Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by klmno, Feb 20, 2009.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    difficult child is approved for medicaid! PO wants difficult child sent to state juvy- everyone else is ok with Residential Treatment Center (RTC). I rec'd a letter from Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and they have approved difficult child for acceptance. Assuming judge is ok with it and doesn't send difficult child to detention, he could go back to where he is now until funding is approved for Residential Treatment Center (RTC). The Residential Treatment Center (RTC) thinks that should take a week at tops.

    Funding has to be approved by county team, which based on my previous meeting with them and PO, will not happen unless judge orders it or at least pushes for it, and of course, doesn't order detention. Medicaid then will reimburse the county team the majority of the cost. The remainder of the cost is educational and I have to wait until Tuesday to hear back about how to get the educational portion funded. All I know is either the school district pays for it directly, or they go to the county team to pay for it, or the county team picks up the cost outside of the school district's allocated funds. His home school remains the same.

    Now, my concerns for the day- 1) I rec'd a copy of the letter from psychiatrist where difficult child is now. He lists difficult child's diagnosis's as Mood Disorder not otherwise specified, Disruptive Behavior not otherwise specified, and parental-child relationship problems. WTH does that mean? He says in the next paragraph that "mother is very concerned about difficult child's behavior and difficult child is concerned about the impact of his behavior on mother's stress". So, does that sound like a horrible relationship?

    2) The mental health worker form our area who is assigned to detention, therefore she's on speaker phone at team meetings at difficult child's current facilities, was showing some attitude last week about difficult child needing to be in detention. She said most all the kids in detention had mental health issues or were Learning Disability (LD) so difficult child wasn't so different and he should be punished, too, instead of getting Residential Treatment Center (RTC). Then, the psychiatrist asked if she'd evaluation'd difficult child and she said no, she'd never met him. Today, I didn't go to team meeting but was on speaker phone and so was this lady. The psychiatrist said difficult child could come back there after court on Monday if judge allowed it. I asked if he put that in his letter because I had not rec'd that letter emailed to me by that time. He said no, he hadn't thought about it but I could relay it to the judge. Now, I understand that it's preferable for it to get relayed to the judge a different way, but this lady at detention said "psychiatrist, could you put that in writing so we don't have to depend on the MOTHER to relay that info?" She said it in a way that implied no one could depend on me to do anything. Well, she's never met me either, so where is this snotty attitude coming from? I wonder if she's that way with all parents or if PO has been bad-mouthing me to her.

    3) The PO apparently called the sw where difficult child is now and wanted to discuss case and told sw that she wanted difficult child in state juvy. SW told her she couldn't discuss difficult child because I didn't sign a release form for her to talk to PO. That's true. I signed a release form for them to communicate with everyone they asked for, except PO. I limited it for school district to information related to difficult child's education (to include IEP, of course), but PO- nothing. So, PO asked sw to put it in writing that I refused to sign that release form. Now, of course PO wants this to present in court to try to nail me. I personally don't see why I would be legally bound to have signed it. I signed for the judge/court and GAL to have any/all communication and records, along with mental health profs.

    PO didn't need to verify that difficult child was there- it was Department of Juvenile Justice that sent him. The GAL rec'd records and psychiatrist's letter and spoke with psychiatrist on phone. difficult child was not sent there until tdo'd from detention, which means he was already in a stricter Department of Juvenile Justice placement than being on probation. So, unless PO was trying to coerce the treatment team into what she wanted, why would she need to discuss difficult child's mental health treatment with them? After the attitude and pre-conceived ideas and judgement that was presented at the county meeting before, and the mental health lady's attitude toward me and difficult child, and thinking back over some other things- I think PO is trying sabatoge every effort to get appropriate care for difficult child, and she's trying to make sure the county profs do not listen to me.

    She'll probably try to claim that I was witholding info from her, but I had signed release forms for her to verify difficult child 's appts and updates with his regular psychiatrist and therapist and to talk with sw at his last acute stay before this one. I don't know what she ever discussed with the psychiatrist and therapist, but she never returned the sw at the other psychiatric hospital phone call when we were talking about Residential Treatment Center (RTC) placement then.
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2009
  2. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Sounds good.

