2 questions completely unrelated.

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by Abbey, Jul 31, 2009.

  1. Abbey

    Abbey Spork Queen

    Easy one first. Can you freeze garlic? My neighbor brought over a HUGE bag of freshly grown garlic. I love it...cook with all the time, but this is enough to last me a year. Should I freeze it as is, or crop it down?

    Harder question. My easy child daughter informed me yesterday that she is going to have the lap-band surgery for weight loss in about 10 days. She wants me to come down and watch over her. I have no problem with that. She has gained 130lbs in the last year alone. She had me call her surgeon who described what was going to happen. There are serious side effects which worries me.

    I know there have been some board members who have been through this procedure. PM/email me with any thoughts. I can see how helpful this would be for her in many ways, but wonder if it is really treating the underlying cause of the obsession of food.

  2. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    I freeze fresh garlic all the time. We have wild garlic in the yard and it's wonderful in all kinds of stuff!

    The other... I don't know. I'll let someone with expertise talk about that!
  3. Fran

    Fran Former Site Owner

    I'm no expert but weight is a very complex issue. The band is a tool that will help her get through and develop her own tools. Follow up would seem to be important with a group or therapist so she doesn't sabotage herself.

    It's like an alcoholic. All the AA meetings, therapists or guilt won't help if they aren't sober already.
    She is young and I think it's a good idea if she is in the right frame of mind. She is missing some of the best days of her life because of her weight. Her obsession with food is no different than the obsession with alcohol. It is a self medicating process and a soothing way to ease anxiety and/or pain.

    From what I have heard from people who have done it, they are screened and there is intense follow up. I don't know anyone with the band but I know others with the actual surgery. It really is a help.

    If it's her choice and it helps then I would encourage her. I would be happy if difficult child would want to do it but he is unaware of his body and would not be able to follow the rules post op. His weight doesn't bother him. It bothers his doctor and me. If he would ask for it, I'd be thrilled.
  4. Abbey

    Abbey Spork Queen

    Garlic - do you freeze it as it comes out of the ground, or do you chop or clean it? It is such good stuff I'd hate to mess it up.

    Fran - She has been outwardly in denial about her weight for as long as I can remember. She finally opened up to me about how it bothers her that she can't get in or out of a car, or people watch every bite she eats. So, she doesn't eat in public...she hides food and eats it when she is alone. Toss in the fact that she lives alone...not a good factor.

    I don't want her to lose weight because of what other people think. I want her to do it for herself. She's already into the pre stages of diabeties and has trouble with the most simple movements.

    They do have post op counseling. I just hope she sticks with it and finds some esteem along the way to keep her going.

    I just want my baby to feel good about herself and be safe. Geez...once a mom always a mom.

  5. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    Clean it, for sure. You can chop it if you want to, but you can also freeze it whole.

    Something else a lot of my friends do if you have the room. Braid the tops together and hang it in a cool dry dark place like a cellar. It dries out but works really well that way.
  6. crazymama30

    crazymama30 Active Member

    Lap band is the safer surgery (the alternative is a complete gastric bypass or Roux en Y) but there are strict dietary stuff to be enforced afterward. I am more familiar with the bypass, which requires a liquid diet for several weeks afterward. If she can follow the dietary stuff, she will lose weight. I am not sure about the emotional aspect. Seeing a counselor who specializes in eating disorders would be good. I hope she follows up with the post op counseling. You are right in that she has to do it for herself. I know someone who had the lap band and she has lost probably around 100lbs and has had no complications that I know of.

    Hope it goes well, and kudos to you for taking care of her afterward.
  7. Star*

    Star* call 911........call 911

    I suppose you could freeze garlic if you could stare at it with that GTH look you have mastered with you S/O.....or if you catch it running away and say "FREEZE!"

    As far as the Lap band.....Here are my thoughts because DF and I just went to a 3 hour Obesity clinic and learned a LOT about why someone would opt for it, why someone would change their minds, what you could do or should do instead, what they are requiring NOW before you commit to it, and what most people do NOT realize - that the actual follow-up is a LIFE-LONG committment. That part blew me away. And I'll explain why. I'll also tell you about what Medicare is now as of 7/21/09 requiring.

    First of all crazymom is correct about that there are three procedures.

