Hung up on difficult child

[AmericanGirl]

difficult child called. I told him I had told counselor that he was pushing me to let him see H (his user friend) who was living with a murderer. difficult child's response was, "You are messing up everything for me here." Sounds like he is trying to fool the counselors.

Told him I would not pay for him to get his license and allow him to use my car if he was going to see people he used with. He threw a fit. Said this friend, H, would die in the streets and I wouldn't care. That H's mother had already said that she wouldn't buy him a casket if he died. So, now it is MY fault H dies if difficult child doesn't go see him for 5 minutes?

Told him he was being disrespectful - to stop or I would hang up. My mistake was saying that twice more before I did hang up.

difficult child may be sober but he's still acting the same. I know it has only been three weeks but I am fearful of putting a car in his hands.

Talked to my Al-anon sponsor. Going to take her advice and try to insist that difficult child not be discharged until they find a placement in a sober house. Going to call them Monday morning and ask they contact sober houses there so I can go see them prior to leaving town that afternoon.

 

[Signorina]

Oh AG-I am sorry this is so much heartache. {{{hugs}}}

 

[Nancy]

I agree that you should push for him to go to a sober house. Please do not let him have access to a car. He is nowhere near ready to be trusted. He is not acting like he is in recovery. You are not responsible for his druggie friend and either is he. If his friend wants help he knows where to get it.

I am worried about you. You cannot allow him to treat you this way. You hold all the cards right now. He Is out if the house and you can refuse to let him back in.

Nancy

 

[Tiredof33]

From my past experience I would doubt that wanting to see his friend for 5 minutes would be a good thing.

Good for you for hanging up - I still remember the counselor that told me people treat us the way we let them!!

Hope your weekend goes better.
(((hugs and blessings for us all)))

 

[Signorina]

Agree with Nancy 100% .

Let me also state that I know nothing about mental health treatment &!get all my rehab info from you guys. That said, I know I've read about dual diagnosis treatment plans/facilities. It sounds to me (from what you've related here) that your difficult child is experiencing ups and downs that could be separate from his addiction...

Maybe that's something to explore while he is still somewhat at your mercy?

Please know I am not suggesting that you aren't doing enough all ready! And I definitely don't think you need any more on your plate!

It's just that I lost any chance I had to get difficult child help - because he moved out when we said we would cut him off. I think if I had known that then (August), I would've explored treatment before we approached him. Hindsight & all.

But really, I support you in ANY choice you make. You are doing your best x 100 with a full heart & I don't know what more you can do. {{hugs}}

 

[Kathy813]

Your difficult child is acting like a dry drunk. That is someone who might be sober but still acts the same way as when they were using. I agree with Nancy. He is nowhere ready to come back into your home and is certainly not someone who is responsible enough to drive your car.

We knew that our difficult child would not be ready to come back into our home after a 30-day rehab. We also knew that we were not ready to have her come back. We pushed her into going into a halfway (sober) house by telling her that should could not come back to live with us. She had nowhere else to go so her only option was the sober house.

If you let him come back now, it will be the same as when he left. in my humble opinion, he is not even close to maintaining sobriety.

{{{Hugs}}}

~Kathy

 

[AmericanGirl]

He is not acting like he is in recovery.

That is exactly what my Al-anon sponsor said!

I agree with all of your opinions.

Nope, no way is he getting a car or cash or anything else from me - except for a check to the Sober House and a ride there. He'd be better off in a homeless shelter than back here with his idiot friend.

Strange but I am grateful he is showing his true side rather than trying to con me. At a distance, I might not catch on.

Sig...I suspected a dual diagnosis from months ago. I asked to insure they could handle that prior to admit. Yes, but we have to get him sober first. (They probably have 40+ psychiatrists on staff in total, including the one who met with difficult child in January and suspects bipolar.) Totally understand the need to wait. I asked the family counselor this week whether he had received a dual diagnosis. He said no. I repeated that his therapist here suspected it. I intend to push that while we meet Monday. I wish they would find something as it would speed things along. Know what I mean??

difficult child is not coming back here. I'm already looking into sober houses here for after partial hospitalization.