    Parent child relationship problems are an Axis 3 or 4 diagnosis and are probably on almost all of the kids here formal forms. We all have a problem in the relationship between the parent and the child when there is any stress because of mental health problems.

    Whatever that Axis is...mine has listed something to do with family stress due to adult children, low income, relationship issues.

    So my grown kids are now being held responsible for me....lol. How is that for payback? LMAO
  3. JJJ

    JJJ Active Member

    Janet - That's hysterical. It reminds me of the saying "insanity is hereditary - you get it from your kids".

    Klmno - I think your fine since you allowed all other court related people access. You have more than enough documentation that PO is a PITA.
  4. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    You also have addressed the issue that PO has been a bottle neck previously, and more than once, if I recall correctly. You've also asked PO be removed. Your position of not signing a release for someone you have already said is not working in your son's best interst is clear and justified. in my humble opinion.

    Hope the wheels keep turning in the right way.
  5. bran155

    bran155 Guest

    I am so happy he was approved. And that darn PO has to fight this to the very end hu??? Aarrgghh!!!

    I hope all goes well from here on out. You deserve some smooth sailing! :)
  6. Steely

    Steely Active Member

    Overall...........this sounds very positive.

    Congrats on getting approved for medicaid! Yipee.

    Parent child relationship. Well that holds true as Janet said for all of us here on this board. We are all invested in our children, and sometimes it comes across as too much to the psychs - therefore deeming us "dysfunctional".
  7. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I think the diagnosis simply documents that there are some issues between you and difficult child - it does NOT mean you are a bad mom in any way. Simply put, if your relationship was fine, he wouldn't hold a knife to you (that is how the docs would look at it). When Wiz was in the psychiatric hospital we had MOTHER/Child relationship stress and sibling relationship issues both documented. They told me that it simply meant that he had attacked me on numerous occasions and that he had hurt his siblings also. They left father/child out because my husband is terribly non-confrontational and during all the rages/arguing, etc... husband stayed in another room with the kids at least 90% of the time. They couldn't have a problem simply because husband refused to address problem behavior.

    I think that you need to go and document every time the PO undermined you to difficult child (do a search on your posts here if you don't have a diary of these things). One thing you may want to do is create a document with bullets for each thing she did - and arrange them to show how arbitrary she was.

    That may or may not be needed in court, but it would CYA if the judge starts leaning toward what PO says. You can say that she has fought to keep difficult child from having services, etc...

    I am keeping positive thoughts that the judge will make the correct ruling and send difficult child to Residential Treatment Center (RTC).

    I think you are doing a great job of advocating for your son, and I hope you are taking care of yourself.
  8. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    The thing is, the PO knew difficult child had been self-harming and knew of a bunch of other stuff going on. She didn't take any steps to help difficult child or me until after the judge agreed to hear my motion when I submitted that letter in January. Then, it would appear that it was PO who had the county reps already convinced that difficult child just needed consequences and then she ordered a specific in-home therapist (from the place that advertises they use their own "unique" method of inducing more stress until the family figures out how to handle things better- LOL!!). That was after I'd been told that's all the county would offer and I could get my choice of who to get it thru- she called and made her order first thing the next morning. And, she said it would start in 2 1/2-3 weeks, but this latest incident happened less than a week later.

    See, she had already told me that "this county will not pay for difficult child to get any more mental health treatment and that they would never pay for Residential Treatment Center (RTC)". The county had not been paying for his mental health treatment , I have (plus private insurance paid by me). She then said that difficult child needed to be in detention and has already told everyone that she's going to tell the judge that. So, what interest could she possibly have in difficult child's mental health records from this place? None. It's not like she's a person who has advocated for him to get treatment, or that she has said she isn't sure what she thinks he needs, she isn't a mental health professional, she was unresponsive to his last psychiatric hospital sw- and if difficult child was sentenced to juvy as she wants, he wouldn't be on probation and she'd be out of the picture and none of it would be her issue.

    My rear could end up in jail on Monday when I am testifying and announce that I am NOT willing to work with her or her supervisor anymore. I already told the CA that I cringe at the thought of it- and given all I've already said to everyone else, I don't guess anyone will be too shocked.

