I need help.

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Kjs, Nov 17, 2010.

  1. Kjs

    Kjs Guest

    I don't know what is going on. I don't know if I am handling it all wrong. I feel as if I have done everything wrong forever. He quit taking the abilify about three or four weeks ago. Then he told us early last week he has been so very angry, but he was willing to try something new if the doctor had something with no weight gain.

    Doctor started him on 20 mg's of Geodon last Friday. However I found a pill in his pocket on Monday. He said he didn't take it Friday night because he read it can cause sudden death..He said he has been taking it since.

    He has been getting angrier and angrier. He has me in tears, so much so I can't even drive. Had to stop twice yesterday on the way home from therapist. He went in and I left for a walk because he had yelled at me all the way. He called me ten minutes later and said he has nothing to say come get him. I told him no, I will come back in 45 minutes when his appointment time is done.

    Didn't see him last night. He got a ride to school today. His medicine was no longer on the shelf, but that doesn't tell me anything. About an hour ago his father called me and said school called him and difficult child had an incident with another student and difficult child punched a locker. they said his hand is swollen, his knuckles are black and blue and they think we should get it checked out. husband drove to school and said difficult child is very, very angry, just a mess I guess. husband was going round and round. husband said his hand wasn't as bad as school made it out to be. They are keeping ice on it and he is staying late since he is so very far behind.

    OMG..I ask him every day if he has homework. He says no. Then I find out he hasn't done any work for a while. Sleeping in class. Grrr.

    difficult child has early release. However they said that he needs to stay if he sleeps or doesn't do his work. Great..keeps me out of it. Well, not really. Because he yells at me. Now he wants to drop a two classes..blah, blah. He does this everytime he falls behind. Years and years of this.

    I am so very sad. He hates me, blames me for everything. I feel so bad for him. The depersonalization makes school difficult. You don't remember this when you see him. Anxiety seems to be ok now that he is taking klonipin. Once in a while he still has a bad panic attack. He has put on weight and is very angry about that. Hates school. He said he quits, he just can't do this anymore. Only he says it so angry. I would do anything for him. I can't help him unless he is willing also.
    When I got home yesterday(he went to girlfriend's) I took away his laptop. He sits in his room on his stupid laptop every minute he is home and I can't take it. I am gone several days a week for work and I want to see him when I am home. Didn't go well. He isn't even speaking to me.

    I think I should just give up. I just don't know what to do. He will be angry after school and if he has to go to the doctor he will be even more angry. I am afraid he will hurt himself.

    Doctors office won't call in x-rays, we have to bring him in first. Dumb. Nurse said if he broke it he would know. But he is so angry he won't admit if it does hurt.
    Nurse said if his knuckles are black and blue, he needs to be seen.

    I just don't know what to do. Is it even worth the fight. I just feel so lost and so alone. husband is just not a help. He gets angry and then we all get into it. Why am I even here. I just don't know what to do.
  2. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    I don't have any advice, just hugs and prayers.
  3. zba189

    zba189 Guest

    I'm so sorry. My heart breaks for you. You are an outstanding Mom who wants the best for your son. Whether he sees that right now or not doesn't make that fact any less true.
  4. PatriotsGirl

    PatriotsGirl Guest

    All I can add besides my hugs and prayers is when I stopped taking Prozac, I was very, very angry, too. So much so that I started taking it again because I felt that I would really hurt some one. I wonder if maybe taking medication and then stopping had the same effect on him. The weight gain does hoover as well as other side effects. :(

    I'm sorry. Mine refuses to take her medication, too, and it is awful because meth has really made her more of a jerk than she was before and she REALLY needs the medications. I don't know why she would rather be miserable than try taking them. I don't get it.

