you* were parenting your husband's difficult child in one of your posts. Well, if you've been with him for the last four or five years, I'd say you have been!
It sounds like he really is able to snow them at school. Scary is the only word that comes to mind to describe it. I am glad that so far he has not done anything "in your face" aggressive. It also makes me fear even more for stepdau. He clearly acts on his aggression, but only in ways that Dad won't believe. I sets stepdau as the perfect victim.
He didn't waste time in trying to triangulate with husband to cut you out, did he? As to what ranger beads are, I couldn't say. But they are just a tool that he could use to make husband think you are out to get him.
Document, document, document. (Soon we are going to have to call you the Document Lady and write a document song to go with it, aren't we? (KIDDING!)
I hope and pray the judge sends him to a locked Residential Treatment Center (RTC). And that your step daughter can get some help to deal with her dysfunctional family.
He didn't waste time in trying to triangulate with husband to cut you out, did he? As to what ranger beads are, I couldn't say. But they are just a tool that he could use to make husband think you are out to get him.
Document, document, document. (Soon we are going to have to call you the Document Lady and write a document song to go with it, aren't we? (KIDDING!)
I hope and pray the judge sends him to a locked Residential Treatment Center (RTC). And that your step daughter can get some help to deal with her dysfunctional family.
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
You ought to pick up the book "Without Conscience" by Robert Hare. I've read it after we had that experience with our glib, charming little foster child who molested our two other children and killed our dogs. He too had such a winning way about his persona that adults loved him. He fooled even child psychiatrists. Adults thought he was the nicest kid on earth.
in my opinion only, your stepson is a lot like him, although he hasn't gotten into the violent stuff yet and is surface nice to your animal (so was our child. He acted as if he LOVED our dogs, then pretended someone else killed them, although he "found" both). I think you'd probably agree that the nightmare you are living is the type of gaslighting existence you live with a budding psychopath (stepson). As adults, these people lie for a living and fool very intelligent people. They have excuses for everything, even when they are caught red-handed--there are many examples. They make you doubt yourself and sometimes your own sanity. They lack emotions, therefore rarely act out unless it is to their benefit, and then, when they act out, it is not from the gut. They just copy others emotions because they don't really feel emotions. Your description of this child is chilling and could fit the bill. But if so he will fool many people on his path.
Be careful. He is trying to get his father to blame YOU for HIS misdeed. And he's probably very convincing. Plus he has a willing enabler. PLEASE be careful. It wouldn't shock me if he set YOU up and then said, "See? It was her all the time!"
in my opinion only, your stepson is a lot like him, although he hasn't gotten into the violent stuff yet and is surface nice to your animal (so was our child. He acted as if he LOVED our dogs, then pretended someone else killed them, although he "found" both). I think you'd probably agree that the nightmare you are living is the type of gaslighting existence you live with a budding psychopath (stepson). As adults, these people lie for a living and fool very intelligent people. They have excuses for everything, even when they are caught red-handed--there are many examples. They make you doubt yourself and sometimes your own sanity. They lack emotions, therefore rarely act out unless it is to their benefit, and then, when they act out, it is not from the gut. They just copy others emotions because they don't really feel emotions. Your description of this child is chilling and could fit the bill. But if so he will fool many people on his path.
Be careful. He is trying to get his father to blame YOU for HIS misdeed. And he's probably very convincing. Plus he has a willing enabler. PLEASE be careful. It wouldn't shock me if he set YOU up and then said, "See? It was her all the time!"
Yes, I've read Without Conscience, and Kids without Conscience. I have absolutely no doubt that difficult child is a psychopath/sociopath/anti-social PD.
We've had family therapy twice. Both times the therapist has recommended residential treatment for difficult child. Therapy with just difficult child and husband is very different than therapy with me. If it's just difficult child or difficult child and husband a lot of really important imformation gets left out. Once I bring up the left out information the therapy changes dramatically. But this is an unfixable problem and after a while husband decides he's spending money and not getting any results and difficult child complains how much he hates therapy because it makes him feel 'different' from other kids and husband drops therapy. Until the next incident...
We've had family therapy twice. Both times the therapist has recommended residential treatment for difficult child. Therapy with just difficult child and husband is very different than therapy with me. If it's just difficult child or difficult child and husband a lot of really important imformation gets left out. Once I bring up the left out information the therapy changes dramatically. But this is an unfixable problem and after a while husband decides he's spending money and not getting any results and difficult child complains how much he hates therapy because it makes him feel 'different' from other kids and husband drops therapy. Until the next incident...
