easy child is trying out for a difficult child position.

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by Mom2oddson, May 13, 2011.

  1. Mom2oddson

    Mom2oddson Active Member

    He's not coming home from college this year. And I've been missing him. So when he pocket dialed my phone and left a voice mail, I thought I'd listen to his voice for a few minutes.

    The thought that it wasn't ethically right did flash through my mind. That should of been a warning.

    Seems easy child and his friends are pothead! And to think I had the delusion that ONE of my kids was smarter than that!! Was I blind! Didn't his siblings rehab stays mean anything to him? As a good friend said "Superman Syndrome".

    Oh, and the other shoe??? Well, Washington has legalized medical pot. And ANT, my just out of rehab son, has a prescription for it and a LICENSE to distribute! easy child was telling his buddies all about it. It's the only thing he misses about not coming home this summer. Of course this explains some of Ant's behaviors lately.

    I think it's time to turn in my Mom resignation. I'm so done with all of it. It's time they go live their lives and I'll live mine! They'll still be my kids and we will talk and visit over holidays, I'll enjoy my grandkids if they have any. But I think I'm done being so emotionally invested in them.

    easy child is still getting a 3.something in college so he's not close to dropping out or anything. And he's turning 21. At that age, I was on my own. I did my own thing and paid the consequences good or bad all on my own. easy child can do the same.

    And Ant has always been one to cross every line in the sand and challenge EVERYTHING! He too, can live with the consequences good or bad.

    And Steph has nothing to do with us, it's like I have 2 (dumb) sons and no daughter at all. As time goes by, it's been getting easier.

    I'll still be there for them when/if they need me, but I need to work on letting go. It's time to adjust to being the parent of Adult children. Even if they don't act like adults! I knew this day was coming. From the moment you give birth to your child they are on a path to move away from you. To be independent.

    I'm ever so grateful for this wonderful place right here and all my wonderful friends here that help keep me grounded! This would be so much harder without you guys!

    thanks for listening.
  2. dashcat

    dashcat Member

    I am so sorry. All of our kids - pcs and difficult children alike, sure can bring us boatloads of heartache. Try and hang on to the thought that, with most pcs, stuff like this is a phase....doesn't make it easier when you're in it, but it might help to think that there will be an end to it down the road.

    I hate pot. It sucks so much ambition and creativity out of our kids.

  3. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It


    I hate pot too. I worked in a "hippy" type restaurant while I was in college. Many times I left a party because everyone was stoned on pot, sitting there going "wow, that is sooooooo cool". No one was doing anything but sitting there so I never figured out what was "soooooo cool". The next day they would describe the party as having all this wild stuff going on and in reality all that they were doing was sitting there going "wow" at nothing.

    It is an awful, mind rotting, stupidity inducing substance. Yuck.
  4. mrsammler

    mrsammler Guest

    I hate pot too. It's a moral solvent--i.e., seems to make it easier to relax into acceptance of poor behavior, underachievement, sliding into worse drugs, etc. I smoked it a lot in my first 3 semesters of college and that, along with the other dysfunctions that accompanied it, crushed my grades and pretty much lost me a full scholarship and drove me into an army enlistment. I have *never* seen a young person who smokes it still be able to perform well in work or personal life--it always triggers a decline.
  5. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    I have certainly changed my view of pot over the years. I smoked it in college and a couple of experiences when I smoked it too often and lost all motivation showed me it was not something to do a lot of... however I was one of those who could smoke once in a while and be fine... and I think there are many kids like that who can use like many use alcohol... once in a while in a social situation. Hopefully your easy child is going to be one of those kids.....

    However I now hate pot too.... because for my difficult child it has been something he has definitely been emotioally addicted too... he certainly has gotten into other drugs, it certainly takes away any motivation he has, and he does incredibly stupid things while high that has gotten him inot legal trouble. I suspect though he would have as much trouble wth alcohol or any other substance because basically I think he is an addict.... So for some kids pot is just downright dangerous as is alcohol....
  6. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    Yup. Agree.

