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My 5 Year Old Has Aspergers and ADHD
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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 104321" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>Hi again, Kate - </p><p></p><p>You said, "She has no problem AT ALL with eye conduct but socially she shows lack of empathy..." this sounds a lot like difficult child 3. Despite a diagnosis of autism (he scores moderate, too, further down from mild) he actually makes good eye contact even with strangers. Not always, but often enough to be confusing to people. Plus, he's always been very outgoing, will divulge intimate family secrets to total strangers. Has no concept of stranger danger, because once someone knows his name (and all they have to do is ask him) then they are no longer strangers!</p><p></p><p>The lack of empathy - it takes time. And it is stemming from her lack of theory of mind. difficult child 3 is acquiring theory of mind, he passes the tests now mostly. They DO get there. But for her still (she IS only 5!) she can't understand that her own thoughts aren't an open book for everyone, and can't see that anybody else feels any different to her. A strong suggestion - do not leave her alone in play, and try to organise play so with friends, it is structured. Unstructured, unsupervised play is where problems arise. Maybe next time have a cooking session with all the girls in the kitchen? Then sit down together to watch a movie, eating what they cooked.</p><p></p><p>To learn empathy (and other social skills) - everybody has to learn this but most kids pick it up by osmosis. Just being around others, it rubs off. But not with Aspies and Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) kids, they need to be taught social skills in the same way you would teach geography. Social stories are a good way at this age. I used photo albums, or you can get from the supermarket those presentation folders, then put something together on the computer with text and photos, then print it off. As the stories change, you change the pages in the folder.</p><p></p><p>Getting her to see some sort of facial expression as a cue to "That's a joke, Joyce" is very good technique (knowing you're an Aussie means I can use that reference and know you understand!).</p><p></p><p>You have a lot of work ahead of you but you're off to a good start.</p><p></p><p>Basket A - keep it VERY limited, the book makes it clear that Basket A should only contain immediate safety (such as grabbing her if she's about to run onto the road in front of a truck) and school attendance. </p><p></p><p>You also said, in reference to her oral fixation, that "she should have grown out of that by now." </p><p>You need to learn to not use that phrase. "By now" is not applicable with autism and Asperger's. They will adapt when they're darn well good and ready, you can't force it at all.</p><p></p><p>The mimicry - yep, a big part of it. A great talent to be able to use, and one she is using more than perhaps you realise. </p><p></p><p>If you want to have a look for yourself at aspects of Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) (Pervasive Developmental Disorder; an umbrella label which includes Asperger's and autism) then visit <a href="http://www.childbrain.com" target="_blank">http://www.childbrain.com</a> and look for their Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) questionnaire. It's not official, you can use it to give you a 'feel' for how she really is. But from what you describe - sounds like my kids, well and truly. difficult child 1 is obsessed with birds of prey, he was working as a zoo volunteer. The only reason he's backed off from that at the moment is he's caught up in a church which has convinced him that evolution theory is in conflict with Christianity (not how we raised him) and so has had to 'bury' this part of his interest, for fear of having to THINK about the conflict between his beliefs and his obsessions.</p><p></p><p>I think "Explosive Child" works as well as it does with a lot of Aspies, because it allows them control and this seems to be something they crave. The world is a confusing, scary place and the more control they can have, the more they can predict what is happening (they need to know) and the calmer they feel. Also, it lets them explore their favourite things, their pet topics.</p><p></p><p>Let her flit from idea to idea; she is finding her own way of learning. Every kid is different; ours more so. You know how they advise you to break tasks up into manageable pieces? It doesn't work that way for difficult child 3, he needs to see the whole topic spread out before him, like the view of a landscape from the top of a mountain. Until he sees it that way, he can't recognise the smaller pieces. For him, it's like trying to do a jigsaw puzzle without having access to the picture on the box. It's just how HE learns.</p><p></p><p>You said 4 hours north of Sydney - if it's anywhere on the coast, I know it well. I have family from Sydney to Brisbane, spent a lot of time over the years with family in Port, Coffs & Woolgoolga. Heading south for Christmas this year for a few days, need to head back north some time, probably will after easy child moves from Canberra to Newcastle for a few months. Will happily chat if you want to - PM me for phone number. We try to keep identity details as confidential as possible here, because that way if we need to whinge about the school, or about anybody who is likely to be lurking for our posts, we can do it in total confidence that it can't be used against us. I needed to have a big whine about our local Regional Office and because I can't be Googled here (name changes, etc) I felt totally free to let 'er rip!</p><p></p><p>Keep reading, by Monday you should be even further through the book.</p><p></p><p>Re ordering a copy - I had trouble, the publisher is one who apparently isn't all that reliable in linking in with a lot of Aussie book firms. Or it might have been that I was trying to order the book just as the 2nd edition came out. It's up to a third edition now, apparently. husband was recommending it to a forum of dads of autistic/Aspie kids the other night, he did some advance research.