    The first is where they re-route your esophagus and basically eliminate it from going into your stomach but DO NOT remove your stomach. They create a pouch that will hold 2 oz. of food and you have to learn to eat smaller portions. This IS reversable but not recommended. The most asked question was "what happens if you cheat - will you stretch your pouch or stomach out?" and the answer was that should you attempt to not keep to the lifestyle change for life there is the chance that with this procedure you could gain the weight back. Trying to overeat will make you sick.

    The second is where they actually remove part of your stomach and staple the remaining portion shut to create a 2oz stomach. Nothing is rerouted but your stomach is thrown out, can't be reattached ever, it will never grown back. the answer was "NO - you will think you are dying - throw up and you will ONLY do it once."

    The third is where they stitch a water-type-filled life preserver apparatus around the top portion of your stomach to create a 2oz. pouch. they stitch a portion of your stomach over the life-preserver to hold it in place and run an air-type tube down to a ring that is to the right of your belly button that has a hole in it. This hole can be filled with solution that will travel up the tube that fills up the preserver making it tight around the stomach and thus creating a pouch. The ring is permanent - it is never removed. You can feel it if you press on anyones belly that has had the procedure. Once you loose the weight - and have adjusted to a lifestyle of exercise and healthy eating - I asked if you would go back in and have it removed. I was told NO. Whatever it was that caused you to GAIN the weight - would come back despite changing your eating habits and exercise habits....(I found that hard to believe...but figured that ring would be removed eventually - and nope - it stays there for life).....

    Okay so my next question - if it's there for life - how long is follow up care? The answer? For life. After surgery? Three weeks visit, SIx week visit, then six months then one year......then every year, once a year after that AND if you move you have to find a doctor that is certified and have your records transferred from the clinic you had this surgery done at to that office AND they charge to make copies of your records each time you move AND you have to have copies send to ANY OTHER doctors you see because once you have this surgery done there are certain prescriptions that you WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO TAKE AGAIN and your MD, GP, OBGYN will need to KNOW that you have had this surgery. YOUR Hospital will need to know - FOR LIFE.

    SO - it's not like - you can have this done and NO ONE will ever know. EVERYONE will know. FOREVER. And the thought of paying for visits every year to be checked until I'm 85 - or whatever were like - NAH.

    Now as far as cost/insurance and how long it takes to find out if you qualify. Once you start the paperwork and you have to do MOST of the calling and filling out and with YOUR insurance company. The offices of the surgery centers do not. That responsibility is yours. First you have to find out if your insurance even allows it, how much they will cover - then you need to see an MD to get a referral TO the obseity center. From there - they have a gigantic packet of stuff you have to fill out and correspond with your insurance co. All this takes about six weeks. You will be calling the insurance company - and the surgery center.
    If you don't have insurance the average cost ranges from 26,000.00 to 39,000.00. You ALSO are required to get a psychological exam from a psychiatrist to make sure that you are doing the surgery for the right reasons.

    My husand says I'm fat, I hate the way I look - will not get you an approval - I want to be healthier - will. But it's not that easy.

    Medicare patients are now REQUIRED to have a six MONTH DOCUMENTED exercise and diet daily record from a qualifying dietitian, gym or health spa with written records - SIX MONTHS.....it has to be Weight watchers, curves....something like that and it has to be SHOWN that you did it under an MD's care - with records to match. They passed this rule recently to make sure that people were TRYING diet and lifestyle change as a first resort.

    What they told us about HOW much weight you lost was a little disappointing. I figured with a 2 oz stomach the weight would POUR off you. I thought - If I did have this done I'd be thin in a year..back to a size 5-6 by this time next year....and when they put the statistics up and showed actual peoples picture of last year in July and then brought them up I expected a WOW factor of 10 - and while I was proud for them I was not impressed. 30 lbs.....in 1 year. $26,000.00/30 lbs. Lifelong committment/dr appts/more money - ring in my belly???? Hmmm.

    After the seminar - and after I looked around at all the people in the room I wanted to hug them all. There were people there that were so obese that they had to bring in special chairs for them to sit in. I know (sadly) they were in excess of 600 lbs. And it doesn't take much to get there so it's not like anyone was judging anyone else in the room....but it just made me sit there and think - OMG I am ONLY 140 lbs overweight - I can try something else----I have to try this - my insurance has a $2500.00 deductible, I can't miss ANY work- I don't want to do this for LIFE...with a ring near my belly button - I think I'd feel like a blow up mattress.

