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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 290910" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>So I gather that difficult child is spending some of the time living with his father? That does make it difficult because kids such as you describe need consistency and he's not getting it.</p><p></p><p>Besides, how can he have Munchhausen's by proxy, if you're not always totally in control? Your ex sounds like an idiot.</p><p></p><p>What you can do - play along, at least with the request for you to have an evaluation. The best defence you have for this, is your own clean bill of mental health. Ofcourse if they find you are stressed that would be understandable and shouldn't be seen as an indication that you have a problem. Of course you would be stressed - any parent in your shoes would be. But you need to make sure that you don't display the hallmarks of Munchausen's. The trouble is, you already have some of them (as do I, so I do understand, I've had the same accusation).</p><p></p><p>For example, you are medically knowledgeable. THis can make some people suspicious. Of course with both you and I there are valid reasons for this. But you do need to make it clear in consultations that while you have good knowledge in your own field of expertise, you need the doctor's professional eye in the areas outside your scope. Kowtow a bit. Admire. Ask questions and appear to value the answers.</p><p></p><p>Your relationship with the patient and with medical staff - the definitions of Munchhausen's are contradictory here, they can get you coming or going. But maybe the best thing you can do is make sure that even while you are with your child, where possible encourage your son to speak for himself. Don't answer everything for him. If he can't answer a question that is OK, because you do have the info yourself and sometimes, the child's inability to answer is itself an answer of use.</p><p></p><p>Most important - when anyone suggests Munchausen's, NEVER run away. Some parents respond with anger and by removing their child from the care of whoever suggested it. But that is exactly how someone with Munchausen's would respond because if they suspect someone is onto them, they can't risk getting found out. So instead of running, stand your ground and say, "here I am - examine me!" Someone with Munchausen's will have no continuity in their medical file. They are constantly on the move, constantly getting angry and storming out in a huff to go find another doctor more willing to beleive their malarkey. Of course after a long period of time it becomes increasingly difficult to do this and not meet someone who has either heard of them or crossed paths with them before, so the typical file is one of increasingly short stays here and tere, usually with attempts to cover access to past history. So if you make sure past history is an open book and actively cooperate with copies of files, names of past doctors, have a long history with one practice - that is the biggest nail in the coffin of a Munchausen's label.</p><p></p><p>The trouble is, someone who is genuinely ill but frustrated with lack of a diagnosis can show a very similar pattern. That's why I always tell people - if you go elsewhere and get the answers you have been searching for, always feed back to previous doctors. Let them know, for the sake of closure, because one day you might need to have your name cleared of all suspicion.</p><p></p><p>Not all Munchausen's by proxy create physical ailments in teir child, nor do their children need to be pre-schoolers. One sad case I know of, the condition was tricky and the one the mother was trying to prove (and which the teenager was diagnosed with) was a fairly new condition which was getting a lot of publicity at the time and the mother was determined to prove that the condition was potentially fatal. Whenever anyone suggested that the child needed to see a psychiatrist to assess for depression or the long-term effects of being chronically ill for all her teen years, the mother would have the child discharged from hospital and often would change doctors. As the child got sicker and sicker, all information on the child's condition was increasngly withheld and only divulged to a narrowing circle of supporters. Finally they had run out of doctors and hospitals, the child was discharged and died at home. The child became a martyr and symbol of the frustrating fight between mothers and unsympathetic medicos. The mother would spout loud and long about how she would prove tihs and confirm that but her pattern was, if ever she made a statement which later turned out Occupational Therapist (OT) be wrong, she would never correct it. But she would crow constantly if she was NOT proven wrong. The teeneager had apparently requested a post-mortem to be done; the results were never released. I suspect the results were either inconclusive, or indicated death due to lack of medical intervention because te moter was at tis point refusing to allow any doctors near the child if they so much as mentioned "psychologist".</p><p></p><p>So when the accusaiton was made at me, I did my best to do the opposite.</p><p></p><p>I have a good friend who is also a health professional who had some worrying symptoms. She had enough medical knowledge to try to discuss her case with her specialist who immediately got snaky about it and accused her of "Ulysses Syndrome" (which I had never heard of). It's one of those labels thta gets you coming and going. As a result, the specialist refused to operate on her until she was "symptomatic."</p><p>"But I'm already in a lot of pain and having trouble walking," she said.</p><p>She waited another 18 months before tey operated (another specialist) to remove a tumour the size of a grapefruit from her spine. The Ulysses Syndrome label had prevented surgery earlier when the tumour was much smaller and more manageable. She now is permanently disabled due to the damage tey had to do to get the tumour out. "Ulysses Syndrome" states that the person is over-concerned with their own medical welfare and imagines they have things wrong withthem when in fact there is nothing; they go searching for answers until they get something. In this woman's case, she already had a big problem and they were ignoring it almost to punish her for her medical knowledge.</p><p></p><p>If she had been male I doubt they would have had this attitude.</p><p></p><p>You shouldn't have any problems with the reports, surely - how can you persuade a neuropsychologist to 'fake' an assessment?</p><p></p><p>Good luck with tihs, makesure your medical history has a very long arm and get a letter from your doctor stating how far back your records and your son's records can rach. If the doctor has access to records form other past doctors that also should put paid to that accusation.