What kind of therapy for ADHD/ODD?
- Thread starter TiredSoul
- Start date
smallworld
Moderator
Jules, personally I don't think ODD is a helpful diagnosis so I wouldn't take my child to a therapist for ODD treatment. When the underlying disorder is identified and treated, the oppositional behaviors typically subside.
In terms of ADHD, we found that school-based interventions (accommodations and skills training) plus tutoring in study skills at home were our best use of time and money. As you know, I'm a big fan of Ross Greene's Collaborative Problem Solving model for day-to-day living with a difficult child.
In terms of ADHD, we found that school-based interventions (accommodations and skills training) plus tutoring in study skills at home were our best use of time and money. As you know, I'm a big fan of Ross Greene's Collaborative Problem Solving model for day-to-day living with a difficult child.
TiredSoul
Warrior Mom since 2007
So here's the thing- in order to see this psychiatrist he told us we have to see the therapist in his office. As you know, not too happy with psychiatrist (but he needs medications) and not convinced he will get anything out of the therapist. psychiatrist doesn't think he needs a neuropsychologist evaluation, neither does pediatrician - children's hospital needs referral from doctor. Very limited resources in our immediate area. We are working on all of the things we feel would support him at school. The main concern in my opinion at this time is his behavior. He has several triggers that set him off. We are treating the ADHD, but the ODD is not subsiding - which could mean wrong diagnosis to begin with. I just keep going round and round, spending money we don't have, feeding him stimulants which help but do not touch the aggression part at all. I think he would be better off taking an anger management class for kids than sitting in a stuffy office getting "counseling" - where it is clearly not a kid's environment. The school has been teaching him a social thinking curriculum for a couple years and he does great in the resource room setting, but what I was trying to explain in the IEP meeting is that he does NOT apply what he learns in real life situations. What do I do to change this present situation? Can I just ditch the psychiatrist and therapist? - I should have read what I signed, do I need to meet with them to say so long. If I do that, who manages his medications? His pediatrician won't because we agreed this psychiatrist would. Arggh.
Again, these are his triggers - we need strategies for dealing with his explosions plus somehow he needs to learn to stop exploding.
We are supposed to meet with the therapist today, but I was thinking just I would go and have a talk with her. I want to say I don't think this is the right avenue for difficult child, but I know she will say we have not given it enough time and these things take time. Suggestions?
Again, these are his triggers - we need strategies for dealing with his explosions plus somehow he needs to learn to stop exploding.
- Friend leaving or wanting to play with someone else
- Being told no
- Being told to do something he doesn't want to do
- Being called on his behavior
- Others talking about him
- Sense of things being unfair
- Someone else not following the rules
- Wanting something he can't have
- Boredom
We are supposed to meet with the therapist today, but I was thinking just I would go and have a talk with her. I want to say I don't think this is the right avenue for difficult child, but I know she will say we have not given it enough time and these things take time. Suggestions?
H
HaoZi
Guest
I'm seeing my own kid there, and since we're now eyeballing a possible AS diagnosis, she's approaching it that way. The pattern I keep seeing here is kids going from ADHD/ODD diagnosis, to bi-polar diagnosis, then to autism spectrum diagnosis's or something that presents in a similar manner. Most kids who get help for diagnosis's that work don't tend to have parents that land here. The therapist I would hope is helping to find triggers and help them identify those triggers and stop themselves in time to consider another way to solve the issue. We had no luck with anger management classes, though many people do.
confuzzled
Member
out of curiosity, was your difficult child tested by the school to see how his disabilities effect his education?
if so, you should have some of the testing results already--many neuropsychologist's use them as a part of their evaluation. you should have a report that explains what tests he was given, what the scores and their subscores are and an explanation of the results. if he hasn't been tested by the school, its within your rights to request he be tested. its also within your rights to request an independent evaluation if you disagree with their findings.
take a good hard look at those tests, particularly note if there are wide spreads in scores, or subtest scores that seem off (meaning, if it shows he scores 10 across most of them and has one that shows say, a 4....it would be notable).
its better than nothing, and will give you some starting point to at least ask questions regarding your son's educational needs and come up with useful stratgies to support him. from some of what you've said, i'd guess that ADHD/ODD isnt standing alone either, and that even if he aced the testing he's still need support as a 2E ("twice exceptional"-gifted/adhd) student.