    With each one of mine I came to a conclusion the time of "teaching" was over. Once the point was reached with each one of them my life became less stressed.

    Threre truly is such a thing as too much information= too much information.

  7. ski10

    ski10 New Member

    In discussions my daughter says pot is "not really" a drug, other things are worse...

    I had friends who smoked it when we when younger, I couldn't stand the smell of it and never even tried it. A neighbor where we used to live did it all the time, never made it a secret at all, he'd say things like "Cool dude" over and over and looked out of his mind, pot, cocaine etc scares the beejezus out of me.
  8. Star*

    Star* call 911........call 911

    Well you need to bootie call the little bugger back and have a conversation with YOUR girlfriends -

    And have it go like -

    OMW - you know the other day Sons phone accidently dialed mine - and I overheard a call about .......(whisper) marijuana.........

    and ......I am so heart broken.......because we were going to have a nice party for him with cake and such and buy him a new car/....a nice gold necklace/ about 5 or 6

    pairs of vintage Nikes/an all expense paid trip to Spain/whatever you think he would have flipped over.......but since he's smoking the dope? We just know he'd only pawn them....so now it's all off and instead we're going to....(and then say OMG my phone is on let me hang up)
  9. mrsammler

    mrsammler Guest

    Star: brilliant and perfect. Let it be so.
  10. Mattsmom277

    Mattsmom277 Active Member

    With so many members, I can't recall, this son (easy child). How is he doing in college? What makes him a easy child? Does he have a job? What is he like when interacting with others? Does he live his life as a adult appropriate to his age? I'm asking all of these questions because it might not be that he's turning difficult child if he is really a easy child and living age appropriately, good kid etc. I can see the gut instinct for parents discovering their idea of a easy child child being caught using pot. I can also see it being much more gutteral to a parent to hear about a easy child when they have another adult addict child. Know what I mean?? For your difficult child Ant, having come out of rehab, no recreational drug or alcohol should be in his vocabulary, not even pot which is considered by some as a gateway to a heroin overdose, and by others as a usable recreational substance that can be used casually much like a glass of wine with a friend over dinner doesn't an alcoholic make. Pot is a hotbed subject, and I've found most people with addicts in their lives naturally see pot through a vision point of the gateway it can be come. Or a parent with a pot head adult child who is unmotivated, lazy, spacey so to speak who can't stand them wasting their lives.

    I would compare your easy child's life and character first before getting too worried. Like it or not, pot is no longer carrying the stigma that the government put on it when they big war on pot began. Most don't know the thousands and thousands of years pot was used by our ancestors. It's only in this past 40-50 years that it became a big illicit substance that everyone should fear. We hear such outrage at the idea of legal pot, but we don't hear that same outrage at the doctors filling bogus scripts for bogus non existent pain issues, to hand out major amounts of legal heroin in the form of prescription narcotics.

    I see pot after reading a ton, watching medical shows and documentaries etc, as no different than alcohol. Take alcohol. We have many more social drinkers who have no addictions and can take or leave alcohol. They enjoy a drink from time to time. They don't NEED it. Their lives are not affected by their random drink here or there. We then hear of others who cannot walk away from alcohol. It is the same with prescription pain medications. Many people who would never spoke pot for pain are conditioned to be okay with prescription pain medications. These aren't people outsiders would suspect could become a junkie. Yet they start taking more than prescribed. Then they run out too soon for a refill so they "borrow" from a friend and then they start buying a few here or there. How many housewives are on talk shows each week discussing their fall into presciption drug addictions? Others take pain medications for the same health issues, and never abuse their medications. They take them as prescribed, and while over time their dependency on the drug would require weaning to avoid withdrawl, they are not addicted.

    Pot is in my mind, the same realm as alcohol. It can lead some down a bad path. I have never however met anyone addicted to drugs or alcohol, that felt if they'd never touched pot, they'd never have become addicts. Pot might have been the safest introduction they allowed themselves into the drug world, but something sent them to the pot, and that something moved them past pot, the pot didn't move them past pot, their need for even greater escapes from their own lives leads them deeper into the drug world. The substances are simply a tool in their arsenal of methods to escape whatever they are trying to escape from when they look for a substance to make their worries fade away for a while.

