Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by amazeofgrace, Jul 13, 2008.
I am very worried, I am having a sad, anxious feeling in my heart.
I don't mean to offend you, but I have to ask why you are trying so hard to arrange time with S2BX and the kids? His relationship with his kids is his responsibility. They left the message. Leave it at that.
I know you are worried, but there is nothing you can do. He is a grown man and is going to do what he is going to do. Worrying about it isn't going to change it.
Has he ever - for one second - been this worried about your or the kids? From what I've read, it doesn't seem like it. Let that be your guide.
you're right, no offense taken, .
I think it's possible that you are not giving your difficult child's enough credit. They know what their dad is about and what type of man he is. Don't force them to call to make arrangements. They all will come to their own conclusions as to who they are to each other, and what their relationship will be. If he starts drinking again and he does something awful, that's on him. But you have to be strong for those kids and show them that whatever it is that he does, you all get to get on with your lives.
I had difficult child's call mother in law's house all last week to try and nail down plans for the weekend with their Dad. This sounds pretty normal. difficult child I finally got her Friday nite and she said she'd have S2BX call difficult child's Sat. morning okay gma thanks and that he'd take them for the day.NOT HER PLACE TO TELL THAT - he may have had other plans - like blowing off his kids for booze.
Sat. came and went with no call, Did you honestly expect one? I even had NO NO NO - difficult child calls once, then no call back? Don't teach him to chase a man who doesn't honor his promises....and by promises I don't mean that your xMIL made plans - what if he was already doing something else and didn't even KNOW about these plans? difficult child's call and leave messages twice. Emailed S2BX last nite, (nah - no more of that - put out your hand - spank spank) stating point blankly the kids were disappointed and apparently you think wasting your time to tell him how anyone but HIM feels is healthy? and that if he thought he'd want them today HE ACTUALLY WOULD BE GIVEN ANOTHER CHANCE? NO WONDER HE THINKS HE CAN WALK ALL OVER YOU AND THE KIDS _ ONE CHANCE _ BLOW THAT NO MORE CALLS< EMAILS.......he should call me asap, b4 we went on with our plans. YOU JUST GO ON WITH YOUR PLANS HE CAN CATCH UP WITH YOU NOT YOU FOLLOWING HIM AROUND ENABLING HIM TO GET ANOTHER CHANCE!!!!! No calls today, (I'd like to find a word that means duh, without being offensive) and I will not have difficult child's leave any more messages,(GOOD) he know's the phone #'s, RIGHT ON!!!!! he is reading my email,(WHY ARE YOU SENDING HIM ANYTHING? so if he is avoiding speaking to me, YA THINK???? NO CALLS NO EMAILS NO PLANS TO SPEND TIME WITH THE BOYS AND GIVE YOU A MUCH NEEDED BREAK????? ARGH....he could just pop me a one liner. I'd like to pop him! I am thinking one of two things: a. his attorney has advised him not to contact me Um......that would have to be in writing. HE DOES HAVE A LEGAL responsibility to his boys and if he were trying for reduced child support you think this man would WANT to show the court he loves to spend time with his boys!or b. he's already fallen off the wagon. Okay - and what if he a. NEVER KNEW about the call - s2bxmil - is a kniving witch - right? So what if she NEVER told him about the calls - and erased the phone messages and then got on his computer and erased his emails from you???
-yeah right. pft......I think I"m going with off the wagon - a shame really but THIS IS WHY YOU ARE NOT WITH HIM - he has /had a BEAUTIFUL WONDERFUL CHANCE GIVING wife - and 2 beautiful boys and he can't get his head out of the bottle long enough to fight for them......WHY do you keep fighting for the opportunity to give him the benefit of the doubt? LET HIM BE - and let him find his sobriety - GO ON with your life. ENJOY your boys while they are young and ENJOY your self why you are still young. Time doesn't wait for anyone......
I am very worried, I am having a sad, anxious feeling in my heart. Pretty normal - so friend says DETACH DETACH DETACH - go print out the detachment 101 pages and read it - but instead of difficult child apply S2BX.
