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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 261141" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>He has Asperger's diagnosed, so this goes beyond behaviour Yes,there are behaviour problems but they are the result of the condition and you can't fix everything by working on the behaviours.</p><p></p><p>This requires some expert on-the-spot opinions from an autism expert if possible. We went through this with difficult child 3 - the Dept of Ed behaviour expert was called in. Often in Australia our Aspie/autistic kids get caught up with the behaviour management area, but at least they are taking the autism into account.</p><p></p><p>This needs to be discussed with you, the teachers and an expert in autism behaviours so you know what can be changed, what can't be changed and what has to be endured.</p><p></p><p>This is where continued observation and diarising between home and school is so valuable - the teacher tries something and has either success, failure or no change. Same thing with home. By feeding back to each other what you tried and what result there was, you all slowly build up a picture of how to manage.</p><p></p><p>Things to try to change:</p><p></p><p>1) he needs to learn the right way to interact with others. </p><p>He cannot simply be left to try to absorb this on his own; autism doesn't work that way, he needs active tuition, support and supervision. He needs positive outcomes and if it has to take adult support for this to happen at least in the beginning, so be it. The more positive outcomes he has the more he will improve, often quite quickly. But if the experiences are negative, his behaviour is likely to deteriorate.</p><p></p><p>Example - difficult child 3 was put on playground supervision. This did involve the aide staying within eyesight of him, but so she wasn't merely following him around she actually organised a game of touch football in the playground. Kids joined in, kids dropped out, the game rules were followed, as game rules changed she made sure difficult child 3 understood that rules had been changed (because other kids signal suchthings to one another more subtly) and any possible problems were picked up on and dealt with immediately. "It's OK, difficult child 3, Benny didn't mean to tip you so hard, he was just getting caught up in the game. Benny just said sorry, let's play on."</p><p>At the end of the play session she would talk to difficult child 3 and they would discuss any issues and finish with an overview of social lessons learned. Other kids couldn't take advantage of difficult child 3 because an adult was supervising, but it was informal so a lot of 'natural' communication was still happening.</p><p></p><p>2) He needs to change his response to change and to distraction in class.</p><p>This is a huge problem area for autistics and Aspies, teachers need to make accomodations here but over time you want him to become more adaptable. It won't happen overnight and it won't happen without support.</p><p></p><p>3) He MUST NOT be expected to stop stimming or to do without his coping mechanisms. However, if what he needs is not practical, then he needs to be supported in the process of making a change to something that CAN be made practical. For example, if his stimulant involved a noisy scream every 5 seconds, this is gonig to be disruptive. If it is at all possible he would need to be supported to find something else that is not so disruptive. Help him find a workable substitute and gently remind him to try the alternative; in the meantime, finding a work area where his noises would be less disruptive to others, would be a short-term management.</p><p></p><p>I would be asking the teacher to make a list of the behaviours they want to fix. Follow "Explosive Child" methods (I'm taking this from the earlier edition) where you sit down and make a list of what you want 'fixed'. You then have to 'cull' that list and only work on what can be maanged, and only a couple of things at a time. You have to ignore the rest of the things on the list, otherwise you'd be constantly correcting and criticising the child and NOTHING would get done.</p><p></p><p>An analogy for the teacher - the problem behaviours are a herd of gazelle, the teacher is the lioness who needs to make a kill to feed her cubs. If the lioness charges at the entire herd, she is not going to catch anything, her cubs will go hungry. What she needs to do is to make a choice - which gazelle is going to be the easiest for her to bring down? Not only the most frail, perhaps the weakest, perhaps the one closest to her. Perhaps a combination of these. But she MUST make a choice and when she charges in, she must not take her eye off that target or allow herself to be distracted or swerved from her aim, or again she will miss.</p><p></p><p>So for now, if the school want to consider this to be a behaviour issue - work with them. Make it clear that you must continue to be informed and involved, and also make it clear that they are NOT going to be able to work on everything. And it is possible that what the teacher chooses to work on, may be too difficult for him to change. It is the equivalent of the lioness choosing to attack the strongest buck in the gazelle herd, the one most likely to be able to defend itself and fight her off.</p><p></p><p>For example, we would all love to put as a high priority, the apparent insolence you can get with these kids. Teacher asks child to stop writing in his maths book and put it away, then get out his English book. Kid says, "I'm not ready, in a minute." Teacher says, "No, NOW!" Kid says, "I said, IN A MINUTE! What part of this don't you understand?"