new here with-19 yo daughter

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by troubled, Jan 24, 2011.

  1. troubled

    troubled Guest

    Just wanted to say "hi" and give some info on me. I come here often to lurk. I derive some comfort knowing I am not alone. I mistakenly thought things would get better with my 19 year old difficult child once she graduated from high school. I thought wrong. She's completely out of control and I am in the process of evicting her from my home. She's to be out by Jan 31. She met a 20 year old boy difficult child online and has been staying with him off and on. This began in Sept. He lives in another state, with his parents! They paid for her bus ticket to come to their home twice and stay with them, in his room, sleeping with their son. What kind of parents do this? Apparently according to my difficult child, her difficult child boyfriend, age 20, runs the household over there and she is welcome to stay as long as she likes. But, I also heard that his mother would not allow her to use their address as her residence when she went to try and get a state ID. Up until now, she thought she didn't need any ID and she could go around lying about her age and name. Then she found out she couldn't go see a movie or sign up for state aide or SSI without some identification other than her birth certificate and social sec card.

    She wants to leave all her stuff here and I want it out. She hoards and hoards and has almost filled a third of my home with her stuff. She won't donate or sell any of it and she fully intends to keep it - all of it. I don't think it will fit into one large storage unit.

    difficult child plans on living off of SSI, which she has yet to file for (about $600 month). She assumes she will get it and it won't take long despite everyone telling her differently. She has not seen a psychiatrist or taken any medicine in over 5 years. She refused. She was stuck in sp ed school for the last 5 years until graduating and I think they let her go to be rid of her. She hates rules. She is extremely immature and acts like a 10 year old. The difficult child boyfriend she has chosen to be with is not much better but he's already collecting SSI. Her dream is to get a place with him and live happily ever after. They've been having sex since the day she met him. His parents allowed it to happen by paying for a motel room for them. They seem to condone this relationship. So they can take her in and all her stuff as far as I am concerned. I refuse to speak to parents who would condone behavior like that. Her father (my ex) spoke to them and left a poor impression. All he wanted to talk to them about was birth control according to difficult child.

    We are now less than 7 days till eviction and she's not arranged to get her things. She has said she will sue me if I touch any of her stuff. She doesn't even have a key to my home.

    I've read several threads on here concerning eviction and kicking difficult children out but most of them end without saying what happened. Did they have to get a sheriff to physically move them out? Did sheriffs pack up their stuff and put it to the curb? My difficult child asked me if I would accept $50 a month to store her things until spring and I said no! She claims her boyfriend father would pay it. She also said something to my sister about a bike I bought belonging to her and she planned on taking it. I can tell she's going to be a real difficult child while packing up her belongings. I can't get her and her hoard out of here fast enough. I have been like a prisoner in my own home because of her and have been waiting until she was old enough and out of school so I could get my house and my life back in order. She knows this. She calls me all kinds of names and does terrible things, makes threats against my life then says, "You have no proof, you can't do anything!, I'll do and say whatever I want!"

    What happens if she doesn't come to get her things by the 31st and further avoids getting a court notice? I can see her defiantly refusing to deal with this by simply not complying with the eviction order.

    She was diagnosed 5 years ago with Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD)-not otherwise specified also ADHD, ODD, BIPOLAR. She took every medication that existed and was hospitalized twice. She has refused medications and psychiatrist for over 5 years since then without much improvement. She dresses and acts like a 10 year old then dresses up like a prostitute and goes back and forth between the two. She goes out of her way to project the "****" image online and shes attracted to young boys (14, 15 years old) despite her 20 year old boyfriend. The only thing she hasn't tried is illegal drugs but I figure that's on her list for later.

    I don't want to live with her. She's like a leach and she tries to manipulate and control everyone and takes advantage of people by lying and putting on helpless acts. She boasts to her little teenage friends that she's never so much as washed a dish or cleaned a toilet. Her room is a disaster, like an episode of Hoarders. She thinks it's funny - laughs about it. I forbid her to go anywhere until her room was cleaned so she stayed home and then when she turned 18 she decided she didn't have to do anything I asked anymore. She stays up all night and sleeps all day, either playing games, on the internet or phone. She would go over to friends houses to get online and on a phone and then she used her birthday money to buy a phone when hers was taken away. She's got loads of junk in my basement, too and it's taking over the downstairs.

    I am not in the best of health myself and I feel trapped here until her stuff is gone and she legally can't come into my home. I have locks on every door but the bathroom and her bedroom. I lock doors behind me when she is here and stay locked in my room. That's how much I distrust her.