    Furthermore- she told difficult child she thought I was over-protective. Well, are they going to give him more priveldges and freedom in detention?

    And now that I think about it- I sat right in that county meeting the week before this happened and when they said all they would give as a in-home therapist, I asked "ok, and if my son holds a knife to my throat 2 weeks from now, what will happen to him". And in 6 days- that is exactly what he did.
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2009
  9. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Who?? difficult child and me?? Surely not! LOL!!

    Really, some of these tdocs think they can change our household to function like a 2-parent, traditional family. That is simply impossible, I think. If the single-parent issues don't do it in, the difficult child issues do. Yet, they'll remove a child from home and put them in another home where they haven't checked out that sort of thing half as much as they checked out the parent that they removed the child from. Kind of like when they refuse to help a family financially, but will pay to remove them and put them somewhere else. They make no sense to me.
  10. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    klmno, I'm so glad he got approved!
    Sigh. You're still going around with-the PO. :(
    The "axis" parent child relationship info is news to me. Is that just for the court system? I'm wondering if it's in my difficult child's psychiatric hospital papers.

    Anyway, I'm sending support and strength for Monday.
  11. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    P.S. I really like the sentiment on your avatar!
  12. great news on the medicaid!!! Finally moving in the right directions.

    I think this PO has it out for you and difficult child. She has made up her mind and doesn't want to change it. I so hope that the judge goes for the Residential Treatment Center (RTC). I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you!


  13. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Terry....it is one of the Axis thingy do's.
  14. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Yeah- one of the Axis is for listing stressors. But, psychiatrist didn't list this there- he has it with the other Axis 1 diagnosis's. LOL! Since when was it an axis 1 diagnosis? It must be pretty bad, huh? Does that mean a psychiatrist can rx medications for it?

    The psychiatrist told me today to just be supportive of difficult child this weekend. I had picked up his form from school to choose his electives for 9th grade. I know he might miss part or all of it, but I thought it might make him feel good to think about it and choose, instead of me choosing for him. So, I tried to call him and I was also going to see if he wanted me to come up Sun. since court is Mon and who knows when I'll see him again after that. They said he was off the ward at the moment but they would ask him to call me in about 5 mins. Ok. That was about 40 mins ago. I wonder if the private attny who was making issue over me and difficult child being on opposing sides at court said anything to cause this major upset when he called difficult child Wed. morning. I didn't even know he had done that until he notified me that he'd take the case. He better not expect me to pay him for time he spent deciding if he wanted the case.

    Edited to add: I just called up there again and told the staff that I didn't want to make difficult child more upset, but I just want to know if he wants to see me before Monday because I don't know what will happen after that. He (staff) said he'd been talking to difficult child about this all day and he'd calmed down a lot. He said he got caught up in something else and someone else is using the kids' phone right now, but he'll have him call me in 15 mins one way or the other.
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2009
  15. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

  16. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    He never called. :(

    Well, let's see.....how do Latin and Creative Fashion sound for electives for a 14yo difficult child entering high school? Actually, Theater Arts might put a thorn in his side more than Creative Fashion. ha ha ha....

    dyfunctional....no, no, no....

    Seriously, he's mad because he's blaming me because he has to go to court and will be locked up somewhere. He's locked up now. He ought to be grateful I've done everything I can to get him to Residential Treatment Center (RTC) instead of letting him be sent to state juvy. Instead, he's mad because I "snitched" on him and called cops. Never mind what he did. I seriously do not think this is an issue that family therapy can fix. I really think he needs a therapist that helps him understand that it is HIS OWN life to live and control and take responsibility for. Why do they want to stress it is a family problem until the kid is around 18 then all of a sudden, the parent is at fault for not getting out of the kid's life quick enough and forcing the difficult child to take responsibility for their own actions?