</p><p>This, believe it or not, is NOT primarily insolence; it is actually task-changing problems and anxiety, coupled with poor social skills. Three problems all together, one at least is diagnostic for Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD). If a mere reprimand could fix this, then our kids would all lose the autism diagnosis instantly. </p><p></p><p>I've watched difficult child 3's current teachers and how they handle this in him. They really are brilliant. Most of the time when difficult child 3 is reacting like this (or other kids; they get classes from the behaviour schools on study days as well) they ignore the outbursts and focus on getting though to the kid via whatever chink they can. </p><p>Example - a science lesson, face-to-face with 20 kids. Most of these kids were from a behaviour school with varying issues and from what I could see, a lot of the problems were impulsivity, arrogance, rudeness and kids generally mucking up to show off. Behaviour like that, when I was a kid, would have had the kid sent out of the room to the principal's office. Kids calling out with rude remarks, being cheeky - this is NOT what you get as a rule with Aspies. The teacher was demonstrating a chemical reaction, the stuff in the test tube fizzedviolently and kids were all shouting, exclaiming loudly. The teacher used the enthusiasm and said, "Yes, this really is a strong reaction."</p><p>Then when he did it again but with a different chemical and there was hardly any fizz at all, one boy said loudly (and rudely), "That's boring! I liked it better before."</p><p>The teacher turned to that boy and said, "You're right - this is a very dull and boring reaction, hardly anything is happening. Can anyone tell me why?"</p><p></p><p>Instead of distracting and derailing the entire lesson by chastising the student, the teacher took it and used it in a positive way. The student, who may have been trying to get attention, did NOT get the sort of attention from the other students he wanted. However, his contribution being turned into a positive, he was automatically engaged back into the lesson despite himself.</p><p></p><p>And surely it is the aim of all teachers to engage all students?</p><p></p><p>You say you want him (you think) in the Aspie program at the other school - I think that is well worth investigating.</p><p></p><p>Changing the subject a little here - how does HE feel about his diagnosis? Or does he not yet understand? If he has been getting constant criticism over behaviour he can't control, he is likely to be feeling very negative about himself and his diagnosis. This is not good, because it's not something about himself that he can control. However, he is just coming into the age group where Sixth Sense program can be very helpful. I would suggest doing some digging on this, it could be a useful strategy if you DON'T move him.</p><p></p><p>The meeting sounds like it was very positive. I hope things continue to be positive, but it will need your constant input and involvement, even with the best school staff in the world.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 261141, member: 1991"] He has Asperger's diagnosed, so this goes beyond behaviour Yes,there are behaviour problems but they are the result of the condition and you can't fix everything by working on the behaviours. This requires some expert on-the-spot opinions from an autism expert if possible. We went through this with difficult child 3 - the Dept of Ed behaviour expert was called in. Often in Australia our Aspie/autistic kids get caught up with the behaviour management area, but at least they are taking the autism into account. This needs to be discussed with you, the teachers and an expert in autism behaviours so you know what can be changed, what can't be changed and what has to be endured. This is where continued observation and diarising between home and school is so valuable - the teacher tries something and has either success, failure or no change. Same thing with home. By feeding back to each other what you tried and what result there was, you all slowly build up a picture of how to manage. Things to try to change: 1) he needs to learn the right way to interact with others. He cannot simply be left to try to absorb this on his own; autism doesn't work that way, he needs active tuition, support and supervision. He needs positive outcomes and if it has to take adult support for this to happen at least in the beginning, so be it. The more positive outcomes he has the more he will improve, often quite quickly. But if the experiences are negative, his behaviour is likely to deteriorate. Example - difficult child 3 was put on playground supervision. This did involve the aide staying within eyesight of him, but so she wasn't merely following him around she actually organised a game of touch football in the playground. Kids joined in, kids dropped out, the game rules were followed, as game rules changed she made sure difficult child 3 understood that rules had been changed (because other kids signal suchthings to one another more subtly) and any possible problems were picked up on and dealt with immediately. "It's OK, difficult child 3, Benny didn't mean to tip you so hard, he was just getting caught up in the game. Benny just said sorry, let's play on." At the end of the play session she would talk to difficult child 3 and they would discuss any issues and finish with an overview of social lessons learned. Other kids couldn't take advantage of difficult child 3 because an adult was supervising, but it was informal so a lot of 'natural' communication was still happening. 2) He needs to change his response to change and to distraction in class. This is a huge problem area for autistics and Aspies, teachers need to make accomodations here but over time you want him to become more adaptable. It won't happen overnight and it won't happen without support. 