Hello. Two years ago I wrote on this forum for some advice from parents more experienced than me and what I got was excellent advice from all of you. So, I would ask your indulgence again. Sorry if the story is long. The last time it was a long story too.
BOTTOM LINE UP FRONT: husband and I took in five homeless grandchildren, ages 5 to 14. This isnt a sad recession story. Its about two feckless parents. These children are actually good kids considering what they have been through in their life. This is what I need advice on: they are completely without manners, they are violent to each other (the parents encouraged that), they are LOUD, they are a pack and are disrespectful of the house and to each other. They ran their parents house, not the parents. They dont even know they are being disrespectful to us (ex: having to have the last word when they are told to do something) because they never learned respect from the parents. We are loving but firm and sometimes you can see in their eyes that they just dont know what do to because they werent taught to be respectful or grateful for ANYTHING. How do I start to fix this?
BACKGROUND: All of husbands children are close to/over 30 years old and all of them still live in the same town as his ex-wife. (We live in a different state about 150 miles away.) He has a biological daughter (from his short first marriage at 19) that he raised and she is a lovely person (married with one child). He also has three step-children from his second marriage of 25 years: a very nice step-daughter (married, two small children) and two step-sons. One step-son (32 years old) has four children with four different women, no job, no motivation, no place to live, hes a total mess. The other (30) has four children with his girlfriend as well as two more children from her prior marriage for a total of six children (ages 2 to 14). Neither one has a job (or really wants one), they live off welfare (long term), cant make it on their own, and were one of the reasons for the break up of my husbands previous marriage. (His ex would draw the line and say no more but my husband leads with his heart and took care of the childrens needs which also meant it benefited the lazy parents and that sent the ex over the edge). husband comes from a good family and treated his step-children no differently than his daughter. They had a nice house and never were poor. The 30 year olds girlfriend (with the 6 kids) is a real scammer: sells her food stamps for $.50 on the $1; sells merchandise she doesnt own via Amazon or eBay and keeps the money; shoplifts and sells the merchandise herself or through a fence. Shes very pretty and great at turning on the tears for the courts, child welfare, the landlord to whom they owed $8,000 in back rent. Yep, shes a winner. Forget about child protective services, they are useless. So many, many people have called about these children but the girlfriend knows all the right moves: empty food boxes on the kitchen shelves look the same as full ones; no dirt bags laying around the living room drinking beer and watching TV when the inspector shows up; house cleaned up; school age children in school; the children dont look beaten or starved. Nothing ever was done. I could go on and on for many pages but you get the idea.
So, a couple of months ago, husband told them that there is no more money for them from our pockets. (I used to be the Rich Girlfriend and now I am the Rich Wife. Im not rich. I just have a job and get paid regularly and pay my bills. Duh.) He told them that they need to find jobs and they need to take care of the children. (And let me tell you that the state/federal benefits they received were very generous: $1200 in food stamps, 75% monthly rent assistance, utility assistance. All they had to do was go to social services and take the required classes to receive all of it continuously . . . and they didnt go so it all stopped, except food stamps.) When husband would call the grandkids, the parents would tell him that everything is fine. Well it wasnt. The girlfriend said she had a job as a waitress in a restaurant at night when actually what she had was a new boyfriend. She spent what money she made on him and eventually she tried to bring him into the house and kick out husbands step-son. Im not sure what happened next but child protective services and the police were involved in some type of drama with them and then . . . both of them and the six children moved out of their house in the middle of the night and left the state (and left everything behind in the house). This was sometime in late October, early November. husband was frantic not knowing where the grandkids were and if they were safe. Finally, two days before Thanksgiving, the step-son called his mother and asked if they could come to her house. They were living in a transient motel (all 8 in one room, the kids told us they only had potato chips and water to eat) and the motel kicked them out when they had no more money. The ex said her son and grandchildren could come to her house but NOT the girlfriend (did I forget to mention the girlfriend is violent when drunk and threatened to slit husbands exs throat? She is also the physical abuser in the relationship but when the step-son would call the police because she was out of control and he had physical injuries, the police removed HIM from the house and left the CHILDREN there because the pretty blue-eyed girl told the nice policemen that her mean boyfriend hit her. He eventually stopped calling the police.) husbands ex drove 50 miles to pick up the grandchildren and the step-son stayed with the girlfriend because she needed him. (What?)
