Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by nlj, Jul 29, 2015.
Oh when I saw this on the news this morning it made my blood boil. Just heartbreaking!!
They said he has had so many death threats that he had to close his practice. I do not feel bad for him at all.
I live in area where people hunt deer. I do not have a problem with people hunting for food but when they go "sport" hunting it makes me sick!!
The response here "across the pond" has been massive and virulent to the extreme.
Predator hunting is not looked upon favorably by many North Americans, with it only being deemed justified in cases of human/predator conflict.
Unfortunately, the majority in control of our government is in favor of removing protections from most of our apex predators in favor of mining and other corporate/industrial/agricultural interests, despite those views going against the views of the majority of the populace.
"Nuff said, I've already gotten more political than I should've on this board.
Lucy, I am a huge, huge animal lover of any/all animals. This makes me sicker than sick. That's what this American thinks. I get teary-eyed about any harm to animals. I can't watch the Humane Society commercials without feeling sick, and I do contribute to the humane society.
Jimmie Kimmel is a late night talk show host who has a double edged sense of humor. He devoted motr than half his time on blasting "the jack wad" who did it. At the end of his tirade he brcamr very emotional. He also put up an organization to donate to. O believe you can you tube last nights show.
Doesn't anyone do anything awful on the other side of the Atlantic?
I do not understand "trophy" hunting. Before I was born my father hunted bear...but I understand they actually ate it. I know my mom said the best lard in the world for pie crust was bear lard and that ones that ate garbage ruined the flavor of the meat. (I'm quite glad that was before I was born.) Jabber hunts deer, and we have one in the freezer. If you're going to shoot it as a sport, you better eat it, is my philosophy!
Do kill a beautiful lion, tiger, elephant, rhino...I don't get it. It's just so wrong!
Response against this guy has, by and large, been negative bordering on virulently angry. Good.
My little nuclear family doesn't hunt, but lots of extended family do, and I totally agree with this. You basically have three options:
- hunt and eat it
- don't hunt
- hunt through a guiding outfit where THEY use the meat (to feed the hunters) - so at least it isn't going to waste.
And yes, untainted bear is about the second-best meat going. (best meat is moose)
In WI, there is an organization called 'Hunters Against Hunger'. Hunters donate unwanted game meat (mostly venison and bear) to HAW, which processes it, grinds it, and packages it for distribution by food pantries.
When I first moved up North and was dependent upon a food pantry for much of my food, I ate quite a bit of HAW donated meat, mostly venison, but some bear.
The venison was well-processed and of high-quality. The bear for the most part? The less said, the better, and I've eaten good bear meat.
husband used to hunt for the table in the days when we NEEDED the meat.
I always say that I don't wear anything that I won't eat. Since I've never had any need or desire to eat a mink or fox...but do eat cows and sheep and chickens, etc....well, there you have it.
Well okay then. Nice to know Mom wasn't just putting me on.
Something about eating a bear...just puts me off. But I have photos of Daddy with the bears and hides. He hunted with a hand-gun by the way, 44 Magnum - same one he kept under the bed. (Just to make the thread more controversial. ) Seriously though, he said running thru the woods with a rifle was a pain, so he used a side-arm.
GoingNorth: How do you wear a chicken?
This bothers me too. Seems like the rest of the world is obsessed with the "baaaaaad" Americans, as if nothing bad ever happens in their own countries and with their own people. In the end, I suspect the foreign media slaps our news all over the place moreso than local news.
I am not a flag waving patriot, but this does kind of get on my nerves. We aren't a bunch of barbaric animals either and we do have a lot more people than ANY country in Europe and, yes, that makes more people to do bonehead things.
My uncles hunt bear with long-gun... but also carry hand-gun in case they have to act fast - as in, somebody else wounds a bear and it comes charging.
Maybe we're a bit more self-absorbed. We tend to not report that much on other countries unless it's really awful, like the guy that murdered all those kids at the camp in Norway back in 2011, or terrorist bombings or something.
Ha! Try reading the BBC news any day of the week! Or better still, one of our many scum newspapers such as The Daily Mail. You'll be spoiled for choice with the amount of awful stuff going on here and in the rest of Europe. No point asking you all about the American response or viewpoint to any of that though is there?
We're also currently planning to cull badgers and reintroduce fox hunting here apparently. By "we", I mean the landed upperclass gentry and royal parasites.
Wow...I'm surprised at the fox hunting. I would think they would find that kind of sport hunting wrong. People hardly even wear fur anymore. Isn't PITA losing their minds?
I have to admit, I have coveted a coyote coat, not that I could ever bring myself to buy one...but no one who has lived on a farm would feel kindly toward coyotes.
Depends from the place, but fox hunting certainly has it's place. Close human habitation people influence to the ecosystem so much anyway that we need to fix it too. And people also have some preferences on which animals are more valuable than others.
