Is AS part of mood dysregulatory dysorder?

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by lovelyboy, Nov 7, 2011.

  1. lovelyboy

    lovelyboy Member

    I was wondering....I think the psychiatrist once said that Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) is also part of the mood dysregulatory dysorders? Because this will explain why my son gets so totally upset if he doesnt get his way or gets dissapointments.....This will help explaining to people that his reactions is not for manipulation, but because he is like any other kid that gets upset when he doesnt get what he wants, but cant control the reaction and emotions that goes with this...this is where the dysregulation comes in and makes it a neurological dysorder?in my opinion I think that people who can manipulate have great regulation!.....

    Any thoughts?
  2. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    Hmm. Not heard that myself. And not really noticed it as a mood disorder type thing either and we have many members in the spectrum.

    I think it's that whole not getting the social interaction thing myself. Ours often fly over their heads or don't even I think it's tougher for them to learn. They can learn. That is important to remember. But it is much more difficult for them and takes them longer to do so.

    I don't think we realize just how social we are as beings. How we look to others for the ways we are to conduct ourselves. But someone on the spectrum tends to really put that in your face. Most kids pick up proper ways of behavior and self control via social cues, if they're not "getting" the social cues.....yeah.

    However, that said, some people may have co morbid mood issues in addition to being on the spectrum.
  3. lovelyboy

    lovelyboy Member

    Hound got me thinking AGAIN! Is MDD even a mood dysorder, must be because sometimes bipolar is mentioned with it....But I was of the impression that MDD is not a mood dysorder as such but it's more like having a problem with regulation of the emotions(olmost like a spectrum?)....this is why I linked it to AS? But then again...isn't dysregulation of moods what causes mood dysorders? I'm confusing myself!
  4. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    My Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) son has no mood swings, meltdowns, or erratic behavior. Mood disorders can be co-morbid with Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD), but it's not a given.
  5. buddy

    buddy New Member

    That is not my understanding, i am not an neurologist though. My understanding is that it is a neurological disorder. They recently found associated genes and I have read articles about structural brain commonalities (like a smaller hippocampus which is involved in emotional regulation and moving short term memories to long term memory). Since people with Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) do not process information in a typical way, they may become overwhelmed, frustrated, anxious, seek or avoid sensory input, etc. they (generalities here, obviously there are individual differences) tend to have pretty rigid thinking and so if that is upset (like transitions, routines, change in plans, rules that are broken, having a plan for how something should play out/others dont follow their plan...etc.) there is naturally a reason to be upset. Autism in and of itself is not an emotional disorder (though long ago they thought that maybe it was due to "refridgerator mothers" who were cold and not bonding with their kids.) This is obviously not the case and we know now that it has a neurological basis. Of course, people with Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) are people first, so clearly they have the right to develop mental health disorders, have a genetic disability or disease, be hurt in accidents and have brain damage on top of Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD).... just like the rest of us, smile. And some kids are just that lucky. that is my casual take on it. I am sure we could do a research review and get more scientific information. I am just sharing my view of it.

    It seems from your post, and please correct me if I am wrong, that there are people who maybe dont buy that your difficult child has autism and/or that due to his medical condition, difficult child has a more challenging time controlling metldowns and outbursts???. It can be frustrating to try to explain to people. I think some times I feel like explaining and other times I think, who cares, it is none of their business. I feel like saying, hey you think this is hard for you to be around? Try being him!

    This may not be of any help, but I wasn't totally sure I understood the question, just gave it the old college try, smile! Hope other wiser folks will chime in...
  6. Liahona

    Liahona Guest

    difficult child 1 has autism and mood swings. He also hallucinates and can be hypersexual. The autism is separate from his other symptoms. With him we're dealing with autism and something else.

    difficult child 2 and 3 have autism. No mood swings.