So, on the Saturday after Thanksgiving, husband drove 150 miles to pick up five kids (not the 2 yr old because he had no room in the car). He brought them to our house and on the following Monday we filed a petition for custody so that we could get them enrolled in school. Before he left that state to drive to our state, he had both parents sign/notarize a Power of Attorney for Care and Custody so that we could get medical care if the children needed it and, also, because I dont trust the girlfriend. I was worried she would call the police and tell them we kidnapped the children (which is what she did to husbands step-daughter who was taking care of the 2 year old. Step-daughter is physically afraid of the girlfriend so she took the child back to husbands exs house).
CURRENT:
So, now, we have the grandchildren in school again (and they are far behind according to several of the teachers), neither of the parents have gone to find a job or a place to live, and they call husband to fight with each other through him. husbands ex kicked her son out of her house because he gave the 2 yr old to the girlfriend and told his mother that he and the girlfriend were better parents than she and husband ever were (and because he will not look for work).
I work 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] shift and I am exhausted. I still have a 15 yo I dont want to get lost in the drama. I get up at 6:30 to get her to the bus. Then its getting the two middle schoolers out the door. Then its the two elementary schoolers. And I am left with the youngest who should be in pre-school but her mother couldnt have bothered. husband and I have appointments with the different schools, with the court, grocery shopping, clothes shopping, etc. We havent had the time yet to find a family counselor. We dont have a custody order so I cant get them on my health insurance. Their mother will not send us their state medical cards. She sold all the food stamps she received for December and we havent seen a cent from her or the father. (Not like I really expect it). I am the only paycheck coming in because husband is disabled. Even with ten people in the house we dont qualify for any assistance because I make too much money. Did I mention that my 80 year old mother in law lives with us? And my 45 year old brother in law too? (he was seriously injured in a scooter accident two years ago [in a coma, saw the bright white light, coded and resuscitated twice] and has never been quite the same). He looks after Mom. Who, by the way, cant stand little kids. She raised seven of her own and they all turned out to be great people. She just doesnt want to be around someone elses little kids.
The two oldest grandchildren, 14 and 12, have a different biological father and he has always paid child support and tried to be in their lives. He always expected they would come to live with him because the mother is such a mess. The mother tried very hard to poison their minds against their father. (He too was physically abused by her but he was smart enough to hide a video camera in the living room and play back the video for the police) husband and I called the father when the children came to live with us (he lives about 8 hours away). He wants his children to come live with him but he doesnt want to just rip them away from their siblings. He drove 8 hours through the night to get up here to see them when they first came to our house. husband and he agreed that he will call his children during the week, they will go to see him (husband will drive halfway), and eventually they will go to live with him.
I know that there are a TON of legal problems here: husband isnt a blood relative to these children and neither am I. There is the Uniform Child Custody and Jurisdiction Act and we cant just file for custody in our state and expect to receive it. I expect our state court to dismiss the custody petition and tell us we have to go back to the state where the children lived with there parents. The father of the two older ones cant just put his children in his car and drive away because the mother has physical custody of them. We will actually have to go to court in the parents state and petition for custody. And that state could STILL take these children from us and put them in foster homes if they wanted to. That would just kill husband. That is what he has tried to prevent. We stopped the money and the parents fell on their face. Now, Im afraid the children will end up in foster care in spite of having a safe, secure, loving home here.
But, on the other hand, we are not dealing with rocket scientists here. The girlfriend is a know it all and is actually pretty stupid, except when it comes to scamming through life. The step-son . . .well . . . this keyboard can generate more brain power then him. They may not even show up in court much less hire an attorney.
OK, its late and I really, really need to go to sleep. If you have read this far, thank you so much. I am open to any suggestions, advice, admonishments you have.
