Family of Origin (FOO) Support Thread Part 2

[Copabanana]

he told me Dixie was DEAD!!!!!!

I am so sorry, Belle. This may well be the crime of animal abuse.

Honestly, I do not know what to tell you. I think you need to leave it in your son's hands. Perhaps this will be the straw that broke the camel's back.

SWOT will be beside herself and she will know what to do.

How utterly horrible. Try not to talk to your son about it more because the more emotional you are the more he will react and blame you for your emotion.

Rest up and the others will get back to you tomorrow morning.

I am so sorry.

COPA

 

[nerfherder]

I wouldn't trust my kids with anyone who was incapable of caring for a pet.

 

[BusynMember]

Oh, Belle, Copa is right. Your news made me cry. I have an insatiable love of all animals, but especially our dog babies. They are members of my family. And we adopted a boy who killed two of our dogs. We thought it was neighbors who did it the first time. I was too griefstricken to think clearly. The second time, he killed a new puppy we had and this always puts me in tears. He did it on purpose and made my younger kids watch. Animal abuse is closely tied to sociopathic/psychopathic personality disorder. I would never ever ever ever ever give a beloved pet to your daughter to care for. You can't. We take our doggies almost everywhere with us now. We are so protective of these two since we lost two to this very twisted child who was forced to leave our home after we found out we he also molesting our younger kids. We said "OUT!" There are some things where we don't believe in second chances and some kids too sick to fix. I never wanted to see him again.

I d o not know if I'd have the heart or forgiveness at this time to talk to my child, if this were me. Knowing how important your precious dog was to you...he let this happen then mocked you for caring so much. I would be in no mood to see this child or talk to him...you will not find out the truth anyway and the "why" doesn't matter as there is no good answer. YOU need to heal. HE needs to start seriously looking at who he is...or this is who he will stay.

It will help you if your child will give you the body so you can have her cremeated and keep her with you. Maybe grow a tree in her honor. She is watching over you. She knows you love her.

You can also go to a grief group for pets. I would have to go.

I don't know where you are with your daughter now, Belle, but for me that could be a dealbreaker. You don't know how your baby died...if it was neglect or your daughter...did something. You will never know. Either way, she has no feelings about it. She has become dangerous and you need to keep yourself, the sanctuary of your home, your other children if any, your SO if any, and your peace of mind save and sound from this sort of ugliness.

In the meantime, if you can't get the body from your sib (which is even more cruel of him) then build a memorial for your baby and plant a tree in her honor anyways. The planting of a tree symbolizes life. When I go, I am thinking of being cremated and having a tree planted...one life to make up for a death.

I wouldn't let this child back in t he house. But I'm the dog lover. This is not a crime I can overlook. My dogs are my therapy, my friends when I don't have any, and my babies. And two were killed by a child who had no love in himat all and after hearing about what he was doing behind our back, we called CPS to take him and the adoption was dissolved.

I will think about you all day and more and hope you can find some peace out of this horror. If you have other animals make sure your daughter gets nowhere near them. Daughter, right? I forget.

Do not trust a disturbed person with your pet, even if they act like they love the pet. Our adopted son, who we no longer have in our custody, acted like he loved all of our pets. It never occurred to me that he'd kill any. A cat went missing on his watch too and we sadly thought she ran away. Now I beileve he strangled the poor thing because my youngest told us, after he was long gone, that she caught him strangling a neighbors cat and when she saw him, she screamed and he let the cat go and it ran away.

Our cat would not have just disappeared.

Go to therapy for this. It is a major loss. Yes, non-pet lovers will not understand.

Belle, keep us posted. We are here. I'm off on Mondays.

I want to pass along what CPS shared with us and I have read since that verifies this: There are three danger/red flags that indicate possible impending antisocial personality disorder (psychopathy) in people. These are the three: 1/playing or fascination with fire, 2/ inappropriate pooping and peeing habits or 3/ cruelty to animals.

Most serial killers have done all three of these markers.

Watch yourself. And pray for your doggie in the way of your beliefs. She is in a better place now, at least according to my beliefs, and will wait for you, and you will meet again. Idon't know if it gives YOU comfort, but perhsps my strong belief that this will happen may help you.

Hugs and tears and lots of empathy.

 

[allusedup]

Serenity, Dixie was the puppy I was going to get after I got back from my trip. The puppy the crazy b $!@h begged my son for. The puppy she neglected to death or strangled. I am sick to my stomach. I never want to see her again. This is the crazy woman that my son is living with that I have been trying to tell you all about. Unfortunately she has a son who is 3. She is doing a remarkable job of screwing him up. I feel sure the poor kid has ODD. That's why (and this current episode) is why I told my son if he messes up and gets her pregnant that I will be forced to sue for custody.

 

[allusedup]

And will somebody please tell me why I feel like this is MY fault? If she had said "I am going to kill her or I am not going to take care of her" I would certainly taken her that day. Now I feel responsible because I didn't.

 

[BusynMember]

Belle, my heart bleeds. I hope you do get a puppy to love on. You deserve one, they are great comfort.

Belle, one thing all of us had to learn is that our disturbed children pick these nuts for a reason. They themselves are not doing well and many are drug addicts. The blame for your son's behavior is on his shoulders, not hers. He would not be all better without her. He'd find another one like her. That's what they do. Like finds like. Nice kids do not hang with creeps and drug users and vice versa. It's kind of like, in a simplistic way, that a clique of adults who like to party and drink usually do not attract non-drinkers to their club and would feel uncomfortable if they were around.

Birds of a feather stick together.

Your son is of the age where he is responsible for his behavior. He may be in more trouble than you know. It can't just be her. He wouldn't put up with her if he wasn't involved in the same drama and bad stuff she is. It is very hard for us to face at first. We finally do find out, and if we are not prepared at all, we are knocked off our feet.

