More tests

[Malika]

So, more tests this morning... The education authority doctor, who seemed nice and rather human and realistic in her comments. A small battery of tests - hearing, sight, various general intelligence tests. Everything is "normal". J moved around the room when he didn't have specific tasks to do but nothing too manic or excessive. He seemed pleased to be doing the tests and interacted very helpfully and smilingly with the doctor. Her comments? Yet again, that he concentrates much better than the typical profile of ADHD kids she sees, though he undoubtedly moves more than the norm, that there is no urgency at the moment about getting a diagnosis (no danger of that anyway ) She also commented that he actually moves around less and is more biddable than other hyperactive kids. She agreed very readily that hyperactivity can be caused by things other than ADHD. She gave me the number of a neuro-pediatre - neuro-psychiatrist for children?? - who apparently is the one to see for a second opinion at the hospital, not the paediatrician I saw. So I should have sat tight and waited rather than trying to organise things myself...
J impressed me with his concentration during some of the tasks, which were fairly intricate. I think he has been really well "trained" at school, where they sit and work autonomously without the teacher while she attends to other age groups. He seemed co-operative, friendly, a nice kid. Of course he saves all the awful stuff up for me, I know, but still, it all shows he is not driven by some motor he cannot control at all times but can modify his behaviour when need be. How much of his behaviour is related to anxiety?? A year ago, I'd say he was far more hyperactive in unknown, new situations than he is now and he has made enormous progress at school. At the same time, I see some social difficulties in that his over-intense energy and impulsiveness is off-putting to some kids, and he always wants to be the leader, the main man as it were, finds it hard to retreat quietly into the shadows with his peers and that too makes life difficult for him.
But basically... I can see that if he continues to do okay at school, we could just slip under the radar and he could go his whole childhood and life without having a diagnosis or any medication. Whether this is a good thing or not, I am not sure - arguments on both sides.

 

[TerryJ2]

Hi Malika,
maybe he's not in the office long enough for her to see his true colors. I do agree that he has adapted beautifully. But my son was usually relatively well behaved at dr's offices unless we had a long wait time, and with-ea min that passed, he got more hyper. He only has a set limit for good behavior and then it's gone.
What else did she say can cause ADHD? Anything about dyes or wheat or fats?

 

[InsaneCdn]

There's multiple angles to this, but...
Just on the really off-chance:
caveat: you have NO way to test for this right now, anyway... usually not until 7 or 8.
Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) is something that really looks like ADHD.
AND, kids with Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) do much better in a quiet room, working one-on-one.
Bring on the background noise... and it doesn't go as well.
Bring on MORE background noise, and... overload happens quickly.

Not saying this is "the" answer, just one more factor to consider.
Research "auditory figure ground" for one Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) that would be like this.

 

[Malika]

Well, J is now "good" all day at school and it is me who gets the explosions, etc at home - that story familiar to many here. So I'm not sure what his "true colours" are, really. As for what else might cause hyperactivity, the doctor just mentioned personal circumstances such as the fact that I am divorced (have heard that somewhere before), anxiety - nothing about food allergies, which isn't surprising, really. She seemed to find it plausible when I said that the psychomotricien says J has "mild" ADHD.
Anyway, the way I've come to look at it now, I am more grateful for the problems J doesn't have than upset about the ones he does, if that makes any sense. In other words, one adapts to everything, in time...
IC - just read your post. Yes, could be, who knows? As you say, can't find out yet. Don't know if it means anything at all but since the hearing test he had this morning (different sounds piped into his ears through headphones), he has been complaining that one of his ears hurts... could be something any child would experience.

 

[buddy]

I think you have to take a lot of credit, too, for how much growth he has seen. Seems he had a good match in his teacher/school... which was your choice after all, and you have worked so hard on meeting him where he is and helping him to grow. Nice too that he is human and is maturing as most of us do anyway, haha.

It is great to know there is another place to go if you need to have anything checked out but if he continues to improve in school and at home I could see keeping that in my back pocket in case of a change.

Are you thinking now that you want to stay there (even though it seems some of the locals are not very understanding or maybe a little too judgmental)?

You are doing a nice job with him. Funny, Q still has his issues outside of home but his pattern has been more issues with me and fewer with other people lately. First time I have experienced that. Kind of an adjustment for me, lol.

Proud of J for doing such a good job while he was there. I think your working on the attachment stuff is pretty significant. So, today you get a sticker on your chart!

 

[Malika]

Ah Buddy, village fever... seems the more you stay in a village, the harder it becomes to leaves Some people here are judgemental but... are they any less judgemental anywhere else, I wonder? The thing is that as long as things are going well for J at the village school, knowing that routine and stability are important for him, that the transition would be difficult and that there is no guarantee things would be as good elsewhere... it becomes impossible to justify leaving. If things were to start being less successful at school, I would certainly think again. And then... there are lovely, open people in this village just as there are closed, narrow-minded ones. I do still dream of having my own space, my own garden, being right in the heart of nature rather just on the doorstep of it but... take it day by day, doing the best I can as things are here and now. That's my best self-prescription!
Thanks for the vote of confidence! I mess up regularly, of course, and feel something of a fraud as a good parent but... I keep trying, I s'pose.

 

[BusynMember]

There's multiple angles to this, but...
Just on the really off-chance:
caveat: you have NO way to test for this right now, anyway... usually not until 7 or 8.
Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) is something that really looks like ADHD.
AND, kids with Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) do much better in a quiet room, working one-on-one.
Bring on the background noise... and it doesn't go as well.
Bring on MORE background noise, and... overload happens quickly.

