Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New profile posts
Latest activity
Internet Search
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Forums
General Discussions
The Watercooler
Looking for advice (warning: sensitive matter, not going to be for everyone)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 281282" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>I think if a court case NOW came down to it, your having stuck to the story for so longshould speak for something. And surely the evidence of other girls could be introduced to show that he has this pattern of behaviour? Or is this what they're hoping to set up?</p><p></p><p>You are working on several levels here. On one hand you're wanting to protect all thr young girls out there from your father. But (and please don't get angry with me) you can't take on all this responsibility. You can't protect them all, nor should you have to try. In trying, you could do a lot more harm, set up a lot more denial from the women in his life (past and present).</p><p></p><p>On the other hand, you are on the brink of forming a survivor relationship with family members who really need you in their life. That is the most important thing right now. Anything else MUST come second.</p><p></p><p>That is not to say you should drop all your attemtps to get your father to face up to what he has done. Not at all. But prioritise - put it lower down the list. The relatiosnhip you are forging with family members and their mental wellbeing, MUST take priority.</p><p></p><p>So by all means, tell them that you are wanting to see him behind bars and let them know you have been asked to testify, and any others who tstify will strengthen the case. But make sure they know that your relationship with them is unconditional. </p><p></p><p>You have asked your brother to stay out of your life - why? I'm not saying I don't understand your reasons, but I want YOU to really explore your own reasons. If your brother is not an abuser himself, then what is so risky about his relationship with you and your children? Or are you nervous about what information he might pass on to your father, thereby making you and your family more vulnerable? Or is it your brother's inability to take sides in such a b/w issue (in your mind) that upsets you?</p><p></p><p>The reason I ask these questions, is that you may have to accept that your sisters/aunts etc may feel just as vulnerable to anyone who is pursuing legal action. They may be thinking to themselves, "I cannot revist the horror I went through. We each had our private hell, we can't compare the abuse we each had because when it comes down to it, when you are in a room with an abuser, you are alone. Nobody could ever share that. And I don't want to go back to even thinnk about that, I need to move on. We all need to move on and pretend it never happened."</p><p></p><p>The reason people like your father keep doing this, is because they can. Nobody can prevent, unless he goes to jail. And even there he will continue his abuse. And for every man like your father who gets caught, there are hundreds out there untouchable. They are very good at what they do - recruiting a family, marrying the family (they don't marry the woman, they in their own minds marry the daughters) and then setting up a system of subtlemental abuse to not only allow them to abuse the kids, but to also make sure the mother will feel completely personally responsible for any abuse that happens.</p><p></p><p>Very intelligent women can get caught up in this. A have a good friend whose second husband was just such a creep. When they met, her daughter was 6 years old. She was grateful to have a man in her life who was also intelligent, shared her academic interests, who encouraged her to go back to uni for further study ("Don't worry about the kids, I'll babysit them for you and make sure dinner is ready.") My friend was also a schoolteacher and he of course took a lot of interest in her work, encouraged the female students to come home for coaching sessions. He even took some coaching sessions himself. My friend was grateful to her husband for all his help.</p><p>Then when her daughter was 15, she told her stepfather that sex was off the menu. Immediately, the stepfather lost all interest in the mother, in the bedroom department. Ofcourse by then he had recruited students and the girl's friends. The girl told her mother, who confronted her husband.</p><p>It is the measure of such a creep that he had successuflly laid the groundwork for my friend to feel completely at fault. SHE was the one who had gone back to study, and therby neglected her husband who OF COURSE had been so easily seduced by the young girl (what - seduced by a 6 year old?). He convinced my friend to try again to save the marriage. He was of course not interested in saving anything but his lifeline to all the young girls in his wife's life and work. But my friend was so desperate to make it work thta she allowed her daughter to move out of home, in order to keep working on themarriage. The daughter was remarkably understanding - "I will be happy to meet with you, mum, but only if he is not there. And I can't come back to the home while he is in your life, I can never be sure he wouldn't walk in and I can't cope with that possibility." The girl was barely 18 and having to live away from her mother at a time when she needed her the most. But my friend was completely under the spell of this man, because the whole truth ws just too ghastly for her mind to accept.