Do you think I wanted to believe my gorgeous little daughter who was so sweet was doing meth? Do you think I even believed it until she told me? No, I thought it was just mostly pot. I didn't even know she drank a lot. They are good at hiding it.

Again, I am sick for you and if it were me I'd ban her from my sight. I'd never look at her again. Ick. Killing a puppy. She is too strung out on drugs to have a pet.

I hope you find peace and comfort in the little things today. Look at the trees, the sky, the flowers, the things that are beautiful and that can never be taken away from you. Try to be nice to YOU today. You deserve it and have been through such trauma.[/QUOTE]

 

[BusynMember]

And will somebody please tell me why I feel like this is MY fault? If she had said "I am going to kill her or I am not going to take care of her" I would certainly taken her that day. Now I feel responsible because I didn't.

You couldn't imagine anyone doing that to a puppy. Blaming yourself won't do any good. Maybe in her honor, adopt a shelter dog. That is something we did after our crazy adoptive son killed our dogs. I felt like they would want me to do it. That helped my heart. I felt like the death of my dogs AND the molestation of my young kids were my fault. He did it right under our noses and we didn't have a clue and our young children were too terrified of him to tell us. He said he'd kill us all and himself if they ever told. He demonstrated it by lighting little fires in his room that we never saw (big house). The kids said they were sure he'd burn the house down with us in it. He also told them he was the Devil and they believed him. They were so young. We were lucky for all the free help we could from social services. They covered all the therapy that saved us all...if our family had not been such a strong unit, we would have imploded.

 

[allusedup]

I feel my son is using these women to replace his original abuser.....his father. He quit smoking pot a year ago and has to be drug tested for his job and we know those tests don't forgive. He is so much like I was when I was his age, it scares me. Wanting someone to love and love him back at almost any price. I don't know how to talk to him about his father. Someone please tell me how do I approach it?

 

[Copabanana]

I don't know how to talk to him about his father. Someone please tell me how do I approach it?

The thought that the woman killed the dog so that you would not get it just entered my mind. I wish it would leave.

I forget how old your son is, but I do not think now is the time to have that conversation. Your son is witnessing what happened with the dog. You said your peace to him about that event.

For him to listen to and take to heart any conversation about his upbringing and experience with his father, I believe he would have to initiate it.

Right now he is being defensive, I think. He would not hear you and could become angry.

If the woman deliberately killed that dog, and we seem to think she did, there is already present enough objective information for your son to act on, and get out of the relationship. If he wants to.

If he does not, there is something within him that is keeping him there. If that is the case only he can work it out.

You will have to learn how to deal with your own sense of guilt and fear, yourself.

Perhaps others will think differently but I think the dynamics of your son's childhood are no longer something that is your responsibility to handle or to broach to your son, unless he puts the topic on the table and asks you. If he were to tell you he is suffering in relationships it might be appropriate to mention the possibility of therapy to deal with the experience of abuse. Barring those types of direct conversations, I think you should say nothing.

His past is his responsibility to deal with, now. Your past is yours to deal with, including your feelings about the past of your son with you.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

What a horrible shock, Belle. Did son tell you how or when the puppy died?

SWOT's thought of choosing a dog from the Shelter in the puppy's name is beautiful. I hope you do that, Belle.

Perhaps the only way to respond to hatred and cruelty is in doing things like SWOT suggested ~ to stop the damage, and then respond to the cruel injustice through intentional kindness.

I really like that thought, SWOT. SWOT, you have been through so much with your children. Strength and belief that you could, and intention to love and to heal pulled your family through it together. That gives me reason to know mine can come together again, too.
And even that, whatever happened in my own upbringing, determination to find and heal it can work for me, too.

***

So, this is what I am up to this morning.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/stop-walking-eggshells/201109/the-w

This is a blog about the effects on children of the various kinds of moms. I am reading there to learn what kind of damaged mom I might have been for my kids, too. It is never too late to change our patterns, and I would like to be as healthy a mom even now, as I can be. (I watched Joel Osteen yesterday. It was about blessing our children with our words ~ or the opposite.)

I think I found my sister in the subset Queen. I was forever wondering SWOT, whether it was a good thing for you to have read so heavily into the various personality disorders.

Here I am, doing the same thing. It clarifies and saves time and validates what I thought I was sure I saw but found myself, instead of being able to incorporate the pieces of the puzzle I was trying to put together, wondering what was the matter with me that I would think such things about my own mom or my own sister.

You know what it is...I think I had to be healthier enough myself before I could believe that what seemed to be happening could be the result of someone else's shortcomings, and not somehow my own. If I had been kinder and etc. Or, if I had been more honest and angry and demanding instead of accommodating.

I've developed a ravening curiosity, especially for those sites which list what the effects of having been parented by (or having been the sibling of) someone with such and such a disorder. If I find myself in there, that is how I have been tracing back to a name for the person's disorder.

***

Effect of Witch Behavior on Children

"Children live in terror of witches' capricious moods. They are collateral damage in a secret war they did not start, do not understand, and cannot control.

...

Attacks are random, intense, and cruel. Children automatically think they're at fault and can become shamed, depressed, insecure, dissociative, and hypervigilant."

***

So, what I see here is that, with the changes happening after my father's death these same patterns of response began happening to me as an adult. That dinner I am always posting about was what I knew of how it could be. I felt that it was some shortcoming on my part that those good changes had not happened for us.

