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<blockquote data-quote="Copabanana" data-source="post: 708957" data-attributes="member: 18958"><p>I forgot to address what you describe as his vindictiveness.</p><p></p><p>I was looking for I thought was a retaliatory act towards your mother, that I remember you described in your post, but could not find it.</p><p></p><p>Let me just start where I start (I have to go to the doctor with M, so this will be brief.)</p><p>Please forgive me if I cause pain by my remarks.</p><p></p><p>There is a linguistic bias in your remarks which while expressing a true thing, nonetheless affect your experience of your son and your life here. Let me try to explain.</p><p></p><p>You have used the active form of the verb and put yourself (your husband, etc) as the subject.</p><p></p><p>He has done this to ME, US.</p><p></p><p>*Which of course is true. But only in part.</p><p></p><p>There is the possibility of seeing this in other ways with different language:</p><p></p><p><em>We *he and my husband and I have been beset by forces, or a problem</em>.</p><p></p><p>And there is more: <em>for which we are searching valiantly and lovingly for answers and remedies. </em>Here you switch to the active voice in the verb. And all of this is true.</p><p>Nobody could be happy in this situation of heartbreak, pain and stress.</p><p></p><p>But there is a another way to see this, if you choose.</p><p>You have chosen and you keep choosing to put his needs as primary.</p><p></p><p>Others (including myself) have brought up the option of hospitalization or residential placement and YOU CHOOSE "no."</p><p></p><p>Now. There has been consideration that guilt, responsibility, duty and/or love may be fueling this choice--but still, the choice must be owned.</p><p></p><p>The primary actors here are you and your husband. You are the adults. Your child is suffering. Does this mean he belongs at home? No. (He may or may not.) But you and your husband are the deciders here. The ones who have put yourselves in this situation where you feel his victim...are you. And you continue to do so.</p><p></p><p>Your son does not have the agency or the capacity to structure his life to protect you. You have the agency, capacity and responsibility to protect both him and yourselves and as the posters have said--others and the community, should this spiral out of control to a greater extent. But I continue to assert that IF the professionals felt there was grave and imminent danger--he would have been hospitalized by the professionals who are responsible for treating and evaluating him.</p><p>This is a feeling, not a fact. Only you can take steps to change this, when and how you choose, according to options available.</p><p></p><p>As said earlier: you will act when and if you choose (or if circumstances force you to choose differently). Up to now you are CHOOSING to take responsibility to continue searching for solutions while you endure the impossible. You ARE HEROES. You would be heroes if you decided on residential treatment. That would not change things.</p><p>You do not KNOW what will come. NOBODY knows.</p><p>That is why you are here at this forum. Who of us in our right minds would post night and day to strangers in the middle of the internet unless we had arrived where you are? Not me for sure.</p><p>Well. There are people who get divorces for medical benefits to preserve assets. There are loving parents who forfeit parental rights so that their beloved children have access to needed medical treatments. Who in life could just you? Not me. People do unimaginable things do deal with realities that are horrible.</p><p></p><p>You are my heroes.</p><p>OK. I know last night I recommended expressive arts therapies, and play therapy could be thought of as similar. But it is different, I think. I would still investigate. And I will, when I have time.</p><p></p><p>Here is your hope:</p><p></p><p></p><p>Here's more:</p><p>These are great stories.</p><p></p><p>OK. Now I get to the vindictiveness and what appear to be revenge fantasies. A fantasy is not an act. Look at action figure games. At computer gaming. Look at cartoons. Look at action movies. All of them have extreme and sadistic revenge fantasies at their heart. And the appeal is the vicarious experience and expression of violence and victimization.</p><p></p><p>If everybody who thought about vicious pay back was held accountable, nobody would be left.</p><p></p><p>This is not to say he can be around other children unsupervised and that potentially he might not hurt somebody badly. I am not saying that.</p><p></p><p>I slammed the silverware drawer on purpose on my sister's hand. I did not turn into a serial criminal. (more on this when I have time.) He is 5. We do not know HOW this will turn out.</p><p></p><p>More Arnold Schwarzenneger:</p><p></p><p>Now here is where we get to the nuts and the bolts of the thing:</p><p>This is what you have to ask every professional you meet who has the responsibility for evaluating the extent of danger and potential harm. (And I might do so in writing, like presenting a written synopsis of his behaviors as you have done with us, dated and signed.)</p><p></p><p>I would start out with something like this sentence: I am concerned that my son might act out violently toward other people and I am requesting that you evaluate his potential to imminently harm anybody. I want to make sure I do the responsible thing, for him and for others.</p><p></p><p>Put the responsibility on them. I believe this might protect you morally, legally and financially. But I cannot know that. *I think I might call a family or disability rights attorney, too.</p><p></p><p>I will come back later tonight.</p><p></p><p>I want to say one more thing: every. single. word you have used to describe your son to us, is filtered by your own psyche. Your fear. Your hopelessness. Your overwhelm. Not too long ago (maybe 2 or 3 year) a psychiatrist, actually a psychoanalyst ($250 an hour type) told me that there was "no hope" for my son who he had never met. His only knowledge of my son was through the lens of my own depression, desperation and utter hopelessness. This was in the year or two after my mother died. I asked him: How can you know? Because everything you know of my child is through me. I cannot represent the situation without some measure of distortion. And he responded: <em>When is it in the best interests of anybody, to deny reality?