Can MS's

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by klmno, Nov 14, 2008.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    slow down the process of difficult child's voice changing? I noticed that his voice was squeaking and clearly changing to a deeper, more masculine sound early last summer- before mood stabilizers were tried. But now, it's like it never started to change at all. He's on lithobid and depakote er. He's been on this combo for a year or more but has been on MS's since the middle of last summer. Other "parts" of his body appear to be going through the normal maturity processes.
  2. Steely

    Steely Active Member

    Well.........I can only something slowed puberty down for my difficult child. Endocrinologist said "all was normal" - yet he was seriously behind in development, and still is moderately. I have not seen any research to back up my theory.
  3. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    It isn't soemthing I remember hearing parents speak of, but I don't think we really know what all the medications do and don't impact.

    Wiz was not on them long enough for them to impact ANYTHING much, except making his stomach hurt.

    But from memory of parents here and in various classes and support groups in this state and in OH, affecting the voice is not something that stuck in my leaky memory.

    But I did send a few ???'s out to some parents I know who had sons on them for long periods. If I hear anything I will let you know.
  4. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Thank you both! Actually, I typed this up to deter difficult child from reading the other thread I have on General (although this is a question I have been a little concerned about).
  5. fuddleduddledee

    fuddleduddledee New Member

    This is something I've started addressing just recently, possibly a little on the late side. My difficult child is seriously delayed in his normal puberty. So far we have gone to a pediatrician who has a special interest in endocrinology. Much blood work has been done, including a test looking at possible chromosonal syndromes. The blood work came back with something amiss. As well, a bone age x-ray was done which showed delayed bone and somewhat uneven growth, my difficult child is 17 1/2 years old but his bone growth is only at that of a 15 year old, which means he's still got some growing to do (he is six feet tall and wears a men's size twelve shoe and his hands are huge),:holymoly:. The next step is a trip to The Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto to do a puberty test which involves two blood test and an injection of a hormone. After that, I don't know what follows other than some motherly worry :anxious:.

    In retrospect, I think I should have looked into this much sooner but, I didn't know about boys development. I did know that some girls don't menstrate until 18 so I assumed it would be the same for boys. Now, I am questioning if this delay could be related to all these medications he's been on since he was a very young child. He has been on a variety of medications since he was 5, including mood stabilizers, anti-psychotics, and anti-depressants not to mention a couple of short trials of amphetimines. Who knows what these medications can do over the long haul in a developing child. Even saying that, if I had to do it over again, I'd still use the medications.

    My whole point is, if you are wondering, get it checked out, you never know, better to check it out and find nothing than to leave it and it really is something.
  6. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Definitely worth following up.

    I'm a bit rusty on my endocrinology but I do remember that melatonin is connected to puberty onset; it is secreted in the pineal gland as is serotonin (which can also be made elsewhere). A reference I found reminded me that serotonin is metabolised into melatonin. I do remember from my lectures that puberty onset is connected to melatonin which itself is also connected to day-night exposure to light; blind children often experience puberty significantly delayed (statistically significant, not anything really serious - a matter of months at most) but despite not seeing daylight, they still do eventually go through puberty anyway, it's not delayed all that much. So while there is a connection between melatonin production and puberty onset, you can't delay puberty indefinitely; it will eventually 'break out'!

    I did find a paper which showed a link to inhibited growth and serotonin inhibition -

    I also found a link which hinted at a connection between SSRIs and onset of REM sleep disturbances in teens; this could also connect to delayed growth since Growth Hormone is released during REM sleep.

    I could keep digging but I've got a lot of distractions right now.

    What I suggest - ask the doctor. But I doubt there are any serious long-term problems because we already know, in blind children for example, that puberty cannot be indefinitely delayed with reduced melatonin, so I doubt serotonin inhibition is going to have MORE effect; I would think it would have less effect, if any at all.

    It is also possible that more research is needed here. Science already knows most of the answers in broad, the answers would be interesting rather than vital.

    It's amazing how many small gaps in research there can be; something you think would already be known for sure, often doesn't get researched if the answer is considered to be no big deal, medically. It is possible for a total novice to stumble onto an idea and do at least SOME digging, maybe by way of a survey of people on SSRIs and giving them a questionnaire - how long were you on SSRIs? What dosage? What were your physical characteristics (weight, height etc)? When did you start puberty? (You would need to define certain milestones for both genders)

    The more people you survey, the more reliable would be any eventual statistics.

    A more medically-based project would require a longitudinal study which also includes blood tests for various hormonal markers.

    The complicating factor is that our kids are going into puberty much earlier, each generation. And we don't have a good reason why. So you would need to do the study on "normal" people, not taking SSRIs.

    As far as your son is concerned - there could be many reasons for what you observed; the medications may be totally incidental.

    Definitely check it out, but in the meantime - don't worry.

  7. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    Have his thyroid levels been checked recently? Lithium is notorious for messing with thyroid function. Many who take Lithium end up on thyroid medications as well.
  8. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Thanks everyone- difficult child had a blood test 2 weeks ago to check typical levels plus glucose and something else psychiatrist threw in for extra precaution. psychiatrist hasn't called so I assume they were ok- he would have called if there was reason to be alarmed because difficult child doesn't need to go back until Jan. otherwise.

    difficult child's growth is fine (maybe too much growth!), as are the other signs of puberty, like hair growth on legs (a little peach fuzz on his lip), and as difficult child says "he's a man now" so I guess that part went ok, too. LOL!
  9. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    Don't assume all the blood work is fine. Ask to see a copy and then judge for yourself.
  10. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    How? All the results go straight to psychiatrist. I could call and ask them to double-check results. Or, maybe the receptionist would make me a copy, I don;t know.
  11. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    You are entitled to a copy of all your difficult child's blood work results. Ask the receptionist for a copy and then make sure all the results fall within normal limits (the lab will show your difficult child's results as well as the normal range).
  12. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Thank you!!
  13. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    you can ask the psychiatrist's receptionist or nurse, or even contact the lab directly for results. At least I have always been able to. They will have an abbreviation for the name of the test, then your level and then the normal range in parenthesis (at least every lab I have gotten results from shows it this way. Then they highlight or underline anything that is out of the normal range.

    Once you get a copy of his labs, take the time to make a graph for each test. Plot his levels over time (get copies of any old labwork they have done to give you more data) and you will see if the levels of things are rising, lowering or staying the same. With some things the levels can be within normal range but the trend of increase or decreasing levels can indicate things. (This is how my mother discovered a very serious liver disease that would have maybe killed her by now with-o treatment! and her levels were/are NEVER out of the normal range!)

    NOT saying anything will kill your son, but this MAY give you some answers that could help him.