I CARE ABOUT YOU -I HAVE been there done that - we've talked about this haven't we???? Hmmmm.???????
thank you Star, I so wish you were here to hug in person and then you could smack me in person
I haven't read all words of every post, I admit. But based on your starter of the thread- I think you and the boys might be better off if you made your plans and followed through with them accordingly- without S2BX in the picture. There is no need to set yourself or the boys up for any more heartache. If he cared, he would be (and will be) beating down your door. Move on- sorry to be cold about it, but the other threads indicate that you have enough on your plate dealing with these boys and all of you living with your parents. Which, by the way, you would not be dealing with alone if their dad was a big enough man to step up to the plate. So, I suggest not spending any more time trying to accommodate him.
I suggest spending your time dealing with the way your boys are dealing with things, and getting your family on your own feet. I know that sounds cold- I'm sorry and I don't mean it as criticism, but I think some part of you is holding out thinking that their dad will "learn his lesson" and jump right in there- personally, I don't think this is going to happen. I think you need to view yourself as a single parent and gather up all the warrier armour you can find. Be as resourceful as you can and find a place for you and your sons to live on your own.
I would be shocked if S2BX is going to rise to the occassion at this point.
Everything Star said.
Oh, and GET YOUR BUTT BACK TO AL-ANON!!!!!!
What BBK said. What BBK said. What BBK said.
Codependency is SO NOT your color...
Yes. You're mom is 150% correct!
Star pretty much covered it. Go about your plans and do what you must. He's the screw up. If he wants to see his kids and do stuff with them....let him make the plans and let him call. Stop going out of your way to please him and help him. If he calls and you already made plans to do something...too bad. Tell him to call you ahead of time and plan things ahead. He has to give you some notice.
No one likes to hear "listen to your mother". But...
"LISTEN TO YOUR MOTHER!!!"
and if you don't want to do that...
"LISTEN TO EVERYONE ELSE!!!"
His choices are his choices. I really think here (and I'm not saying this to hurt your feelings...if I do, please, please. please know in your heart that my comments are only meant to try and provide a little insight!!!), that you're still in love with him (in your mind). But in reality, you're really in love with the IDEA of him. What could have been, what should have been, what HE COULD HAVE BEEN to himself, you and the boys. But he's not that. He's in a deep dive that is using everyone and everything as an excuse to do what he wants to do. He's narcissistic at best.
Do you really want to chase a dream of what he could be for your boys or do you want them to learn about realities in this life? Chasing a dream like that results in more pain than they deserve. Learning the realities is sort of pulling the Band-Aid off quickly - it hurts for that quick second, but it's over fast. They need to understand that he's an addict and that he's got to take control of his life before he can do the right thing for his boys. It doesn't mean that he doesn't love them, it just means that he's so sick and incapacitated by his addictions or the results of his having been addicted, that he's still not going to be the Dad that they want.
Like BBK said, go back to Al-anon and if there's a chapter in your neighborhood, hitting ala-teen might be a good idea for the boys.
Thinking of you!
My thoughts exactly: That's why you're getting a divorce.
I'm so glad others here, with-experience, are responding.
Okay kid - here's the deal.
EVENTUALLY your older sisters people- will not be there to kick your crumpets. So, we are training and teaching you now. I have about the thickest head ever. I bet I could have at one time pounded 16 penny nails into a board with one whack of my head. That thick. I would ALSO listen to MY MOTHER (and at that time I think I refered to her as QUEEN OF THE KNOW IT ALLS) tell me the EXACT same thing - that I was being to accomodating to "those" people. To this day she refers to them as "those" people. The difference is; today I also refer to them as "those" people. And I stopped being accomodating years ago.