    All three of them do have a hard time regulating themselves when they are upset. They have to be taught what to do to calm themselves down.
  7. lovelyboy

    lovelyboy Member

    Yes Buddy, unfortunately you are right!
    this post stems from this Q and remarks coming from my mom.....she keeps on asking and telling me that my son doesnt look like an aspie...she only see him 3 times a year!
    She tells me all the time that I am making excuses For his bad behaviour, holding the diagnosis as an excuse!
    Then she asks me, why then if he has AS does he only get meltdowns when he doesnt get his way....NOT TRUE!
    Why then does he stop his behaviour when he does get his way? Ok, sometimes true, but not always....I keep on telling her that we dont give in, that behaviour has consiquences, but she doesnt believe this!
    I think she is refering to the fact that when he wants to go home or try and avoid to much social issues he asks us to leave and we gladly do....this she see as manipulation...not AS!
    But I agree, I do think there might be more than only As...he does also have anxiety dysorder and Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) and a bit of ODD traids.....
  8. Liahona

    Liahona Guest

    My mom didn't believe difficult child 2 has Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) until years after he was diagnosis she had to try to feed him breakfast while I was in the hospital. She still doesn't believe difficult child 1 has problems. She has told me that if only she could get difficult child 1 away from my parenting he'd be o.k.

    Not nice, but you do have lots of company about family not believing you.
  9. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    Many people on the spectrum have anxiety issues, I think it's also related to the social thing unless they happen to have an anxiety type diagnosis along with it. Not hard to imagine, if you don't feel comfortable in most social situations, it's probably going to make you feel anxious.

    My mom still doesn't get that Travis is autistic, it doesn't help that she refuses to educate herself on the topic. She also tends to forget he has most of his other dxes too. She's been wanting to firmly believe he is normal as long as I first noticed there were issues (birth). She can't handle their being something wrong with a member of the family, a quirk of hers. An annoying one.

    You can offer your mom some educational literature, but you'll also have to remind her that everyone is also an individual and won't display all the same characteristics, heck some of them come and go and come back again. lol It's not up to you to convince her, and you'll make yourself miserable trying.

    Autism is a neurobiological disorder. I know most kids on the spectrum here see psychiatrists ect for treatment, my son saw a neurologist who specialized in autism and tourettes syndrome, who could also treat him for his other neuro issues. psychiatrists and tdocs never worked for Travis. I think with him it was difficult for them to grasp the whole picture. I had far better success with his neuro and the neurophsychologist that worked with him.


  10. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    well if you want to get something even more confusing try combining bipolar and The symptoms almost overlap. I have both. Well at this point in time we say I have traits of borderline but as far as my complete psychiatric dxs we keep the borderline on there for insurance sake.

    When you kept talking about the dysregulation of moods it made me think more of borderline because that is more of a dysregulation of emotions which is essentially what our moods are made up of for the most part. We dont have a mood unless an emotion makes us feel a certain way. Not saying your son has borderline but maybe reading up on how to treat a child with borderline would help you find ways to parent your son by combining the ways you parent an aspie with the way you parent a child with borderline traits. I dont have my bookmarks on this computer of my sites dealing with borderline but if you google "children with borderline personality disorder" I am fairly certain you will get something. I think there was a page with sites that led to a message board. Also there are tons of books out there you can read that are very good. I read things all the time to help me.

    Let me tell you, I was perfectly fine being bipolar but when I found out I had borderline I felt like someone knocked the wind completely out of me and I cried for days. I felt like I had been told I was dying. I never wanted to leave the house again. It took me reading somethings and searching the internet and finding out I wasnt going to go out and murder small kids and chop up animals and end up on death row. I really did think I was going to be the next Ted Bundy. I was that confused. Borderline is not a Whew.
  11. lovelyboy

    lovelyboy Member

    I can see why you say this....this is EXACTLY why I don't want my mind wondering there......:(......But yes I do sometimes wonder about this!
  12. keista

    keista New Member

    If your mom doesn't get the AS diagnosis, adding another diagnosis isn't going to give her any more understanding.

    Analogy maybe? If a mosquito is buzzing around my ear, I'm going to swat it away. I will continue to swat as long as it is still buzzing. Once it stops buzzing, I'll stop swatting. While your mom may see that he stops his meltdowns because he "gets what he wants", she's not seeing or understanding what EXACTLY is causing the meltdown. In the example of leaving her house: Is her house highly decorated? doe she use excessive air fresheners? Moth balls? Not provide sufficient entertainment? Whatever the issue, she probably still won't get it because "regular kids" would be able to deal. AS kids have a shorter threshold for lots of things because we can't see the sensory problems they may be experiencing.

