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I miss my sister...for the first time in say 55 years.
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<blockquote data-quote="BusynMember" data-source="post: 654959" data-attributes="member: 1550"><p>Did you stand up to your mother, SWOT?<em><strong> I tried, but I didn't have the communication or social skills to give her a good argument. I'd just jumble angry words and end up crying I am a very talkative person who tended while young to blurt out stuff that did not mean what I meant. I did not learn how to express myself in an empowering way until later in life and often my method was an attack on an attack and that just makes the other person feel validated that they called you rotten, ya know?</strong></em></p><p></p><p>I don't mean over that incident. I mean, were you...there were times when I saw my mother crumble, back down, back away. I was not bigger than her, so it wasn't a physical threat. <em><strong>She never backed off. Not even when my Dad screamed at her, and he could sound intimidating. She'd bait and bait. When I was very young, sometimes she actually apologized when I was in my room, hating myself, wanting to jump out my window because I knew something was wrong with me and that I couldn't control my rages and that mommy thought I was bad...I thought of suicide very, very young. When she would come in I'd hug her hard and say how sorry I was. But that was sometimes and when I was very young.She never wanted to acknowledge something was wrong with me, but I knew something was and I needed her to try to get me help. Most kids are not as unhappy as I was.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>It was just that I knew what I knew.</p><p></p><p>Or maybe it was that she knew that if she allowed any further degree of crazy, she would kill us and that sort of snapped her to her senses or something.</p><p></p><p>I just wonder, if you did sort of confront her with the perfect understanding that you knew what she was doing was wrong, whether that is why she would hurt you like that. <em><strong>When I hit my teen years, I definitely stood up to her, the best I could, trying to explain that I was not the way she said I was and that I had problems beyond just being "bad" or "lazy" and that she was ignoring them. But if she called me a name, I crumbled and died and cried. A part of me believed her accusation. A part of me was devastated that she would tell me I was such a terrible person.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>Were you at a ceremony, like they show on television, so that the humiliation was public? <em><strong>No. It was just a family saga. She did not hide it from the other kids. But, honestly, she did not drive or work so she was always home. We never went anywhere with her.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>And here is another thing: When I was in The Will (and D H was made Executor over my own brother <em>even while my father was still alive</em>) it was our intention to correct whatever the wrongness was if it was in our power to do it. If there was a discrepancy, an attempt to hurt from the grave. <em><strong>Oh, gosh. I adored both of my siblings most of my life. It my mother had treated them the way she treated me, and if she had considered me a favored child, I would have intervened on their behalf, threatening to stop talking to her until she treated Sis or Bro better. That's how I am. If the Will had been in my hands and been an obvious attempt to hurt one of them, I would have given them something, even though I don't think anyone got much. I would not have wanted them to suffer the pain of a total parental rejection, even though it had been going on for years. The actual fact of it is different...it's like the whole wound open and scratched with a giant knife.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>Now, I am very sure D H is no longer Executor, and equally certain I am not in The Will at all.</p><p></p><p>My mother sent strawberries to her sister's funeral over some slight involving strawberries when they both were young. That is vengeance. <em><strong>It is amazing to me how mean some people can be...and at such inappropriate times! That is horrid!</strong></em></p><p></p><p>Ew.</p><p></p><p>I had best gird my loins for this whole The Will thing. <em><strong>Yep. It brings out the worst in hurtful people. I don't know first hand as my mother's affairs...I know nothing about them, really. Hubby and I chose to let it be and not find out if there was any way we were entitled to anything of hers. That was actually a wonderful decision and kept our lives calm and balanced. She had no big Estate or anything. If she had, we still would have probably just sat back. She didn't like me. It is her business what she does with her money. My brother is rather stoic and a puzzle to me...I barely know him anymore...but he would not try to cheat anyone.