Thank you for letting me vent. Good night.
BOTTOM LINE UP FRONT: husband and I took in five homeless grandchildren, ages 5 to 14. This isnt a sad recession story. Its about two feckless parents. These children are actually good kids considering what they have been through in their life. This is what I need advice on: they are completely without manners, they are violent to each other (the parents encouraged that), they are LOUD, they are a pack and are disrespectful of the house and to each other. They ran their parents house, not the parents. They dont even know they are being disrespectful to us (ex: having to have the last word when they are told to do something) because they never learned respect from the parents. We are loving but firm and sometimes you can see in their eyes that they just dont know what do to because they werent taught to be respectful or grateful for ANYTHING. How do I start to fix this?
BACKGROUND: All of husbands children are close to/over 30 years old and all of them still live in the same town as his ex-wife. (We live in a different state about 150 miles away.) He has a biological daughter (from his short first marriage at 19) that he raised and she is a lovely person (married with one child). He also has three step-children from his second marriage of 25 years: a very nice step-daughter (married, two small children) and two step-sons. One step-son (32 years old) has four children with four different women, no job, no motivation, no place to live, hes a total mess. The other (30) has four children with his girlfriend as well as two more children from her prior marriage for a total of six children (ages 2 to 14). Neither one has a job (or really wants one), they live off welfare (long term), cant make it on their own, and were one of the reasons for the break up of my husbands previous marriage. (His ex would draw the line and say no more but my husband leads with his heart and took care of the childrens needs which also meant it benefited the lazy parents and that sent the ex over the edge). husband comes from a good family and treated his step-children no differently than his daughter. They had a nice house and never were poor. The 30 year olds girlfriend (with the 6 kids) is a real scammer: sells her food stamps for $.50 on the $1; sells merchandise she doesnt own via Amazon or eBay and keeps the money; shoplifts and sells the merchandise herself or through a fence. Shes very pretty and great at turning on the tears for the courts, child welfare, the landlord to whom they owed $8,000 in back rent. Yep, shes a winner. Forget about child protective services, they are useless. So many, many people have called about these children but the girlfriend knows all the right moves: empty food boxes on the kitchen shelves look the same as full ones; no dirt bags laying around the living room drinking beer and watching TV when the inspector shows up; house cleaned up; school age children in school; the children dont look beaten or starved. Nothing ever was done. I could go on and on for many pages but you get the idea.
So, a couple of months ago, husband told them that there is no more money for them from our pockets. (I used to be the Rich Girlfriend and now I am the Rich Wife. Im not rich. I just have a job and get paid regularly and pay my bills. Duh.) He told them that they need to find jobs and they need to take care of the children. (And let me tell you that the state/federal benefits they received were very generous: $1200 in food stamps, 75% monthly rent assistance, utility assistance. All they had to do was go to social services and take the required classes to receive all of it continuously . . . and they didnt go so it all stopped, except food stamps.) When husband would call the grandkids, the parents would tell him that everything is fine. Well it wasnt. The girlfriend said she had a job as a waitress in a restaurant at night when actually what she had was a new boyfriend. She spent what money she made on him and eventually she tried to bring him into the house and kick out husbands step-son. Im not sure what happened next but child protective services and the police were involved in some type of drama with them and then . . . both of them and the six children moved out of their house in the middle of the night and left the state (and left everything behind in the house). This was sometime in late October, early November. husband was frantic not knowing where the grandkids were and if they were safe. Finally, two days before Thanksgiving, the step-son called his mother and asked if they could come to her house. They were living in a transient motel (all 8 in one room, the kids told us they only had potato chips and water to eat) and the motel kicked them out when they had no more money. The ex said her son and grandchildren could come to her house but NOT the girlfriend (did I forget to mention the girlfriend is violent when drunk and threatened to slit husbands exs throat? She is also the physical abuser in the relationship but when the step-son would call the police because she was out of control and he had physical injuries, the police removed HIM from the house and left the CHILDREN there because the pretty blue-eyed girl told the nice policemen that her mean boyfriend hit her. He eventually stopped calling the police.) husbands ex drove 50 miles to pick up the grandchildren and the step-son stayed with the girlfriend because she needed him. (What?)