    It made me sad for the people in the room like myself who have probably NO idea HOW we got like this...Angry, bitter, we give up - we think What is the use, no one cares...I go see my doctor I got told I am just FAT....and things spiral, we get depressed and we eat.....That's not what happened to me....but I know it happens to a lot of people.

    So I got lucky - found a Nurse that gave a hang - told her LOOK SISTER I need help - and made a list of ALL the junk that is bugging me. EVERY LAST THING.....I asked for tests - I'm not a medical person - Most of what I know medical I get here from the smart medical know it alls here who say - TRY THIS...and I ask for that....and now In a month? I feel a little better, I've lost 12 lbs.....in one month.....that's almost 1/2 of what I would have lost in a year to the lap band. And I'm still loosing.

    I'd be glad to help your friend if she wants to try what I'm trying or ask her dr. to test her for what I got tested for. I think it would help a lot of women. My NP said "OMG look at your blood sugars...." and now we can move on to the next set of problems." so maybe before your friend commits to this - she should consider giving her body a six week trial of a lifestyle change and mild exercise -and I mean MILD....not diet either - just throwing out junk....

    I'm sure she is beautiful.....she just needs to know that......It's working for my other friend who was going to have lap band - she's already lost 9 lbs in 3 weeks.

    Hugs -
  8. Marcie Mac

    Marcie Mac Just Plain Ole Tired

    Re the garlic, my mother used to strip it down to bare cloves, put them in a jar of olive oil and keep it in the fridge till they were needed. They never went moldy, and the olive oil which was garlicky was used when needed, and the jar just refilled with more oil.

  9. KTMom91

    KTMom91 Well-Known Member

    I had considered the lap band surgery, but decided against it, for several reasons. The main one being, as Star said, I didn't get to this weight through overeating. I'm about 100 pounds overweight because of way too much prednisone, though I didn't know that at the time.

    A friend of mine had the stomach staple/reattachment. She nearly died several times because her stomach healed closed, rather than allow any food to go in. I don't know what the answer is.
  10. muttmeister

    muttmeister Well-Known Member

    I used to buy the minced garlic in the jar but since I've been growing my own I either chop it or put it through the garlic press and then put it in a small jar with some oil thinned with a little vinegar. It keeps indefinitely in the fridge that way.
  11. Fran

    Fran Former Site Owner

    Abbey the few folks I know who have been through this have not had the life threatening issues that have read on this thread. Probably why my view is different. It is in her best interest to do this before she is 600lbs with lots of obesity related health problems. If she wants it. I totally disagree that one should wait until you are at the end of your rope healthwise. If she is healthy and committed then this is the time.

    All weight loss programs including Weight watchers work if you keep to them for life. It's about learning different choices and eating differently and the realization that you can't eat like others just like an alcoholic can't drink like others. I struggle with weight and it's a constant battle but I work on it. If one can't find a program that helps you change a lifestyle then you need more help. Self discipline can't do it alone for the truely obese.

    Life is cruel when you don't look, can't do or have the same dreams as your peers. In your early 20's is when there are tons of possibilities that will affect the life you will lead.
    She ends up marrying someone just because he will have her and work a job because they will hire her and her life continues to be pretty hopeless. She wants to be proactive to help work on her weight, then she will educate herself and make the best choice. I see this as a positive. As parents all we can do is support her decision. Seems to me that instead of looking at this as a crutch, you could look at this as a tool.

    I know that surgery is drastic but now there is laproscopic surgeries that require very little hospitalization or even less recovery period away from work. My friend had returned to work 2 wks after the laproscopic surgery.
    The few folks I know who have been through this are obligated to walk every day or do some structured exercise. I know your daughter was once a successful horse person who played ?polo. (I may have that wrong).

    Feeling like there is some staple or ring inside you for life may not be everyone's cup of tea but pacemakers, rods, screws and plates are all supports that are left permanently inside a person.

