I have a daughter who is 32. She is totally depressed, has been diagosed as having BiPolar (BP) and also I believe Borderline (BPD), but at the very least they've said a personality disorder. She has no employment and has extreme difficulty finding a job and if she does, she can't keep it. She tells me she will get dressed and sit there and can't make herself go to work. She lives in total squallor....bathes maybe once every few weeks, washes hair about the same. She has four dogs and you can smell her place from outside. The only reason she has any living arrangement is because the landlord passed away and the little trailer really probably would be condemned if anyone saw or inspected it. She lives in a really small town. There are maybe two places that occasionally are hiring but they will not hire her. She has a car that is surprisingly still running. I've almost bankrupted myself trying to get her on her feet. It's the same merry-go-round and I know it..I give her money for gas to go to a job interview and I never really know if she goes or not. She tells me she goes all over town to look for a job and I don't believe her. She has food stamps and that's the only assistance she gets. This vicious circle has to end but I don't know how to make it stop. If she has no gas, she will never get anywhere to try to find the job that she won't go to anyway. She also refuses to take any medication. She did try that route several times and had bad experiences and refuses it again. She's been in in-patient treatment centers at least four times as an adult and once for 30 days when insurance actually did that, when she was young. She at one point had insurance through her husband who is in the military but he was discharged, he's in jail, she has no insurance. The in-patient even when she had insurance was a joke...stabilize her in three days, go home. She always threatens to kill herself and always has so I see that hopefully still as a ploy, but she tells me if I take her to a mental facility she will just lie to them and they'll say she's stable and let her out in three days. The only option she has at this point is the state mental facility. I just can't bear the thought of her living in this trailer, absolutely nothing to do, no a/c, hotter than heck, filthy, dog and oh, I forgot the cat, waste more than likely all over the floor. She will never become not depressed in this situation. I have issues with depression as well and some days I can't force myself to do anything and I in the back of my mind wonder if this is how she is all the time, how can I just leave her in this situation. I know the money isn't helping her but I'm now to the point that I'm wonder if I call some state agency....although several years ago I called so many state agencys and found very little help, but if she was a person with a physical illness I wouldn't let her there in that filth and try to force her to get better. I can't help but make that comparison in my mind. The rent on her place is cheaper than you could imagine and yes, I do pay that. My thought was to pay that until she can get disability, if she can get disabilty, but I've been told she probably could. Just need to talk I guess. We had a horrible blow out the other day where she nailed me with every mistake I ever made and of course blamed everything on me and the I don't care speech, and today we went through another different drama, her asking me for money and me giving in yet again...needs gas for the job that never comes, how do I expect her to get better if she has nothing to do at all, no tv, no friends, nowhere to go, nothing. I can see the circle but don't know how to stop. I think she needs major help. I do think that if I can force myself to stop giving her money she may make a total turnaround but logistically I don't see how she'll get anywhere to work...she would have to walk 20 miles to a place that may have a job. No phone, either.
Please help
- Thread starter jaeco
- Start date
everywoman
Well-Known Member
I don't even know what to say to you. She is 32. Does she have a sub. abuse issue? Is there are reason besides depression/ possible BiPolar (BP) that she can't work? Has she applied for disability? I do no that giving her money is not the answer. You may do better to take her to apply for jobs so that you know she is going. Unfortunately, if she is BiPolar (BP) and unmedicated, she probably won't be able to work. Just a big hug and and understanding ear.
Thanks for the reply. I don't know what to tell myself! I tried taking her to interviews but I work and can't get her there very often....she then has that as an excuse. I even tried going in with her and sort of lurking in the back of the restaurant or wherever she is applying...how bizarre and encouraging is that for prospective employer?? I only did this because IF we found an opening, IF I got her there, sometimes she wouldn't be in there long enough to fill out an application or she'd say they filled the position. I'd then call sometimes to see if they were still hiring and if they said they were, she'd say well, I told you nobody would want me. People probably do not at this point. Her front four teeth are just rotten and she is very self-conscious about this and that probably puts off a lot of employers. I can't get her to the clinic for unemployed because she said the one time she went there they were like butchers. In other words, she does not want to help herself at all usually, will come up with any and all excuses. But then it breaks my heart..sometimes she'll come here, do laundry, be in a decent mood, clean up and be optimistic for her, I'll take her to apply and she's trying so hard to be social and that is really hard for her.....I've seen her hang signs over her bed saying things like *Get Up And Do Something*.I know that giving her money doesn't work at all but neither does lying in that filth. I couldn't pull myself up from that I don't think. She's running out of time. She can't move back here because our house looked like hers when she lived here and the dogs destroyed the upstairs and it took major luck that she moved. Things were really dire here at that time. My husband had a breakdown and we are all different because of that period of time. At that time she was addicted to heroin and we had a lock on our bedroom door...still do. She did manage to kick that and she smokes pot. Her dad was very similar to her...would always be better with pot.
