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<blockquote data-quote="klmno" data-source="post: 193578" data-attributes="member: 3699"><p>Thanks, Heather! All responses help me work through this. I'm only going to address the things that are still giving me food for thought- the things I'm not addressing, I don't have a concern about. Except that I think the parent needs to trust the therapist, too, but I see that the therapist is going to start with trying to get the kid's trust. So, no issue with therapist getting difficult child's trust. Issue was that I felt therapist plowed right into something we discussed and I thought he wasn't going to do. (See below for clarification.)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think that is typical for individual therapy with a child, and primarily, that is what we discussed for this situation. But, since there are some things that I wanted to address with the therapist (like learning more tecniques to help difficult child de-escalate, for instance), we discussed format and I asked him how he thought we should go about this last week - the last meeting before bringing difficult child in. We got to a certain point in that converstaion but then time was up. He mentioned maybe we needed to talk again privately before going further, to make sure we were on the same page, but he did already know that I wasn't there seeking family therapy, unless he saw some compelling reason to do that later on, then we'd discuss it. Due to what had already been scheduled, I had to go ahead and take difficult child with me this Tues. When we got there, therapist said he'd like to meet with both of us together first, then me by myself, then difficult child by himself. Given that it's only a 45-50 min appointment., I figured he was just using this initial meeting to help difficult child feel comfortable with him and touch base with me about any further thoughts on format. </p><p></p><p>Instead, we weren't in his office for 5 mins before he starts on the typical family therapy approach and doing it in such a way that it appeared obvious (I could be wrong but is sure looked this way) that he was trying to prove this is what we needed. That really bugs me, still. Not only did that move too fast, but if he for some reason decided we needed this more than anything, I think he should have told me that first- there would have been no reason that he couldn't have met with difficult child to get to know him a little then used a little time with me privately to say "I really think the best way to accomplish things is through family therapy, I'm not willing or comfortable to pursue anything elses with you right now", or whatever. This approach made me concerned, then, when he started going into mania issues with us, I tried to send him gestures that would remind him that this is a very sensitive subject with difficult child and he had told me he would take that slow, then when he got to the other stuff, plowing ahead more, I just shut down. The time limit was up, it didn't matter, so we just left.</p><p></p><p>What could be done differently? I guess I should have made sure he and I met without difficult child again. I had previously explored different tdocs, an individual one with format as you describe above for difficult child, and a different one for family therapy or both of us or just as an individual therapist for myself. However, for a number of reasons, both psychiatrists involved, and actually even the tdocs that we tried this with, said that is a bad idea in this situation- use one therapist only for all of it. So, this is still up in the air, I'm not mad aboout it being up in the air. I'm mad because I don't think he should have plowed down that road with this being up in the air. And even if we had decided on family therapy as the solution, he plowed to faast and didn't lead the session in a way that left a stopping point at end of session time. He didn't stop after a certain time to meet with either of us individually like he said he was going to and he just kept "plowing" until 45 mins was up- no "stop plowing at 40 mins" so we can reel things back in to a good, calm stopping point. It was more of a peel back layers then open the door, like I told him already, this was a concern I'd seen in a therapist before. Some tdocs are pretty good about making sure this doesn't happen- or at least they try to prevent it.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>As said above, he jumped right in with typical family therapy instead of sticking to 15 mins each- meeting together, then individually, just since this was the first time difficult child had been there, like he himself said is what he wanted to do.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That happened when difficult child first started going to counseling- but now it only happens if he <em>really</em> doesn't like the counselor. So, I do give weight to difficult child's opinion on whether or not he's comfortable with the therapist.</p><p></p><p>I had a lot of hope in this one- it became obvious through our 5 meetings alone that he is skilled and used to using CBT with kids, he's at the psychiatric hospital (teaching hospital) and they are using more current methods than other places, he seemed like he wasn't to one extreme or the other, personality-wise, so I thought difficult child would like him, etc. You know how it is- the more you have your hopes built up, the more disappointing it is. That has a lot to do with why I got so upset over this. And, I do have the access baggage from previous bad experiences that I have to fight with to try to stay objective. Between psychiatrists who sincerely did make things worse or were a complete waste of time because all they ever heard was difficult child saying things were going great and all that we've gone through with legal issues this past year, it's like having PTSD that is triggered when I get concerned about a therapist or when legal authorities are not happy.</p><p></p><p>I think maybe part of this happened because we weren't on the same page as much as I'd thought and additionally, maybe this is where his lack of experience does come in. The first 2-3 meetings I had with him, he was answering the phone when it rang, answering the door, etc, like we were just chatting and anyone else could interrupt whenever they wanted- it happened 4 times in one session. I kept looking at him funny about it, then it came to an abrupt stop and never happened again. I assume he's discussing things with some sort of supervisor at later times and learning some things. I hope he learned something out of this situation. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think this was all my doing that caused this problem.</p><p></p><p>Anyway, previous therapist (Mr. go in circles) called yesterday and left a message- I left a message back about scheduling another appointment with him.</p><p></p><p>The other thing I forgot to mention- the intern seemed to put words in our mouths a lot. If they'd really conveyed what we were thinking, I would view it as "oh, he really clicks with difficult child" or "wow, he really understnads where I'm coming from", but instead, they were more reflective of stereotypes or his wrong assumptions. Maybe it's me not communicating things well but this leaves me having to decide how much time, if any, I want to spend seeing if I can undo his pre-conceived ideas, which I think Marg or someone brought up in a previous thread. Also, he wasn't very good about reading my or difficult child's body language correctly either. I'm not sure if that's his lack of experience, not knowing us, or just that we're that "different" from other people. LOL!