When I sat down and really really thought about my life and what I had done during the times that I kept hanging in there for the sake of my marriage and my brain would say things like "you took vows - sickness and in heaaalllllth." I stayed for those reasons. I stayed because I was honorable. I stayed because I LOVED him. I stayed because I figured that if I EVER EVER left him he would either commit suicide or die from a broken heart. I stayed because I didn't know how to make it on my own with a kid. I stayed because of my son needing a father (some figure there), i stayed because I did NOT want to mark the DIVORCED [ ] box on any paperwork. I stayed because I didn't want myself and my son to have different last names, i stayed because I thought he would see how much I had suffered and change, I stayed because I was afraid of him, I stayed because I didn't like the looks I got from his family (but I got those my whole marriage I was "goody 2 shoes") and I stayed because I figured if I left - God would be mad at me. I stayed because I was stubborn, I stayed because I wanted a marriage not a divorce, I stayed because I didnt' know how to get out. I stayed because I was in fear for my life.
I left because I found out what the religious meaning being in sickness and in health meant in my vows. It does not now nor did it ever cover drug and alcohol addiction with any abuse (verbal, mental, physical). I left because I WAS honorable and in being such I could no longer tolerate the way I was not being honorable treating. I left because I had learned to loathe, despise and hate everything about him. I left because if he was going to commit suicide I didn't want my son to walk in and find him. I left because I figured literally living in a box was better than what I was putting myself and my son through, and I had smarts, I could get a job, I could be frugal. (I know own my own home). I left because my son didn't need a Father like he had to show him how to abuse women, animals his own mother and his wife. I wanted better role models for my son and if NO role model was to be our deal - then it was better than the one he had. I left because after being stabbed and kidnapped and nearly killed for the 10th time - I didn't care about marking the divorced box - it wasn't failure on my part - I'd just mark SINGLE [ ]. I left because at this point I didn't care if my last name was different than my sons - my name was already mudd according to my S2bx - I'd make a name for myself and my son. I left because I had suffered ENOUGH and so had my son. I left because fear no longer ruled my head - I was so afraid I knew I had to try to get away by running or stay and die. At least if I left - I had a chance of staying away and alive. I left because his family knew he was going to try to kill me and instead of stopping him - they took my son the McDonalds play place and a guilty relative stopped the whole mess after that i didn't care WHAT they looked like and amazingly when i did leave they all said "Best thing you could do is to leave - you're doing the right thing." (KISS MY PARTRIDGE IN A PEAR TREE) I left because I made my peace with God through some Christian counselor that wasn't ANTI DIVORCE and actually listened to my horror filled life of 13 years and said GET OUT. He was a pastor. He said it one more time - GET OUT. I left because after being treated like I did - stubborn just didn't make me hang on anymore - smarts won out and I finally looked at myself and said "Dang girl you have a lot to offer -why are you with this looser?" You deserve so much more - even if you go get it ALL yourself. I left because despite wanting to be married - I did NOT HAVE A MARRIAGE - I had a relationship of control, slavery, abuse, mental anguish, physical torture, and complete insanity - not a marriage, a marriage is where two people agree to disagree and love each other, lift each other up, put each other first in all things.....I left because I didn't have ONE of those things. I left because I sought help at a local womens shelter denying ALL THE TIME that I needed their help or assistance - I really wasn't a DV person - I just had a tough marriage - you know - a little slap or broken bone or word. I left because I was in fear of my life. I stayed gone - because I found out that i am WORTH MORE than I got, GAVE more than I received, LOVED more than a woman could possibly love and eventually hated him.
This might seem extreme to your life, and by no means do I want you to compare your life to mine and say "Well gosh Star - MY life wasn't so bad." AMAZE - Your life with STBX IS that bad.
Already - you are starting to see the signs of what is yet to come.
You set up appointments to have him spend time wtih HIS children - and what did he do? Did he honor that? No.
He let his sons down - and will over and over. This is who he is. And I'm not speaking ill of persons who go to rebah or try to beat addiction. But I can not and never will give the "I coudn't even call my sons" excuse validity on the wagon or off. You may forget you have a parking ticket, you may forget your wife's birthday, you may even forget your own birthday - but you don't forget your kids. Rehab didn't change that - rehab wasn't FOR that. Rehab was for him to gain sobriety - not make excuses to his children that he can't see them, call them or return a call. The smallest of manners.