That was good imagery. I like that I did that. As we went through this process here on the site, I had begun to feel that I'd been foolish, and had allowed not only myself, but my D H and kids too, to have been taken advantage of through some weakness, through some reluctance to deal with inappropriate things as they arose maybe, on my part. That kind of thinking left me vulnerable. This morning, I am understanding that my family of origin is just doing what they do. It feels so good to know that. I can let go of that sense of responsibility for failing to bring us all together, which is what was represented by that family dinner. At the same time, I recognize integrity and forgiveness in my having believed we could come together, and in wanting that instead of vengeance. When the kids were okay, I lived some modified version of "Living well is the best revenge." When the family D H and I created fell apart, the sense of rightness in trying to do the best thing I knew fell apart with the admission that I didn't know the best thing, anymore. Fatally, I turned to FOO, who were all too ready to condemn me regarding the terrible things that were happening with my kids as they would have condemned, ridiculed, and found satisfaction for any confusion or loss in my life.

And what I am learning now as regards the behavior of my FOO is that, like all abuse, their actions and responses, however rotten and seemingly senseless, have nothing to do with me or my kids.

Abusers abuse because they are abusers.

There is freedom there from a whole chain of consciousness kind of thinking having to do with the kinds of self image we take from our FOO.

Here again, Joel Osteen's admonishment that the words we say to our kids matter, however old they are ~ this applies to my kids, too. It is never too late to do a good thing, to have a look at the patterns we've set up in our families, and change what we can for the better through changing our words and behaviors.

So, that's good, then.

I have been reading about how to do that. Saying "You are some good thing." has been found to limit both kids and adults because it seems that our good (or bad, I suppose) qualities are inherent and therefore, unchangeable. It takes away the power of determination, to speak words implying that the child (or adult, or even ourselves, in our self talk) just is something good or bad. Here is material from the following book.

Succeed: How We Reach Our Goals, by someone whose last name is Halvorson.

"Abilities are not innate and unchangeable."

"No matter the ability ~ whether it's intelligence, creativity, self control, charm, or athleticism ~ studies show them to be profoundly malleable. When it comes to mastering any skill, your experience, effort, and persistence matter a lot. (This would fit in with Tipping Point author Malcolm Gladwell's contention that we master what we master only after 10,000 hours at it.) So if you were a Bright Girl (this is the girl used to doing well without having to try) it's time to toss out your (mistaken) belief about how ability works, embrace the fact that you can always improve, and reclaim the confidence to tackle any challenge that you lost so long ago."

Somewhere in there: Through our mistaken beliefs about our abilities we may be our own worst enemy.

So.

This all comes together very nicely for those raised to believe nothing we do is worth the effort put into it and raised also to believe we are missing some essential something which will make it impossible for us to succeed ~ that however hard we try, the results will be so substandard it would have been less shaming for us never to have tried, at all. (Like I was raised to believe I cannot think appropriately because I "am the romantic of the family." Or like SWOT was, in having been told repeatedly that she was bad or stupid.

***

Now that I have read a little about the effects of whatever personality disorder it is and found myself there, I can let go of responsibility for what's happened in my FOO. I can let go of feeling judged and found wanting or even, of feeling condemned and ostracized for something I don't understand. That is the true benefit to me of having read through this material.

:O)

Cedar

I love it so much to have found research indicating it is never too late. That must be a FOO thing, too.

Hopelessness; that feeling that even to try is doomed so who do we think we are, when we take on any challenge. That essential weakening belief system is very strong in me, and led, I am sure, to self sabotage on many levels.

Remember "That'll do, pig."

Isn't that something.

 

[BusynMember]

His past is his responsibility to deal with, now. Your past is yours to deal with, including your feelings about the past of your son with you.

Yep. All of us here are coping with our pasts. Nobody can fix us (including w hat happened to us and how that affects us) except us.

 

[Copabanana]

I am still popped into that shocked place. Because they would have to hate me, they would have to have focused on and hated me, personally, me, to do what they've done.

I do not think that inside of their minds it feels like hate....I asked my son, in the cafe on Friday, why did you yell at me across the restaurant and not approach the table to speak to me?

He replied that he hates himself so much that he cannot be close to me.

Cedar, you wrote something like that, that my son hates me the most because I love and accept him, and if everybody else were to turn away, I would still be there. In his mind that stigmatizes me. I am the club that accepts him as a member and he would never want to join.

Which is another way of saying that familiarity breeds contempt.

Let us look at your family for a minute. Let's say you played my role. The love machine. Taken for granted. The last resort. What would Cedar do?

And then you are not. With your husband you gain backbone and structure, and worst of all stuff they want and cannot have without your consent. You can say yes or no. Now.

Whaaat? How dare she? Does she not know who she is? Her essential nature? The travesty.

They are not feeling hate, I think. At least initially. I think they feel pain, and they blame you for it. Then when the pain does not stop they feel rage, because they feel themselves to be your victim. Because you hurt them.

You have become the abuser, because you are not giving them what they seek from you to which they feel entitled. You caused them pain. You deliberately inflicted it. You changed. Their ill feelings, to them, are justified. A natural consequence of your acts towards them. Or the opposite. What we did not do and should have. And it is only then that they may feel hate. Like my sister hates me. She hates me because of what I did to her or did not do. Even if it was only protecting myself or mother.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

I am thinking about this idea of how they may see me, Copa. The difference I see is that my FOO attack and disparage in subtle ways always. Sort of...encouraging self sabotage would be a good description. It is when I have been vulnerable in the sense of needing information I could not attain elsewhere (talking about the baptism, here ~ remember, no internet back then), or when I was so broken over my daughter that the gloves come off. So, are you saying the the steady, underlying hatred that kind of behavior represents is come of disappointment in me for having messed up in my assigned role?

That could make sense, Copa.

I will be thinking about that today.

Thank you, Copa.

:O)

Cedar

I like that explanation very much. There is compassion for all of us there; I could put this away with something so much different than "Ours is an ugly story."

