Inappropriate behavior at school

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by KateBC, Nov 8, 2008.

  1. KateBC

    KateBC New Member

    I'm new to the site and this is my first post. I have an 11 yr old ADHD boy. The headmaster of his school called yesterday to say a girl in his class reported my son said he wanted to "use his pen to kill himself, but no I have a better idea I'll use it to kill you." Also, as they were talking about solar power and he said, "I wish the sun would explode and kill you all." We have noticed an increase in angry outbursts. He says he "just snapped" more often than I've ever noticed before. This is his first year at a private catholic school (lots of structure and home). He attended public school from grades 1-5. This is not the first time he has made inappropriate statements, but the first time they have been done at this school and in a threatening way to others. He's been to therapy before. One to one or in small groups he knows exactly what to say and how to behave...however out in the real world he can't seem to transfer what he knows into action. We switched him from Medadate to Vyvanse this summer. Has anyone noticed increased anger with Vyvanse? And, any ideas on how I should handle this behavior. We have told him he must write a letter of apology, ask her what he can do to make her feel better. Additionally, since he was inconsiderate to others he will volunteer at a charity of the girls choice for a month doing acts of kindness for others. He has already lost TV and video games do to grades...I felt like to couldn't take anything else away maybe it was time to try something else. I"m looking for any support and guidance you can offer. I'm frightened for my son.
  2. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Welcome! Glad you found us but sorry you needed to, Know what I mean??

    It sounds like your son has had a lot of changes this year. Any of the stimulants can cause an increase in irritability and anger, so the Vyvanse might be part of it.

    Has your son ever been evaluated by a child and adolescent psychiatrist or a neuropsychologist (neuropsychologist is a psychologist with extra training in how the brain works, some here feel they do excellent evaluations)? Who prescribes his vyvanse?

    Others will be along soon, with more help and questions. If possible, can you go to the User CP and make a signature, like at the bottom of my post? It helps us know who's who. No identifying info like full names, phone numbers, etc...)

  3. KateBC

    KateBC New Member

    Thank you for you thoughts. He was evaluated when he was 4 at our local Children's Hospital. He had a full CORE evaluation at the Developmental medication. Dept. and diagnosised with ADHD and some sensory integration issues. Recently was evaluated by school as Gifted & Talented. He's seen many neuropsychs over the years. His primary pedi prescribes his vyvanse. He is will be visting his Nuerologist ASAP. She'll be getting a call on Monday as these rep. significant changes in his behavior.

    What does Know what I mean?, difficult child, easy child, husband? I've seen these abbrev., but have no idea what they mean.
  4. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Welcome! My gut, layman's opinion (I'm no expert and can't really diagnose) is that it sounds like depression. Although I didn't do this when my son started acting this way, knowing what I know now, I'd take him to a therapist for signs of depression and anger. What I did, I took my son to a therapist for "inappropriate and erratic behavior". The difference is in what method of treatment the therapist will give your son/you. I also agree with an evaluation as Susie suggested, but if I had it to do over again, I'd jump to a therapist as I mentioned because my son only got worse- and his behavior became a nightmare as more therapists kept pushing the disciplanry (rewards & consequences) approach.
  5. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Also, you might try reading The Explosive Child by Ross Greene.
  6. Jena

    Jena New Member

    Good morning and welcome!!! :)

    I'm glad you found us!!
  7. Kate, Know what I mean?=know what I mean,difficult child= gift from God, easy child= perfect child, and husband=dear hubby.
  8. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Hi and welcome!
    I'm sorry you are going through this. However, I think perhaps your focus should be on revisiting what may be wrong with your son (yes, I know it's tiring!) rather than on what punishment will change him. I doubt any will change him for the long-term or in a significant way while he is still so unstable.

    in my opinion, whatever NeuroPsychs you've seen were not good ones. This child in my opinion does not sound it's just ADHD. If you would do a signature like I did below, it would help us help you. Also, I have a few questions that will also help.

    1/WEre his neuropsychologist exams private or through schools? How long were the evaluations? Most NeuroPsychs test from 6-10 hours and test on every level.

    2/Are there any mood disorders, bipolar, drug abuse or suicide attempts on either side of the family tree? This to me smacks of a serious mood disorder, and not just depression. According to "The Bipolar Child" by Demitri and Janice Papolous, gory thinking is a common trait of those children with early onset bipolar. And it is commonly mistaken at first for ADHD. I'm not saying he was misdiagnosed and his bipolar, but to me it sounds way extreme for ADHD. If he WAS misdiagnosed, any stimulant can make him violent.

