Why do they do this?

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Cory, Feb 22, 2008.

  1. Cory

    Cory New Member

    I just found, stashed away in S's room, dozens of her medications which she has been hiding. They were Celexas, Seroquels (which she just got taken off of a couple weeks ago), and Tenex's. She claims they were from a long time ago when she went on a medication strike (years ago), but I know that's not so. She says she is taking them now, but we have found her pills around the house--on the floor, on the stairs, etc, within recent weeks. She immediately got into her "f*** you" mode of operation so there was no reasoning with her. I asked her why she wasn't taking them and she said because she hates taking medications. I asked her why she just doesn't tell us that she won't take them and she said because everyone will think she's a screw up, which she is anyhow. I told her if she refuses to take them, she needs to be honest with psychiatrist, herself, and us because there is no point in us spending thousands of dollars on medicine that she refuses to take. She needs to be honest with psychiatrist, because she can't make sound medical decisions based on lies. psychiatrist is moving her up on medications that she's not giving a chance to work. Being on antidepressants erratically, is worse than not being on them at all. She said, good, then she can just kill herself. All this was "discussed" with her in her angry, spiteful, vindictive, shouting mind-set, which comes on like a flip of a switch.

    psychiatrist needs to talk to her about this at their appointment next week. I would rather she go off everything than keep playing these games. She says she is taking her morning medications (ADD medications), and I didn't see any of them in there, so that may be true. She even commented yesterday that going up to 100 mg of Vyvanse (which started Wednesday) is really making a difference. But if she refuses to take the rest, she ought to just say so.

    What's strange is that S asked psychiatrist to put her on Tenex because she wantied something to lessen her tics. Why would she ask for it if she has no intention of taking it? I do not understand how her mind works at all.

    And this is a kid who expects to go away to college next year.
    What do we do about all these constant lies?

  2. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    My BIG concern here is that she is stashing them with the intent of selling them. From what I learned on a thread in Teens and Sub Abuse, even Seroquel is crushed and snorted. And the new type of "party" here is to have one's parents out of town, then put out a bowl and kids put whatever pills they have into them. Then take whatever out, often in a small handful. I know these happened in the late 80's as I went to a couple of parties to learn this was what was going on, then left. My son, now 16, has told me this is going on again. He, his best friend, and his girl friend went to a party where they thought it was just going to be movies and popcorn, and they found this. They left (both his best friend (female) and his girl friend have very clear goals and don't tolerate drugs - yippee for us!!!). I would be wondering if she is planning to sell the medications or take them to this kind of party.

    I can understand not liking how they make her feel. But if she wants grown up priveledges like going away to college, then she needs to be able to communicate with you like a grown up. Maybe, if she just can't verbalize these feelings to you, then she can write a letter about it for you. Or you can have a journal just for her and husband and you. You can each write your opinions, feelings, and requirements, and pass it back and forth. It might increase communication?

    Sorry you have to deal with this, but please don;t let her get away with lying about the medications being from a long time ago.



    ps. You might want to strong point that if any pets ate these pills they might die a horrible and painful death. I don't have info saying they would or would not, but neither does she. So keeping them on the floor is very dangerous to any younger visitors and to any pets.
  3. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    if for whatever reason she is not taking her medications, the responsible adult thing for her to do is to 'fess up and discuss it. She should know that if she has a problem, she should be able to say so. If she fails to say so, and the apparent lack of response to medications is answered by therapist increasing the dose (which of course STILL won't work, if she isn't taking them!) then you're right, money is being wasted and therapist's time (and everyone else's, including S's).

    We use a pill container with pills for each day of the week. Depending on how compliant the kids are, we either make up the containers ourselves or get the kids to do their own, with varying levels of supervision. If the kids do it themselves they are supposed to let me know when supplies are getting low. The older kids are supposed to buy their own (where practical).

    I will check the containers to ensure medications have been taken. The main compliance problems are forgetfulness. We've been through the sneakier "I want to stop taking it to see what happens and I won't tell anyone because then it will be a blinded test" routine.