    Once a person has addictions to substances and is in recovery, even those so called legal prescription narcotics are on their do not touch list. Pot being illegal in most places gets a rap as a bad bad bad thing. Yet oxycontin for example would be forgiven in many addicts minds because they indeed has physical pain and it was not drug seeking and was legal and condoned. I'd be much worried about a addict in my life getting a script for an injury that gives them a month of pain medications then I would be about a addict in my life that tooted on a joint. I'd STILL not want my loved one smoking that pot when in recovery. It would not be my fear that the pot would be an addiction that would bother me as pot is not addictive in and of itself. It would be the fear that my addict loved one was seeking ANY substance while in recovery, because I'd know that the addictions developed due to a need to escape their own worlds, which would worry me because I'd know my loved one was hurting and looking for relief from themselves via the worst route possible, drugs.

    I'll be the first on the board probably to admit I smoke pot. Am I big smoker? Nope. Hardly at all actually. A few years ago when MS was making my bladder insane, I couldn't pass urine. My bladder would spasm into a tight drum that hurt more than giving birth to a elephant out of a human body. I was in and out of the ER so much it was nuts. I was injected with so many medications to try to relax the bladder and stop this damaging body problem. I was injected and prescribed medications for home with so many different narcotics for the agonizing pain, moving higher up the narcotics potency scale because nothing helped. I had so many bladder and urinary tract infections from this issue that I really some nights wished I would fall asleep and not wake up. I had months I wasn't walking, in bed. Missing my entire life, my childrens lives. Someone I know, a business professional/parent/spouse/achiever, told me they had recreationaly smoked pot ever since college. They told me if I ever wanted to test the whole medical pot thing for relief with my bladder and/or pain, let them know. Well over a month later I was still in this bladder war and honestly could not face another mid night run to the ER. Called my friend who promptly drove over in the middle of the night and brought coffee and a joint. I probably smoked all of 2-3 drags (not big ones either) of this joint and that was it. We visited and were talking and suddenly I had to go to the bathroom. I swear I unloaded months of backed up, toxic, blood streaked urine. My bladder completely relaxed for the first time in months. The relief from just being empty instead of full was intense and overwhelming after months of this! More so, the relief of my bladder, which is a muscle, NOT being spasmed up into a tight ball? I'd have severed a limb at that point in time to rid myself of this nightmare.

    Converted? You betcha! I still only ever smoke 2-3 drags. I don't smoke it for the high, although even with the small amount I inhale when needed, I do get a low level high effect. I have not taken bladder medications except for a week or two here or there, since. My major problem with MS is fatigue which I can't fight, it swallows me whole and nothing will help that except medications that make me ill. Yet my other most major symptom is muscle cramping, spasms, and spasticity. All very painful ways my muscles behave and is disabling. Fatigue will hit yet I end up unable to sleep due to the major pain from the muscles. When that happens, I have nothing to lose. Getting lazy from a few drags of pot won't ruin my day or rob me of motivation. I'm already beyond fatigued and falling over on my feet, and my muscles will prevent me at times from even moving from the sofa to my own bed to be more comfortable. So I smoke a couple of "puffs" and within 5-10 minutes? My muscles are relaxing, I can lay in bed without agony, and I sleep the sleep of sleeps. I wake up with rested muscles, fatigue conquered temporarily. Without pot on those nights? I barely sleep and when I am sleeping it is a disturbed sleep. So I am not rested in the morning, just miserable after a horrible night. My muscles will stay clenched all night making it near to impossible to stretch my legs out in the morning. On the mornings after I smoke something before bed? My muscles relax as I fall asleep and stay relaxed and no spastic for a glorious 6-8 hours. I wake rested and can get out of bed on the first try and even though I still am still every single morning regardless, I am not walking bent over at my waist, walking with bent knees and on the side of my foot that won't go flat.

