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<blockquote data-quote="Hound dog" data-source="post: 498204" data-attributes="member: 84"><p>I'm not going to be very popular, but I'm against mainstreaming in general.</p><p></p><p>Yes, I know, shocking from the woman who demanded Travis tow the line with his sibs. But it's not quite the same. </p><p></p><p>I've seen very few kids who were very successful mainstreamed, actually the complete opposite is true. Now this does depend on the child and what is going on with them too, of course. But I'm talking both physical and mental / social disabilities here. </p><p></p><p>Travis would have done tons better in a classroom geared for his needs, odds are due to that he'd had had much more self confidence (which by the time he hit 2nd grade was in the toilet). Learning would have not been a constant battle as he'd had trained staff around who might actually understand what his IEP said, because quite frankly none of his teachers EVER got it. And in all honesty, school did squat for his social issues until he attended the tech center in his jr year where they made it a point to address the issue with ALL students every friday. Instead of real constructive learning before that, he was tortured by other students, badgered nearly non stop by teachers who didn't have a clue, told he was downright lazy and his attitude stunk. (a child who'd never acted out in class, never gotten in trouble once with the school) Tech school was the dumping ground for many students such as Travis, no joke, and they were determined these kids weren't going to be lost in the shuffle. (paid a hefty private fee for him to attend jr and sr years) Classrooms were small, staff really cared about their kids and although they might not understand dxes ect there were other staff there to sit down and explain it to them, ONLY place his IEP was NOT ignored. Travis loved it there, thrived there, they thought he was a pretty awesome kid. Other kids I met there loved it just as much.....many of those kids were teary eyed come graduation day.</p><p></p><p>If not for the tech center willing to accept spec need kids the sd no longer wanted, Travis would have graduated (no kid with an IEP can be prevented from graduating) but he would've learned nothing. And so it goes with so many many spec need kids.</p><p></p><p>What is the point of graduation if nothing or so little was learned that they still can't function as an adult or independently on any level?</p><p></p><p>Mainstreaming, in my opinion, is not working. Yes, there are some kids who can handle it given that their IEPs are followed (how often does that really happen even with a warrior parent) And those kids should be allowed to do it. But there are now so many kids who simply cannot handle it who are being forced to due to a small percentage that can. I have to wonder how many of those kids are graduating with little or no skills or just dropping out when it gets so frustrating or they give up on themselves. </p><p></p><p>I've had long conversations with other warrior moms in this area. There are some who's kids are doing ok mainstreaming, would do much better if their IEPs were actually followed the way they are written, but are coping ok. But most, at least the ones I've met, are angry that there is no longer an alternative to mainstreaming your spec needs child. We have deaf children here who are supposed to have ASL interpreter for all classes. They're lucky if they have one for 1st and 2nd grade, after that they have to do the best they can, regardless of what is written on their IEP. Most don't do very well because it's a constant struggle with teachers doing what they can to cope (not fair to them either by the way). Same with other types of disabilities. This is not just with the mental dxes, but all of them. Mainstreaming might work for more kids IF those kids got the special attention they needed say in grade school, then could be weaned later to see if they can cope, if not, returned to Special Education.</p><p></p><p>Alex is another example. And it makes me soul sick to watch him. I don't give a d@mn if that is politically correct or not. He's sitting in a 4th grade class where he has NO business being because of mainstreaming. He's not quite up to 1st grade level academically, in many ways not because he needs so many aides to help him function at that low level. He has no clue what is going on in that classroom. Any lesson that doesn't pertain to his own level, zips right over his head. He doesn't get it because he can't get it. Add in the autism......oh yeah. I've watched my grandson cry and pound himself in the head for being "stupid" and "retarded" and unable to learn like his peers. How is this a benefit to him? Socially he's not even in the same ballpark as his peers since his behavior is also that of being several years younger. Alex wants so badly to learn, but each year his frustration is mounting, his confidence is deteriorating.....and honestly I'll be surprised at this rate if he makes it to mid HS. He's had great teachers the past 2 yrs, but they're trying to teach a classroom full of students on a totally different level, then gear it down to him. Great teacher or not, that has got to be difficult to do.</p><p></p><p>I'm not saying every Special Education class was great either. Some were downright horrible. But it seems to me to "correct" the problem they threw all the spec needs kids into the educational ocean to sink or swim. They could've cleaned up the Special Education dept, required more training, more teacher / student ratio, and still allowed mainstreaming for students who could successfully make the transition while giving those who would drown in a normal classroom a soft place to land and a learning environment more suited for their needs.</p><p></p><p>This is just my opinion, Mom and grandma to two very special needs kids, and years and years of watching mainstreaming fail the kids it was supposed to help.