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>***</p><p></p><p>My mother is still with us. I anticipate nothing at all in her Will. Though I will say that she certainly does (did, when we were talking) bring up that Will, and what did we think she should do with her money (regarding investments, I mean).</p><p></p><p>Then?</p><p></p><p>She would launch into this whole diatribe about the economy and how stupid we were to have whatever.</p><p></p><p>So, who knows what that was all about. It felt like she was fishing. You know, tossing out bait to see what would elicit a hurt.</p><p></p><p>She generally did wind up calling everyone stupid. Our generation was stupid, rock and roll in general and the Rolling Stones (whom D H is partial to to this day) in particular, were stupid.</p><p></p><p>Stuff like that. That's really sucky.<em><strong> I'm sorry you had to go through that. That is not the sort of rot my mother would have pulled. She did other things.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>Was your mom like that, too? Cedar, <em><strong>if you asked me what my mother was REALLY like I wouldn't know. She is definitely quite a chameleon. I only know what she was to me, and that was sneaky, a big troublemaker, mean, a namecaller, one who not only disowned her daughter but disowned her daughter's grandchildren because they were my daughters, and a VERY unstable woman. She was also capable of extreme hurtfulness and, if she wanted to, she planned it and languished in it and did it with a twisting dagger. Again, this was how she was with me and I don't doubt my sibs would say I was lying, but I'm not. She was able to be who she wanted to be with whom she wanted. I heard her fight with her own mother many times and her mother, my grandmother, was very close to me a nd she upset her own mother VERY often and a lot. My sibs would vehemently deny this, however they did not have the daily, close relationship with my grandmother that I had. So this is something I know that they do not.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>My mom even left her Will lying on a kitchen counter and went into the other room once. I did not read it, but I always wondered whether she meant me to, or believed I had.<em><strong> I don't even know if my mom had an actual Will. I'm sure she had things legally in place to make sure I didn't even get that dollar that I am supposed to be entitled to...lol. My brother knew all about her will, I'm sure. I don't know if my sister did. I sure didn't. I didn't expect to be in it, but when it actually happened, I felt as if s he was laughing at me from wherever she was in the afterlife and it hurt like she had planned it to hurt.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>Just that phrase The Will carries a kind of numismatic magic. <em><strong>I hate the idea of Wills. How many real life folks have been killed over money? It's sick.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>I'm sorry that happened to you, SWOT. <em><strong>And I am sorry what is happening to you, Cedar. But we will survive. We already have.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>What a cruel biatch she was, to reach out from the grave with that stink. <em><strong>Yes. Conniving too. </strong></em></p><p></p><p>Would you like to borrow my motorcycle and needlepoint?<em><strong> At the same time? Do them both together? Hahahaha! Sounds like, er, fun????</strong></em></p><p></p><p>You were not a fool. You were a human being with a working brain. Everyone around us has a mother, SWOT. They seem to really enjoy their children and grands. We just don't get it why our moms don't behave that way about us. It is shaming to us.</p><p></p><p>But you know now who I think that shame belongs to. And about a bucket of rage that goes with it.</p><p></p><p>Your mom was differently wired, SWOT. <em><strong>That is putting it mildly, Cedar. Yours was too. I remember being shocked awake at 3am often in my teen years. It was my wild-eyed mother screaming at me about something t hat was bohering her about something I had done three weeks earlier that I had thought had been resolved. Terrified me. Woke my sister too. When I saw the wire hanger scene on "Mommie Dearest" that reminded me of my mother's night raids. She didn't make me clean up, but she scared the bejeezus out of me and wakeing me up at that hour over things that had happened weeks earlier...I mean, she couldn't wait until morning if she had to rage at me? She looked a bit like Joan Crawf</strong></em>ord too. She was very pretty. But Joan Crawford always freaked me a bit because of the resemblence in a few ways.</p><p></p><p>I think that might be code for "psychotic biatch". Maybe it is like I was posting to you about my mom. Fishing for something to hurt you, she landed on that <em>because </em>it hurt you. Custom made torture.<em><strong>I have no doubt that the latter years were done just to hurt me, yes. Don't let yours hurt you that way. Please be smarter than I was.