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<blockquote data-quote="Nancy" data-source="post: 504862" data-attributes="member: 59"><p>TL,</p><p></p><p>This may be hard to hear but it's what I really believe and I believe it for my own difficult child too. He is still using. Spice can be detected in the urine up to 72 hours after use. From what I understand they can't detect the actual spice use but they detect its parent drug elements. I am not a chemist, but if my difficult child tested positive I would believe the test long before I believed her. His comment that he used a lot before he got caught mean what? Got caught when? Last week or when he first came back into the sober house? If he was caught using after he came back in he really shouldn't be there, they should have kicked him out. I know he was caught and sent to the more restrictive part of the house but that was well over 72 hours ago. My difficult child once tried to tell me her test was positive because she was around a lot of people who used and so it got into her system that way, give me a break.</p><p></p><p>The thing that sticks out is that he is in denial, even in the face of all these consequences and his living on the street for a week and everything else. It does appear as though he is using this place as a place to sleep and that's it. And now he is looking around for another place that will allow him more freedom to continue doing what he wants without getting caught and he is expecting you to pay for it. Until he admits he has a drug problem he is going to continue to use. </p><p></p><p>This isn't easy to say because you are going to have to say the same thing to me at some point I am sure. But our difficult children are not even at step one.They have not admitted that they are powerless against drugs. Your difficult child is telling you he does not think he has a problem. My difficult child thinks she can drink/use responsibly.</p><p></p><p>I know you are terrified of doing anything that will push him onto the street into further drug use. So he is holding you hostage and he knows you won't let that happen. If you stop supporting him financially he will go use and blame you. Is that fair to you? It's just another smoke screen so he doesn't have to take any of the responsibility himself. But what you are doing by continuing to allow him to lie about his drug use and to agree to financially support his living arrangements even though he intends to continue to use, is to push him into further drug use anyway, just delay the out on the street part for awhile until he makes more drug contacts to live with.</p><p></p><p>He isn't trying to find another place to live that is going to be more restrictive that's for sure. So that means he is looking for a place that he can con. My difficult child did the same when she left the first sober house. By then she had already talked to people in the program who knew all the different sober houses and she picked the one that she thought was less restrictive, and it was.</p><p></p><p>If this were my difficult child I would tell her that her options were to go into treatment which I would finance (if I could but if I couldn't I would do whatever I could to find her affordable treatment) or go on the street. And then I would tell her I loved her and when she was ready to be serious about getting help she should let me know.</p><p></p><p>I have been thinking about this for a while now, have you considered asking Dr. Phil for help? Don't laugh, when I see those shows he does with addicts and their families I so wish I could get my difficult child on and have him pay to send her to one of those fancy treatment centers.</p><p></p><p>I'm sorry about all this TL. It does seem as though both your difficult child and mine are not ready to live the sober lifestyle. I have backed off talking to my difficult child. I can't continue interacting with her knowing that she is using and pulling the wool over everyone's eyes and just in the program for show and either she will get it and realize what she is doing and get back in the program for real, or she will fall hard and lose everything she worked so hard to get. I told her I wasn't sticking around to watch her fall this time.</p><p></p><p>Hugs,</p><p>Nancy</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Nancy, post: 504862, member: 59"] TL, This may be hard to hear but it's what I really believe and I believe it for my own difficult child too. He is still using. Spice can be detected in the urine up to 72 hours after use. From what I understand they can't detect the actual spice use but they detect its parent drug elements. I am not a chemist, but if my difficult child tested positive I would believe the test long before I believed her. His comment that he used a lot before he got caught mean what? Got caught when? Last week or when he first came back into the sober house? If he was caught using after he came back in he really shouldn't be there, they should have kicked him out. I know he was caught and sent to the more restrictive part of the house but that was well over 72 hours ago. My difficult child once tried to tell me her test was positive because she was around a lot of people who used and so it got into her system that way, give me a break. The thing that sticks out is that he is in denial, even in the face of all these consequences and his living on the street for a week and everything else. It does appear as though he is using this place as a place to sleep and that's it. And now he is looking around for another place that will allow him more freedom to continue doing what he wants without getting caught and he is expecting you to pay for it. Until he admits he has a drug problem he is going to continue to use. This isn't easy to say because you are going to have to say the same thing to me at some point I am sure. But our difficult children are not even at step one.They have not admitted that they are powerless against drugs. Your difficult child is telling you he does not think he has a problem. My difficult child thinks she can drink/use responsibly. I know you are terrified of doing anything that will push him onto the street into further drug use. So he is holding you hostage and he knows you won't let that happen. If you stop supporting him financially he will go use and blame you. Is that fair to you? It's just another smoke screen so he doesn't have to take any of the responsibility himself. But what you are doing by continuing to allow him to lie about his drug use and to agree to financially support his living arrangements even though he intends to continue to use, is to push him into further drug use anyway, just delay the out on the street part for awhile until he makes more drug contacts to live with. He isn't trying to find another place to live that is going to be more restrictive that's for sure. So that means he is looking for a place that he can con. My difficult child did the same when she left the first sober house. By then she had already talked to people in the program who knew all the different sober houses and she picked the one that she thought was less restrictive, and it was. If this were my difficult child I would tell her that her options were to go into treatment which I would finance (if I could but if I couldn't I would do whatever I could to find her affordable treatment) or go on the street. And then I would tell her I loved her and when she was ready to be serious about getting help she should let me know. I have been thinking about this for a while now, have you considered asking Dr. Phil for help? Don't laugh, when I see those shows he does with addicts and their families I so wish I could get my difficult child on and have him pay to send her to one of those fancy treatment centers. I'm sorry about all this TL. It does seem as though both your difficult child and mine are not ready to live the sober lifestyle. I have backed off talking to my difficult child. I can't continue interacting with her knowing that she is using and pulling the wool over everyone's eyes and just in the program for show and either she will get it and realize what she is doing and get back in the program for real, or she will fall hard and lose everything she worked so hard to get. I told her I wasn't sticking around to watch her fall this time. Hugs, Nancy [/QUOTE]
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