    Let me just say, NO medication EVER given me from a doctor, has ever magically relaxed my muscles and let me get a good night sleep. I've had muscle relaxers, anti inflammatories, pain medication, neuropathy medications, you know it, I've had it. I've also had tremors, upset stomache, headaches, developed an ulcer etc from a combination of major strong medications and their side effects. The added bonus on a bad pain night where I smoke before bed? My life long anxiety has always been at its worst at bedtime and through the night. Nights I smoke, my anxiety is non existent.

    I'm not at all saying people don't have valid concerns about addicts using pot, or people using pot and eventually moving to harder drugs, or sticking to pot to a level that it becomes their focus and their lives fall to the wayside. The thing is, realistically and scientifically, pot is the chosen tool as might be in others alcohol or sex or Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) or hard core drugs. The key difference being that pot is not addictive. Someone may feel dependent on it, that is a behavioural condition and not a physiological one. Any person abusing anything, legal or otherwise, needs to find coping skills to prevent that overwhelming desire to escape.

    When it comes to pot, one CAN use pot no different than social drinkers might have wine with dinner etc. Meth? No chance! You use it, you get hooked. You don't puke your guts out and sweat and shake and fever with stopping pot.

    I still hate to see people caught in a whole "Drug culture" that can accompany hard core pot smokers. Slackers most of them and it is a shame. However, most of us know, even when we don't know it, many highly educated, motivated and ambitious adults, using pot for whatever reason. For me it isn't the high, its the effect on my body that improves my condition. For others it might be that light headed feeling many like from one or two drinks of wine.

    I am completely honest with doctors that I choose to use pot for medicinal purposes. I don't recall the last pain script or muscle relaxant I received. Ditto anxiety medications. And I'm not smoking often. Not daily, often not even weekly. That may change to more frequent as my condition progresses over the rest of my lifetime, given I'm young and MS will be with me for decades. There might come a time it doesn't do for my body what it does now, in which case it will be of no use to me and won't be a part of my war cabinet when my body carps out on me. Until then, legal or not legal, this is a plant well used by many cultures for thousands of years. There has always until now been a place in our societies for it. People aren't dying using pot. Perhaps in the war on drugs that targets pot users harsher than they target meth addicts, they may get hurt in process of arrest or because to use pot they end up sucked into the vast drug underworld. But more than the street pot dealers and the huge drug culture out there (that is hardly focused on pot, it is just one of many drugs in that world and not the most popular), there is a LARGE part of our population, the ones people say "Oh my goodness, I'd never have suspected", using pot. I don't get the "want" to be high, but I also as I get older am less inclined to the way even one glass of wine makes me feel. But I can't judge someone who drinks a few drinks at a social gathering any more than I can judge a person who ocassionally uses a bit of pot for the same goals as the person socially drinking. In terms of medical pot, well we have medical laws for pot here and therefore regulation for it. But doctors won't sign patients who clearly meet the strict government criteria. So effectively we are allowed by law, but you are forced to go to a dealer to buy it illegally because the legal avenues are NOT there for Canadians to get their forms filled in. Medical pot laws don't work, for this very reason. Only be regulating something like pot like alcohol, are people going to have access for medical reasons. Sure that would mean those with no medical reason would access it, but we have people who use a shot of brandy for bad nerves or red wine for a heart condition. And we have people who just like a little glow from a drink after a long day. We have laws to protect regulations for alcohol to do our best to help people make good decisions about its use. But ultimately the percentage that use that access to abuse alcohol doesn't stop others from having a use for it that IS socially acceptable and even at times medicinal.

    I can't believe I've ranted so much lol. I guess I just wanted to say that I get your worry. Especially in terms of your difficult child/addict child. I just wanted to say to not give up mentally on your easy child if his life is not something that screams addict at you, simply because you found out a college age kidlet smoked pot. Sometimes it really is a social equal to just having one drink, and doesn't have to mean abuse. There are more factors to this particular "drug", and I do hope that your easy child is nothing to worry about with this. I'd worry far more as well if he was attending those college keg parties where kids are turning up with alcohol poisoning in dorms across the country, Know what I mean??