</p><p></p><p>She finally had to accept the truth. It took her months to come out of this. Of course no charges were ever laid - the choice was left to the daughter and she chose to not go through it all. I suspect they were advised that it would come down to "he said, she said" plus the daughter had, all the time, been made to feel like a willing participant and was afraid that in pressing charges she would cause a lot of hurt to her mother. Her stepfather is getting to an age when he is going to be physically less capable of molestation, maybe. I don't know their thinking. I wanted to scream at both of them, "Press charges!" but I wouldn't be the one standing up in court giving evidence of every little detail, it's not my right to tell my friends what to do.</p><p></p><p>My friend never talks about it now. Her daughter has been donig well, seemingly unaffected by it all (I don't know how, though). She's been in a relationship with the same guy for some years now, she's the same age as easy child. Doing well professionally and in her relationsnhip, apparently. Yes, she had counselling. So did the mother.</p><p></p><p>My friend has married again. Her third husband - no point in him being a pedophile because there are no children left in my friend's life, only her adult children. No children living at home.</p><p></p><p>If someone came back into my friend's daughter's life and said, "We're gonig after him; after he left you, he went on to abuse another four families," I really don't know how they would react. I suspect they'd want it to all go away so they could go back to pretending nothing had ever hurt them.</p><p></p><p>It depends on the type of hurt, how deep the hurt and how far-reaching, as well ashow resilient the person is, as to whether they will cope with what you want to do. They need to know thta you want to stay incontact with them regardless of their decision. No guilt trips from you if they choose to stay out of it. They also need to know that you won't nag or want the topic to come up again. And even if you can promise all that - maybe simply knowing your intent could be enough to have their own guilty conscience (for refusing to get involved) too painful to continue contact.</p><p></p><p>Ans that would be a pity.</p><p></p><p>SO I'm sorry, I have no b/w answer for you. ONly you can assess (as best as anyone) how they will react to the situation. But whatever you do - make it clear that your relatiosnhip with them comes first and foremost, and no guilt trips are allowed.</p><p></p><p>You want him to stop - but it's not your responsibility. It's a very hard thing to accept, after what you've been through, because in trying to stop him, it can help you feel the abuse can be turned to some good after all. But tere are other ways in which you can turn the abuse to good. What you are doing now is a good start.</p><p></p><p>So go carefully. Andbe good to yourself. Remember the women in your father's life are victims too, his first victims. He built up in their minds layer upon layer of denial and guilt, so it's not surprising that they would find it difficult to accept what he has done. To accept it, they also have to accept the guilt he put there as insulation against their knowledge of his actions.</p><p></p><p>Men like this are nasty and clever. To survive such an experience is a huge achievement.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 281282, member: 1991"] I think if a court case NOW came down to it, your having stuck to the story for so longshould speak for something. And surely the evidence of other girls could be introduced to show that he has this pattern of behaviour? Or is this what they're hoping to set up? You are working on several levels here. On one hand you're wanting to protect all thr young girls out there from your father. But (and please don't get angry with me) you can't take on all this responsibility. You can't protect them all, nor should you have to try. In trying, you could do a lot more harm, set up a lot more denial from the women in his life (past and present). On the other hand, you are on the brink of forming a survivor relationship with family members who really need you in their life. That is the most important thing right now. Anything else MUST come second. That is not to say you should drop all your attemtps to get your father to face up to what he has done. Not at all. But prioritise - put it lower down the list. The relatiosnhip you are forging with family members and their mental wellbeing, MUST take priority. So by all means, tell them that you are wanting to see him behind bars and let them know you have been asked to testify, and any others who tstify will strengthen the case. But make sure they know that your relationship with them is unconditional. You have asked your brother to stay out of your life - why? I'm not saying I don't understand your reasons, but I want YOU to really explore your own reasons. If your brother is not an abuser himself, then what is so risky about his relationship with you and your children? Or are you nervous about what information he might pass on to your father, thereby making you and your family more vulnerable? Or is it your brother's inability to take sides in such a b/w issue (in your mind) that upsets you? The reason I ask these questions, is that you may have to accept that your sisters/aunts etc may feel just as vulnerable to anyone who is pursuing legal action. They may be thinking to themselves, "I cannot revist the horror I went through. We each had our private hell, we can't compare the abuse we each had because when it comes down to it, when you are in a room with an abuser, you are alone. Nobody could ever share that. And I don't want to go back to even thinnk about that, I need to move on. We all need to move on and pretend it never happened." The reason people like your father keep doing this, is because they can. Nobody can prevent, unless he goes to jail. And even there he will continue his abuse. And for every man like your father who gets caught, there are hundreds out