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hound dog, post: 498204, member: 84"] I'm not going to be very popular, but I'm against mainstreaming in general. Yes, I know, shocking from the woman who demanded Travis tow the line with his sibs. But it's not quite the same. I've seen very few kids who were very successful mainstreamed, actually the complete opposite is true. Now this does depend on the child and what is going on with them too, of course. But I'm talking both physical and mental / social disabilities here. Travis would have done tons better in a classroom geared for his needs, odds are due to that he'd had had much more self confidence (which by the time he hit 2nd grade was in the toilet). Learning would have not been a constant battle as he'd had trained staff around who might actually understand what his IEP said, because quite frankly none of his teachers EVER got it. And in all honesty, school did squat for his social issues until he attended the tech center in his jr year where they made it a point to address the issue with ALL students every friday. Instead of real constructive learning before that, he was tortured by other students, badgered nearly non stop by teachers who didn't have a clue, told he was downright lazy and his attitude stunk. (a child who'd never acted out in class, never gotten in trouble once with the school) Tech school was the dumping ground for many students such as Travis, no joke, and they were determined these kids weren't going to be lost in the shuffle. (paid a hefty private fee for him to attend jr and sr years) Classrooms were small, staff really cared about their kids and although they might not understand dxes ect there were other staff there to sit down and explain it to them, ONLY place his IEP was NOT ignored. Travis loved it there, thrived there, they thought he was a pretty awesome kid. Other kids I met there loved it just as much.....many of those kids were teary eyed come graduation day. If not for the tech center willing to accept spec need kids the sd no longer wanted, Travis would have graduated (no kid with an IEP can be prevented from graduating) but he would've learned nothing. And so it goes with so many many spec need kids. What is the point of graduation if nothing or so little was learned that they still can't function as an adult or independently on any level? Mainstreaming, in my opinion, is not working. Yes, there are some kids who can handle it given that their IEPs are followed (how often does that really happen even with a warrior parent) And those kids should be allowed to do it. But there are now so many kids who simply cannot handle it who are being forced to due to a small percentage that can. I have to wonder how many of those kids are graduating with little or no skills or just dropping out when it gets so frustrating or they give up on themselves. I've had long conversations with other warrior moms in this area. There are some who's kids are doing ok mainstreaming, would do much better if their IEPs were actually followed the way they are written, but are coping ok. But most, at least the ones I've met, are angry that there is no longer an alternative to mainstreaming your spec needs child. We have deaf children here who are supposed to have ASL interpreter for all classes. They're lucky if they have one for 1st and 2nd grade, after that they have to do the best they can, regardless of what is written on their IEP. Most don't do very well because it's a constant struggle with teachers doing what they can to cope (not fair to them either by the way). Same with other types of disabilities. This is not just with the mental dxes, but all of them. Mainstreaming might work for more kids IF those kids got the special attention they needed say in grade school, then could be weaned later to see if they can cope, if not, returned to Special Education. Alex is another example. And it makes me soul sick to watch him. I don't give a d@mn if that is politically correct or not. He's sitting in a 4th grade class where he has NO business being because of mainstreaming. He's not quite up to 1st grade level academically, in many ways not because he needs so many aides to help him function at that low level. He has no clue what is going on in that classroom. Any lesson that doesn't pertain to his own level, zips right over his head. He doesn't get it because he can't get it. Add in the autism......oh yeah. I've watched my grandson cry and pound himself in the head for being "stupid" and "retarded" and unable to learn like his peers. How is this a benefit to him? Socially he's not even in the same ballpark as his peers since his behavior is also that of being several years younger. Alex wants so badly to learn, but each year his frustration is mounting, his confidence is deteriorating.....and honestly I'll be surprised at this rate if he makes it to mid HS. He's had great teachers the past 2 yrs, but they're trying to teach a classroom full of students on a totally different level, then gear it down to him. Great teacher or not, that has got to be difficult to do. I'm not saying every Special Education class was great either. Some were downright horrible. But it seems to me to "correct" the problem they threw all the spec needs kids into the educational ocean to sink or swim. They could've cleaned up the Special Education dept, required more training, more teacher / student ratio, and still allowed mainstreaming for students who could successfully make the transition while giving those who would drown in a normal classroom a soft place to land and a learning environment more suited for their needs. This is just my opinion, Mom and grandma to two very special needs kids, and years and years of watching mainstreaming fail the kids it was supposed to help. [/QUOTE]
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