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>You made yourself a wonderful mom, and you gave a wonderful mom to so many kids, SWOT. Living well is the best revenge, and vengeance is a dish best eaten cold. T<em><strong>hank you, Cedar. And you turned out to be such a caring, giving, wise person. And, yes, living well is the best revenge. It doesn't allays set well with siblings who are not quite as happy though.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>I never used to be about revenge or vengeance. I am probably just being a big shot right this minute. But that phrase appeals to me. "Vengeance is a dish best eaten cold."</p><p></p><p>Where is my pirate skirt. <em><strong>LOL. Really, I just agree that being a good person, having a lot of love in your life, and feeling peace and stability is tremendous revenge. And it hurts nobody intentionally. If others in the clan make choices that hurt themselves, that is on them. You and I are not choosing to live wild, crazy, manicky lives with horrible men and substances and dramatic, toxic people. Nobody can take my wonderful family from me and they are in my life because I made good choices in the man I married. Twenty years in a month! How long have you been married?</strong></em></p><p></p><p>Roar.</p><p></p><p>I am so over our mothers. <em><strong>But are we ever really over them? I only tend to think about her now when I vent here. But it took a few years to get over being disowned. However, I did it and I managed to keep my head on straight with those who needed me to stay strong.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>How do you know he forgave your sister, SWOT? </p><p></p><p>My sister bullies my brothers. It's all like, "dear" and "love" and etc, but it is at her convenience and they are dropped again at her convenience. They seem eager to respond to any positive effort on anyone's part to include them because my mother hates one right out loud and twists the other to keep herself in the boss position. <em><strong>I don't know how it happened, or how Sis talked herself out of all the horrid abuse she heaped on her brother, but I believe he forgave her. She probably told him she was mean to him because she loved him so much and he was so sick and she pushed him away...because she was so afraid he'd die. I am finding she can really be good at snowing people. I neither know nor care. I won't say I'm not needy. I am. But I have my needs met with my hub and kids. Sis didn't pay that much attention to Bro until she decided to cut me off again...actually, though, I think this time I cut her off. It's iffy. At any rate, she needs people to lift her up and without me he is the only one left. So I can see her suddenly playing up to him to get close to him.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>So...how do you know he forgave her?</p><p></p><p>Maybe, she just overwhelmed him and wants you to <em>think</em> he is allied with her against you. <em><strong>Naw. He isn't really the one who does revenge much. Yeah, he wrote me a letter. His therapist probably told him to. He was under mother's influence for a long time. I'm sure he buys her version of me. But I believe Sis snowed him with pretty words and he's kind of socially awkward. Nothing against him. I am too.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>My brother has been so badly hurt that all he wants is to do the right thing by his mother (and she takes shameless advantage) and that same, forever unknowable thing we all want, a family. He has his own very loving family. He was an excellent father. <em><strong>My brother has always lived alone. That kind of makes me sad. I can never get as angry at him as Sis. He wants a family too and has tried to make one by being a father figure to his students. I would not be happy with a lifetime of living alone with my students being close to me only, but I'm not him and perhaps he likes his life just how it turned out. A part of me will always feel badly for him...he is so sick and, like me, knows what being bullied by his peers feels like. I hope he is happy. I just don't want to find out what all his gripes are, since he was so close to his mother. I am going to opt to stay No Contact with both of them. From now on when I meet new folks and they ask about siblings I'm going to say I'm an only child so I don't have to answer any questions about siblings. I'm like an only child so why not just state it? My Sis has been meaner to me than anyone on earth, in an ongoing way, other than my mother. I don't know why I kept taking her back after her eternal cut offs. That was plain dumb of me...and naive. Maybe more naive.