</em></p><p></p><p>Can you imagine? He told me that I had to accept that my son for the rest of his life had to live in a single room occupancy hotel room on skid row.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Copabanana, post: 708957, member: 18958"] I forgot to address what you describe as his vindictiveness. I was looking for I thought was a retaliatory act towards your mother, that I remember you described in your post, but could not find it. Let me just start where I start (I have to go to the doctor with M, so this will be brief.) Please forgive me if I cause pain by my remarks. There is a linguistic bias in your remarks which while expressing a true thing, nonetheless affect your experience of your son and your life here. Let me try to explain. You have used the active form of the verb and put yourself (your husband, etc) as the subject. He has done this to ME, US. *Which of course is true. But only in part. There is the possibility of seeing this in other ways with different language: [I]We *he and my husband and I have been beset by forces, or a problem[/I]. And there is more: [I]for which we are searching valiantly and lovingly for answers and remedies. [/I]Here you switch to the active voice in the verb. And all of this is true. Nobody could be happy in this situation of heartbreak, pain and stress. But there is a another way to see this, if you choose. You have chosen and you keep choosing to put his needs as primary. Others (including myself) have brought up the option of hospitalization or residential placement and YOU CHOOSE "no." Now. There has been consideration that guilt, responsibility, duty and/or love may be fueling this choice--but still, the choice must be owned. The primary actors here are you and your husband. You are the adults. Your child is suffering. Does this mean he belongs at home? No. (He may or may not.) But you and your husband are the deciders here. The ones who have put yourselves in this situation where you feel his victim...are you. And you continue to do so. Your son does not have the agency or the capacity to structure his life to protect you. You have the agency, capacity and responsibility to protect both him and yourselves and as the posters have said--others and the community, should this spiral out of control to a greater extent. But I continue to assert that IF the professionals felt there was grave and imminent danger--he would have been hospitalized by the professionals who are responsible for treating and evaluating him. This is a feeling, not a fact. Only you can take steps to change this, when and how you choose, according to options available. As said earlier: you will act when and if you choose (or if circumstances force you to choose differently). Up to now you are CHOOSING to take responsibility to continue searching for solutions while you endure the impossible. You ARE HEROES. You would be heroes if you decided on residential treatment. That would not change things. You do not KNOW what will come. NOBODY knows. That is why you are here at this forum. Who of us in our right minds would post night and day to strangers in the middle of the internet unless we had arrived where you are? Not me for sure. Well. There are people who get divorces for medical benefits to preserve assets. There are loving parents who forfeit parental rights so that their beloved children have access to needed medical treatments. Who in life could just you? Not me. People do unimaginable things do deal with realities that are horrible. You are my heroes. OK. I know last night I recommended expressive arts therapies, and play therapy could be thought of as similar. But it is different, I think. I would still investigate. And I will, when I have time. Here is your hope: Here's more: These are great stories. OK. Now I get to the vindictiveness and what appear to be revenge fantasies. A fantasy is not an act. Look at action figure games. At computer gaming. Look at cartoons. Look at action movies. All of them have extreme and sadistic revenge fantasies at their heart. And the appeal is the vicarious experience and expression of violence and victimization. If everybody who thought about vicious pay back was held accountable, nobody would be left. This is not to say he can be around other children unsupervised and that potentially he might not hurt somebody badly. I am not saying that. I slammed the silverware drawer on purpose on my sister's hand. I did not turn into a serial criminal. (more on this when I have time.) He is 5. We do not know HOW this will turn out. More Arnold Schwarzenneger: Now here is where we get to the nuts and the bolts of the thing: This is what you have to ask every professional you meet who has the responsibility for evaluating the extent of danger and potential harm. (And I might do so in writing, like presenting a written synopsis of his behaviors as you have done with us, dated and signed.) I would start out with something like this sentence: I am concerned that my son might act out violently toward other people and I am requesting that you evaluate his potential to imminently harm anybody. I want to make sure I do the responsible thing, for him and for others. Put the responsibility on them. I believe this might protect you morally, legally and financially. But I cannot know that. *I think I might call a family or disability rights attorney, too. I will come back later tonight. I want to say one more thing: every. single. word you have used to describe your son to us, is filtered by your own psyche. Your fear. Your hopelessness. Your overwhelm. Not too long ago (maybe 2 or 3 year) a psychiatrist, actually a psychoanalyst ($250 an hour type) told me that there was "no hope" for my son who he had never met. His only knowledge of my son was through the lens of my own depression, desperation and utter hopelessness. This was in the year or two after my mother died. I asked him: How can you know? Because everything you know of my child is through me. I cannot represent the situation without some measure of distortion. And he responded: [I]When is it in the best interests of anybody, to deny reality?[/I] Can you imagine? He told me that I had to accept that my son for the rest of his life had to live in a single room occupancy hotel room on skid row. [/QUOTE]
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