    Any advice would be appreciated.
  2. DaisyFace

    DaisyFace Love me...Love me not

    Hello and welcome!

    Yikes! The hoarding would drive me up a wall...

    Although, from what I understand, the hoarding itself is an indicator of an untreated mental illness of some kind - the hoarder tries to make themselves feel better by filling an emotional void with "stuff".

    If I were you, I would contact the sheriff's office and ask them about evictions. Sounds like you gave her a 30-day notice - so you need to ask the sheriff what happens next? Can you just change the locks on day 31 and refuse her entry? Do you have to take care of her stuff or can you just box it all up and put it at the curb?

    I think you can just pack up her stuff and put it on the porch for her and tell her "Too bad - you're out. Come and get your stuff with x number of days if you want it"....but I'm not positive.

    Hopefully, others will be along who know the answers...
  3. katya02

    katya02 Solace

    Hi and welcome! Sorry you had to find us here, but glad you did. What a situation. The law regarding what you can and can't do with your difficult child's things probably varies from state to state,
    so consulting an attorney would probably be your best bet. Checking with the sheriff's office will let you know how evictions usually go, although they wouldn't give you formal legal advice.
    I imagine they'd be very helpful, and you could run your situation by them.

    If your difficult child is already away and is not planning on coming back by the deadline, and you have some evidence that she knows about the deadline (even texts or emails?), I would think you can
    change the locks then to be sure she or one of her friends doesn't have a key. I would think that, once she's been away a certain length of time, she would be considered to have abandoned
    the premises and her belongings and you would be free to do as you wish with them - but some formal legal advice would let you sleep better. You don't have any obligation to permanently hang
    onto and care for her things.

    Her 'plan' for living on her own is going to go sour when she finds out that SSI is not easy for 19 year olds to get, and without extensive recent medical records she'll be unsuccessful. She will have
    to go to plan B, whatever that may be, and won't likely have funds to try to sue you from another state. She might have a hard time persuading an attorney to take her case on contingency when
    the 'award' is her hoarder's stash of stuff (or its value, which wouldn't likely be much when independently assessed).

    You must be breathing a sigh of relief right now - sounds like you've had a bad time in the past few years. I would check with a lawyer, follow his/her advice, change my locks and enjoy the quiet - and
    try not to get pulled back into the inevitable drama when your difficult child doesn't get her way. I'm sure others will have better information and more suggestions ...
  4. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    I'm sorry you are facing such a trauma. on the other hand, the trauma really belongs to her. I've read your post quickly since I am work and my response will be quick too...sorry. I agree to check with authorities before following through. Regarding her things
    I am sure there must be a storage space available for $50. That's where I would deposit her things. I've watched too many of the Hoarders episodes to think you should keep her stuff in your home. You deserve better. Sending hugs. DDD
  5. Andy

    Andy Active Member

    If you go the route of putting her stuff into storage - that storage should be put under her name and an address to send the bill. When the storage place doesn't get paid, they have procedures in place to get rid of the stuff. Probably something about abandonment of property that they can pull off easier than you can. She can not come to you and blame you for a payment she missed because the bills are being sent to her.

    Tell her that she needs to sign whatever and take ownership of the storage rental agreement - you are out of it! Because we KNOW if she only has to pay you $50 per month that payment would never be seen and you stay in the boat you are in.
  6. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    I agree with checking with the authorities on evicting her. Laws vary by state. Where we live all we needed to do was give our son a no tresspass order to our home. He did not legally have a right to live here because he was not paying rent. So the day we kicked him out last year he was being awful.... we told him he could not live here if he could not follow our rules (which were simple and what you would expect from anyone living with you, like not stealing, no violence, not taking the car without permission). He said if we called the police he would leave and then come back after they were gone. He had done that once before. He was so cocky. So after crying for a while, I got up, got dressed and went to the police and talked to them. They then agreed to just show up at a certain time and give him the no trespass order. They came, he was not expecting him, and they were here while he collected some things and then they drove him to the center of town. That was in June 2010.