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>F you, mom. <em><strong>Ah, it's so much better to be living a better life than your siblings that she loved more <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> Wherever she is, she sees my Sis making bad choices, wasting her life, crying because she picked such a terrible man to "love." And that she is still living with her ex. There is more. She just does not have a good life. The entire time I tried to advise her, as she did ask for my advice, I tried to help her because she was so miserable. Even though I believe her kids are all nice, thriving kids (remember, I don't know them well so I could be wrong), we all know that we are separate from our adult children and our adult children can not make us happy. We have to make the choices that make us happy.</strong></em></p><p></p><p>I will write more later, SWOT. <em><strong>Love healing with you, Cedar <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></strong></em></p><p></p><p>Thank you for working through this with me.</p></blockquote><p>[/QUOTE]</p>
[QUOTE="BusynMember, post: 654959, member: 1550"] Did you stand up to your mother, SWOT?[I][B] I tried, but I didn't have the communication or social skills to give her a good argument. I'd just jumble angry words and end up crying I am a very talkative person who tended while young to blurt out stuff that did not mean what I meant. I did not learn how to express myself in an empowering way until later in life and often my method was an attack on an attack and that just makes the other person feel validated that they called you rotten, ya know?[/B][/I] I don't mean over that incident. I mean, were you...there were times when I saw my mother crumble, back down, back away. I was not bigger than her, so it wasn't a physical threat. [I][B]She never backed off. Not even when my Dad screamed at her, and he could sound intimidating. She'd bait and bait. When I was very young, sometimes she actually apologized when I was in my room, hating myself, wanting to jump out my window because I knew something was wrong with me and that I couldn't control my rages and that mommy thought I was bad...I thought of suicide very, very young. When she would come in I'd hug her hard and say how sorry I was. But that was sometimes and when I was very young.She never wanted to acknowledge something was wrong with me, but I knew something was and I needed her to try to get me help. Most kids are not as unhappy as I was.[/B][/I] It was just that I knew what I knew. Or maybe it was that she knew that if she allowed any further degree of crazy, she would kill us and that sort of snapped her to her senses or something. I just wonder, if you did sort of confront her with the perfect understanding that you knew what she was doing was wrong, whether that is why she would hurt you like that. [I][B]When I hit my teen years, I definitely stood up to her, the best I could, trying to explain that I was not the way she said I was and that I had problems beyond just being "bad" or "lazy" and that she was ignoring them. But if she called me a name, I crumbled and died and cried. A part of me believed her accusation. A part of me was devastated that she would tell me I was such a terrible person.[/B][/I] Were you at a ceremony, like they show on television, so that the humiliation was public? [I][B]No. It was just a family saga. She did not hide it from the other kids. But, honestly, she did not drive or work so she was always home. We never went anywhere with her.[/B][/I] And here is another thing: When I was in The Will (and D H was made Executor over my own brother [I]even while my father was still alive[/I]) it was our intention to correct whatever the wrongness was if it was in our power to do it. If there was a discrepancy, an attempt to hurt from the grave. [I][B]Oh, gosh. I adored both of my siblings most of my life. It my mother had treated them the way she treated me, and if she had considered me a favored child, I would have intervened on their behalf, threatening to stop talking to her until she treated Sis or Bro better. That's how I am. If the Will had been in my hands and been an obvious attempt to hurt one of them, I would have given them something, even though I don't think anyone got much. I would not have wanted them to suffer the pain of a total parental rejection, even though it had been going on for years. The actual fact of it is different...it's like the whole wound open and scratched with a giant knife.[/B][/I] Now, I am very sure D H is no longer Executor, and equally certain I am not in The Will at all. My mother sent strawberries to her sister's funeral over some slight involving strawberries when they both were young. That is vengeance. [I][B]It is amazing to me how mean some people can be...and at such inappropriate times! That is horrid![/B][/I] Ew. I had best gird my loins for this whole The Will thing. [I][B]Yep. It brings out the worst in hurtful people. I don't know first hand as my mother's affairs...I know nothing about them, really. Hubby and I chose to let it be and not find out if there was any way we were entitled to anything of hers. That was actually a wonderful decision and kept our lives calm and balanced. She had no big Estate or anything. If she had, we still would have probably just sat back. She didn't like me. It is her business what she does with her money. My brother is rather stoic and a puzzle to me...I barely know him anymore...but he would not try to cheat anyone.