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<blockquote data-quote="recoveringenabler" data-source="post: 618692" data-attributes="member: 13542"><p><em>" I am realizing that FOG descending is where people pleasing begins."</em></p><p></p><p>That is such a good point Cedar. I had never put that together in that way before, thank you. I have been fighting that fog for a very long time............as you said, not only with my daughter, but in all my relationships, interestingly, mostly with women. Mother complex. I did not play this out the same way with men. In this last year, I have made significant changes in my relationships.........the most difficult and sad for me was the demise of two of my closest friendships. Both going back 40-50 years, so the patterns that began in childhood were certainly embedded in these connections............subtle and yet harmful to me. Had I been healthy all those years ago, the likelihood is that I would not have initially entered into these relationships in the first place, I would have not entered the fog..............</p><p></p><p> "<em>Always before, I was so conscious of my own pain that I wanted to protect others from experiencing pain or discomfort."</em></p><p></p><p>For me that was disappointment. I was profoundly disappointed as a child and when confronted with another's disappointment, I would try to fix it, change it, give them what they wanted to make their disappointment go away. I did that big time with my daughter. She did not experience much disappointment in her childhood...........at least that I could fix. Taking that away from her or anyone, takes away their ability to deal with life's disappointments. I have a lot of empathy so even today that is difficult for me, in particular with my granddaughter..............but now I override my angst about HER disappointment and take deep breaths and move on.</p><p></p><p>"<em>'Or of no longer trying to manipulate situations so things don't go bad, so my fraudulence is not exposed." </em></p><p></p><p>I tried to manipulate situations so things didn't go bad because I was terrified of doing something wrong which would effectively evict me from my family. That fear was placed in me when I was 5 years old when my mother made it apparent that the actions demanded of me had to be met or I would be cast out of the family and delivered to a monster. Fear. It's taken me a lifetime to unload fear.</p><p></p><p><em>"In all these years, I have never really believed there was a purpose to all this."</em></p><p></p><p>I am very glad you now believe there is a purpose to all of it.</p><p></p><p>I think Providence assisted my lonely childhood self by supporting my learning early (7th grade) about life being about lessons to be learned, that karma existed, spirituality, reincarnation............I had already read everything in our local library by the 7th grade that had to do with alternative religious/spiritual/philosophical practices in other cultures. (I was a weird kid!) And by the 10th grade, I did a report on Mental Illness and identified my family..........that's when my commitment to get into therapy as soon as I grew up began. I have been on this road of learning, healing, becoming conscious for over 50 years, so for me, thankfully, I always believed there was a purpose for everything. I think that has kept me sane a midst all of the insanity. </p><p></p><p>Thank you for sharing that story about your granddaughter. I was smiling from ear to ear to hear that. I could FEEL her joy and pride. Oh my, we can thrive anywhere can't we? The human spirit is a remarkable thing. I thought of the flower that grows in the crack in the concrete right in the middle of a ghetto. </p><p></p><p>It reminds me of a wonderful documentary I recently saw about a couple who fell in love in a concentration camp and all they could do was write to one another for years.......on scraps of paper...........until the war ended and they were separated and he found her. They are still together to this day and do speeches all over the world about their experiences to keep the knowledge of the camps alive.........he is almost 100 years old now. It was such a touching and oh so tender story. Like your granddaughter, not just surviving, but thriving. Wow.</p><p></p><p>I am glad to hear your daughter is also thriving. Cedar, who would have thought it would have gone in this direction after that horrible beating? But look where it has gone now. You are detached, your daughter is healing,( in every sense of that word), your granddaughter is thriving, husband is doing much better and so are the cat and the dog!! It is a miracle. Sometimes dramatic life events occur to wake us up. Appears as if your daughter has awakened as you detached. You were able to see that beating as stepping up the game, you didn't have the same response...............so perhaps your daughter can release the need to put herself in such risky environments now. Both our daughters removed themselves or were removed from risky environments when we detached from their lives. </p><p></p><p>Cedar, I think about you and your family throughout my days.........you are a dear friend with a similar experience of life which connects us on deep levels............we are simpatico. I am happy and honored to be with you on this journey out of the fog.</p><p></p><p>"<em>Acknowledging that people (even me) can be jerks sometimes, and should be called on that behavior."</em></p><p></p><p>Yup, me too. Very freeing indeed.</p><p></p><p>I am pretty happy Cedar................as you sound as well. One can survive trauma and come out the other side, as long as we face it and feel it..........we are so fortunate...............and it's never too late to have that happy childhood..........go with husband and play...........I do that as much as I can now.........play.