    Lots of not great stuff happened in between where he got himself into a heap of trouble, spent a couple weeks in jail because of his legal problems and that woke him up. He ended up agreeing to a plea agreement and going to a rehab program (a big part of his issue is drugs) and he has just finished his 90 days and is doing very well so far. He is out of state and is not coming home any time soon...... which is a lot better for all of us. He needs to find a way to be independent and live his life and he seems to be doing that...So right now it is good news. As awful as the interim was he needed to be woken up and that started with us kicking him out of the house. I don't regret doing that at all.
  7. Steely

    Steely Active Member

    I did not have to do this with difficult child, but with difficult child's dad. I changed the locks, got a no trespass warrants, and when he showed up and would not leave, I called the cops. I do not know of any state when they are over 18 that you cannot carry out this practice - but I could be wrong. Check with your local police.
    As for the hoarding - if she does not come and get it by the time the locks have been changed - I would take it all to the local dump. It is not doing her any good by staying attached to those things. In fact, it is making her illness worse - you would be helping to just throw them all away for her. Seriously.
    I am so sorry you are going through all of this - so sorry. Stay strong - she is going to have to learn the hard way which is always tough on us Moms.
  8. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    You have gotten great advice. Many lawyers will do a free consultation of 15 or 30 mins, check the phone book for one or call the office and ask. This way you can find out your rights and hers. If you are working you may have prepaid legal as a benefit, check with HR. Or it may be part of an employee assistance program (EAP) to pay for 1-2 consults with an attorney per problem. If you have EAP as a benefit call them and ask. Also call the cops because they will know how the laws are enforced, rather than just what they are.

  9. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Just from watching many of the judge shows on TV, I think you have to keep any tenants belongs a "reasonable" length of time after they leave even after an eviction. Now reasonable is a broad term. I would say reasonable would be no more than 3 months. Especially if you can prove by a certified letter sent to where she is living that you attempted to contact her telling her to get her things or they would be removed.

    Now I dont believe you a required to keep trash. I would get a camera...I would assume you have one anyway. Make sure the date function is set correctly, and take still and video pictures of everything when she leaves. Then I would start tossing everything that is actual trash as soon as she goes. You can then put anything of value in the basement or a storage facility in her name and send her the key and contract.

    I would certainly not keep a bunch of trash in my house for her for more than 3 months. That is plenty of time for her to come get it. I assume you did give her a 30 day notice to vacate right?
  10. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I also believe that unless she is paying rent she is not a tenant. Tenants pay rent. However, yes, check with your local police. As for her things, I wouldn't keep trash in the house. I'd find out what is legal to do and then I'd do it.
  11. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    Hi and welcome.

    You have to pay rent to be a tenant. Usually belongings are expected to be removed from the residence by the date stated on the eviction notice. If not, said belongings can be taken to the curb. At least that seems to be the case here as I see households of stuff sitting at the curb of many rental houses......seriously, you wouldn't believe!

    But to cover your fanny, be sure to check either with a lawyer (preferred) or local police.

    Doesn't sound to me like the boyfriend's parents are condoning they're not allowing her to establish their home as a place of residence. This means they won't have to go through eviction with her as you're having to do. Smart parents. As for the sex part.......both involved are consenting adults, odds are this boy's parents are looking at it from that angle. And that is true. Although all of my children knew there would be no sex in my home, period. And I'm bold enough to break down the door and put an end to it. lol Not that I'd give them the opportunity.

    Daughter sounds awfully manipulating for Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) to me, wondering how accurate that diagnosis actually is for her.

    I don't blame you for wanting to reclaim your life. If difficult child is not listening to rules and following them, disrespecting you ect, she has no business in your home. She ought to feel lucky. I'd not have waited a year. ugh

  12. Bean

    Bean Member

    Hello and welcome.

    I like Andy's advice about the storage facility. I have no knowledge of how they work, if they need a 1st month's rent/deposit, but I would definitely tell your daughter this is what you are doing. And then I'd do it. Clutter can be horribly oppressive. I can't imagine living with a hoarder, that would be very difficult.
  13. troubled

    troubled Guest

    I had to wait until my post cleared through to be posted. I didn't forget. This is what happened; difficult child came back home with only 3 days left. She has been slooooooow to pack her things. Her boyfriend's father is paying for a large ($50 month) storage unit with the hopes that she will pay him back "when" she gets her SSI. She still doesn't even have an ID but she's also still adamant that she will get SSI.

    My sister has volunteered to come over and provide transportation to the storage unit but neither she or I will help load or pick up or pack her things. All she has to do is put stuff in a bag, tub or box but she's (ADHD) trying clothes on, waffling about what to get rid of and otherwise is stalling the inevitable. When my sister is not here, difficult child starts in on me instantly. She's wanting me to make her something to eat, messing up the kitchen ( 9pm at night!) well after we already had dinner, went shopping today to take things back, etc. Taking her sweet old time.