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as for the therapist thing...i know where you are coming from. i myself can take it or leave it--i've seen grown adults accomplish nothing but draining their checkbooks (my bff has been with a therapist for 15! years, and she's literally the exact same as she was before she started)--but the flip side is that lots of people do get something out of it. i also think its flat out wrong for another dr to make his care dependant on another course of treatment, making it a mandatory thing. but thats me.
i too was seriously ready to call it a day, even though the therapist was SO credentialed/SO reccommended/SO the expert in the field. i could see zero point to it, and i saw nothing worthwhile happening with my difficult child...and we gave it a year (so no one could say "it takes time", LOL)
turns out, apparently it wasnt the right fit for my difficult child.
found a new therapist and have accomplished more in three sessions than we did in a year. *MOST IMPORTANTLY* my difficult child TALKS to her, and told me flat out she likes her, likes to talk to her, likes going, etc....you could have knocked me over with a feather :-D. for my difficult child, talking to anyone is 9/10ths of the battle, so thats a small miracle in itself.
now whether we are on a honeymoon high right now or if it will continue, I don't know, but i'm eternally grateful i tried someone else before forgetting the whole thing.
i know its hard when you live in a small town, but it might be worth exploring a new person (if you cant get the current one to listen) before giving up entirely.
if so, you should have some of the testing results already--many neuropsychologist's use them as a part of their evaluation. you should have a report that explains what tests he was given, what the scores and their subscores are and an explanation of the results. if he hasn't been tested by the school, its within your rights to request he be tested. its also within your rights to request an independent evaluation if you disagree with their findings.
take a good hard look at those tests, particularly note if there are wide spreads in scores, or subtest scores that seem off (meaning, if it shows he scores 10 across most of them and has one that shows say, a 4....it would be notable).
its better than nothing, and will give you some starting point to at least ask questions regarding your son's educational needs and come up with useful stratgies to support him. from some of what you've said, i'd guess that ADHD/ODD isnt standing alone either, and that even if he aced the testing he's still need support as a 2E ("twice exceptional"-gifted/adhd) student.
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as for the therapist thing...i know where you are coming from. i myself can take it or leave it--i've seen grown adults accomplish nothing but draining their checkbooks (my bff has been with a therapist for 15! years, and she's literally the exact same as she was before she started)--but the flip side is that lots of people do get something out of it. i also think its flat out wrong for another dr to make his care dependant on another course of treatment, making it a mandatory thing. but thats me.
i too was seriously ready to call it a day, even though the therapist was SO credentialed/SO reccommended/SO the expert in the field. i could see zero point to it, and i saw nothing worthwhile happening with my difficult child...and we gave it a year (so no one could say "it takes time", LOL)
turns out, apparently it wasnt the right fit for my difficult child.
found a new therapist and have accomplished more in three sessions than we did in a year. *MOST IMPORTANTLY* my difficult child TALKS to her, and told me flat out she likes her, likes to talk to her, likes going, etc....you could have knocked me over with a feather :-D. for my difficult child, talking to anyone is 9/10ths of the battle, so thats a small miracle in itself.
now whether we are on a honeymoon high right now or if it will continue, I don't know, but i'm eternally grateful i tried someone else before forgetting the whole thing.
i know its hard when you live in a small town, but it might be worth exploring a new person (if you cant get the current one to listen) before giving up entirely.
We have been in both positions. One where we had a psychiatrist who wanted difficult child to have therapy...we tried play therapy, he could've cared less, plus he was like 5 or 6 at the time and the only time we could go was at 6pm. He was so done for the day. We've been through a few psychiatrists that didn't push it too. We are now in the same situation as you have to see the therapist to get to the psychiatrist. It's bs...The therapist does nothing. difficult child barely talks and its the same script and 20 minutes everytime we go. I have stayed with it as these are local services we got assistance from after difficult child's hospitalization a few years ago and I am also not thrilled with-the psychiatrist, but they are close and take our insurance. Our last psychiatrist was a 40 min ride and $150 out of pocket everytime and I'd have to fight my then insurance to get out-of-network reimbursement. Although we liked him we just couldn't keep doing it.
difficult child has therapy (ind and group) at school so my main thing when we entered here is I didn't want him overloaded with therapy. We see them both on avg every 1-1 1/2 months, but there is no real therapy going on just another co-pay.
difficult child has his bucket of coping skills and seems to use them when prompted at school. Sometime he'll use them at home but not always. I think it's helped a bit, but it definately wasn't learned from the therapist I pay.
