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<blockquote data-quote="scent of cedar" data-source="post: 614613" data-attributes="member: 1721"><p>Thank you, Janet. I am so careful around the issue of my own anger. Feeling the legitimacy of the anger someone else feels in listening to my side of the story clarifies things for me, sort of lets me see that what is happening really is a wrongness that should be addressed, not something to be backed away from or rationalized or minimized.</p><p></p><p>I like that you did that for me, Janet. </p><p></p><p>:O)</p><p></p><p>************</p><p></p><p>I don't think you were an abusive mom, Janet. I think you were a mom pushed to her limits and doing the best she knew. Know how I know that? Because your love for your kids pulses through every post you write. You get frustrated, you get out of sorts. Sometimes, you react in ways you wished you hadn't. (Ha! I still remember reading some of <u>those</u> posts!) But you are so darn honest about everything, Janet. You remind me of my own daughter, sometimes. No one really understands why she does some of the things she does? But she has a great heart. </p><p></p><p>When she is well, difficult child daughter is one of the coolest moms ever. She's so darn far from perfect with her kids that there just isn't any question but that she loves them, wants them, values them, and is doing her best. Her kids are remarkably healthy, given all they have been through. I think that's because, at the core of it, they know who they are. She acts out their value to her in every interaction she has with them, good or bad. But it's like...here's the difference. I would always say I'd had enough of something, or that I didn't want something, so my kids could have it. difficult child daughter is like ~ "Don't touch that. It's mine."</p><p></p><p>:O)</p><p></p><p>That's the kind of mom I think you probably are too, Janet. Real and honest with your kids, out in the open about any parenting shortcomings. Probably an easy mom to talk to about anything because you have been through so much, yourself. </p><p></p><p>I don't know how to clarify what I am trying to say. </p><p></p><p>The gist of it is that your son probably doesn't remember specific incidents as abusive because they weren't. They were the overreactions of a frustrated parent who had been pushed beyond her breaking point. Kids understand that. It makes sense. They did thus and so enough times that their mother took after them. Real abuse, the kind that scars the psyche, has nothing to do with parenting and everything to do with victimization. There is no lesson to be learned, no sense to be made of it. </p><p> </p><p>My mother, who was and still is abusive, Janet, not only does not apologize as you did to your children ~ she is literally still out to destroy us. And does so, to the limit of her power, on a routine basis. She is out to destroy our marriages too, unless she can dominate the male or the female partner. She has actually played a part in destroying two of my sister's marriages through what she told the husbands about my sister shortly after the weddings. She did the same to me, of course. My husband, though, is so "first son in an Italian family" that you could be contemptuous with him, about him, around him, all day long and he would wonder what was wrong with you, not him.</p><p></p><p>:O)</p><p></p><p>He discounts my mother, and always has. Probably having to do with whatever it was she told him about me, now that I think about it. He has never told me what it was, only that it happened and didn't matter. My mother hates husband with an unbelievably passionate intensity and tenacity to this day, and we will have been married 42 years, in June.</p><p></p><p>So, no Janet, you did not abuse your children. You love them now as you loved them then, and I can feel your love for them in every post you write.</p><p></p><p>Cedar</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="scent of cedar, post: 614613, member: 1721"] Thank you, Janet. I am so careful around the issue of my own anger. Feeling the legitimacy of the anger someone else feels in listening to my side of the story clarifies things for me, sort of lets me see that what is happening really is a wrongness that should be addressed, not something to be backed away from or rationalized or minimized. I like that you did that for me, Janet. :O) ************ I don't think you were an abusive mom, Janet. I think you were a mom pushed to her limits and doing the best she knew. Know how I know that? Because your love for your kids pulses through every post you write. You get frustrated, you get out of sorts. Sometimes, you react in ways you wished you hadn't. (Ha! I still remember reading some of [U]those[/U] posts!) But you are so darn honest about everything, Janet. You remind me of my own daughter, sometimes. No one really understands why she does some of the things she does? But she has a great heart. When she is well, difficult child daughter is one of the coolest moms ever. She's so darn far from perfect with her kids that there just isn't any question but that she loves them, wants them, values them, and is doing her best. Her kids are remarkably healthy, given all they have been through. I think that's because, at the core of it, they know who they are. She acts out their value to her in every interaction she has with them, good or bad. But it's like...here's the difference. I would always say I'd had enough of something, or that I didn't want something, so my kids could have it. difficult child daughter is like ~ "Don't touch that. It's mine." :O) That's the kind of mom I think you probably are too, Janet. Real and honest with your kids, out in the open about any parenting shortcomings. Probably an easy mom to talk to about anything because you have been through so much, yourself. I don't know how to clarify what I am trying to say. The gist of it is that your son probably doesn't remember specific incidents as abusive because they weren't. They were the overreactions of a frustrated parent who had been pushed beyond her breaking point. Kids understand that. It makes sense. They did thus and so enough times that their mother took after them. Real abuse, the kind that scars the psyche, has nothing to do with parenting and everything to do with victimization. There is no lesson to be learned, no sense to be made of it. My mother, who was and still is abusive, Janet, not only does not apologize as you did to your children ~ she is literally still out to destroy us. And does so, to the limit of her power, on a routine basis. She is out to destroy our marriages too, unless she can dominate the male or the female partner. She has actually played a part in destroying two of my sister's marriages through what she told the husbands about my sister shortly after the weddings. She did the same to me, of course. My husband, though, is so "first son in an Italian family" that you could be contemptuous with him, about him, around him, all day long and he would wonder what was wrong with you, not him. :O) He discounts my mother, and always has. Probably having to do with whatever it was she told him about me, now that I think about it. He has never told me what it was, only that it happened and didn't matter. My mother hates husband with an unbelievably passionate intensity and tenacity to this day, and we will have been married 42 years, in June. So, no Janet, you did not abuse your children. You love them now as you loved them then, and I can feel your love for them in every post you write. Cedar [/QUOTE]
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