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="recoveringenabler, post: 618692, member: 13542"] [I]" I am realizing that FOG descending is where people pleasing begins."[/I] [I][/I] That is such a good point Cedar. I had never put that together in that way before, thank you. I have been fighting that fog for a very long time............as you said, not only with my daughter, but in all my relationships, interestingly, mostly with women. Mother complex. I did not play this out the same way with men. In this last year, I have made significant changes in my relationships.........the most difficult and sad for me was the demise of two of my closest friendships. Both going back 40-50 years, so the patterns that began in childhood were certainly embedded in these connections............subtle and yet harmful to me. Had I been healthy all those years ago, the likelihood is that I would not have initially entered into these relationships in the first place, I would have not entered the fog.............. "[I]Always before, I was so conscious of my own pain that I wanted to protect others from experiencing pain or discomfort."[/I] [I][/I] For me that was disappointment. I was profoundly disappointed as a child and when confronted with another's disappointment, I would try to fix it, change it, give them what they wanted to make their disappointment go away. I did that big time with my daughter. She did not experience much disappointment in her childhood...........at least that I could fix. Taking that away from her or anyone, takes away their ability to deal with life's disappointments. I have a lot of empathy so even today that is difficult for me, in particular with my granddaughter..............but now I override my angst about HER disappointment and take deep breaths and move on. "[I]'Or of no longer trying to manipulate situations so things don't go bad, so my fraudulence is not exposed." [/I] I tried to manipulate situations so things didn't go bad because I was terrified of doing something wrong which would effectively evict me from my family. That fear was placed in me when I was 5 years old when my mother made it apparent that the actions demanded of me had to be met or I would be cast out of the family and delivered to a monster. Fear. It's taken me a lifetime to unload fear. [I]"In all these years, I have never really believed there was a purpose to all this."[/I] [I][/I] I am very glad you now believe there is a purpose to all of it. I think Providence assisted my lonely childhood self by supporting my learning early (7th grade) about life being about lessons to be learned, that karma existed, spirituality, reincarnation............I had already read everything in our local library by the 7th grade that had to do with alternative religious/spiritual/philosophical practices in other cultures. (I was a weird kid!) And by the 10th grade, I did a report on Mental Illness and identified my family..........that's when my commitment to get into therapy as soon as I grew up began. I have been on this road of learning, healing, becoming conscious for over 50 years, so for me, thankfully, I always believed there was a purpose for everything. I think that has kept me sane a midst all of the insanity. Thank you for sharing that story about your granddaughter. I was smiling from ear to ear to hear that. I could FEEL her joy and pride. Oh my, we can thrive anywhere can't we? The human spirit is a remarkable thing. I thought of the flower that grows in the crack in the concrete right in the middle of a ghetto. It reminds me of a wonderful documentary I recently saw about a couple who fell in love in a concentration camp and all they could do was write to one another for years.......on scraps of paper...........until the war ended and they were separated and he found her. They are still together to this day and do speeches all over the world about their experiences to keep the knowledge of the camps alive.........he is almost 100 years old now. It was such a touching and oh so tender story. Like your granddaughter, not just surviving, but thriving. Wow. I am glad to hear your daughter is also thriving. Cedar, who would have thought it would have gone in this direction after that horrible beating? But look where it has gone now. You are detached, your daughter is healing,( in every sense of that word), your granddaughter is thriving, husband is doing much better and so are the cat and the dog!! It is a miracle. Sometimes dramatic life events occur to wake us up. Appears as if your daughter has awakened as you detached. You were able to see that beating as stepping up the game, you didn't have the same response...............so perhaps your daughter can release the need to put herself in such risky environments now. Both our daughters removed themselves or were removed from risky environments when we detached from their lives. Cedar, I think about you and your family throughout my days.........you are a dear friend with a similar experience of life which connects us on deep levels............we are simpatico. I am happy and honored to be with you on this journey out of the fog. "[I]Acknowledging that people (even me) can be jerks sometimes, and should be called on that behavior."[/I] [I][/I] Yup, me too. Very freeing indeed. I am pretty happy Cedar................as you sound as well. One can survive trauma and come out the other side, as long as we face it and feel it..........we are so fortunate...............and it's never too late to have that happy childhood..........go with husband and play...........I do that as much as I can now.........play. [/QUOTE]
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