And that part of you that "still" cares and "always" will because he's the father of your sons - ask yourself HOW MUCH of a Father has he been for me to say ALWAYS? How much of himself has he applied to really making a go of repairing his marriage for you to say I still care? You still care - but maybe that is it - YOU care. So ask yourself to write down all the things that he SHOULD do as a husband and has not - and read that list and stay angry every time you want to whimpout and "still care" still worry - because sister i don't see him worrying about you and the boys - nope - you're at your moms (have a place to live) and have food, so you're covered, but that isn't your parents responsibility - THAT WAS HIS, and he failed, and now it's up to you - and you WILL NOT FAIL.
So stay angry - and when you're weak bend over 'cause we got boots! and a hug - Wish I were there for your hug too. I'm squishy. lol.
As all the others have pretty much summed it up. Better than I ever could. I just wanted to add my support and thoughts.
I haven't had a chance to read all of the other replies either, but what I did read, I totally agreed with. Your situation sounds so much like mine when my kids were younger it's not even funny! Only difference is that my ex would have never gone to any kind of rehab because, even though he's half dead from his many years of heavy drinking and has alienated his entire family, he still insists that he doesn't have a problem!
Maybe you (and your kids) are too close to the situation to see it for what it really is. HE should be the one making the effort to see his kids, not the other way around. It's not their place to seek him out and practically beg him to see them! They shouldn't have to do that. They're the kids, he's the parent! It's very obvious that his children aren't very high up on his list of priorities. And this has got to be hurting those kids terribly! Every time you have them try to initiate contact with him and then he doesn't respond, that's another rejection of them by their father! It's very difficult, if not impossible, for kids not to take this rejection personally. If I were you, I would not make even one more attempt at arranging a visit! The ball is clearly in HIS court and if he doesn't initiate something, so be it. They are better off without him.
Quite frankly, I don't understand why you are so anxious for them to spend time with him! He sounds like a horrible influence and will do nothing but hurt them again and again. It wasn't until years later when they were grown and out from under the influence of their father that the stories started coming out about what really happened on their infrequent "visits" with their father. He was drinking (and probably taking pills too) every time - drinking and driving with MY KIDS in the car and they were too intimidated by him to tell me. He gets mean, abusive and mouthy when he drinks. He'd pick fights with total strangers and his teenaged children had to try to get him out of it! My son was 15 when we divorced. He went through so many years of being hurt and disappointed by his dad again and again and thinking that it was his fault somehow, that he just wasn't good enough. Most men would be happy and proud to have a son like him - not my ex! It took many years of growing and maturing and being able to look at it from the viewpoint of an adult, but my son finally knows that it wasn't HIS fault. He knows now that his father is simply incapable of caring about anyone else but himelf and his addictions! But that doesn't take away all the hurt and disappointment he went through as a kid. Better off to just let it be.
AOG-Ditto on what others have said. Hugs.
Don't have the energy to write a lot........but take it from someone who has been there done that. STOP IT!~
My difficult child finally has bio-dads number. After years of me trying to "make it right", difficult child has nailed it. Hmmmm.....Dad, you don't do what you say, then I will remove myself from your life.
Step back, and let your difficult child do what is necessary to make this their relationship. Not yours.
thank you all, I know I am loved, and I am eternally thankful!
AOG- I know this is a difficult time for you. Hang in there- you can work thru it.
I knew someone in AA once- he used to say that when he drank, he was an A****le. Then he sobered up. And when he sobered up, instead of being a drunk A****le, he was a sober A****le.
If your S2BX is following the typical 12 step program, then he will reach a step where he is supposed to make amends, if possible without hurting others. He isn't to that step yet. He might never be.
Just concentrate on yourself and your sons, for your own sake.
Big hugs...and stay strong.
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