    Hopefully your daughter got to talk to others who have been through the procedure and can tell her their experiences both good and bad.
  12. ML

    ML Guest

    As you know manster has the food addiction cross that he will bear during his lifetime. I struggle daily with how to deal with this issue. If he were an adult I could just detach with love. But he's not, he's 10 and it's my job to keep him healthy. I really am trying and will continue to do so for as long as I can. I remember a year ago asking folks here if he was too young to take to a 12 step meeting because in my gut I know this is the kind of help he needs, the kind that comes from a higher power and I'm not it.

    I know that I'm not really answering your question but I do commiserate. I would love to talk more about this issue with you privately.

    Love, ML
  13. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I have contemplated this surgery many times. Maybe one day I will take the plunge, maybe not. Back in probably 97 or 98, I actually went to a dr and started the whole process to try and get the surgery. My insurance denied me at the last minute. Actually I found out later they may have saved my life because that doctor was on 60 minutes for some sort of scandal...lol. Then maybe a year or so later I tried to go to another doctor who had started doing it laproscopically. Made it much less invasive. Shorter healing time. One of my coworkers went to him. I got denied again! I was devestated. I quit trying. Felt it just was not meant to be.

    Plus at this whole time Tony was really not thrilled at me even trying. I was close to the age his mom had died and my kids were near the age that he and his brothers were when his mom died. She died getting the bypass surgery back in the late 70s. Of course, logically he knew the operation had improved but that fear was still there.

    So I put this whole thing on the back burner. I tried to lose weight the old fashioned way. In 2003, I did lose quite a bit of weight when Jamie went into the Marines. That was also when I started topomax and wellbutrin. Weight fell off but I was also only eating like 800 calories a day. When he was in bootcamp I lost 50 pounds in 17 weeks. I have gained most of the weight back though.

    I think my weight is emotional. When I started to get close to 200 pounds my mind simply couldnt handle it and I freaked out.
  14. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Whether you get the surgery or not, you need the self-discipline also to go with it.

    I had to lose weight because of my health. My specialist said I was close to needing gastric bypass surgery and I DON'T want surgery, so I figured - I would simply eat as if I had already had the surgery. Make sure there was only healthy food around me and only eat a couple of mouthfuls for a meal, enough to stop the hunger pangs and the feeling faint. If I needed another few mouthfuls an hour later - OK. I was driven by desperation to ward off the imminent diabetes and the serious liver problems. I also had diet pills to help (although I don't think they made a lot of difference in my case, although tkaing them helped me THINK they were helping).

    As for all that garlic - I would NOT freeze it for now, I might bottle some of it under olive oil, but if you keep it in a spare fridge (we have a house fridge and a garage fridge) it might easily store there for the year you need. Only freeze it or bottle it if it begins to look a bit wrinkled and tired.

    Instead, cook some healthy casseroles for your daughter. I use garlic a lot. My current fad is Moroccan cooking, done slow-cooked with a lot of vegetables and loads of flavour, served with brown rice. Help her cut back on carbs (but not as far back as Atkins Diet) and switch to wholegrain everything and no potatoes. If she's hungry, have a drink of water. Then lean protein. Sauce is OK as long as it's appropriate in quantity. Fruit - one piece a day, except unlimited strawberries. Unlimited vegetables except the high carb ones. No sweets at all unless they're the Isomalt ones. Basically, if she gets that sour taste in her mouth after eating, she's had too much carb and needs to find out where it came from so she can avoid it next time. Otherwise - eat when she wants to. Five small meals are better, she MUST eat breakfast but it needs to be wholegrain and low fat with no added sugar. Drink lots of water, no drinks with sugar (that includes fruit juice, even unsweetened - one glass of juice is the daily fruit serve, gone in one gulp).

    If hse is obsessed with food (as I became increasingly so, while dieting) then let her cook for other people. I found I was baking cakes and biscuits, playing with biscuit dough and making multicoloured, multi-layered shapes with decorations which I then gave away to friends.

    Oh yes - and eat two to four squares of good quality dark chocolate every day. Without fail.

  15. Abbey

    Abbey Spork Queen

    Thank you all for your wonderful advice. I just look at my 'baby' and want the best for her. I don't want her to do this for the wrong reasons. In a perfect world, she'd have the procedure done, feel better about herself and move on with life. Well...life isn't perfect. She still has the issue of food being an addiction. I hope they address that. I just wish I was there to be a support.