    And then he called- he seems perfectly fine now. Who knows. So, he wants Spanish and Study Hall. He seems much better about the idea of Residential Treatment Center (RTC) but if he gets juvy, I hate to think how he'll react. We agreed that I'll visit him Sun. afternoon.
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2009
  17. KTMom91

    KTMom91 Well-Known Member

    So glad he was approved for medicaid!
  18. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Oh believe me you are gonna get so much family therapy with him in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) it will make your head spin. Hopefully the therapist is pretty good. Cory's was and he was used to the bs that was slung by the patients. Im sure he had heard it all. He explained to Cory that what he wanted to do for him was give him the tools to help him learn to cope with life. He explained it much like building a treehouse. How you could build a leantoo treehouse with a board sitting on two branches in a tree but you could build a much better treehouse if you had a hammer, nails, a saw, a tape measure, and a ladder. All those things would be the tools that they would be working on in Cory's toolbox. I thought that was imaginative.

    We had some good sessions, some not so good sessions and some downright ugly sessions. Kids are really good at trying to deflect the issues at hand away from them. "It wasnt my fault I did XXX, so and so irritated me so I had to do YYY!"
  19. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    LOL! Please keep fingers crossed that I can get him there! And that I can get judge to rule that difficult child would be off probation at the end of it. Or at least, that PO and her super are switched to other people who are reasonable and doing their job, not mine.
  20. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    You asked two questions in your original post - the first was about te parent-child relationship topic, I agree with Janet that it sounds like a standard problem, not having a go at you.

    Your other question was the comment about someone not wanting to leave it up to you to have to be communicating psychiatrist's views to the judge. Frankly, I think that was a valid comment - I don't think they were showing lack of faith in you, only that it looks so much better for a professional comment to come from that professional. You've had far too much dumped onto your shoulders, you shouldn't have even more to deal with tan you absolutely have to.

    As for the PO - try to find exactly WHY she is like she is. Nobody is all bad. She must have her reasons, she is supposed to be trying to do a good job. Clearly she and you are coming from opposing views. But she will be motivated by something other than apathy and wanting to oppose you. If you can understand what is motivating her (really) then you have a better chance of getting under her skin and either turning her opinions around, or at least undermining hrnagativity by countering her arguments.

    I'm wondering - could she be convinced that you're an over-indulgent mother of a delibreately defiant, obnoxious brat who is manipulating the system to get away with being a thug? That your plans will only serve to reinforce the child's bad behaviour by giving him a soft option allowing him to get away with his crimes, and that the only valid option is jail?
    If this is what she believes, then the corollorary is that she will also believe that all the specialists and doctors will be backing you, because it means money in THEIR pockets if difficult child goes to Residential Treatment Center (RTC). Therefore in her eyes, no medical experts, counsellors etc are woth paying any attention to because whatever they say is tainted and suspect.
    If these are her views, then she will also be considering that this approach will also save the county money.

    What she would need to hear (I suspect you have tried this, depending on her past experiences it would have variable success) - she needs to hear that Residential Treatment Center (RTC) will be just as much a punishment, just as much a control on difficult child's movements and activities, as jail. She also needs to hear that it won't cost the county any more (hopefully less) and maybe also see some figures compariatively, on recidivism from either Residential Treatment Center (RTC) or jail. Without any of these, she probably won't consider changing her opinion.

    She may be considered a good PO because she sticks at her views and isn't easily swayed. Tough. Uncompromising. Steadfast in her duty, to the end. Like a bulldog, biting on and not letting go.

    Think about it - you may have other ideas on her motivation, but if you can work it out and use it to get around her in some way, it could help.

    She really sounds like the Dept of Ed Special Needs people I've had to work with,with difficult child 3. Supposed to be there to help him (and others like him) but in reality, mostly focussed on NOT spending the allocated budget (hence doing her utmost to refuse all funding applications even when the need was clearly demonstrated). I found ways to get around these people. Not easy. First I had to give them plenty of rope, then got their comments noted as publicly as I could. In writing is best, then you can freely quote them.

    Good luck with this one. Wherever possible, try to get people to put all opinions etc supportive of difficult child, into writing in their name. YOu shouldn't have tostand up in court and say, "Dr S says this, therapist says that - sorry I haven't got it for you in their reports, they didn't think of it at the time." Because for them to not think of it,makes it seem like it wasn't really very important. And it is. This mustn't be the KLMNO show. It's the difficult child show, with best supporting cast of professionals all wanting the best for him, via Residential Treatment Center (RTC).

    Good luck, I hope it all comes together. If it doesn't, it certainly won't be due to any lack of effort on your part.