 

[Copabanana]

he difference I see is that my FOO attack and disparage in subtle ways always. Sort of...encouraging self sabotage would be a good description.

Seduction is the word that comes to mind.

The Cedar they want is different than the one you have chosen. They could care less what you want. They want the Old Cedar and they try to seduce her back.

The sense of self-sabotage is within you. You are the only one who cares that you have a choice between old and revised Cedars, and that if you choose old, it would be self-sabotage and a betrayal of self.

Believe me your sister and mother could care less that you act with integrity towards yourself. They will never understand. Nor is it necessary they do so.

All they are trying to do is to get the attention of old Cedar. Unfortunately, this causes a great deal of discomfort in you because old Cedar is still you too.

As I write this I recognize that this may be what is fueling the resentment and bad behavior of my son towards me (I started a new thread on PE). He could care less whether it hurts me to be his old Mom. He much preferred her, thank you. And he is doing whatever he can to punish revised Mom, as a result.

 

[BusynMember]

I've developed a ravening curiosity, especially for those sites which list what the effects of having been parented by (or having been the sibling of) someone with such and such a disorder. If I find myself in there, that is how I have been tracing back to a name for the person's disorder.

LOL! I had that addiction for a long time. I am very curious about human behavior. The problem is, when I started doing that I was focused on my own badness so I saw MYSELF only in those words. And had the bad sense to tell that to my sis and bro and they agreed...lol. When my head cleared, and my Sister's head cleared because she read bout borderline, both of us thought I didn't have it. But now it's used as a weapon. Ah, so what?

 

[BusynMember]

He replied that he hates himself so much that he cannot be close to me.

Attachment Disorder.

READ THIS. All of us will see some of ourselves in there too because none of us were nurtured as children and maybe not even held and massaged and hugged as infants. My mother didn't do it. I am sure I had attachment issues, but I worked so hard on myself that I know now that I can not only love but accept love. It was a close call, but I got the therapy in time and was able to stop it.

But, Copa, your son was in an orphanage in his early years. Read this, all. It is about a disorder that usually only some adoptive parents know about because almost all older adoptees have it. And adults who had unloving parents can have it too. It can ruin your life. Self-sabatage your life. Or somebody else's.

Adult Attachment Disorder

This is a subject I haven't lived with. But Bear is 16 and fast approaching adulthood. I see on my stat counter that often this is a topic that is googled. So I thought I'd dig around a little and see what I can find. What I find is that living with an adult with attachment disorder would be a tough tough life. This first information is from Evergreen Consultants. I bet anything people with adult attachment disorder are diagnosed with personality disorders. It would be tough to tell the difference. I think, as a mom observer, the key is looking at what lies underneath. What started it all? Was there some form of abandonment or severe neglect especially in the first 3 years of life?

"Unresolved childhood attachment issues leave an adult vulnerable to difficulties in forming secure adult relationships. Patterns of attachment continue through the life cycle and across generations. New relations are affected by the expectations developed in past relationships. There is a strong correlation between insecure adult attachment and marital dissatisfaction and negative marital interactions. If an adult does not feel safe with others, he/she will tend to be either rejecting of their partner or overly clingy. Attachment problems are often handed down transgenerationally unless someone breaks the chain. As a parent, an insecurely attached adult may lack the ability to form a strong attachment to their child and provide the necessary attachment cues required for the healthy emotional development of the child thereby predisposing their child to a lifetime of relationship difficulties. Depending on the genetic personality style of the individual and the early life events experienced, insecurely attached adults fall in one of two categories of insecure attachment:
AVOIDANT
Intense anger and loss
Hostile
Critical of others
Sensitive to blame
Lack of empathy
Views others as untrustworthy
Views others as undependable
Views self as unlovable or "too good" for others
Relationships feel either threatening to one's sense of control, not worth the effort, or both
Compulsive self-reliance
Passive withdrawal
Low levels of perceived support
Difficulty getting along with co-workers, often preferring to work alone
Work may provide a good excuse to avoid personal relations
Fear of closeness in relationships
Avoidance of intimacy
Unlikely to idealize the love relationship
Tendency toward Introjective depression (self critical)
ANXIOUS/AMBIVALENT
Compulsive Care giving
Feel over involved and under appreciated
Rapid relationship breakups
Idealizing of others
Strong desire for partner to reciprocate in relationship
Desire for extensive contact and declarations of affections
Over invests his/her emotions in a relationship
Perceives relationships as imbalanced
Relationship is idealized
Preoccupation with relationship
Dependence on relationship
Heavy reliance on partner
Views partner as desirable but unpredictable (sometimes available, sometimes not)
Perceives others as difficult to understand
Relationship is primary method by which one can experience a sense of security
Unlikely to view others as altruistic
Sensitive to rejection
Discomfort with anger
Extreme emotions
Jealous
Possessive
Views self as unlovable
Suicide attempts
Mood swings
Tendency toward anaclitic depression (dependent depression) "

There is a site with an adult attachment disorder support group.

"You say you are struggling; many with depression, anxiety, self mutilation, sadness, a loss of self worth, lonely, and feelings of just not being good enough. So why put hearts on a site where people are suffering and lonely? The hearts are there to remind you that people really do love you and care about you. You are not alone and you really are lovable. Really! I'll say that again in case you missed that. You really are lovable! So when you are feeling lonely, sad, depressed, or thinking you are not worthy, remember the hearts, you are lovable!
Here you will find adults working at overcoming attachment disorder, adults who have overcome attachment disorder, or adults who have relationships with someone who has attachment disorder."

