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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 405683" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>Texasfilly, you sound like you have a really big heart. I suspect you wear it on your sleeve. You have a huge amount of love to go around and people who meet you can see this fairly early on. </p><p></p><p>I think this can be a two-edged sword for you. Your SO may be a lovely bloke, but he sounds totally out of his depth. At some level he is almost certainly blaming himself, and is scared (possibly rightly) that a therapist would blame him (probably wrongly). He feels out of his depth, not sure what to do but certainly believing that what his daughter needs, has needed, is love and a normal family life. He undoubtedly feels he needs that, too.</p><p></p><p>Then he met you. The answer to his prayers on so many levels. I am NOT saying that he only wants you for your nurturing nature and to mother his daughter. I would bet his main motive is - he loves you. But in a situation like this, love is not enough. Also, at a subconscious level, he was looking for someone to rescue him and his daughter and I bet you fit the bill in so many ways.</p><p></p><p>Only nobody can do what you are trying to do. Legally it is not permitted. Morally, it should never be asked of you.</p><p></p><p>Sadly I have seen this before - a bloke remarries (either formally, or moves in with someone) for complex reasons that may include love but go way beyond. The bloke then relaxes from his former position of concern, and feels he has solved his problem by taking on a new partner who will pick up the ball and run with it.</p><p></p><p>Only in your case, he has also drawn certain boundaries - don't take her to a therapist. I really think he is scared of what a therapist might say. This is sad, because I suspect this girl's problems run so deep, no one person should ever be blamed. And it is not necessarily all nurture - sometimes, often, the child is born with underlying problems or at the very least, the tendency to develop a mental disorder which, like all illness, requires medical treatment or the disease progresses.</p><p></p><p>As the others have said - your first duty is to your own family unit. That is you, and your daughter. Obviously part of your duty to you is to allow yourself some happiness in love. But you don't have to live together for this, and frankly I think at the moment, you need to move out with your daughter but not necessarily break up. Just move out for the sake of your child.</p><p></p><p>When two people meet and fall in love, they eventually want to share their lives. But when these people already have had a life before with someone else (and at the very least, the child you each have is this) then things don't follow the usual rules of relationship. You can't just do what you would do, if you didn't have children. The child didn't have a choice, and if the child is a problem kid, they will actively resent and prevent the relationship from developing.</p><p></p><p>My best friend became involved with a married man. The man told her that although he still lived with his wife, they were in reality separated but under the same roof. The man's wife had, from the moment their son was born, poured all her emotional energy into the boy and ignored the marriage. She had affairs; he had affairs. But he would never formally leave because there were practical and financial issues. So my friend continued her affair, saw her boyfriend about once a week when he might drop in at any hour of the day but mostly night. She became accustomed to him arriving at 4 am. But she was content with this. And in a way, they both were getting something out of even this minimal a relationship. </p><p>Then his wife went in to hospital for routine surgery, and died on the table. Very unexpected, very sudden. He grieved, even though they had not loved one another for years. Their son, late teens by this stage, was inconsolable, because his relationship with his mother had been so intense.</p><p>My friend gave her boyfriend some space. She had always been careful, also, to not let the son or the wife know about her (although the wife had known; she told her husband before the surgery that she knew he had a mistress stashed somewhere but had not told their son).</p><p>It took two years before the dad was able to be seen by his son, to have a life of his own. Before that, any hint of a companion would trigger histrionics in the young man. The father and son had a lot of work to put in, to rebuild their relationship, since the mother had very successfully alienated her husband from the boy. In those two years, my friend saw her boyfriend even less often than before his wife had died. She felt frustrated at times, but understood the necessity.</p><p></p><p>Then came the time, ground carefully prepared by the dad, when my friend slept over and the son came home unexpectedly. It was sticky, but because the dad had already said he had a girlfriend, it wasn't as bad as it could have been. Very early on after she met him, my friend told the son, "I am not your mother, nor will I ever try to be. You are a man, you do not need me as a mother."</p><p></p><p>The relationship has been going now for ten years or more. My friend still keeps her own home and only occasionally sleeps over at her boyfriend's place, maybe one night a fortnight. Boyfriend sleeps over at her place about the same amount. The relationship has progressed and increasingly, friends have accepted that they are a long-term couple. But it has not been easy. They needed to consider the children of both of them. My friend's children were both adults when she began her relationship, her children had already left home. They met him fairly early, and accepted him.</p><p></p><p>Love can find a way, but when there are practical problems you need to get inventive and you also often need to take things much more slowly, and much more carefully.</p><p></p><p>And always, be aware that there are some men out there who will consciously or subconsciously, seek out a mother rather than a lover. A mother for them, as much as for their kids. And then they begin to behave like an oppositional child in the relationship instead of a partner.</p><p></p><p>In a loving relationship, you need a partner. You also each have your own responsibilities which you each need to meet, for the sake of your relationship. Not only do you have to work on your link with one another, you also have to work on your own responsibilities so they don't get in the way of your partner. This is a much taller order than we ever encounter when we first fall in love as teenagers. I think that is why so many subsequent relationships struggle so much more - it is a lot more difficult, there is a lot more to do, second time around.</p><p></p><p>It's OK to love this guy, and to love his daughter. But you and your daughter have to come first for now. Find your own space, a space where your daughter can feel her space is not infringed by someone who is totally unrelated to her. Enjoy your partner, but from a distance. Encourage him to get help for his daughter, as you are getting help for you and yours. And take things a little more slowly, watch how he handles the problem with his daughter.</p><p></p><p>How he responds to this will determine if your relationship is meant to be. If he accepts this, if he works on things, then you are meant to be. If he does not or if he behaves like a petulant child, then the sooner you get out the better.