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="klmno, post: 193578, member: 3699"] Thanks, Heather! All responses help me work through this. I'm only going to address the things that are still giving me food for thought- the things I'm not addressing, I don't have a concern about. Except that I think the parent needs to trust the therapist, too, but I see that the therapist is going to start with trying to get the kid's trust. So, no issue with therapist getting difficult child's trust. Issue was that I felt therapist plowed right into something we discussed and I thought he wasn't going to do. (See below for clarification.) I think that is typical for individual therapy with a child, and primarily, that is what we discussed for this situation. But, since there are some things that I wanted to address with the therapist (like learning more tecniques to help difficult child de-escalate, for instance), we discussed format and I asked him how he thought we should go about this last week - the last meeting before bringing difficult child in. We got to a certain point in that converstaion but then time was up. He mentioned maybe we needed to talk again privately before going further, to make sure we were on the same page, but he did already know that I wasn't there seeking family therapy, unless he saw some compelling reason to do that later on, then we'd discuss it. Due to what had already been scheduled, I had to go ahead and take difficult child with me this Tues. When we got there, therapist said he'd like to meet with both of us together first, then me by myself, then difficult child by himself. Given that it's only a 45-50 min appointment., I figured he was just using this initial meeting to help difficult child feel comfortable with him and touch base with me about any further thoughts on format. Instead, we weren't in his office for 5 mins before he starts on the typical family therapy approach and doing it in such a way that it appeared obvious (I could be wrong but is sure looked this way) that he was trying to prove this is what we needed. That really bugs me, still. Not only did that move too fast, but if he for some reason decided we needed this more than anything, I think he should have told me that first- there would have been no reason that he couldn't have met with difficult child to get to know him a little then used a little time with me privately to say "I really think the best way to accomplish things is through family therapy, I'm not willing or comfortable to pursue anything elses with you right now", or whatever. This approach made me concerned, then, when he started going into mania issues with us, I tried to send him gestures that would remind him that this is a very sensitive subject with difficult child and he had told me he would take that slow, then when he got to the other stuff, plowing ahead more, I just shut down. The time limit was up, it didn't matter, so we just left. What could be done differently? I guess I should have made sure he and I met without difficult child again. I had previously explored different tdocs, an individual one with format as you describe above for difficult child, and a different one for family therapy or both of us or just as an individual therapist for myself. However, for a number of reasons, both psychiatrists involved, and actually even the tdocs that we tried this with, said that is a bad idea in this situation- use one therapist only for all of it. So, this is still up in the air, I'm not mad aboout it being up in the air. I'm mad because I don't think he should have plowed down that road with this being up in the air. And even if we had decided on family therapy as the solution, he plowed to faast and didn't lead the session in a way that left a stopping point at end of session time. He didn't stop after a certain time to meet with either of us individually like he said he was going to and he just kept "plowing" until 45 mins was up- no "stop plowing at 40 mins" so we can reel things back in to a good, calm stopping point. It was more of a peel back layers then open the door, like I told him already, this was a concern I'd seen in a therapist before. Some tdocs are pretty good about making sure this doesn't happen- or at least they try to prevent it. As said above, he jumped right in with typical family therapy instead of sticking to 15 mins each- meeting together, then individually, just since this was the first time difficult child had been there, like he himself said is what he wanted to do. That happened when difficult child first started going to counseling- but now it only happens if he [I]really[/I] doesn't like the counselor. So, I do give weight to difficult child's opinion on whether or not he's comfortable with the therapist. I had a lot of hope in this one- it became obvious through our 5 meetings alone that he is skilled and used to using CBT with kids, he's at the psychiatric hospital (teaching hospital) and they are using more current methods than other places, he seemed like he wasn't to one extreme or the other, personality-wise, so I thought difficult child would like him, etc. You know how it is- the more you have your hopes built up, the more disappointing it is. That has a lot to do with why I got so upset over this. And, I do have the access baggage from previous bad experiences that I have to fight with to try to stay objective. Between psychiatrists who sincerely did make things worse or were a complete waste of time because all they ever heard was difficult child saying things were going great and all that we've gone through with legal issues this past year, it's like having PTSD that is triggered when I get concerned about a therapist or when legal authorities are not happy. I think maybe part of this happened because we weren't on the same page as much as I'd thought and additionally, maybe this is where his lack of experience does come in. The first 2-3 meetings I had with him, he was answering the phone when it rang, answering the door, etc, like we were just chatting and anyone else could interrupt whenever they wanted- it happened 4 times in one session. I kept looking at him funny about it, then it came to an abrupt stop and never happened again. I assume he's discussing things with some sort of supervisor at later times and learning some things. I hope he learned something out of this situation. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think this was all my doing that caused this problem. Anyway, previous therapist (Mr. go in circles) called yesterday and left a message- I left a message back about scheduling another appointment with him. The other thing I forgot to mention- the intern seemed to put words in our mouths a lot. If they'd really conveyed what we were thinking, I would view it as "oh, he really clicks with difficult child" or "wow, he really understnads where I'm coming from", but instead, they were more reflective of stereotypes or his wrong assumptions. Maybe it's me not communicating things well but this leaves me having to decide how much time, if any, I want to spend seeing if I can undo his pre-conceived ideas, which I think Marg or someone brought up in a previous thread. Also, he wasn't very good about reading my or difficult child's body language correctly either. I'm not sure if that's his lack of experience, not knowing us, or just that we're that "different" from other people. LOL! [/QUOTE]
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