[/B][/I] *** My mother is still with us. I anticipate nothing at all in her Will. Though I will say that she certainly does (did, when we were talking) bring up that Will, and what did we think she should do with her money (regarding investments, I mean). Then? She would launch into this whole diatribe about the economy and how stupid we were to have whatever. So, who knows what that was all about. It felt like she was fishing. You know, tossing out bait to see what would elicit a hurt. She generally did wind up calling everyone stupid. Our generation was stupid, rock and roll in general and the Rolling Stones (whom D H is partial to to this day) in particular, were stupid. Stuff like that. That's really sucky.[I][B] I'm sorry you had to go through that. That is not the sort of rot my mother would have pulled. She did other things.[/B][/I] Was your mom like that, too? Cedar, [I][B]if you asked me what my mother was REALLY like I wouldn't know. She is definitely quite a chameleon. I only know what she was to me, and that was sneaky, a big troublemaker, mean, a namecaller, one who not only disowned her daughter but disowned her daughter's grandchildren because they were my daughters, and a VERY unstable woman. She was also capable of extreme hurtfulness and, if she wanted to, she planned it and languished in it and did it with a twisting dagger. Again, this was how she was with me and I don't doubt my sibs would say I was lying, but I'm not. She was able to be who she wanted to be with whom she wanted. I heard her fight with her own mother many times and her mother, my grandmother, was very close to me a nd she upset her own mother VERY often and a lot. My sibs would vehemently deny this, however they did not have the daily, close relationship with my grandmother that I had. So this is something I know that they do not.[/B][/I] My mom even left her Will lying on a kitchen counter and went into the other room once. I did not read it, but I always wondered whether she meant me to, or believed I had.[I][B] I don't even know if my mom had an actual Will. I'm sure she had things legally in place to make sure I didn't even get that dollar that I am supposed to be entitled to...lol. My brother knew all about her will, I'm sure. I don't know if my sister did. I sure didn't. I didn't expect to be in it, but when it actually happened, I felt as if s he was laughing at me from wherever she was in the afterlife and it hurt like she had planned it to hurt.[/B][/I] Just that phrase The Will carries a kind of numismatic magic. [I][B]I hate the idea of Wills. How many real life folks have been killed over money? It's sick.[/B][/I] I'm sorry that happened to you, SWOT. [I][B]And I am sorry what is happening to you, Cedar. But we will survive. We already have.[/B][/I] What a cruel biatch she was, to reach out from the grave with that stink. [I][B]Yes. Conniving too. [/B][/I] Would you like to borrow my motorcycle and needlepoint?[I][B] At the same time? Do them both together? Hahahaha! Sounds like, er, fun????[/B][/I] You were not a fool. You were a human being with a working brain. Everyone around us has a mother, SWOT. They seem to really enjoy their children and grands. We just don't get it why our moms don't behave that way about us. It is shaming to us. But you know now who I think that shame belongs to. And about a bucket of rage that goes with it. Your mom was differently wired, SWOT. [I][B]That is putting it mildly, Cedar. Yours was too. I remember being shocked awake at 3am often in my teen years. It was my wild-eyed mother screaming at me about something t hat was bohering her about something I had done three weeks earlier that I had thought had been resolved. Terrified me. Woke my sister too. When I saw the wire hanger scene on "Mommie Dearest" that reminded me of my mother's night raids. She didn't make me clean up, but she scared the bejeezus out of me and wakeing me up at that hour over things that had happened weeks earlier...I mean, she couldn't wait until morning if she had to rage at me? She looked a bit like Joan Crawf[/B][/I]ord too. She was very pretty. But Joan Crawford always freaked me a bit because of the resemblence in a few ways. I think that might be code for "psychotic biatch". Maybe it is like I was posting to you about my mom. Fishing for something to hurt you, she landed on that [I]because [/I]it hurt you. Custom made torture.[I][B]I have no doubt that the latter years were done just to hurt me, yes. Don't let yours hurt you that way. Please be smarter than I was.[/B][/I] You made yourself a wonderful mom, and you gave a wonderful mom to so many kids, SWOT. Living well is the best revenge, and vengeance is a dish best eaten cold. T[I][B]hank you, Cedar. And you turned out to be such a caring, giving, wise person. And, yes, living well is the best revenge. It doesn't allays set well with siblings who are not quite as happy though.