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 405683, member: 1991"] Texasfilly, you sound like you have a really big heart. I suspect you wear it on your sleeve. You have a huge amount of love to go around and people who meet you can see this fairly early on. I think this can be a two-edged sword for you. Your SO may be a lovely bloke, but he sounds totally out of his depth. At some level he is almost certainly blaming himself, and is scared (possibly rightly) that a therapist would blame him (probably wrongly). He feels out of his depth, not sure what to do but certainly believing that what his daughter needs, has needed, is love and a normal family life. He undoubtedly feels he needs that, too. Then he met you. The answer to his prayers on so many levels. I am NOT saying that he only wants you for your nurturing nature and to mother his daughter. I would bet his main motive is - he loves you. But in a situation like this, love is not enough. Also, at a subconscious level, he was looking for someone to rescue him and his daughter and I bet you fit the bill in so many ways. Only nobody can do what you are trying to do. Legally it is not permitted. Morally, it should never be asked of you. Sadly I have seen this before - a bloke remarries (either formally, or moves in with someone) for complex reasons that may include love but go way beyond. The bloke then relaxes from his former position of concern, and feels he has solved his problem by taking on a new partner who will pick up the ball and run with it. Only in your case, he has also drawn certain boundaries - don't take her to a therapist. I really think he is scared of what a therapist might say. This is sad, because I suspect this girl's problems run so deep, no one person should ever be blamed. And it is not necessarily all nurture - sometimes, often, the child is born with underlying problems or at the very least, the tendency to develop a mental disorder which, like all illness, requires medical treatment or the disease progresses. As the others have said - your first duty is to your own family unit. That is you, and your daughter. Obviously part of your duty to you is to allow yourself some happiness in love. But you don't have to live together for this, and frankly I think at the moment, you need to move out with your daughter but not necessarily break up. Just move out for the sake of your child. When two people meet and fall in love, they eventually want to share their lives. But when these people already have had a life before with someone else (and at the very least, the child you each have is this) then things don't follow the usual rules of relationship. You can't just do what you would do, if you didn't have children. The child didn't have a choice, and if the child is a problem kid, they will actively resent and prevent the relationship from developing. My best friend became involved with a married man. The man told her that although he still lived with his wife, they were in reality separated but under the same roof. The man's wife had, from the moment their son was born, poured all her emotional energy into the boy and ignored the marriage. She had affairs; he had affairs. But he would never formally leave because there were practical and financial issues. So my friend continued her affair, saw her boyfriend about once a week when he might drop in at any hour of the day but mostly night. She became accustomed to him arriving at 4 am. But she was content with this. And in a way, they both were getting something out of even this minimal a relationship. Then his wife went in to hospital for routine surgery, and died on the table. Very unexpected, very sudden. He grieved, even though they had not loved one another for years. Their son, late teens by this stage, was inconsolable, because his relationship with his mother had been so intense. My friend gave her boyfriend some space. She had always been careful, also, to not let the son or the wife know about her (although the wife had known; she told her husband before the surgery that she knew he had a mistress stashed somewhere but had not told their son). It took two years before the dad was able to be seen by his son, to have a life of his own. Before that, any hint of a companion would trigger histrionics in the young man. The father and son had a lot of work to put in, to rebuild their relationship, since the mother had very successfully alienated her husband from the boy. In those two years, my friend saw her boyfriend even less often than before his wife had died. She felt frustrated at times, but understood the necessity. Then came the time, ground carefully prepared by the dad, when my friend slept over and the son came home unexpectedly. It was sticky, but because the dad had already said he had a girlfriend, it wasn't as bad as it could have been. Very early on after she met him, my friend told the son, "I am not your mother, nor will I ever try to be. You are a man, you do not need me as a mother." The relationship has been going now for ten years or more. My friend still keeps her own home and only occasionally sleeps over at her boyfriend's place, maybe one night a fortnight. Boyfriend sleeps over at her place about the same amount. The relationship has progressed and increasingly, friends have accepted that they are a long-term couple. But it has not been easy. They needed to consider the children of both of them. My friend's children were both adults when she began her relationship, her children had already left home. They met him fairly early, and accepted him. Love can find a way, but when there are practical problems you need to get inventive and you also often need to take things much more slowly, and much more carefully. And always, be aware that there are some men out there who will consciously or subconsciously, seek out a mother rather than a lover. A mother for them, as much as for their kids. And then they begin to behave like an oppositional child in the relationship instead of a partner. In a loving relationship, you need a partner. You also each have your own responsibilities which you each need to meet, for the sake of your relationship. Not only do you have to work on your link with one another, you also have to work on your own responsibilities so they don't get in the way of your partner. This is a much taller order than we ever encounter when we first fall in love as teenagers. I think that is why so many subsequent relationships struggle so much more - it is a lot more difficult, there is a lot more to do, second time around. It's OK to love this guy, and to love his daughter. But you and your daughter have to come first for now. Find your own space, a space where your daughter can feel her space is not infringed by someone who is totally unrelated to her. Enjoy your partner, but from a distance. Encourage him to get help for his daughter, as you are getting help for you and yours. And take things a little more slowly, watch how he handles the problem with his daughter. How he responds to this will determine if your relationship is meant to be. If he accepts this, if he works on things, then you are meant to be. If he does not or if he behaves like a petulant child, then the sooner you get out the better. Marg [/QUOTE]
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