    2/Any early speech delays, motor skills problems, lack of eagerness to cuddle or look people in the eyes, strangeness in the way he used toys? Does he have problems relating normally to his peers (kids his own age?) He could also have some autistic spectrum disorder (although these kids are less apt to threaten to kill other people--they DO hurt themselves sometimes with scratching themselves etc). They are rigid thinkers who can not transition from one activity to another very well. They also get tagged with ADHD rather often. And they can REALLY be helped A LOT! My son is a great example.

    Others will come along with other suggestions. Has he ever seen a regular Psychiatrist?
  9. Andy

    Andy Active Member

    Is the Catholic School by any chance small? How many kids in his classroom? Is he having difficulty fitting in with the kids who may have built bonds from being together for years?

    Last year when my difficult child fell apart, he pretty much lost the full first quarter of school. By the time he returned to school ready to renew relationships, the other boys had already set up the friendships for the year and in his work to try to get back into the group, difficult child ruined his previous relationships with innappropriate behaviors. difficult child felt so left out and angry that he did a lot of name calling and did threaten kids a few times. All out of anger because they purposely left him out of things.

    I think it is really hard for kids in 6th grade to make friends. Almost all kids would rather spend time with those friends they already know than to take a chance of becoming friends with a new person. Kids know that each of them can be mean with new information and you need to give information to make a friend. Why bother making another friend when the one(s) you have are satisfying your social needs already?

    You can ask him and his teacher how he is fitting in. If you find that this is an issue (don't discount any other's inputs - I am just trying to find ways to make life easier - others know more on how to direct you into finding out medical causes), ask the teacher which kids she feels are best chances of being good friends with difficult child. You can then try to find times outside of school for those kids to have individual time with difficult child.
  10. Lothlorien

    Lothlorien Active Member Staff Member

    Welcome to the boards.

    I would redo the evaluations. What may fit as a diagnosis as a young child is not always the same as the child gets older.

    You should also get him back into therapy. Maybe he's saying these things to get a reaction out of the kids; maybe it's more serious. I wouldn't take the chance.
  11. KateBC

    KateBC New Member

    His school is small, but starts at 6th grade so everyone is new this year. He seems to be making friends. He talks positively about several boys and has been playing football with them during free periods. I do think some of this is adjustment to the new school. Lots of new rules for him. No, I don't think he is depressed. He loves affection and seeks it as much as he gives it. He is a twin (has twin sister) they are in school together. They laugh and joke and play together well and often. He has a very good friend who lives across the street and they seem to play well together at our house and at the friend's. I'm a consultant to early education programs and have a background in Sped. I'm positive he isn't on the autistic spectrum or bipolar. He just finished a 10 week social group session with 3 ADHD boys. doctor who ran it had loads of positive things to say about him and his choices in group. Our biggest hurdle seems to be to get him to make the right choices outside of "safe" areas like therapy and home. He can tell you exactly what he should do in situations, but in the situations he can't seem to find the right choice!! How do you teach that? Also, once angry he seems to have a very difficult time calming down. He knows to count to 10, breathe, walk away, use words to say what is bothering him, etc...but again its a 50-50 on choosing the right one. As for the outbursts, they come with the anger. He doesn't stop to think about what he is saying...he just lashes out. It isn't often enough to think its Turrets and its always accompanied by anger. He never says things when he's calm or during play.
  12. jetiduncan

    jetiduncan New Member

    Your child sounds like mine, BUT after years we finally got a diagnosis of Celiac Disease. Celiac disease can cause some neuro issues that are very similar to ADHD with anger outbursts, irritability, moodiness, etc.

    My son has multiple ADHD characteristics but after years of trying to figure it out we have him on naturopathic remedies and he is doing great. We tried a couple of the ADHD drugs and they were a nightmare and we really just don't know long term what they will do to our son so we took the tougher route and went naturopathic.

    Our son is taking ATTEND by Vaxa and it has been successful for him. We have also tried Native Remedies products (Brightspark and Focus) that have worked.

    This past week was the FIRST full week where my son actually had a GREAT full week and he said he feels better. He is only a first grader but has had Celiac his entire life (undiagnosed thanks to uninformed pediatrician, neurologist, etc...)

    We found the Celiac Disease by going through a center that is more holistic in nature. He was further diagnosed by a Pediatric Gastroenterologist who did the full biopsy.

    There is quite a bit of research that backs up the neuro claims of celiac disease kids and there is also a good amt of research out there that shows MANY kids diagnosed with ADHD are Celiac kids.

    We have certainly worked hard, but it has paid off for our son.

    I know how hard it is when your child is struggling in school and you want to help them do well....

    Best to you and yours,