The Institute for Attachment & Child Development has excellent information but their site is copyrighted so here is a link: http://www.instituteforattachment.org/

If you live with someone who has Attachment Disorder as an adult there is hope. I have a dear friend who has a relative who began her healing from Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) in her 60s and is doing very well. ALL things are possible. Never give up hope. Be determined to find the help you and your family need.
Posted by Brenda at 7:20 AM
Labels: adult attachment disorder, Reactive Attachment Disorder
15 comments:
Simply Moms said...
We've got a few posts about adult Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) too. Unless the cycle is broken...relationships are devastated. Speaking from multiple firsthand experiences....it is not a pretty picture. You are right....adult Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) is often misdiagnosed and sadly.....causes more Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD).

December 10, 2008 at 5:15 PM
Brenda said...
Simply Moms,

That is so sad. I think all we can do is try to educate our friends, doctors, everyone we come into contact with. It is still so unknown.

December 10, 2008 at 6:05 PM
Anonymous said...
You might want to check out this discussion here:

http://answers.psychcentral.com/published/page/4/

it is from an undiagnosed RADster who lives in a 12 year celibate marriage.

March 8, 2009 at 10:18 AM
Angeni said...
Thanks for the info. It is confusing and frustrating to experience that it's so hard to get the right diagnosis. I am 37 yrs old and have known something is "wrong" since I was a kid. I have been diagnosed with ME/Chronic Fatigue, depression, PTSD and some other "stuff". After reading here about Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) I found info on C-PTSD. Which is probably a little more accurate for me.

I just want to add that whether it is Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) or C-PTSD it made my life nearly unbearable in relationships, friendships, couldn't finish college because of being undiagnosed at the time. I also passed on some things to my daughter during pregnancy. I had to stop working because of the anxiety and panic. It also caused adrenal exhaustion.
Understanding the influence of the attachment disorder and the unsafety during childhood makes me feel better. It helps me understand why I physically/emotionally respond the way I do. At the moment I am doing Brain State Conditioning developed by Lee Gerdes. The good thing is, you don't need an exact diagnosis for the treatment. It is based on the assessment of the brain and conditioning it back in a balanced state.

It is important to realise it is vital to understand what is going on in order to deal with it better and mourn your childhood. In my experience it is often underestimated, even trivialized as long as you act "normal" enough. I have been told to just get a grip many times, while I felt stuck and couldn't get out of my invisible prison, just because I didn't know what was going on.

Everyone deserves to know the truth about their health and background!

February 17, 2010 at 2:38 PM
GrowingUpLost said...
I'm an adult living with Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)... and I can personally agree that it's hell on your personal life... and relationships always seem to fail.

My life is a nightmare on a daily basis, and I continously fight it...

http://growinguplost.wordpress.com

June 2, 2010 at 10:14 AM
Anonymous said...
Hi, recently, after a conversation with a friend, I realized I might suffer from Adult Attachment disorder. The list of symptoms you describe as "avoidant" pretty much define me. When I was a baby I had to put in the hospital for three weeks, and I guess that could be the reason? Other than that I had a pretty normal childhood, although I feel I never really created a bond with my mum (don't know why). My question is, is there a way I can cure or treat this on my own? I don't think I can afford therapy, but it is really affecting my life, specially my love life. Thanks.

October 31, 2010 at 7:37 PM
Anonymous said...
i am 37 i am a mom of an 18 yr old we both have Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) and have attached to each other the rest of our relationships in our life have not beeen good can someone tell me what to do i dont want my son to live with this his whole life

April 23, 2011 at 2:17 PM
Anonymous said...
I have just recently discovered that I am afflicted by Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) or Adult Attachment Disorder. I don't really have a lot of information but it's beginning to shed some light on areas of my life where relationships have been difficult. I am determined to have a fulfilled life and to share genuine feelings towards other people. I have hurt a lot of people by closing up shop whenever I felt obligated or expected to give more of myself. I have been carrying this around for 40 years and I am not committed to the baggage any longer. Does anyone have tips on how to meet this head on with out having to medicate myself or perform hypnosis? I joke but the reality is I see a great person with a lot to offer inside but my difficulty is getting that person to show up on a consistent basis.

November 10, 2011 at 1:21 PM
Becky said...
my friend has just been diagnosed with an attachment disorder and feels he is doomed and it very upset by this all he think that it cannot be cured is this true?

December 13, 2011 at 12:10 PM
Anonymous said...
I am 53, and my natural mother had T.B, and was extremely ill by the time she was pregnant with me. She died when I was 2yrs 8 months, but according to relatives, she had spent time in hospital away from me.
After her death, I was cared for by a number of relatives, which i remember, and was put into various day nurseries, one of which was so appalling I remember it with dread to this day. the regime there was brutal.
My father remarried, and when I was 8, my half brother was born- life changed for me then, as if a switch had been flicked.
My half brother was much longed for, according to the family, and he was worshipped.
I was outcast, and my stepmother said ''It is very hard to love another woman's child'' while pummelling me with her fists. My dad was driven mad by me, so she said, and often beat and kicked me for having a messy room, or not helping willingly around the house.
All my life I have felt ''apart'' from others, as if something was missing.I became addicted to opiate drugs which at first soothed, and this further estranged my family from me.
I have a son, who I love dearly, he is currently 30, and he is the only really good thing in my life.
I find mixing and dealing with people so hard,I have zero self confidence, and just wish I felt less exhausted and low all the time. It was a friend with an adopted daughter who said to me ''I think you have Attachment Disorder''- by dint of my early loss, which , when I tried to go for counselling, the counsellor said my loss was too great for them, the damage too deep, so I was sent away after an initial assessment.
This is a horrible condition, and even now, my stepmother makes me feel like a lesser member of the family [my dad is now passed away], with my two brothers held in high regard, and me not really liked at all.
I am 53, for goodness sake, why do I still feel like a lost child? why do I still care what a spiky 74 yr old woman thinks?
I just wish I could live in control of my own life, instead of feeling lost and like a child!