[/B][/I] I never used to be about revenge or vengeance. I am probably just being a big shot right this minute. But that phrase appeals to me. "Vengeance is a dish best eaten cold." Where is my pirate skirt. [I][B]LOL. Really, I just agree that being a good person, having a lot of love in your life, and feeling peace and stability is tremendous revenge. And it hurts nobody intentionally. If others in the clan make choices that hurt themselves, that is on them. You and I are not choosing to live wild, crazy, manicky lives with horrible men and substances and dramatic, toxic people. Nobody can take my wonderful family from me and they are in my life because I made good choices in the man I married. Twenty years in a month! How long have you been married?[/B][/I] Roar. I am so over our mothers. [I][B]But are we ever really over them? I only tend to think about her now when I vent here. But it took a few years to get over being disowned. However, I did it and I managed to keep my head on straight with those who needed me to stay strong.[/B][/I] How do you know he forgave your sister, SWOT? My sister bullies my brothers. It's all like, "dear" and "love" and etc, but it is at her convenience and they are dropped again at her convenience. They seem eager to respond to any positive effort on anyone's part to include them because my mother hates one right out loud and twists the other to keep herself in the boss position. [I][B]I don't know how it happened, or how Sis talked herself out of all the horrid abuse she heaped on her brother, but I believe he forgave her. She probably told him she was mean to him because she loved him so much and he was so sick and she pushed him away...because she was so afraid he'd die. I am finding she can really be good at snowing people. I neither know nor care. I won't say I'm not needy. I am. But I have my needs met with my hub and kids. Sis didn't pay that much attention to Bro until she decided to cut me off again...actually, though, I think this time I cut her off. It's iffy. At any rate, she needs people to lift her up and without me he is the only one left. So I can see her suddenly playing up to him to get close to him.[/B][/I] So...how do you know he forgave her? Maybe, she just overwhelmed him and wants you to [I]think[/I] he is allied with her against you. [I][B]Naw. He isn't really the one who does revenge much. Yeah, he wrote me a letter. His therapist probably told him to. He was under mother's influence for a long time. I'm sure he buys her version of me. But I believe Sis snowed him with pretty words and he's kind of socially awkward. Nothing against him. I am too.[/B][/I] My brother has been so badly hurt that all he wants is to do the right thing by his mother (and she takes shameless advantage) and that same, forever unknowable thing we all want, a family. He has his own very loving family. He was an excellent father. [I][B]My brother has always lived alone. That kind of makes me sad. I can never get as angry at him as Sis. He wants a family too and has tried to make one by being a father figure to his students. I would not be happy with a lifetime of living alone with my students being close to me only, but I'm not him and perhaps he likes his life just how it turned out. A part of me will always feel badly for him...he is so sick and, like me, knows what being bullied by his peers feels like. I hope he is happy. I just don't want to find out what all his gripes are, since he was so close to his mother. I am going to opt to stay No Contact with both of them. From now on when I meet new folks and they ask about siblings I'm going to say I'm an only child so I don't have to answer any questions about siblings. I'm like an only child so why not just state it? My Sis has been meaner to me than anyone on earth, in an ongoing way, other than my mother. I don't know why I kept taking her back after her eternal cut offs. That was plain dumb of me...and naive. Maybe more naive.[/B][/I] F you, mom. [I][B]Ah, it's so much better to be living a better life than your siblings that she loved more :) Wherever she is, she sees my Sis making bad choices, wasting her life, crying because she picked such a terrible man to "love." And that she is still living with her ex. There is more. She just does not have a good life. The entire time I tried to advise her, as she did ask for my advice, I tried to help her because she was so miserable. Even though I believe her kids are all nice, thriving kids (remember, I don't know them well so I could be wrong), we all know that we are separate from our adult children and our adult children can not make us happy. We have to make the choices that make us happy.[/B][/I] I will write more later, SWOT. [I][B]Love healing with you, Cedar :)[/B][/I] Thank you for working through this with me.[/QUOTE] [/QUOTE]
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