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am I doing the right thing.....
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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 436920" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>It's okay, we've disagreed before and will again.</p><p></p><p>I was not saying at any point that this is okay. I think this sort of behaviour is very much NOT okay. But if you want to help the child change his behaviour, sometimes more traditional methods are not the way to go; sometimes the child is behaving tis way because for him, the more traditional discipline methods are actually part of the cause. For some kids. Which is why an evaluation is needed, to try to find out what is going on.</p><p></p><p>Letting a child be abusive without response, is not healthy. But responding to abuse with what the child perceives is an abuse response (and even when we are following parenting 101, to a child with skewed social sense, it can seem abusive to them) is also not the way to go.</p><p></p><p>We had a really rough day yesterday with difficult child 3. I was not the problem, but I was copping verbal abuse. I was not wearing it, I kept making it clear that I was trying to help and did not deserve to be treated badly. difficult child 3 wanted my help and he was not going to get it if he did not show me respect. When he disrespected me, I made it clear I was not accepting it. But I knew I would get nowhere if I tried to send him to his room, or punish in some other way. I got a better result by pushing through and insisting on respect, then demonstrating that when he showed me respect, he got a good result.</p><p></p><p>difficult child 3 has hit me. Not long ago, either. And I made it clear - that is abuse and he is 17, anybody observing could have called the cops and what would difficult child 3 do then? Absolutely no excuse, never ever. I avoided difficult child 3 for the rest of that day and would not talk to him, would not spend fun time with him. He wanted to play a game later - I told him I was still very hurt and he had to make amends. Even if he felt justified in his anger, he was never justified in his violence.</p><p></p><p>A couple of weeks later he verbally threatened me. I said to him, "That is a serious threat and I have every right to call the police. You can apologise to me now, or explain yourself to the police. And it will not look good for you - you are 17 now, far too old to use that approach and get away with it. I am your mother; I forgive a lot more. One day you will say that to someone outside the family and I will not be able to help you. So learn now - no more threats of violence."</p><p></p><p>And there have not been. He has learned that lesson. Even yesterday when he was so very angry (and I understood why) he did not make any threats of physical violence and he did not hit.</p><p></p><p>It took time, but I don't think any other more conservative discipline would have taught that lesson. </p><p></p><p>Please go back and read what I wrote. I was not endorsing ort condoning violence or abuse. But if you recognise where it is coming form, it makes it easier to know HOW to help the child learn a better way to respond. </p><p></p><p>And surely that is the ultimate goal? Punishing in the meantime - what is the purpose? To teach! But for these kids, it anti-teaches. That is what I was trying to say. </p><p></p><p>We HJAVE to teach, but for some kids, that needs a different approach.</p><p></p><p>Which is why we need to know - is this child one such child who needs that different approach?</p><p></p><p>But we never, ever allow ourselves to be treated like dirt - because, according to my own logic, that teaches the child to continue to behave that way and that it is right. And it certainly is not.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 436920, member: 1991"] It's okay, we've disagreed before and will again. I was not saying at any point that this is okay. I think this sort of behaviour is very much NOT okay. But if you want to help the child change his behaviour, sometimes more traditional methods are not the way to go; sometimes the child is behaving tis way because for him, the more traditional discipline methods are actually part of the cause. For some kids. Which is why an evaluation is needed, to try to find out what is going on. Letting a child be abusive without response, is not healthy. But responding to abuse with what the child perceives is an abuse response (and even when we are following parenting 101, to a child with skewed social sense, it can seem abusive to them) is also not the way to go. We had a really rough day yesterday with difficult child 3. I was not the problem, but I was copping verbal abuse. I was not wearing it, I kept making it clear that I was trying to help and did not deserve to be treated badly. difficult child 3 wanted my help and he was not going to get it if he did not show me respect. When he disrespected me, I made it clear I was not accepting it. But I knew I would get nowhere if I tried to send him to his room, or punish in some other way. I got a better result by pushing through and insisting on respect, then demonstrating that when he showed me respect, he got a good result. difficult child 3 has hit me. Not long ago, either. And I made it clear - that is abuse and he is 17, anybody observing could have called the cops and what would difficult child 3 do then? Absolutely no excuse, never ever. I avoided difficult child 3 for the rest of that day and would not talk to him, would not spend fun time with him. He wanted to play a game later - I told him I was still very hurt and he had to make amends. Even if he felt justified in his anger, he was never justified in his violence. A couple of weeks later he verbally threatened me. I said to him, "That is a serious threat and I have every right to call the police. You can apologise to me now, or explain yourself to the police. And it will not look good for you - you are 17 now, far too old to use that approach and get away with it. I am your mother; I forgive a lot more. One day you will say that to someone outside the family and I will not be able to help you. So learn now - no more threats of violence." And there have not been. He has learned that lesson. Even yesterday when he was so very angry (and I understood why) he did not make any threats of physical violence and he did not hit. It took time, but I don't think any other more conservative discipline would have taught that lesson. Please go back and read what I wrote. I was not endorsing ort condoning violence or abuse. But if you recognise where it is coming form, it makes it easier to know HOW to help the child learn a better way to respond. And surely that is the ultimate goal? Punishing in the meantime - what is the purpose? To teach! But for these kids, it anti-teaches. That is what I was trying to say. We HJAVE to teach, but for some kids, that needs a different approach. Which is why we need to know - is this child one such child who needs that different approach? But we never, ever allow ourselves to be treated like dirt - because, according to my own logic, that teaches the child to continue to behave that way and that it is right. And it certainly is not. Marg [/QUOTE]
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