    Again, apologies for my rant. Didn't mean to get so into the conversation lol. I guess right now I just get tired of pretending I think pot is ALWAYS a evil thing to be feared when I know that it is not always that way. Given your easy child's status AS a easy child, I felt like maybe offering a different perspective. I would prefer my kids never touch pot, except I would be supportive if they used it for true medical reasons as I've explained I have. I've had a huge discussion, very open, with my difficult child about pot and alcohol etc. He can't stand alcohol for his own reasons and doubt that will change. He was honest that he'd smoked pot and hated it too, done sitting around a room with a bunch of teens smoking enough to space them right out etc. He hated the feeling of the "high". He can't see smoking just a "bit" either, if there is no high, why use it? So he doesn't like being high, no point to smoke except to get high. But he does understand that smoking not enough to be high but enough to correct painful medical things would be something he would do. The only benefit he found of his pot experiments actually was his familial essential tremors calmed, and he didn't shake and could tie his shoes and use a knife again. To him the benefit of that isn't worth the ick factor he gets smoking pot so he doesn't use it to treat his tremors. But he now can understand the benefit to MY body and that I don't smoke enough for a "high" but if it is enough to get me a bit light headed, the benefits outweigh the brief "buzz". When taking hard care pain medications? I was a zombie. Far more high than a months amount of pot I smoke combined to smoke all at once.
  11. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    Since Onyxx was caught smoking pot in a vacant house last Friday... I can say that, really, I see it this way...

    IT'S ILLEGAL HERE. It is against the law for her to smoke tobacco, too. The fact that she is willing to break these laws, in addition to illegally entering a vacant home, etc. - that's my biggest gripe. In addition - I see a difference between using it medicinally and for the high - which is how Onyxx uses it - for the high. That and any medications she can get her hands on - hence our safe for medications.

    I've smoked pot. Not in a long, long time - because it made me paranoid, gave me a headache and red eyes. It did not relax me. So... For me, it's a why bother.
  12. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Grandpa

    I'd agree with Mattsmom that if easy child is otherwise a easy child, which seems to be the case since his grades are pretty good, then experimenting with pot is not in and of itself that bad. He is running a risk of trouble with the law, for sure, but probably pretty minor, all things considered. I do know several people who use pot occasionally but aren't potheads, just as I know many people who have a drink or two now and then who aren't alcoholics. The only difference being legality. Since it is against the law, whether justifiably so (vis-a-vis alcohol) or not, that does introduce the problem of law-breaking - although even law-breaking has degrees (who hasn't exceeded the speed limit?).

    So unless easy child shows other signs of GFGness, I wouldn't be too concerned. Watchful, but not panicking.
  13. Mom2oddson

    Mom2oddson Active Member

    Thank you for all your wonderfull support!

    easy child is a good kid. He always has been. He has always worked hard in school, worked hard at any job or chore he's had. He takes full responsibility for all his actions. If something goes wrong in his life, like a bad grade, and you say "I'm sorry to hear that." He'll tell you not to feel sorry for him, it did or didn't do whatever and it's the consequences of his behavior. He's had a credit card for 3 years and has always paid the bill in full every month.

    And I think for me, it was a gut reaction of "Oh Crud!" (cleaned up for sensors sake). With both Steph and Ant having addictions problems and husband being a recovery addict himself, and seeing all the pain and struggles that come/came with it, I was totally freaked out that easy child was going to live through it too.

    easy child & I have had many conversations over the last couple of days. He's actually in counseling with one of his pysch professors dealing with his issues. easy child has always come across as someone with a huge sense of self-confidence and he didn't want to worry me. So he didn't tell me that most of it is an act. He's been dealing with his prof because when he's in a social setting with his friends, he has a hard time standing against his peers and their actions.

    And unlike Steph, Ant and husband, easy child doesn't show the addictive personalities of the rest of the family. And easy child understands the risks and the dangers. He's seen it first-hand with most of husband's family. And the fact that he sought out help before he was caught had to, says a lot about him being aware of the danger in what he is doing.