    My sister is getting very frustrated. So far, difficult child has only packed 20 boxes and has a long way to go. The good part is, after the 31st, my poor sister will be letting difficult child stay with her until she returns to the other state where her boyfriend is. I get a break but she has to put up with difficult child. Bad part is, my sister is not mentally doing well herself.

    I have not had to call police or sheriff. I can't do anything, I found out, unless there are court papers saying she has not moved out. Police and sheriff will not remove her without court order. That much I know for sure. difficult child plans on "doing whatever she wants" until after the 31st. Despite having packed very little, she was talking about visiting a friend and spending the night there tonight which means she would be up half the night on the computer over there chatting or whatever. Has not packed a thing since my sister left here at past 9pm.

    I doubt it will all get in storage by the 31st and there is a BIG snowstorm coming and I did not want to be trapped here with difficult child after the 31st so she's going home with her aunt tomorrow night. But she will have to come back again to get more of her stuff later this week and doesn't know yet when she will return to her boyfriend. I don't care if her stuff is not all out right away but I don't want her spending the nights here keeping me up all night, taunting me, etc. My poor sister and her husband will have to deal with her. I can't. I am so grateful to them for saving the day but I think my sister is already regretting her offer of help.

    Speaking of being grateful, I am grateful to all of you! I have not always jumped in to tell you that something you said was of importance to me or that I really felt bad for you or that I applaud you but I am here anyway and now you know. Thank you.
  14. troubled

    troubled Guest

    To toughlovin: Sounds like you had a hard time with your son. I'm really sorry that you are still going through this. Are you thinking that if he shows improvement you'll let him return to your home? I don't want my difficult child back here. She's burned a lot of bridges with me and I will be hurting for a long time over the way she has treated me. Words hurt - and once spoken, you can't take them back. I would never tell my mother I wish she would die (knowing I have physical ailments) and "I should have killed you a long time ago". That's just a few of the things she has said.

    To Steely: Yes, it is hard on me. It has always been hard. I had to raise this girl myself without help from her difficult child father. Living with him was He!! and I left that marriage only to find I had to deal with a hateful child that is a lot like him. I would be afraid - seriously - to toss difficult child's stuff out to take it to the dump or even donate it. One time she tried to break my fingers by bending them back because I tried to take her cd player away from her. She has a vengeful, jealous difficult child boyfriend, too, to team up with and they like to terrorize people online for fun.

    susiestar: I did some online research and found that the laws concerning tenants property are very fuzzy here. There are no set rules on how long after eviction the left behind stuff becomes yours. They suggested keeping it safe until the tenant comes to get it to avoid any liable. I don't think it's right I have to keep her stuff safe but that's what I read on some legal site. Thanks for the (hug) - I really need it.

    Dammit Janet: Yes, I did give her 30 day notice to vacate. I got the papers from the court house. I had them mailed return receipt to prove she got them. I think you are right about the stuff left behind and the legal ramifications. There is no set time. There is not really much actual trash. difficult child has a lot of great stuff! Nice clothing, toys, etc. She just has way too much of it. She has got rid of some clothing that was way too small but other than that, the rest is usable items. Not all hoarders save trash. She has many collections. A whole wall full of barbie and barbie-type dolls, for example. I don't think you can get a storage unit in someone else's name. I am not physically able to move any of her things, either. I am handicapped.

    MidwestMom: As ridiculous as it sounds, your child becomes a tenant with tenant rights as soon as they turn 18 and are still living in your home. That is the law in my state. You have to follow legal eviction proceedings to get them out if they don't leave willingly. Unless they do something to break the law - like physically abusing you. Who told my difficult child about that? Her ever-helpful therapist.

    Hound dog: I was told once by police that if someone had belongings at your home, they could be considered living with you and you'd have to evict them if they refused to leave. I had an old boyfriend that spent the night on weekends and he went ahead and changed his address on his drivers license to mine so that if the police saw that they couldn't remove him from my apt. I had to end up leaving myself and breaking the lease because I couldn't get rid of him and his name was not even on the apt lease.

    Bean: If I got a storage unit, I alone would be liable to pay on it. Not only would they confiscate the belongings, they would send it off to collections to ruin my credit. Not a good idea.

    DaisyFace: I wish I could just toss her stuff to the curb! I don't want her to be able to sue me over her stuff, tho, so I am forced to "play nice" like it or not.
  15. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful


    Katie has "belongings" in my home. Actually quite a bit, now that xmas has come and gone. However, I have proof she has not lived in my home, even though she has used it as a mailing address. I have 2 shelters and a motel to tell the court she lived there, not here. So not sweating that.