there untouchable. They are very good at what they do - recruiting a family, marrying the family (they don't marry the woman, they in their own minds marry the daughters) and then setting up a system of subtlemental abuse to not only allow them to abuse the kids, but to also make sure the mother will feel completely personally responsible for any abuse that happens. Very intelligent women can get caught up in this. A have a good friend whose second husband was just such a creep. When they met, her daughter was 6 years old. She was grateful to have a man in her life who was also intelligent, shared her academic interests, who encouraged her to go back to uni for further study ("Don't worry about the kids, I'll babysit them for you and make sure dinner is ready.") My friend was also a schoolteacher and he of course took a lot of interest in her work, encouraged the female students to come home for coaching sessions. He even took some coaching sessions himself. My friend was grateful to her husband for all his help. Then when her daughter was 15, she told her stepfather that sex was off the menu. Immediately, the stepfather lost all interest in the mother, in the bedroom department. Ofcourse by then he had recruited students and the girl's friends. The girl told her mother, who confronted her husband. It is the measure of such a creep that he had successuflly laid the groundwork for my friend to feel completely at fault. SHE was the one who had gone back to study, and therby neglected her husband who OF COURSE had been so easily seduced by the young girl (what - seduced by a 6 year old?). He convinced my friend to try again to save the marriage. He was of course not interested in saving anything but his lifeline to all the young girls in his wife's life and work. But my friend was so desperate to make it work thta she allowed her daughter to move out of home, in order to keep working on themarriage. The daughter was remarkably understanding - "I will be happy to meet with you, mum, but only if he is not there. And I can't come back to the home while he is in your life, I can never be sure he wouldn't walk in and I can't cope with that possibility." The girl was barely 18 and having to live away from her mother at a time when she needed her the most. But my friend was completely under the spell of this man, because the whole truth ws just too ghastly for her mind to accept. She finally had to accept the truth. It took her months to come out of this. Of course no charges were ever laid - the choice was left to the daughter and she chose to not go through it all. I suspect they were advised that it would come down to "he said, she said" plus the daughter had, all the time, been made to feel like a willing participant and was afraid that in pressing charges she would cause a lot of hurt to her mother. Her stepfather is getting to an age when he is going to be physically less capable of molestation, maybe. I don't know their thinking. I wanted to scream at both of them, "Press charges!" but I wouldn't be the one standing up in court giving evidence of every little detail, it's not my right to tell my friends what to do. My friend never talks about it now. Her daughter has been donig well, seemingly unaffected by it all (I don't know how, though). She's been in a relationship with the same guy for some years now, she's the same age as easy child. Doing well professionally and in her relationsnhip, apparently. Yes, she had counselling. So did the mother. My friend has married again. Her third husband - no point in him being a pedophile because there are no children left in my friend's life, only her adult children. No children living at home. If someone came back into my friend's daughter's life and said, "We're gonig after him; after he left you, he went on to abuse another four families," I really don't know how they would react. I suspect they'd want it to all go away so they could go back to pretending nothing had ever hurt them. It depends on the type of hurt, how deep the hurt and how far-reaching, as well ashow resilient the person is, as to whether they will cope with what you want to do. They need to know thta you want to stay incontact with them regardless of their decision. No guilt trips from you if they choose to stay out of it. They also need to know that you won't nag or want the topic to come up again. And even if you can promise all that - maybe simply knowing your intent could be enough to have their own guilty conscience (for refusing to get involved) too painful to continue contact. Ans that would be a pity. SO I'm sorry, I have no b/w answer for you. ONly you can assess (as best as anyone) how they will react to the situation. But whatever you do - make it clear that your relatiosnhip with them comes first and foremost, and no guilt trips are allowed. You want him to stop - but it's not your responsibility. It's a very hard thing to accept, after what you've been through, because in trying to stop him, it can help you feel the abuse can be turned to some good after all. But tere are other ways in which you can turn the abuse to good. What you are doing now is a good start. So go carefully. Andbe good to yourself. Remember the women in your father's life are victims too, his first victims. He built up in their minds layer upon layer of denial and guilt, so it's not surprising that they would find it difficult to accept what he has done. To accept it, they also have to accept the guilt he put there as insulation against their knowledge of his actions. Men like this are nasty and clever. To survive such an experience is a huge achievement. Marg [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forums
General Discussions
The Watercooler
Looking for advice (warning: sensitive matter, not going to be for everyone)
Top