    You are a great mom!!!!! Always remember that!!!!! We all are or we wouldn't be here seeking help for our kids....
  5. Kjs

    Kjs Guest

    My head is spinning. difficult child stayed after for the last block but didn't do any work because he quits. Then he texts me and says how angry he is and how he doesn't know how to do any work. Then he calls and asks if he should take the bus or if I am picking him up. I told him to take the bus. Then he starts on me. Saying he doesn't want to see me, he doesn't want to come home. He'll just stay at school uneil 3:45 when dad can get him. I told him what ever he wants. Then he yells at me more and I lose it. I just started crying and telling him to STOP. Then he says I am crazy so I hang up. He calls back and yells at me for hanging up. Then he asks again about bus or staying. I tell him whatever he wants. Then he says he doesn't want to come home he doesn't want to see me, saying I will yell at him and he would rather be at school. So I told him to stay. Then he keeps going on and on. I am crying and asking him what he wants from me. I don't know. difficult child said he is going to run out in the road and get hit by a truck. I hung up and called the school office. Next thing I know is he is in with the school cop and he is calming down. Of course he is telling school it is all my fault. I didn't call him. I didn't text him. Then difficult child says he doesn't want to live here he wants to live at his girlfriends. I sent husband a text to call, he calls and tells me "I can't keep calling". Fine. What am I suppose to do? difficult child won't come home with me. Won't take the bus. husband now says he has to stay late and make up his time. So husband is mad at me, difficult child hates me and I don't know what I did. My head is spinning. So when husband picks him up I know difficult child will say he doesn't want to come home. He will want to go to girlfriends. Now school called again, omg. difficult child kept calling me and flipping from one thing to another. Doesn't matter what I said then he would switch to something else. I lost it. Now I am thinking he set me up with the cop at school. OMG. I am losing it.
  6. Josie

    Josie Active Member

    What does his psychiatrist say about all of this? I would call in between appointments for something like this.

    Did any of this start or get worse with any of the medication changes? Something to talk to psychiatrist about, if so.

    Even at his age, I would take charge of the medicine, if possible. I know your work schedule might not allow that, though. That way you would at least know if he was refusing to take them. When we forgot to give my daughter her Lexapro, it was an even bigger nightmare than pre-medications. I'm not sure if his medications would have that effect, but it can't be good to be skipping them, if he is.

    We also tapered her off Lexapro slowly and she still had mood issues from withdrawal for longer than her psychiatrist thought she should. She's been medication-free for a few years without problems so I am sure it was medication withdrawal and not mood disorder symptoms coming back.

    I would view it as some kind of chemical imbalance that needs a psychiatrist's help.

    I realize you were asking for help for you, but to me, getting a kid stable is what helped me the most.
  7. Bunny

    Bunny Guest

    You sound as lost as I feel sometimes. First thing is: stop and take a deep breath. This is not your fault. It sounds like difficult child is saying to you the things that he knows will upset you. He is pushing all of your buttons. Do you have Caller ID? What would happen if you don't answer the phone when he calls, or would that make it worse when he finally does come home?

    Do you think that it would be a good idea if you started seeing a therapist of your own? You need support from someone outside of the family dynamic.

    I really hope that it gets better for you.

  8. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    Sweetheart... something you mentioned stuck out for me - "I don't know what I did".

    YOU didn't.

    Your husband needs to understand that YOU cannot do it all yourself. And if I might make a suggestion? Have the school start calling him. He can't keep calling? OK... This is his child, too, right? So don't ask him to call you. Just have the school contact him. Not you.

    You, my dear, need a break. Some respite, somehow. I know how you feel - maybe not exactly, but the overwhelmed part for sure - and you need to take care of you. He wants to live at girlfriend's? What do HER parents think? (Hopefully, they'll shoot him down.) He doesn't know how to do his schoolwork? Um - they're teaching him, he's falling asleep in class. When he starts paying attention, you'll start helping him - is what I told Onyxx and Jett - and they discovered they really don't need much help.

    One thing I found really helped was if he said I was yelling, I would just reply in a monotone - not "whatever you want" but "if that's what you want to do". Over and over. Didn't make me feel any better exactly, but Onyxx left me alone - she was trying to get a reaction, make it MY fault - and I wouldn't allow that to happen.

    Otherwise, I have lots and lots of hugs coming your way. 'Cause it ain't easy - and you sound pretty overwhelmed.
  9. janebrain

    janebrain New Member

    your relationship with your son is the same as it has been for the past couple of years. He is abusive to you and I see you responding to him as an abuse victim would. He knows he has all the power in your relationship--he knows just how to upset you and you bite every time. I really think you need to be seeing a therapist to learn how to take care of yourself and not be a doormat for your son and husband.