Not saying this is "the" answer, just one more factor to consider.
Research "auditory figure ground" for one Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) that would be like this.

Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) and VPD did not look like ADHD with my daughter so I'd say kids are different and her son may not have either. It seems her son tests in the normal range for school and may have a slight behavioral or impulse control problem. He is not as extreme as many of our kids, even at home. I really have no idea what is wrong with him. Maybe his birthmother or birthfather were energetic and it is hereditary. Now if it gets worse, rather than better, she can look into behavioral issues or even mental illness, but he really seems like he is usually manageable.

Malika herself said very truthfully that what our kids have we often see in other children. I know this is true of me. I have respect for Malika and it seems that J's problems are mostly at home. There ARE kids who are mildly different, but can do ok in life and even improve. He seems to me to be mostly a normal kid with a lot of energy. Since I'm working with mostly four year olds at work (4K) I can tell ya almost all the boys are off-the-charts in the energy department.

All of us, not just me, need to try not to project our own experiences onto other kids. I was very happy Malika brought it up because it is something I think a lot of us are guilty of doing. I certainly plead guilty.

The fact is, there are as lot of "somewhere different kids" who really never get diagnosed and still go on to have good lives. Malika, thank you for the reminder not to see what our child has in every child. I also sure wish I could help you more. I am just wondering if J. is one of those energetic kids (genetically). You should only see how our 4K boys act!!! You would maybe not feel he is so different!

 

[Malika]

Thanks for your generous, open-minded words, MWM. We do of course all see the world through our own filter, to some extent - trick is just to know we are doing that, I suppose.
I really don't want to give the wrong impression with J. I think he's more than just a basically typical kid with excess energy - even if somewhere I would still like that to be all that is going on He is a very explosive child, and he saves the explosions up for me. He does not do so from some malevolent intent, of course. SOME of it is just temperament - he has had from babyhood a very strong-willed, intense, dominating kind of character alongside his undeniable sunny, playful, generous and affectionate side. But what this means in practice is that he is periodically what I could categorise under the label EBD - extremely bloody difficult Argues with everything, has to have everything his own way, will be rude and insulting when thwarted. This behaviour has got better in general over recent months and he is always quick to apologise after his outbursts, which are definitely made worse by hunger and tiredness - but I think it's all beyond what one could call normal. Since at school all this is under wraps and under control and he is trying hard to please his teacher, no professionals are really very interested in this behaviour or in trying to help me with it at present. Unfortunately because of my own "stuff", I am sometimes quite explosive myself in response to his rudeness and defiance, though I too have got generally better with that, as I have related. I too have my periodic lapses, however... partly because he is so good and sweet and helpful some of the time that I then want him to be that way all the time and keep getting sideblinded by the appearance of the difficult child...
He is a puzzle because of how well he performs when he has to - most hyperactive kids simply cannot do this as convincingly, even if they want to, I think. I started out on this forum not wanting a label but seeing his skills deficits; now I don't care about having a label and would certainly accept one, but getting it turns out to be problematic... Meanwhile, the skills deficits are definitely there and I am alone with dealing with them, as many of us are. Up to me to do the research, find what works and what doesn't, in response to parenting a child who is both delightful and deeply challenging.

 

[InsaneCdn]

Up to me to do the research, find what works and what doesn't, in response to parenting a child who is both delightful and deeply challenging.

Malika - I'm guessing you could get 1000 BTDTs from the rest of this board... !
We parents. DO most of the work - and get little credit or even acknowledgement that we have something to say. But if something goes wrong? who gets the blame?

<smile>
We're behind you.

And ahead of you and all around you... keep diggin.

 

[BusynMember]

IC, lol! I think EBD should be in the DSM!!!!! LOLOLOL!

Thanks for making me laugh.

Sometimes I need a reminder not to see the world through my filters and I appreciate hearing it. It does not anger me. If the guy from Mayo Clinic can be wrong, I suppose I can be too...lololol!

 

[Ktllc]

Keep adjusting your own behavior, learn as much as you can about your child because you are right: you are his main teacher. Scarry thought, but that is the reality. And you are probably his best teacher as well.
I completely understand your decision about not moving. Not very polite but I'm sure you've heard about that say "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence... sure it is: there is more sh*t!".
If you feel he needs to make progress in his social skills, you can work on it as well. Play with him and take turn being the leader and the follower. Talk about why one needs to follow sometime. It might not come natural to him, but he can learn without having to give up on his strong personality.

 

[Malika]

Yes, it is a bit scary I am sure I will keep working on my own behaviour and reactions but one of the dilemmas I face with J is how far I see his behaviour as like an illness, something he simply cannot "help" and how far I hold him accountable for it - at the tender age of five. I do need and want him to understand that his rudeness and defiance are unacceptable and sometimes I am too over the top in my own reaction, just making him think he is "naughty" rather than helping him have the skills to behave differently. This is really why these kids are so hard, isn't it? Because they would try the patience of a saint sometimes... When he is clearly tired/hungry, whatever, and has a meltdown, I am now much more able to be patient and understanding with him - when he is obstructive/rude just for the hell of it, as it were (apparently), I still find that REALLY challenging. Work in progress.

 

[buddy]

This is really why these kids are so hard, isn't it? Because they would try the patience of a saint sometimes...

You said a mouthful there!

 

[sathya]

Thanks for sharing your useful informations..