N
Nomad
Guest
Your situation sounds tragic and sadly, one that is not too uncommon for bipolar patients and their families. I think I would focus on your own mental health and happiness. Her success will depend much on what she wants for herself. I would offer to pay for therapy for her. Let her sets some goals there. Is this lifestyle what she wants for herself? Consider getting her to a therapist who has experience working with Bipolar patients. I would also consider helping her get on SS Disability. Just completing the paperwork for this is very difficult. After that, you'll be able to more comfortably pull back. Even on Disability she can work pt and should be expect to try her best to do so if she has any ability to work to supplement her check. I would pull back giving her any money. Perhaps do so in a limited way now, but completely if and when she should receive disability in the future. However, I would always be willing to lend a hand to help her with medical care, especially psychological care. I would encourage her to go to NA and you should seriously consider going to NA or Families Anonynous. If she is disrespectful to you or worse, I would seriously consider walking away from the situation until she choses to look at it differently and behave more appropriately. Work this so that you rapidly detach emotionally and financially. Start the separation process now. You can not keep this up. She is an adult, she needs to be independent. Do your very best to nurture your relationship with your husband and if necessary, go to a few Couples Therapy sessions. Wishing you well. I'm very sorry...I totally understand...it is profoundly difficult.
Last edited:
I think your suggestions are good ones. I can't even think clearly about this anymore. I have been to therapy on and off for years but the older I get the more toll this situation is taking. I hate to be so needy...but any suggestions on setting boundaries re the money situation while I'm tapering off and we apply for disability? It's so difficult in the circular conversations with her and she gets me at every turn. I've thought about giving her some sort of allowance until disability comes through, IF it comes through. She can be very disrespectful and unfortunately this is a situation that I have allowed to continue for years. I was told when I divorced her father that she was developmentally impaired and I stupidly thought that well, how bad is it that when you're 25 you act like you're 20?!? I always hung onto that and thought she'd *outgrow* all of this...and now I wake up at her age and see it for what it is I guess.
DammitJanet
Well-Known Member
I think you need to get her on SSI like yesterday. Then if nothing else, depending on where you live, maybe she could get into disabled low income housing. Sometimes that is in a nice section of town where she could comfortably access places like therapy appts and some sort of recreational centers. In others words...a life.
I truly can understand how depressed and irritable she feels because I have been there...and still am in some sense but she really does need to get into a psychiatrist and a therapist because they can work wonders.
I truly can understand how depressed and irritable she feels because I have been there...and still am in some sense but she really does need to get into a psychiatrist and a therapist because they can work wonders.
We've yet to find a good fit with a psychiatrist, etc., and that leaves her not being willing to go. She says talking about this or taking medication is not going to magically change her, that she sees no purpose in living and just wants to not be alive. She is pretty defiant about not seeking help so maybe with some changes I put in place that are realistic perhaps she'll change her mind. I think it's her only hope. She WILL NOT give up her animals...says that's the only thing she has and is what keeps her from killing herself. I know I can't make her change her mind but I do know now that I should have checked into SSI a long time ago.
Hound dog
Nana's are Beautiful
I agree. I'd try for the diability. Although she may need to see a psychiatrist and therapist for documentation of her illnesses and severity. But perhaps the motivation of having more to live on than foodstamps would be enough to motivate her into cooperating with that much....which may lead to more treatment.
(((hugs)))
(((hugs)))
N
Nomad
Guest
I would consider a very small allowance, perhaps twice a week. Understand, that this is temporary. If she spends it all and asks for more...the answer is "NO!" Twice a week, give her a small amount of money for necessities and/or to supplement her Food Stamps. If you are paying for things like rent, pay it directly. Try to give her less than what you are giving her currently. If you go to a Al Anon or Families Anonymous meetings you might be able to speak with other parents who can give you other ideas. One thing that you could also do there is ask other people if they know of any psychologists and/or psychiatrists who have experience working with Bipolar patients. You really need a referral for both. You might tell your daughter that you would no longer be willing to support her at all financially unless she is willing to go to therapy. Additionally, you might explain to your daughter that within the next year, you plan on stopping all support financially with the exception of helping her with medical needs and so she will have to get on disability. Don't let her get all melodramatic on you. Refuse to help her, even speak with her, if she is dispresctful to you. Find out from other parents about low income, disabled housing or even group homes. Seeing a doctor, should actually be helpful getting her on disability. Concentrate on your own mental well being. There is a book on Boundaries that is very good that you can buy at Amazon. The author's last name is Cloud. I would consider getting this at the library or buy it. Additionally, I would google for information about a Families Anonymous meeting and go immediately. YOu will get much support from other parents there. Your daughter might even benefit in a certain way if she sees you moving on. She might get the hint that it is time, past time, for her to do the same. Please call the SS Disability Office tomorrow, as well as google for a FA meeting location. Inch by inch, slowly, one baby step at a time, I would help your daughter get on disability, and end your financial support. Additionally, I would work on your own mental health and develop or strenghthen any outside relationships that you find rewarding.