June 17, 2013 at 9:24 AM
Anonymous said...
I am 53, and my natural mother had T.B, and was extremely ill by the time she was pregnant with me. She died when I was 2yrs 8 months, but according to relatives, she had spent time in hospital away from me.
After her death, I was cared for by a number of relatives, which i remember, and was put into various day nurseries, one of which was so appalling I remember it with dread to this day. the regime there was brutal.
My father remarried, and when I was 8, my half brother was born- life changed for me then, as if a switch had been flicked.
My half brother was much longed for, according to the family, and he was worshipped.
I was outcast, and my stepmother said ''It is very hard to love another woman's child'' while pummelling me with her fists. My dad was driven mad by me, so she said, and often beat and kicked me for having a messy room, or not helping willingly around the house.
All my life I have felt ''apart'' from others, as if something was missing.I became addicted to opiate drugs which at first soothed, and this further estranged my family from me.
I have a son, who I love dearly, he is currently 30, and he is the only really good thing in my life.
I find mixing and dealing with people so hard,I have zero self confidence, and just wish I felt less exhausted and low all the time. It was a friend with an adopted daughter who said to me ''I think you have Attachment Disorder''- by dint of my early loss, which , when I tried to go for counselling, the counsellor said my loss was too great for them, the damage too deep, so I was sent away after an initial assessment.
This is a horrible condition, and even now, my stepmother makes me feel like a lesser member of the family [my dad is now passed away], with my two brothers held in high regard, and me not really liked at all.
I am 53, for goodness sake, why do I still feel like a lost child? why do I still care what a spiky 74 yr old woman thinks?
I just wish I could live in control of my own life, instead of feeling lost and like a child!

June 17, 2013 at 9:25 AM
Anonymous said...
Chеeгs for yοur аrticle.
Learn to cease and defeat paniс аnd anxiety asѕaults.

June 18, 2013 at 11:54 PM
Amanda miller said...
I was told i have Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) i was told along time ago. I have has these problems in my life for a while.
If my boyfriend goes out with his friends i will get mad for real no reason and feel like he hurt me.
Also i cant get over the past if something hurt me i can remeber it and it hurt just as much.
I cant tell you anything i like about my self but that i love my son.
I feel i hurt my loved one mainly my friends and boyfriend emotinal without feeling i did it.
I lie when i feel i am in troble or i guess bord and i dont know why.
Dose any of this mean i have Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) if so please tell me if i can get help and how

July 6, 2013 at 2:53 AM
Anonymous said...
I have lived with this nonsense all my life. I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder and ptsd at 8 after i was adopted. Then it changed to Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) once it became a bit better known around when I was 11ish. Life was hell for me until...well some days it still is hell. But around 14, after 6 years of intensive therapy, trips to the psychiatric ward, intensive care facilities I finally started to care about people. From there I like to think I have changed a lot and that it has gotten easier. I am at least lucky that children are my therapy.. I started going to work at the daycare with my mom at 14 and found that I love interacting with little kids under 5 years old. There is a relaxing quality about taking care of them and most of them are really sweet. The ones that aren't are just plain cute. Angry children aren't threatening or scary even a little bit and it does not take much to gain the trust of most children. Having Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) myself i can work with all kinds of kids a bit easier, from autism to normal kids and especially Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kids. I am actually working towards getting a psychiatric degree and being stable enough to help others with Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) get stable too. Today nearly 11 years after I discovered that being around children was helping me to learn to trust and care about people I am stable "enough" to be mostly happily married, even despite my physical contact issues (which frustrate my husband to no end but I'm better about it now). I have a beautiful, genius level , amazingly healthy, perfectly normal son. I even managed to make a handlful of friends along the way! I still fight panic attacks, depression, general hatred of people, PTSD and social anxiety episodes which sounds much milder than it is. I also still have problems with self harm when overwhelmed (since harming others is no longer an option. But none of that is a problem when my son is around and to a lesser degree my husband. Even in the middle of a quiet panic attack as I call them ( cause no one can tell I am having one generally) they never fail to calm me just entering room. I have never been one to make a scene though. I have almost always been decent and kept my "episodes" for when i was alone or if i absolutely had passed my limit only around my parents/husband ( thank god and goddess for them. Sorry for the rant i am prego with my second and I am wondering how I will manage to keep my son from knowing how screwed up his mother is. I don't want him getting exposed to any of my "episodes " ever no matter how much better they are now. With my first I got a bit worse for a while due to the craziness of being prego and homeless living in crappy tiny houses with too many people to prevent being really homeless. At least we are financially stable now. (I took over the money after that... taking control stresses me out less than not having money) Anyways i guess what I am really trying to say is that it takes a very long long time to even begin to heal but eventually with enough help, support and social acclimatation it does get better. Just don't get discouraged too much, something I know is almost impossible. If I had any advice for both parents and people with Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) it would be in my motto "all thing go away, be it now or when you or it are dead". That sounds bad or cliche I know, but my motto used to only contain the first part so you can see the progress right?

July 19, 2013 at 2:03 AM
Anonymous said...
A lot of this disorder is based on developmental trauma. For anyone else who stumbles on this blog after I do, help is "easier" than you think. I can personally recommend a therapy called "somatic experiencing" that can go a long way... for more information, read "Waking the Tiger" by Peter Levine, and then "Healing Developmental Trauma" by Laurence Heller.

July 31, 2013 at 2:34 PM


Find an Attachment Therapist

• RADkid recommendations
• Attach members
• Nancy Thomas suggested therapists

Symptoms of Reactive Attachment Disorder (as listed by Mayo Clinic)
"Reactive attachment disorder is broken into two types — inhibited and disinhibited. While some children have signs and symptoms of just one type, many children have both.