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 104321, member: 1991"] Hi again, Kate - You said, "She has no problem AT ALL with eye conduct but socially she shows lack of empathy..." this sounds a lot like difficult child 3. Despite a diagnosis of autism (he scores moderate, too, further down from mild) he actually makes good eye contact even with strangers. Not always, but often enough to be confusing to people. Plus, he's always been very outgoing, will divulge intimate family secrets to total strangers. Has no concept of stranger danger, because once someone knows his name (and all they have to do is ask him) then they are no longer strangers! The lack of empathy - it takes time. And it is stemming from her lack of theory of mind. difficult child 3 is acquiring theory of mind, he passes the tests now mostly. They DO get there. But for her still (she IS only 5!) she can't understand that her own thoughts aren't an open book for everyone, and can't see that anybody else feels any different to her. A strong suggestion - do not leave her alone in play, and try to organise play so with friends, it is structured. Unstructured, unsupervised play is where problems arise. Maybe next time have a cooking session with all the girls in the kitchen? Then sit down together to watch a movie, eating what they cooked. To learn empathy (and other social skills) - everybody has to learn this but most kids pick it up by osmosis. Just being around others, it rubs off. But not with Aspies and Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) kids, they need to be taught social skills in the same way you would teach geography. Social stories are a good way at this age. I used photo albums, or you can get from the supermarket those presentation folders, then put something together on the computer with text and photos, then print it off. As the stories change, you change the pages in the folder. Getting her to see some sort of facial expression as a cue to "That's a joke, Joyce" is very good technique (knowing you're an Aussie means I can use that reference and know you understand!). You have a lot of work ahead of you but you're off to a good start. Basket A - keep it VERY limited, the book makes it clear that Basket A should only contain immediate safety (such as grabbing her if she's about to run onto the road in front of a truck) and school attendance. You also said, in reference to her oral fixation, that "she should have grown out of that by now." You need to learn to not use that phrase. "By now" is not applicable with autism and Asperger's. They will adapt when they're darn well good and ready, you can't force it at all. The mimicry - yep, a big part of it. A great talent to be able to use, and one she is using more than perhaps you realise. If you want to have a look for yourself at aspects of Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) (Pervasive Developmental Disorder; an umbrella label which includes Asperger's and autism) then visit [url="http://www.childbrain.com"]http://www.childbrain.com[/url] and look for their Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) questionnaire. It's not official, you can use it to give you a 'feel' for how she really is. But from what you describe - sounds like my kids, well and truly. difficult child 1 is obsessed with birds of prey, he was working as a zoo volunteer. The only reason he's backed off from that at the moment is he's caught up in a church which has convinced him that evolution theory is in conflict with Christianity (not how we raised him) and so has had to 'bury' this part of his interest, for fear of having to THINK about the conflict between his beliefs and his obsessions. I think "Explosive Child" works as well as it does with a lot of Aspies, because it allows them control and this seems to be something they crave. The world is a confusing, scary place and the more control they can have, the more they can predict what is happening (they need to know) and the calmer they feel. Also, it lets them explore their favourite things, their pet topics. Let her flit from idea to idea; she is finding her own way of learning. Every kid is different; ours more so. You know how they advise you to break tasks up into manageable pieces? It doesn't work that way for difficult child 3, he needs to see the whole topic spread out before him, like the view of a landscape from the top of a mountain. Until he sees it that way, he can't recognise the smaller pieces. For him, it's like trying to do a jigsaw puzzle without having access to the picture on the box. It's just how HE learns. You said 4 hours north of Sydney - if it's anywhere on the coast, I know it well. I have family from Sydney to Brisbane, spent a lot of time over the years with family in Port, Coffs & Woolgoolga. Heading south for Christmas this year for a few days, need to head back north some time, probably will after easy child moves from Canberra to Newcastle for a few months. Will happily chat if you want to - PM me for phone number. We try to keep identity details as confidential as possible here, because that way if we need to whinge about the school, or about anybody who is likely to be lurking for our posts, we can do it in total confidence that it can't be used against us. I needed to have a big whine about our local Regional Office and because I can't be Googled here (name changes, etc) I felt totally free to let 'er rip! Keep reading, by Monday you should be even further through the book. Re ordering a copy - I had trouble, the publisher is one who apparently isn't all that reliable in linking in with a lot of Aussie book firms. Or it might have been that I was trying to order the book just as the 2nd edition came out. It's up to a third edition now, apparently. husband was recommending it to a forum of dads of autistic/Aspie kids the other night, he did some advance research. Marg [/QUOTE]
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