</p><p></p><p>It's a nasty one. I hate it. </p><p></p><p>marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 290910, member: 1991"] So I gather that difficult child is spending some of the time living with his father? That does make it difficult because kids such as you describe need consistency and he's not getting it. Besides, how can he have Munchhausen's by proxy, if you're not always totally in control? Your ex sounds like an idiot. What you can do - play along, at least with the request for you to have an evaluation. The best defence you have for this, is your own clean bill of mental health. Ofcourse if they find you are stressed that would be understandable and shouldn't be seen as an indication that you have a problem. Of course you would be stressed - any parent in your shoes would be. But you need to make sure that you don't display the hallmarks of Munchausen's. The trouble is, you already have some of them (as do I, so I do understand, I've had the same accusation). For example, you are medically knowledgeable. THis can make some people suspicious. Of course with both you and I there are valid reasons for this. But you do need to make it clear in consultations that while you have good knowledge in your own field of expertise, you need the doctor's professional eye in the areas outside your scope. Kowtow a bit. Admire. Ask questions and appear to value the answers. Your relationship with the patient and with medical staff - the definitions of Munchhausen's are contradictory here, they can get you coming or going. But maybe the best thing you can do is make sure that even while you are with your child, where possible encourage your son to speak for himself. Don't answer everything for him. If he can't answer a question that is OK, because you do have the info yourself and sometimes, the child's inability to answer is itself an answer of use. Most important - when anyone suggests Munchausen's, NEVER run away. Some parents respond with anger and by removing their child from the care of whoever suggested it. But that is exactly how someone with Munchausen's would respond because if they suspect someone is onto them, they can't risk getting found out. So instead of running, stand your ground and say, "here I am - examine me!" Someone with Munchausen's will have no continuity in their medical file. They are constantly on the move, constantly getting angry and storming out in a huff to go find another doctor more willing to beleive their malarkey. Of course after a long period of time it becomes increasingly difficult to do this and not meet someone who has either heard of them or crossed paths with them before, so the typical file is one of increasingly short stays here and tere, usually with attempts to cover access to past history. So if you make sure past history is an open book and actively cooperate with copies of files, names of past doctors, have a long history with one practice - that is the biggest nail in the coffin of a Munchausen's label. The trouble is, someone who is genuinely ill but frustrated with lack of a diagnosis can show a very similar pattern. That's why I always tell people - if you go elsewhere and get the answers you have been searching for, always feed back to previous doctors. Let them know, for the sake of closure, because one day you might need to have your name cleared of all suspicion. Not all Munchausen's by proxy create physical ailments in teir child, nor do their children need to be pre-schoolers. One sad case I know of, the condition was tricky and the one the mother was trying to prove (and which the teenager was diagnosed with) was a fairly new condition which was getting a lot of publicity at the time and the mother was determined to prove that the condition was potentially fatal. Whenever anyone suggested that the child needed to see a psychiatrist to assess for depression or the long-term effects of being chronically ill for all her teen years, the mother would have the child discharged from hospital and often would change doctors. As the child got sicker and sicker, all information on the child's condition was increasngly withheld and only divulged to a narrowing circle of supporters. Finally they had run out of doctors and hospitals, the child was discharged and died at home. The child became a martyr and symbol of the frustrating fight between mothers and unsympathetic medicos. The mother would spout loud and long about how she would prove tihs and confirm that but her pattern was, if ever she made a statement which later turned out Occupational Therapist (OT) be wrong, she would never correct it. But she would crow constantly if she was NOT proven wrong. The teeneager had apparently requested a post-mortem to be done; the results were never released. I suspect the results were either inconclusive, or indicated death due to lack of medical intervention because te moter was at tis point refusing to allow any doctors near the child if they so much as mentioned "psychologist". So when the accusaiton was made at me, I did my best to do the opposite. I have a good friend who is also a health professional who had some worrying symptoms. She had enough medical knowledge to try to discuss her case with her specialist who immediately got snaky about it and accused her of "Ulysses Syndrome" (which I had never heard of). It's one of those labels thta gets you coming and going. As a result, the specialist refused to operate on her until she was "symptomatic." "But I'm already in a lot of pain and having trouble walking," she said. She waited another 18 months before tey operated (another specialist) to remove a tumour the size of a grapefruit from her spine. The Ulysses Syndrome label had prevented surgery earlier when the tumour was much smaller and more manageable. She now is permanently disabled due to the damage tey had to do to get the tumour out. "Ulysses Syndrome" states that the person is over-concerned with their own medical welfare and imagines they have things wrong withthem when in fact there is nothing; they go searching for answers until they get something. In this woman's case, she already had a big problem and they were ignoring it almost to punish her for her medical knowledge. If she had been male I doubt they would have had this attitude. You shouldn't have any problems with the reports, surely - how can you persuade a neuropsychologist to 'fake' an assessment? Good luck with tihs, makesure your medical history has a very long arm and get a letter from your doctor stating how far back your records and your son's records can rach. If the doctor has access to records form other past doctors that also should put paid to that accusation. It's a nasty one. I hate it. marg [/QUOTE]
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