    Hugs to you,
  10. HaoZi

    HaoZi Guest

    Oh darlin' you sound like you need a vacation by yourself! A no technology allowed vacation, so you can concentrate on you and difficult child and husband will *have* to figure it out without you for a little bit. Those wilderness survival schools come to mind, no cell phones allowed and you'll learn that there's a lot you can survive and handle and that you're stronger than you think. Or at least an afternoon to yourself with the phone off somewhere you won't be bothered at, like the library, enjoying yourself and giving yourself a little space and respite.
    In some ways some difficult child's can be a lot like bullies, and when you stop reacting to them they'll up the ante at first, but if you steadfastly keep your armor up they'll get bored. Notice good behavior instead and hope they veer towards that when bad behavior doesn't get a reaction.
    You just gotta hang in there, and we'll be right here with you.
  11. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    If the anger got worse since Geodon was introduced, it could be the Geodon. Geodon can be activating for some adolescents. Please call the psychiatrist and let him know.
  12. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    YES. But I don't agree that this boy is behaving like a typical abuser. Although his father comes close... and with that example, it's not good.

    OK, take a deep breath, Kjs. This kid needs to learn action and consequences. YOU also need to learn to duck out of being blamed. His dad blamed you for the call to him, asking him to help (by picking up his son). Suddenly dad has to work back? Yeah, right... he's trying to duck out of having to actually DO anything. If your son or you had been in an accident, you can bet the boss would let him come home immediately.

    YOU need to take back control, at least of what you CAN control. Then shrug off the rest. Hand it back to where it belongs.

    Another problem I think you inadvertently aggravated - your son rang you, because he needed help making a decision. "Mom, what should I do? Should I catch the bus or will you come and get me?" It was a light bulb for me - this kid wanted YOU to make the choice for him, and when you refused, he abused you. If you had realised that was why, would you have still been so upset? He is not abusing you, or angry with you, he is just ANGRY. The medication muck-around is a huge part of this. Yes, he has to learn to not lash out in anger, but he has some very good teachers there (sorry - I'm calling it). What your son needs, is the EXAMPLE of calm control around him, and you can't do that at the moment without help. A lot of help. You're burned out, hon, and you need to get your grounding back.

    Then when you do, learn to not react. Do not see his verbal abuse as aimed at you (even if his words are, the abuse is not - keep telling yourself this). He is just plain angry, because life is out of control, his mind is out of control and he hates it. In the past you have been the one to fix it, so he wants you to fix it now. Again. And if shouting at you will make you do what he wants, he will shout at you. He's been taught that shouting makes it happen.

    So - first, don't YOU shout. Not at anyone. Often, the quiet, controlled voice can be more scary, anyway. If you are in an argument with someone and they are shouting, but you are speaking softly, they have to shut up to hear you. If they don't shut up, they can't hear what you have said, and if they don't hear you say, "I'm selling your golf clubs to the pawn shop next week if you don't go mow the lawn before you go out with your golfing buddies yet again," and you then follow through, he will learn that you mean what you say and you need to be listened to. "You probably couldn't hear me - I was not shouting at you."

    OK, weird example. But I had a teacher at school who used to do this - while the class was in uproar, she would quietly say, "there will be a pop quiz tomorrow; this is the topic." ONly those who were being quiet, could hear. And those kids who were making the worst noise, us other kids were not inclined to rescue. They learned, fast, that when the teacher spoke SOFTLY, they had to shut up fast.
    It requires follow-through though. Consistency. And at the moment that requires more strength than I think you have right now.

    So go find that strength. And to avoid being dragged down constantly, learn how to shrug off the abuse. A counsellor will help. Next time difficult child says, "I have nothing to say; come get me," go get him but make him wait outside. Then YOU take the rest of the appointment time! Let difficult child wonder what you could be saying ABOUT HIM.