We have for example lately sailed and visited couple islands that are protected area and are closed from early spring till the young birds learn to fly. Except hunters are allowed (and paid) to go to those small islands and islets and their job is to kill every fox and mink that have gotten there during winter. Some rare birds nest there and even one fox may kill every young bird from whole islet...
Also in mainland some of our birds are getting less common, because fox etc. populations are in rise, so hunters tend to hunt those predators to give also the birds the chance. Foxes especially tend to greatly benefit from people, so they are getting more plenty around human habitats. And that is not good for some other animals.
Unfortunately we have a royal family here and an extended entourage of upper-class twits who think they have a god-given right to dress up in silly clothes and ride around the countryside until they find a fox to rip to shreds.
But anyway... we digress... this killing of the lion is sick. I wondered what the response had been locally and nationally and whether this 'man' is going to be able to continue with his current lifestyle. I'm very glad I'm not his mother!
The issue with fox-hunting with horse and hound is that it's cruel to the fox. It is ripped to shreds by the hounds.
If a fox needs to be killed, the proper way to do it is with a well-placed head shot from a high-powered rifle.
That said, I rode for many years (It's what's wrong with my knees, in fact.) and have ridden to a few "drag" hunts where a scent trail is laid using a scented "drag" and the hounds set free to follow that. (They are rewarded with praise and treats when they find the "fox") The riders follow the hounds.
Drag hunts are an absolute blast! And, because the obstacles and terrain are chosen carefully,they are both safer, and in many cases, more challenging for the horses and riders. In addition, alternate routes for less-experienced riders or children on ponies can be set up along the "drag line".
There's no reason to actually chase a terrified animal to the point of utter exhaustion and then watch in glee as its flesh is rent by slavering hounds.
One of my fondest "fox-hunting" experiences while in Germany came during a drag hunt mostly over ditches, hedgerows, and stone walls, when a black-masked, red face popped up from a thicket and I realized that a young fox had be following the hunt! S/he was curious about what we "hunters" and the pack of hounds were doing.
Oh, forgot. We of course do not hunt foxes with horses. They are usually either trapped and shot, shot from hiding, shot after one hound has tracked and driven them or shot after a terrier has driven them out from the cave.
Dirty job, no glamour included.
The dentist says that he hired a hunting guide and depended on them to set up the hunt and he had no idea that the lion was collared and tagged and a park icon. Except he is a member of organizations for big game hunting, so I doubt he left it all up to the guides. Just seems like too easy a way to lay blame on someone else, in my opinion. This is all from an article on yahoo news earlier today. They showed a photo of the door of the dentist's office where people were leaving stuffed animals as a protest against his actions.
I have zero problems with hunting for food when done in accordance with the local/state laws. Studies have proven that managed hunting actually prevents long slow starvation of large numbers of animals. I have a major problem with hunting animals that are even close to being endangered, and with hunting of ANY animal if you are not planning on using every possible part of the animal.
I think this man is sick. He has already killed lions, why did he need to kill another one? Isn't there some sort of ethical standard on not killing just to kill? This type of hunting, just to have a trophy, is disgusting to me I don't see a whole lot of difference between this man's actions and the actions of people who are thrill killers or who have hunted people for the thrill of killing the next trophy. Once you have killed so many of the apex predators, what is left but hunting people? This dentist has shown he has no morals or respect for hunting laws, so why would he respect any other laws about killing?
I wonder if he will ever be able to open his dental practice again? (If he isn't arrested for killing the lion, that is.) I know people who have done things that have gone viral have lost their jobs, and I wonder if this man will lose all his patients? The man who went on a rant at the Chick father in law A drive through worker and posted it on youtube still cannot find a job, and all he did was post a short rant that didn't physically harm anyone on a website. This man killed an animal, and likely cost that park millions of dollars of lost revenue. I think that is far worse and I wonder what the long term consequences to this dentist will be.
SuZir, the type of hunting you describe: using "earth dogs" to dig the fox out of its hide to be shot, or trapping it an shooting it, are standard methods of control in many areas, though not the most humane.
They are also accompanied by tradition.
"Earth dog" competitions were popular in the area of Germany in which I lived, with terriers and "teckels" (Dachshunds) competing.
Tunnels were dug maze-fashion, and a rat in a cage was placed in a chamber at one end of the maze.
The dogs were placed at various entrances to to the "maze". The dog which reached the rat first won the competition.
Neither rat nor dog was harmed during these competitions, though I imagine it had to be terrifying for the poor rat.
I had a longhaired teckel for a while in the US, and what he did to my back yard when we acquired moles was truly terrifying. I have NEVER seen a dog dig like that!
The problem with the British views on foxhunting go far beyond the cruelty to the prey, however. It is sport associated with the elite; the "landed gentry", and it hearkens back to a time when the poor weren't allowed to hunt in the great forests that covered much of Britain on pain of death.
A British writer or playwright, I cannot remember who at the moment, once characterized foxhunting as, "the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible"., which basically sums up the bulk of public opinion in the UK.
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