Inhibited type:
In inhibited reactive attachment disorder, children shun relationships and attachments to virtually everyone. This may happen when a baby never has the chance to develop an attachment to any caregiver.
Signs and symptoms of the inhibited type may include:
Resisting affection from parents or caregivers
Avoiding eye contact
Appearing to seek contact but then turning away
Difficulty being comforted
Preferring to play alone
Avoiding physical contact
Failing to initiate contact with others
Appearing to be on guard or wary
Engaging in self-soothing behavior

Disinhibited type:
In disinhibited reactive attachment disorder, children form inappropriate and shallow attachments to virtually everyone, including strangers. This may happen when a baby has multiple caregivers or frequent changes in caregivers.
Signs and symptoms of the disinhibited type may include:
Readily going to strangers, rather than showing stranger anxiety
Seeking comfort from strangers
Exaggerating needs for help doing tasks
Inappropriately childish behavior
Appearing anxious
A word of caution: Not all experts agree on the signs and symptoms of reactive attachment disorder. Some attachment therapists use checklists with numerous nonspecific signs and symptoms that go well beyond what the American Psychiatric Association includes in its definition of the disorder. Be cautious when trying to interpret checklists that include such symptoms as lack of eye contact, rage, aggression, lying, stealing, hoarding food, an apparent lack of a conscience, nonstop chatter, and a desire to wield control. These nonspecific symptoms are difficult to apply to any one diagnosis."

My own two children present their cases of Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) very differently from one another. A professional diagnosis is necessary as other disorders share some of the symptoms. If you are frustrated because your child has worked with a variety of therapists and a variety of treatments with no change maybe you should have him/her checked for Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) with an experienced Attachment Therapist. There is help. You are not alone.
Disclaimer:
Reactive Attachment Disorder (Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)) is a profound disturbance. If you suspect your child may have Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) please seek the professional counsel of an attachment therapist. Above you will find links that will hopefully help you find an attachment therapist. This blog is just my thoughts and ideas as an adoptive mom. I do not know your child and cannot be responsible for results from trying any ideas you find on this blog.

One can live in the shadow of an idea without grasping it.Elizabeth Bowen
Favorite Books About Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)

• Attaching in Adoption
• Change Your Brain Change Your Life
• Dandelion On My Pillow Butcher Knife Beneath
• The Miracle Worker
• When Love Is Not Enough

Websites on Reactive Attachment Disorder

• Beyond Consequences
• Center 4 Family Development
• My Website for mom's about taking care of yourself
• Nancy Thomas Parenting
• RadKids
• The Attachment Disorder Site
• Trauma Adoption

Blogs from mom's dealing with Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD)/Adoption issues

• Attaching Hearts
• Center 4 Family Development Blog
• Crawford Life & Times
• Eyes Opened Wider
• Family Gregg
• Finding Our Way to Family
• Gold to Refine
• Leaders In Learning
• Life In The Crazy House
• My Radical Family
• Neither Here Nor There
• Pieces From Me
• Raising Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) Kids
• Rancho Chico
• Sanity Searcher
• Stellar Parenting
• Stubborn Fish Tales
• The Accidental Mommy
• Watching the Waters
• We May Not Have It All Together, But Together We Have It All
• Welcome To My Brain

 

[Copabanana]

I feel so sad to think he has Attachment Disorder. We loved each other so much. He attached so well and completely at 22 months and thereafter.

I am planning my trip. That is the only way I can cope with this. I have said my piece to him about necessary treatments. I will help my son to the extent that he wants to and I am able. He knows what he needs to do. He needs to re-enter treatment and continue. If he needs a lifelong protected environment, he can find it there. The Big City near us is among the best places in the USA I think to find what he needs. He just needs to accept it.

What my son does is beyond my control now. I will put aside my lobbying for treatments of any sort. I have done what I can do. I will concentrate on my own, on M's and our welfare together as the only priorities.

I will no longer explain to my son how I feel. I will cut short our phone conversations. He can no longer come to my home. I will no longer go anywhere with him where I cannot get away quickly.

When I get to my cross country destination I will go to as many Coda and Al Anon meetings as I need to to achieve a semblance of well-being.

My course is set, as is my son's and they are independent. I see there is no other way.
___
All kinds of beautiful new clothes and shoes have been arriving at my house. They are all 'my style." The 15 pounds plus weight loss has given me back my face. My hair is in a long braid. I am happy looking at myself even without any makeup, once again. I do not want to keep all of the clothes because I do not want to stay at this weight. It will be hard to decide. What a great problem to have.
____
There seems to be a consensus that my son's problems are severe, disabling and global. How could I have missed this? What planet have I been living on? I have such grief for him. How can I be with him if I accept there is no recovery from this?

He saw a Psychiatrist since 6th grade. How did that person miss this? How do I live with this and go on? How can I find a way to be with my son in a way that is gratifying? Will he ever come back to me in a way that we can love each other as we once did, even remotely? In a way that is relaxed and comfortable and positive?

 

[BusynMember]

He saw a Psychiatrist since 6th grade.

You can not see a psychiatrist once and not go back. Diagnosis is an ongoing, long process and the doctor needs to get to know the child and often I like to get second and even third opinions. It isn't like going to an Internist for a virus. On top of that, if indeed attachment disorder is part of this picture, and I'd personally be shocked if it is not at least part of it, many psychiatrists don't really know about it yet. It is starting to get more noticed. At one time, when I adopted Goneboy, it was pretty much felt that only adopted children who were older could get attachment disorder so since that is not the majority of people, it got ignored. Now it is starting to get more noticed as people divorce, leaving young kids puzzled and down a parent and wondering what happened and sometimes being passed from grandma to aunt to mom and back to dad, etc. That doesn't cause strong attachment.