    I encouraged the kids to tell me if they felt worse or more confused (or whatever) with any medications or a change in dosage. I would then ring the doctor to talk about it and try to negotiate a change. But you can't do that if they don't TELL you.

    If the kids stop taking medications and don't tell you, I equate that as fraudulent and a sign that I will have to take charge of medications and ensure dosage, as if we live in a methadone clinic. "Here is your midday pill - put it in your mouth, swallow - now open your mouth and let me check it has gone." Any move from this back to self-reliance has to be earned. Pill supplies would be locked away in a safe, the key permanently around my neck (even in the shower). It would remove temptation to sell the pills, too. And it also would remove any possibility of your kid being pressured by others to sell her pills - "No way, I can't bring any of my pills to the party, my mother has them locked in a safe. Yeah, A SAFE! And did you know, she even checks my mouth to make sure I've taken them? Honestly, she is obsessive!"

    The main worry you then have, is if she tries to bite you while you check her mouth. In which case, you up the ante - get one of those dental gags to hold her jaws open (or use the handle of a wooden spoon inside her jaw as well, so her teeth can't close on your fingers). And if she won't cooperate - tell the therapist, call the cops, threaten hospitalisation, handcuffs, whatever it takes. And if you threaten, follow through.

    I've never had to do this, but my kids know that I would, in a heartbeat.

    The sane alternative to this is for her to be honest in her communication with you about her medications. If she says, "I don't want to take Tablet Y!" then don't just shove it down her throat, sit with her and talk about it. ANY beginning to open and honest communication is to be welcomed.

    easy child 2/difficult child 2 did this with us, and her ADHD medications. "I don't like taking them, they make me feel 'flat'. I feel much happier, more upbeat, when I skip my medications."
    I made an appointment with the doctor, we talked it through. He noted that I wanted her to stay on the same dose (I felt she needed it) but allowed her to ease back and see how she went. To my surprise, she functioned almost as well (well enough) and also felt a lot better.

    difficult child 1 has to take Zoloft. The doctor wanted him to cut back, so he tried it, but found that at really low doses he became obsessive to dysfunctional degrees. So he knew to come to me and ask me to arrange for an appointment to discuss it. The doctor heard him out and immediately increased his dose again.

    When it comes to screaming matches, easy child 2/difficult child 2 can compete with the best of them. I've learnt to ignore it while she's raging (I'll leave the house if necessary) and talk about it when she's calmer. And when talking about it sets her off, I walk away again. I keep doing this until I say what I need to say, even if it takes a week.
    She also knows I'll report this to the doctor. She is supposed to be intelligent, mature, compassionate, capable. And wants to get married ASAP. Kid, you gotta shape up BIG time!

    Good luck with this one, it really can be nasty. I really hope she's just been hoarding because she's a hoarder and wants to be in control, and not because she was planning to sell them or take them to parties. If you suspect the latter, I would be threatening no college unless she shows maturity and responsibility, and I would also be grounding her as far as possible, as regards parties (or party opportunities).
    Although - if she REALLY is reluctant to take her medications because she doesn't like how they make her feel, or doesn't like the lack of control, it makes it far less likely she is abusing drugs in any form.

  4. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I agree with Marg, any child on medications should be able to come and talk to you about how the medications make her feel, and what the side effects are. Also to ask for changes. I have always supported B (and the others) when they said they had a problem with a medication. I remember paxil making Jess fly higher than a kite. When it wore off she came to me and said she just COULDN'T take it, it was too scary a feeling and it interfered with her schoolwork. I was flabbergasted, she was in 3rd grade!!!

    But all of my kids know they CAN come to me to talk about medication changes. Or go to their grandma (my mom). Sometimes B comes to me, sometimes he goes to my mom. Of course my mom and I take notes of the chat and talk to each other.

    Encourage her to talk to you, but don't let her off the hook for SOME kind of consequence for hidine/hoarding the pills.