3) He MUST NOT be expected to stop stimming or to do without his coping mechanisms. However, if what he needs is not practical, then he needs to be supported in the process of making a change to something that CAN be made practical. For example, if his stimulant involved a noisy scream every 5 seconds, this is gonig to be disruptive. If it is at all possible he would need to be supported to find something else that is not so disruptive. Help him find a workable substitute and gently remind him to try the alternative; in the meantime, finding a work area where his noises would be less disruptive to others, would be a short-term management. I would be asking the teacher to make a list of the behaviours they want to fix. Follow "Explosive Child" methods (I'm taking this from the earlier edition) where you sit down and make a list of what you want 'fixed'. You then have to 'cull' that list and only work on what can be maanged, and only a couple of things at a time. You have to ignore the rest of the things on the list, otherwise you'd be constantly correcting and criticising the child and NOTHING would get done. An analogy for the teacher - the problem behaviours are a herd of gazelle, the teacher is the lioness who needs to make a kill to feed her cubs. If the lioness charges at the entire herd, she is not going to catch anything, her cubs will go hungry. What she needs to do is to make a choice - which gazelle is going to be the easiest for her to bring down? Not only the most frail, perhaps the weakest, perhaps the one closest to her. Perhaps a combination of these. But she MUST make a choice and when she charges in, she must not take her eye off that target or allow herself to be distracted or swerved from her aim, or again she will miss. So for now, if the school want to consider this to be a behaviour issue - work with them. Make it clear that you must continue to be informed and involved, and also make it clear that they are NOT going to be able to work on everything. And it is possible that what the teacher chooses to work on, may be too difficult for him to change. It is the equivalent of the lioness choosing to attack the strongest buck in the gazelle herd, the one most likely to be able to defend itself and fight her off. For example, we would all love to put as a high priority, the apparent insolence you can get with these kids. Teacher asks child to stop writing in his maths book and put it away, then get out his English book. Kid says, "I'm not ready, in a minute." Teacher says, "No, NOW!" Kid says, "I said, IN A MINUTE! What part of this don't you understand?" This, believe it or not, is NOT primarily insolence; it is actually task-changing problems and anxiety, coupled with poor social skills. Three problems all together, one at least is diagnostic for Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD). If a mere reprimand could fix this, then our kids would all lose the autism diagnosis instantly. I've watched difficult child 3's current teachers and how they handle this in him. They really are brilliant. Most of the time when difficult child 3 is reacting like this (or other kids; they get classes from the behaviour schools on study days as well) they ignore the outbursts and focus on getting though to the kid via whatever chink they can. Example - a science lesson, face-to-face with 20 kids. Most of these kids were from a behaviour school with varying issues and from what I could see, a lot of the problems were impulsivity, arrogance, rudeness and kids generally mucking up to show off. Behaviour like that, when I was a kid, would have had the kid sent out of the room to the principal's office. Kids calling out with rude remarks, being cheeky - this is NOT what you get as a rule with Aspies. The teacher was demonstrating a chemical reaction, the stuff in the test tube fizzedviolently and kids were all shouting, exclaiming loudly. The teacher used the enthusiasm and said, "Yes, this really is a strong reaction." Then when he did it again but with a different chemical and there was hardly any fizz at all, one boy said loudly (and rudely), "That's boring! I liked it better before." The teacher turned to that boy and said, "You're right - this is a very dull and boring reaction, hardly anything is happening. Can anyone tell me why?" Instead of distracting and derailing the entire lesson by chastising the student, the teacher took it and used it in a positive way. The student, who may have been trying to get attention, did NOT get the sort of attention from the other students he wanted. However, his contribution being turned into a positive, he was automatically engaged back into the lesson despite himself. And surely it is the aim of all teachers to engage all students? You say you want him (you think) in the Aspie program at the other school - I think that is well worth investigating. Changing the subject a little here - how does HE feel about his diagnosis? Or does he not yet understand? If he has been getting constant criticism over behaviour he can't control, he is likely to be feeling very negative about himself and his diagnosis. This is not good, because it's not something about himself that he can control. However, he is just coming into the age group where Sixth Sense program can be very helpful. I would suggest doing some digging on this, it could be a useful strategy if you DON'T move him. The meeting sounds like it was very positive. I hope things continue to be positive, but it will need your constant input and involvement, even with the best school staff in the world. Marg [/QUOTE]
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