Think about your son as a small boy. Be honest. Remember, cheating is bad. It distracts from the true picture. It lies. It distorts. You don't have to answer anything on this thread, but ask yourself some questions:

1/ Did I notice anything unusual about my son as a child and just disregarded it or hoped it would go away?

2/ Did my son make friends easily? Was I his main friend? You speak of pulling him out of many schools. That can lead to broken friendships. I'm not blaming you. I'm just wondering if your son knew how to socialize well with his peers. Especially starting in his tweens, he would normally prefer his own peers to time spent with you, no matter how much he loved you. If he just stayed at home, hanging around you, something was not right with him. What? I don't know f or sure. I just know it's not the typical way a child behaves.

3/Did he ever talk about his adoption and birthparents? This is important because there is no way in the world he did not think about all of this. If he did not talk about it, he bottled it inside. No adopted child loves us so much that they forget t hat th ey are different this way. My very well-adjusted and typical daughter Jumper was going through a hard time about adoption once and told me, "Adoption should be considered a special need. You're different." I think most adopted kids have strong feelings about their adoption and whether they express them or not can depend on the child's personality, fear of hurting adoptive parents, and the openness in which the topic is expressed by the parent.

4/Did YOU encourage him to go out and make friends?

Again, this is not for our benefit. This is to assess if you actually had a normally behaving little boy or if he maybe was different from the get-go. And sometimes we don't want to know so we avoid those who can diagnose, such as psychiatrists. It isn't uncommon. I always liked therapists, but they scare some. There are parents who can not accept a child who is not "normal" (whatever we perceive normal to be).

And that can cause us to miss things that we don't want to see, just like we missed that our FOOs were abusive. We thought it was us. Copa, you think your son's behavior is your fault, like you think that your mother was abusive and you didn't want to put up with it so you didn't...you think that is your fault too, that you should have stayed by her side anyway. Neither of those things are true.

Chances are, if you look back you will see that your son was not really a typical kid. I of course did not know him and don't know him now and I could be wrong, b ut w ith his history I can not imagine that he went unscathed. We can love them to death, but love doesn't cure some things, like the horrors of drugs in the system pre-birth or the lack of warmth before we came into their lives. And their subconscious does not forget.

It sounds, like so many adopted kids, your son has a variety of problems, some physical. It is a pity he has active Hepatitis B and I hurt for you and him. I knew many kids adopted from Asia and many were Hep. B. carriers, but I only met one child who had active Hep. B. Goneboy was a low grade carrier and has not had any medical issues, but I was terrified when I first found out. Devestated. The rest of us all had to take Hep. B vaccinations at a time when they did not routinely do it.

At any rate, just some food for thought. No condemnation. Just maybe you can gain some clarity and with clarity, self-blame can dissipate. You did not cause ANYONE to be the way they were. and are. You played the cards you were dealt in all aspects of life, like I did, like cedar did, like IC did, like Belle does, like Confused does, like we all do. And your only flaw is that you love so much t hat you sometimes do not see clearly, and that hurts you, not anybody else. You'd never hurt anyone else on purpose.

You are making progress. You will keep making progress. Keep telling yourself, "None of this was my fault. And I handled it very well. I'm still standing!!! HEAR ME ROAR!"

 

[Copabanana]

You can not see a psychiatrist once and not go back.

We were involved with this Psychiatrist from 6th grade until early adulthood. It was not a one or two time deal. He was well-regarded, highly trained and competent.

Of course there were differences. He had recurring problems in nursery school and in school. He went to a behavioral preschool and ultimately was Other/Health Impaired ADHD in Special Education.

He had friendships. He played normally but was messy with toys. I was not his only friend. I did not cling to him. He played outside as soon as he was old enough to do so. He had good friends. One from 6th grade is still his friend. He was not a self starter with homework and he did not date normally. Part of this was that he was a therapeutic high school or out of the country where kids did not date.

I am not saying he was a normal kid. How could I? I am just saying it is painful to accept that my son will likely never lead a normal life. That is painful. For him and for me.

I do not think that any remedy for me involves diagnosing or treating my son. I cannot. That is between him and whoever takes responsibility for his care. The only thing I can rightfully do is learn to take care of myself and M and be a mother to my son in a way that does not hurt him or me or M.

 

[Scent of Cedar *]

Great post, SWOT. Copa, it was true for me too that when I reviewed my daughter's childhood ~ night terrors, just the strangest darn things that she would do ~ I was able to let go of thought processes that were not helpful to any of us in coming to terms with what our situations really were. I learned that is there is something specific we need to apologize for or some current behavior we can change, that is one thing and is a good thing to do. But Copa, if we honestly assess the real difficulties and challenges our kids cope with every day instead of beating ourselves up for the quality of our mothering, then we can actually be of some value, to ourselves and to our kids, too. My daughter would try to talk to me about what it was like for her Copa. I didn't want her to be sick. Sick is so horrible a thing to be. I wanted it to be something temporary ~ something I could fix by being a better mom or finding the right doctor.

Daughter has an illness, Copa. It was disrespectful to her to behave as though it were nothing. If we discount the illness and its symptoms, we are putting full responsibility on our children in a way that implies that if they were stronger, they would be better.

When daughter discusses her illness with me now, she tells me that it is strengthening to her to know that I "get it" that she is suffering. That I "get it" that she does hurtful things to herself and to me but that she would not have chosen those things in a different mindset.

Mostly, daughter has been able to share her own fear and confusion regarding how this happens and how to stop it or to be aware of it when it begins.

I have Book Club tonight. I wish I could take more time to respond, Copa. I know how hard it is to believe what we need to believe.

Cedar