    And when I had calmed down and relistened to the voicemail (and listened to the end), it wasn't as bad as I first thought. A group of college juniors who just finished their last finals, talking about drugs, alcohol and girls...bragging about all of it and then ending up ordering pizza and playing video games.....Yeah....Mommy over-reacted. But, like I told easy child, it was the universe showing him that he will never get away with anything. Your Mom will ALWAYS find out anytime you do something stupid.

    Thanks for all the support!
  14. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Grandpa

    That really made me grin, because it was a watchword with all our kids. "You can't put one over on Mom, she always finds out." And she always did, sooner or later.
  15. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful


    Mine still think I have a crystal ball stashed somewhere.........

    Maybe I do, maybe I don't. :winks:

    Simple fact is that at some point or another a kid is going to try pot, beer or what have you. Doesn't make it right, especially for the pot, and the beer if they're under age.......but they do it anyway.

    Nichole's husband..........Mr. Teatotaller himself, has suddenly decided he wants to drink socially. It's not the drinking that bothers me. He's of legal age. It's the reason that has me wondering. He wants to fit in better with his peers at work........Ok, the guy is going to be 25 yrs old. Seriously? Has me a teeny bit worried because his dad is a functioning alcoholic as his his grandfather. And Nichole's husband can't handle cough medicine or allergy medications. lol I didn't say anything, he's legal. But Nichole told me it makes her uncomfortable because his reasons are childish and stupid. So if the guy that lectured Nichole for weeks on end on drinking can suddenly decide for silly reasons to drink.......ehh, goes to show you.

    I tried it a few times. I wasn't impressed. It didn't relax me, it didn't really make me high either. I was sort of well heck, what's all the fuss about. And never bothered again. lol
  16. mrsammler

    mrsammler Guest

    Pot is a tough topic for me. I smoked it quite a bit in my first 3 semesters of college after having been a fairly perfect kid in high school: varsity athlete, top student, drank beer with friends on weekend nights my jr & sr years, just like everyone else, but that was about it. Then pot in college led me right down the rabbit hole into taking many other drugs, especially LSD, and after 3 semesters I lost my scholarship and dropped out. Another year in my home town, smoking pot when I could get it, and getting nowhere in life before I decided I'd better enlist in the army and get my life together. That worked and I got my life back in order and, except for a few low-level post-party incidents here and there in adulthood, have never smoked it again. So for me, pot was the classic gateway drug that led me to ruin in youth.

    However, I have friends who are are successful, accomplished adults who smoke it occasionally and discreetly (i.e., never at home or around the kids--more like smoking a joint on the tee box of the 18th bowl at the end of a Sunday round of golf, or occasionally with other adult friends on the back deck after a dinner party, that sort of thing.

    So my conclusion is that pot is very bad for young people who haven't finished their schooling yet and haven't settled into mature, effective adulthood and the good, embedded habits that accompany solid adulthood. I've told my kids my story wrt pot and have urged them all to stay away from it until they've finished college and started a career and feel like they've got their adulthood well underway and things are going well in life. If they decide then to enjoy pot occasionally with other accomplished, effective adults who are enjoying it occasionally in much the same way that adults enjoy cocktails together socially, that's their business and so long as it doesn't negatively effect their lives or become a habit instead of an occasional treat, I can't see how it could be a problem. So far, my orientation to pot seems to be theirs too--they've all (except my teenage son, who's had access to it but has never tried it and regards it as a "loser" activity) tried it in college but never fell into consistent use of it; I'm pretty sure that none of them have smoked it more than a couple of times, as they all regard it as having a taint of "loserdom."

    There's nothing intrinsically wrong with pot--it is far less destructive, in terms of health issues and lost lives via traffic accidents, than alcohol, for instance. But it does put young people in the company of people who are essentially criminals--anyone who sells pot is a criminal, period--and who offer access to more serious drugs. On that basis alone, I don't like it and don't want my kids using it, at least while they're still in school. Life offers enough trouble and difficulty--why add this too?