 

[DaisyFace]

AG--

That must have been a tough phone call...

Good for you for staying strong!

 

[Nancy]

AG I have been thinking about you. Your difficult child seems to be abusive towards you and his biodad was abusive to you and difficult child. Do you think your son is traveling down the same road? I am a firm believer in the role genetics play in our lives. My difficult child is a good example. She is acting the same way her birthmom did and she has no knowledge of her. The difference between her and my easy child is like night and day.

You cannot allow your son to abuse you. He will abuse any woman he is with in the future unless he learns boundaries now.

I am so sorry you are alone in this.

Hugs,
Nancy

 

[AmericanGirl]

AG I have been thinking about you. Your difficult child seems to be abusive towards you and his biodad was abusive to you and difficult child. Do you think your son is traveling down the same road? Nancy

Yes, I have felt that way for about six months now. I've been drawing firmer and firmer lines in the sand with consequences (thrown him outta my car three times on the street, etc.)

Yesterday I think it was the ugliest it has ever gotten. I've been praying that God will tell me where difficult child needs to go after rehab. I have no clue except not here.

I wonder why he was so great for the first week after detox. It was the old difficult child...the easy child one. Now the other one is back. I wonder of there was nothing to control then so he didn't need to scheme and push...now with release coming, he is back to his old ways.

 

[Signorina]

I wonder why he was so great for the first week after detox. It was the old difficult child...the easy child one. Now the other one is back. I wonder of there was nothing to control then so he didn't need to scheme and push...now with release coming, he is back to his old ways.

My guess would be that he was in contact with his cronies...

just from my own experience with my difficult child. He would be amiable, agreeable, and REASONABLE etc... until he saw or was in contact with his girlfriend or his buddies... then he changed his tune and wanted to call the shots.

Stupid peers, stupid difficult children for being so easily pressured, {{{hugs}}}

 

[AmericanGirl]

Interesting Sig...thank you for sharing.

 

[Calamity Jane]

AG,
Just a possiblilty, but God forbid he is bipolar, that could be why he is acting so miserable. Maybe his dad was BiPolar (BP) also - who knows? Nevertheless, my brother is bipolar, schizoaffective since age 19 (he's 60 now), and he was never abusive to anyone in our family, least of all my mom. He was frustrating as hell, but never vicious. So whether your son is dual diagnosis or not, abuse should never be tolerated, and you're doing a great job organizing boundaries for yourself. I also suspect he's escalating this attitude because he's been in contact with-stupid cronies - it's what they know best, and misery loves company.

 

[wantpeace]

Oh how I can relate! My ex was abusive and toward the end of our marriage he was diagnosed with bipolar. He was also an alcoholic. Now my difficult child is acting the same way he did. You are doing a great job setting boundaries. I haven't been as strong, and I'm so tired of walking on eggshells in my own home. Stay strong!

Hugs,
wantpeace

 

[DammitJanet]

i have been a long firm believer that quite a lot of addicts are duel diagnosed. Not all of course but a good many of them. I would believe the percentage is way up there. I am sure that genetics factors in with whether they can stop when the mental health piece gets addressed properly.

I agree that you dont have to take any rude or aggressive talk from your son. I never took it from mine when he was in jail and he knew I would hang up. One thing you have to be on the lookout for. He will change back and forth. He will either be on his best behavior or he will swing it to threats. Oh he will do whatever you want and he is a changed kid. He will never do that again. All his stupid stuff is in the past and you were right. He has found Jesus and he wants to go to church. He needs a whole new group of friends and he is going to find them in the church youth group. Blah blah blah. If you are asking for therapy or substance abuse counseling, he will promise that and he will even promise something more. Then he will switch over to threatening you about all you better do for him or else he will get him self sent back to jail to punish you. That will make you see how much you missed him because he knows it was hard on you. It really wasnt all that bad for him. Then he will switch back and say how sorry he was. He wasnt in his right mind. He was scared. He was thinking with about how hard it was going to be to be in another controlled setting but he knows you are right. He needs it. He still wants to do everything he told you before. He will never use drugs again...blah blah.