    My son has a hard time in art classrooms. He LOVES art, but the classrooms are often highly decorated. They are visually "busy". This makes it extremely difficult for him to focus in art class. Strip the classroom down, and he'll function just fine.
  13. confuzzled

    confuzzled Member

    comorbidty of spectrum disorders and anxiety issues/<acronym title="Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder">adhd</acronym> is high, and its completely possible to have both a spectrum disorder and a mental health disorder...the same way someone can have both diabetes and heart disease.

    that said, <acronym title="In My Opinion">in my opinion</acronym>,its important to not minimize the impact of social deficeits...when we talk about social issues, is more than "hard time making friends" or "difficulty knowing whats expected of them". much more--social interaction is just a part of it. for whatever reason, <acronym title="Autism Spectrum Disorder">Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)</acronym> kids have a hard time with the minutia of life...things other people just "know". its hard to explain what i mean, especially since every kid is different. it often comes across as having no filter, no couth, or as being manipulative. they tend to not have the saavy needed to navigate a complex world.

    kids on the spectrum can most certainly be taught lots of skills to compensate for it, but the problem with that is sometimes situations cant be anticipated, or a response/reaction might vary depending on the situation--think about how frustrating that must be. i'm trying to think of a good example to explain what i mean...i guess a simplified one would be something like...lets teach kid how to introduce themselves---so, often, a well meaning sp. therapist tells them what to say..."Hi, my name is first,last. GREAT. if you are talking to an adult. NOT SO GREAT if you are on the playground. instead of noticing that other kids say, I don't know, "hey dude, what up"....they launch into "hi, my name is first, last". and then they dont "get" why the other kid looks at them like they have two heads---in their minds, thats what they were taught, its polite, its a perfectly acceptable response, it works great in other situations--why the HECK did that kid walk away from me?

    its kind of in the noticing. and the slickness. NT kids just seem to "get" it...whether is because they have more of a peer group or if its inate, I don't know. our kids kind of get befuddled over what they are supposed to do...another example: bell rings, most kids know to sit down, get out pencil and be quiet. sometimes (not always of course, i'm trying to come up with drastic examples!)...the <acronym title="Autism Spectrum Disorder">Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)</acronym> kid might not even realize the rest of the class is ready to go--maybe they honed in on a new item in the classroom and they are standing in front of it examining every iota of it. another kid that wanted to check out that item ran over, examined it, but heard the footsteps of the teacher and ran to his seat at the last second so he appeared to be doing what was expected. or, kid might have been taught that when the bell rings at 8:51, you must be in your seat...all other kids "heard" teacher is absent, and the sub is running late, so its party time--but there is kid sitting in seat, ready to go, at exactly 8:51---as in, that is the rule, thats what i'm supposed to do--they have difficulty "going with the flow"....they just know thats what they always do at 8:51!

    i also think the higher functioning one is on the spectrum, the MORE subtle the issue is, and the more frustrating it is for people to understand they ARENT just being manipulative in the true sense of the word (in the simplified sense, sometimes..."i want that candy", no (meltdown) give candy (meltdown ends)--simple, almost primative, reactionary method of getting what they want.)

    meltdowns that have a distinct trigger are all part and parcel of it--again, impulse control, the obliviousness, the self centeredness, very often their literal reasoning, and almost an inability to realize "that aint working for you"--the frustration levels are crazy high. sometimes its hard to pinpoint that trigger, especially when the reaction seems SO overblown, but we have to almost get inside their heads and see it from their perspective, which often is so far removed from OUR perspective. and sometimes we just.dont.listen.

    maybe (MORE THAN LIKELY, ROFL!) i'm not making much sense--i'm having a very hard time putting it into words. but being a social being is much more than having a clique of friends--it impacts every breathing minute of our lives.

    and you know what they say about those who assume...with our kids, its pretty much a given that if you assume one thing, you probably arent even close :)