    Frankly at therapist appointments, I am either in the room with the kid (including my adult, married daughter) or I'm waiting outside.

    I remember my own therapist appointments when I was a kid - basically, I had no skills and would often spend much of the time trying to work out how to pass the time without making eye contact and having to give that little embarrassed smile. I never really understood why I was there. I think I understand now, but I wish my therapist had been far more proactive and actually DUG for answers. I would have been very cooperative; but if she didn't ask questions, I had nothing to say. And I know NOW I needed a lot of help. Looking back, it should have been glaringly obvious. But I was too young to know what help I needed; what help was available; and how to ask for it.

    Kjs, I suspect your son is the same - he doesn't know how to ask for help. But he knows at some level he needs help. His anxiety is a huge problem, again he reminds me a lot of difficult child 3. As he is getting older, he is getting more verbally abusive. he also can argue black is white, very fluently. But I have learned to not wear it. I shrug responsibility right back to him. I also use praise where appropriate, to de-fuse the anger and anxiety. When you are dragged down as you are, you can't see the good in your son at all, which means you can't find anything worth praising. But it is there, even as he is now. He didn't take his pill because he was worried about side effects - "Son, I am proud of you for paying attention and caring about your own health. But the doctor would have been very careful a bout prescribing this. Let's discuss the level of risk and help you make the choice you need to make. We have to weigh up the risks of taking the medications, vs the risks of not taking the medications. Let's find out under what conditions this can cause heart problems. Hmm, it says here that only if there are pre-existing and serious heart problems. In other words, you are fit, healthy and have no problems. They have no records of anyone like that having problems." [I am guessing here - do check it out before you say anything like this!]
    Of if you are not equipped to check this out, then ask the doctor to do this and EXPLAIN IT TO difficult child. As he gets older, he has to begin making his own decisions. And he is so stressed right now, he is frozen when it comes to making decisions. He wants you to make them all, then he also has someone to blame when things are not working.

    Now, when he calls and asks you to make a decision for him, don't just say, "You do what you want," because he NEEDS help. But also, don't just make the decision for him. HELP HIM make his own decision. "Son, you could wait for the bus. While you wait, you could put in the extra time you lost while you slept. Or I could come and get you, but it would be inconvenient for me; I would require some help from you in turn, to make up for pulling me away from my work." Then when he makes the choice, even if you have talked him into it, make sure he owns the choice. "So you want me to come get you? You are sure? This is your choice? OK, I'll see you soon."
    If he then rails at you for anything, point out it was his choice. You heard him say so.

    This takes time, it takes practice. But your whole family is overloaded with stress and you each have developed very unhealthy ways to handle it, and all those ways are interacting negatively. You are the one who bears the brunt of it. You are the focus for this family, in other words.
    That has to change, and again - the first one to change this, has to be you. it has nothing to do with fault, or blame - it just IS, simply because of how your particular family dynamic currently functions.

    You need to turn yourself into Hilary Clinton. Strong, capable, calm, dignified but no pushover for anybody.

  13. HaoZi

    HaoZi Guest

    *searches in vain for a "Like" button. again*
  14. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    I forgot to mention, Kjs - the workload for difficult child 3 was getting overwhelming, and school was becoming a huge issue. I also have a kid who wants to do well but doesn't know how to study. He expects to absorb information by osmosis. But he is also easily overwhelmed by the work and takes a lot longer to get his work done. So the school are allowing him to work at half pace. it means he will be three years older than everyone else by the time he graduates, but he will at least PASS it all! And he is coping a lot better. For us here, it's called Pathways. Look it up for more info, and see if that could be an option. Instead of having a difficult child struggling in every subject and asking to drop a couple (and which couple doesn't matter, they're all suffering), difficult child 3 now can concentrate on half the subject load and do them all much better.

    A lot of students here do this; maybe 20% or more, including PCs, finish their high schooling this way. Some even get part-time work and study between work shifts. If you know you only have school 2 days a week, working on the other two (in a store perhaps, or an early apprenticeship) can actually promote good work habits mentally, and some valuable living experience. In other words, they begin to grow up and find independence but under controlled conditions (which is what these kids desperately need).