    And I have 3 big dogs that would keep them out. lol As M has discovered.........even if my dogs are nice to you when you visit.........they WILL attack you if I don't give you permission to come inside. He also discovered that they WILL attack you if you attempt to move something OUT of my house. These are facts both my mailmen and garbage men have known for years. lol

    And about it being their stuff? Uh, sorry, not really. If it comes down to the wire? I bought everything that is here except for M's clothing.......which I'd gladly burn in a heartbeat. I could look any cop/judge in the eye and say without a twinge of guilt they don't own a d*mn thing in my house.

    I grew up with such gfgness. And I'm still enough of a difficult child myself, that I will go above and beyond the law and fight fire with fire when a situation calls for it.

    Belongings? What belongings? They have no belongings here? I don't know what you're talking about. And I can do it with a straight face and the best dumb look you've ever seen.

    Doesn't hurt that we're a small town. I know the cops here, they know me. They know katie due to what she pulled many years ago. Trust me, they're not going to side with her.

    Katie and M can't even prove they bought the stuff.........because they didn't, none of it. phht.

    I'm devious enough that anything "left behind" due to her dragging her feet would just up and vanish. When asked about it claim know....Are you sure you didn't take it already? You must've taken it already as you can clearly see it is not here. phht.

    It's on them to prove it as otherwise they could claim they had absolutely anything and everything there and you'd be responsible...........and of course that would be ridiculous. This I know from my mother's many divorces. She had to prove what was hers, he had to prove what was his on items that were disputed.

    I wouldn't over worry on it. Get out as much stuff as possible while she is there. Do with what you wish with what is left. She will be out and that will be that. In order to "sue" you for anything left behind she has to prove 1. that it existed and 2. that she bought it and 3. that you did something with it. Odds of that are pretty much nill.

  16. amazeofgrace

    amazeofgrace New Member

    <<<Hugs>>>> sigh....I wish I had more than just hugs to difficult child I is just home after living with his girlfriend and her Mom for almost 3 months...I was puzzled as to how this woman could allow these kids, both unemployed, to live in her home and sleep together and not work! May I add she bought them cigarettes daily, but they "cleaned up around the house", as she put it. It sounds like you've established your boundries and you're moving forward! That's a good thing, my only advice, being I've been where you are now, is, don't let them come back (which I just did!)

    PS: I am typing this LOCKED IN MY ROOM! You're not alone sweet one.
  17. Nomad

    Nomad Guest

    Dear Troubled...
    I'm so sorry to read of your woes. I read some of the replies and you've already gotten such good advice! Seems to me that it is always good to double check your state's eviction laws. And if she is staying with your sister (for now) in time, your sister might need to know them as well. She is over 18 and you've done your best. I would leave the door open for her in certain ways.... especially with reference to medical care...including birth control. In other words, I would let her know that you might be willing to help her pay for medical care...including seeing a psychiatrist, etc. But, it sounds best that she doesn't live in your house!!! And if you don't want her things in your home....I would be willing to place in storage (for now) a small amount of valuables...but the rest has to GO! Give her 30 days to pick her things up (put it in writing), store items worth more than $100 and give the est to charity after 30 days. Set boundaries, not for her benefit, but for yours.
  18. troubled

    troubled Guest

    amazeofgrace: Oh NO! I wish you had not let your difficult child come back if you still have to lock yourself in your room.
  19. troubled

    troubled Guest

    Update: difficult child is out and most of her stuff is in storage. Some is at my sister's. difficult child is stuck at my sister's until such time that she can catch a bus back to Minn. Maybe Thurs. At least, my sister has her husband as backup so difficult child can't bother her too much. She was almost pleasant today as she finished packing up and I couldn't help but shed some tears after she said "bye" and hugged me. I suddenly felt sorry for her and at the same time relieved for me. I don't know how I feel now. Still waiting for the other shoe to fall I guess. She's so clueless.
  20. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful


    There are many kids, difficult child and easy child alike, who simply have to learn life lessons the hard way. It's hard as a parent to watch them taking the hard road. We know it's hard, they've yet to discover we actually have a clue what we're talking about.

    That she said Good bye and hugged you says a ton.

    I love my mother but we could never live under the same roof and manage to get along.......even with both of us trying. We're just too different. I was one of those difficult children who had to learn about life the hard way. She thought she should be able to just tell me and me tow the line. lol Along the way I learned that while she's often not right, she's also not always wrong. And I grew up.

    Enjoy the peace that has come to your home while it lasts. Do nice things for yourself. You've earned it.