As for the neuropsychologist, do you have any pivate practicing ones in your area that accept insurance? That's how we got started. We had our own evaluation done around the age of 4. We have been fortunate that we don't have to fight our SD as they have bent over backwards to assist us, so any testing/evaluations that I have requested have been done at their expense.
difficult child has therapy (ind and group) at school so my main thing when we entered here is I didn't want him overloaded with therapy. We see them both on avg every 1-1 1/2 months, but there is no real therapy going on just another co-pay.
difficult child has his bucket of coping skills and seems to use them when prompted at school. Sometime he'll use them at home but not always. I think it's helped a bit, but it definately wasn't learned from the therapist I pay.
As for the neuropsychologist, do you have any pivate practicing ones in your area that accept insurance? That's how we got started. We had our own evaluation done around the age of 4. We have been fortunate that we don't have to fight our SD as they have bent over backwards to assist us, so any testing/evaluations that I have requested have been done at their expense.
T
TeDo
Guest
Boy, does your difficult child sound like a carbon copy of mine!
Being told no
Being told to do something he doesnt want to do (or thinks he can't do perfectly)
Being called on his behavior (when others who do the same things aren't)
Others talking about him (or he thinks they are)
Sense of things being unfair
Someone else not following the rules (when he hasn't gotten away with it EVER)
Wanting something he cant have (especially something one of his friends has)
Not being listened to when he DOES say what's bothering him
His opinion/interpretation/feelings not being taken into account when something goes wrong
I had to travel over 100 miles for a neuropsychologist that took my insurance and didn't need a referral. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do in the best interest of our dear ones. Our new psychiatrist is 40 miles away but takes our insurance with no "strings" attached. I would shop around soon. Don't discontinue anything until you have something else in place so there is no lapse in medications. Therapy didn't do my difficult child much good. He isn't a talker to anyone but me so it was a waste of time. My difficult child has some serious trust issues. I am seriously questioning my difficult child's ODD diagnosis. I really do feel that his defiance is due to underlying issues that we haven't been able to pinpoint yet. That is why I found another psychiatrist to start over. ODD is clearly a symptom in my difficult child's case. I would get a second opinion no matter where it was but, in my case with being an unemployed single mom, it has to be covered by my insurance. Hope you figure something out soon.
Being told no
Being told to do something he doesnt want to do (or thinks he can't do perfectly)
Being called on his behavior (when others who do the same things aren't)
Others talking about him (or he thinks they are)
Sense of things being unfair
Someone else not following the rules (when he hasn't gotten away with it EVER)
Wanting something he cant have (especially something one of his friends has)
Not being listened to when he DOES say what's bothering him
His opinion/interpretation/feelings not being taken into account when something goes wrong
I had to travel over 100 miles for a neuropsychologist that took my insurance and didn't need a referral. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do in the best interest of our dear ones. Our new psychiatrist is 40 miles away but takes our insurance with no "strings" attached. I would shop around soon. Don't discontinue anything until you have something else in place so there is no lapse in medications. Therapy didn't do my difficult child much good. He isn't a talker to anyone but me so it was a waste of time. My difficult child has some serious trust issues. I am seriously questioning my difficult child's ODD diagnosis. I really do feel that his defiance is due to underlying issues that we haven't been able to pinpoint yet. That is why I found another psychiatrist to start over. ODD is clearly a symptom in my difficult child's case. I would get a second opinion no matter where it was but, in my case with being an unemployed single mom, it has to be covered by my insurance. Hope you figure something out soon.
I dont' know i'm a big fan of biofeedback for anxiety issues and cbt for the rest to retrain those wild little minds of theirs, while the medications in place though. yet small's on target with the odd thing it's a bs diagnosis. spoke to a friend of mine the other day who is a therapist she was like yea when i hear a kid with odd is coming in as a new patient right away i think ok what's really going on with the child, going to take some evaluations and digging