He is manipulating you. I cant tell you how many times i heard those stories. If I had a dollar for every time Cory was going to go back to therapy, go get his GED, follow all my rules, yada yada. I would be a rich woman.

 

[wantpeace]

Janet - All I can say is WOW! You pegged my difficult child - asside from the church groups (haven't gotten that lucky yet). I would like more information about Cory if you don't mind. What is TDD? Was he ever diagnosed with bipolar? You mentioned in a previous post that he is calm and does better when using MJ. That's how my son is. He was an exceptionally easy child from birth to 13. Now it's been nothing but h###! I should probably be posting this somewhere else, but I'm still new at this.

 

[Kathy813]

wantpeace, my difficult child was also a easy child up until the age of 13. Total easy child . . . excellent student, well-behaved, avid tennis player. There have been others on the board with the same story. I believe that the genetic factor kicks in when hormones kick in. I can even tell you when the big changed happened . . . the last quarter of eighth grade. It was all downhill from there.

My difficult child has mental health issues along with substance abuse issues. Which came first? I will never know but I do know that the substance abuse has to stop in order to work on the mental health issues.

However, we do not have to accept being abused because our children have mental health or substance abuse issues. They have to learn that we will not put up with that behavior. It's easier for me since my difficult child is older and we can simply choose not to be around her when she is acting out. AG, I think that announcing that your difficult child is out of line and hanging up the phone is very effective.

We heard from our difficult child many times that we were messing up her life. Even in the halfway house, she would tell me things and then tell me not to tell anyone or she would get hurt. It was all manipulation.

Considering how abusive he still is to you, AG, I really believe that a halfway house is your only solution. I have to warn you though. He is going to fight it tooth and nail and you have to be prepared with option B if he gets kicked out of the halfway house.

I was watching Dr. Drew the other night and someone sent in a question about what to do if their substance abusing son didn't have insurance for a treatement program. His answer was to find a halfway house that usually run "only" about $800 a month and to join Nar-anon and that the people there would have advice about other low cost help that is available.

I kind of chuckled at the "only" $800 a month. How many of us have an extra $800 a month?

~Kathy

 

[AmericanGirl]

Hung up on him again.

He called and was nice at first. Still pushing for hotel. Talked down about sober houses. Said the one nearby had lots of relapses and they made you go to their meetings. Said counselors got kickbacks from the house he talked to last week. Yeah, sure. (They won't take him because he is 18.)

Then he is mad because I told family counselor that he wanted to see his idiot friend, H, who lives with a murderer. Said me doing stuff like that could get him killed.

He was ugly so I told him I was hanging up and he could call me again when he was calm. He called six times in five minutes. I answered on a last call and told him to wait at least an hour and then hung up.

I am even more convinced he MUST go into a sober house. Am concerned that it may be hard to get him admitted at this late date.

I don't know what the rehab will do if I refuse to come get him unless he has a sober house to go into.

Called a local one - 3-6 week waiting period. Thinking that is where he needs to go after partial hospitalization.

Going to pray a whole, whole lot and head over in the morning.

My agenda:

1. Does difficult child have a dual diagnosis?
2. What sober houses in the area will take a 18 year old? Can you call and help to facilitate getting him admitted straight from your facility?

 

[DammitJanet]

Wantspeace....Cory was dxd at 4 with ADHD and ODD. At 13 he was then dxd with bipolar and ADHD. At about 20 or 21 he was dxd bipolar and pesonality disorder not otherwise specified. (not otherwise specified)

About 8 months ago he went to another psychiatrist and that doctor said Cory now was showing very few signs of bipolar but he was over the moon with signs of ADHD. That doctor said he feels that Cory most probably fell into the category of kids that are now going to be labeled as having Temper Dis-regularization Disorder which is in the DSM-V.