So, on the Saturday after Thanksgiving, husband drove 150 miles to pick up five kids (not the 2 yr old because he had no room in the car). He brought them to our house and on the following Monday we filed a petition for custody so that we could get them enrolled in school. Before he left that state to drive to our state, he had both parents sign/notarize a Power of Attorney for Care and Custody so that we could get medical care if the children needed it and, also, because I dont trust the girlfriend. I was worried she would call the police and tell them we kidnapped the children (which is what she did to husbands step-daughter who was taking care of the 2 year old. Step-daughter is physically afraid of the girlfriend so she took the child back to husbands exs house).
CURRENT:
So, now, we have the grandchildren in school again (and they are far behind according to several of the teachers), neither of the parents have gone to find a job or a place to live, and they call husband to fight with each other through him. husbands ex kicked her son out of her house because he gave the 2 yr old to the girlfriend and told his mother that he and the girlfriend were better parents than she and husband ever were (and because he will not look for work).
I work 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] shift and I am exhausted. I still have a 15 yo I dont want to get lost in the drama. I get up at 6:30 to get her to the bus. Then its getting the two middle schoolers out the door. Then its the two elementary schoolers. And I am left with the youngest who should be in pre-school but her mother couldnt have bothered. husband and I have appointments with the different schools, with the court, grocery shopping, clothes shopping, etc. We havent had the time yet to find a family counselor. We dont have a custody order so I cant get them on my health insurance. Their mother will not send us their state medical cards. She sold all the food stamps she received for December and we havent seen a cent from her or the father. (Not like I really expect it). I am the only paycheck coming in because husband is disabled. Even with ten people in the house we dont qualify for any assistance because I make too much money. Did I mention that my 80 year old mother in law lives with us? And my 45 year old brother in law too? (he was seriously injured in a scooter accident two years ago [in a coma, saw the bright white light, coded and resuscitated twice] and has never been quite the same). He looks after Mom. Who, by the way, cant stand little kids. She raised seven of her own and they all turned out to be great people. She just doesnt want to be around someone elses little kids.
The two oldest grandchildren, 14 and 12, have a different biological father and he has always paid child support and tried to be in their lives. He always expected they would come to live with him because the mother is such a mess. The mother tried very hard to poison their minds against their father. (He too was physically abused by her but he was smart enough to hide a video camera in the living room and play back the video for the police) husband and I called the father when the children came to live with us (he lives about 8 hours away). He wants his children to come live with him but he doesnt want to just rip them away from their siblings. He drove 8 hours through the night to get up here to see them when they first came to our house. husband and he agreed that he will call his children during the week, they will go to see him (husband will drive halfway), and eventually they will go to live with him.
I know that there are a TON of legal problems here: husband isnt a blood relative to these children and neither am I. There is the Uniform Child Custody and Jurisdiction Act and we cant just file for custody in our state and expect to receive it. I expect our state court to dismiss the custody petition and tell us we have to go back to the state where the children lived with there parents. The father of the two older ones cant just put his children in his car and drive away because the mother has physical custody of them. We will actually have to go to court in the parents state and petition for custody. And that state could STILL take these children from us and put them in foster homes if they wanted to. That would just kill husband. That is what he has tried to prevent. We stopped the money and the parents fell on their face. Now, Im afraid the children will end up in foster care in spite of having a safe, secure, loving home here.
But, on the other hand, we are not dealing with rocket scientists here. The girlfriend is a know it all and is actually pretty stupid, except when it comes to scamming through life. The step-son . . .well . . . this keyboard can generate more brain power then him. They may not even show up in court much less hire an attorney.
OK, its late and I really, really need to go to sleep. If you have read this far, thank you so much. I am open to any suggestions, advice, admonishments you have.
Thank you for letting me vent. Good night.