Last edited:
Thanks for all the suggestions and support. I will call tomorrow. It is so easy with this condition to wait and think things will change. Just horrible and life is wasted in the process. I WILL call tomorrow. I have been paying her rent but do pay that to the landlord and also the utilities directly to the company. Where she gets me is the nickel and dime stuff, gas money, dogs need food, she needs things the food stamps won't buy....you all know the drill I'm sure. I have boxed myself into a hole with this financial situation so will by necessity have to be giving her less and if I don't I will start to really cause us harm. Also, I don't know at this point that I presently can afford therapy for her and the resources we've found that are income based weren't so helpful....but good idea about the meetings and surely there are suggestions there. I am so glad I wrote today. I've got to find a way now to do the hard work that I should have done before...because she will be really dramatic and hateful once I get the strength to stick to my guns.
everywoman
Well-Known Member
Another place to check out is your local vocational rehab. They can help her get the skills to find and keep a job.
DammitJanet
Well-Known Member
Honestly to even apply for disability, she needs to be seeing and actively in treatment for her mental illness. Now its a given that she has this documentation in the past but they want to see that she is also currently in treatment so she needs to get into care now.
I am bipolar and borderline. I know it isnt a pretty disorder to have or to treat. I have been on medications for 10 years now...or almost 10 years now and have been in therapy for 3 years. I went in to therapy to prove to those idiots that not only did I "not do" therapy but that I would stick with this stupid therapy stuff because "borderlines are known for not sticking with therapy." 3 years later we laugh about that...lol. I guess I tricked myself.
I make quite sure I take my medications and I research them well. I am very compliant with my therapeutic regimen.
Disability is going to have to be a given for your dtr. She appears simply unable to work at this time. You need doctors who will back this up.
I am bipolar and borderline. I know it isnt a pretty disorder to have or to treat. I have been on medications for 10 years now...or almost 10 years now and have been in therapy for 3 years. I went in to therapy to prove to those idiots that not only did I "not do" therapy but that I would stick with this stupid therapy stuff because "borderlines are known for not sticking with therapy." 3 years later we laugh about that...lol. I guess I tricked myself.
I make quite sure I take my medications and I research them well. I am very compliant with my therapeutic regimen.
Disability is going to have to be a given for your dtr. She appears simply unable to work at this time. You need doctors who will back this up.
N
Nomad
Guest
My guess is that if your daughter went to doctors in the past and if you let them know whats been going on, they might help you. If she goes to one now, they might also help. Some doctors hesitate to help, but if they see and understand all the losses here, they might be willing to help. I would ask around to see if you can get low cost mental health help for her. Maybe you can ask around for a decent "income based" counselor. There are county mental health agencies that provide low oost therapy...perhaps some are better than others. Additionally, some mental health counselors will do it pro bono (like charity) or at a reduced fee. After that, hand her the name (s) and telephone numbers and encourage her to make her own appointments. Also, you might see if her father will help with some of the costs, if he is not doing so now. However, remember, keep the costs low. And keep them steady. If she escalates things, too bad, so sad. For her. Let it go in one ear and out the other. Put your hand over the receiver, speak into the phone and tell her that you are willing to give her this small allowance for now out of the goodness of your heart, however, there is no way that you are willing to hurt yourself in the process. YOu have gone above and beyond and you can not go into debt, you can not destroy yourself and you love yourself too much to do these things. You would hope that she would be grateful for the help you are providing and will be cooperative and will learn to help herself. If she can not, than that is okay. It is what it is. You can provide a little assist and nothing more. Nothing...it can be a bottomless pit. Do not go there. If you do, then you are no better than her, are you? You are doing your part and you are doing it well. She has to learn to step up to the plate. She absolutely has to. There is no other way.
Last edited:
Star*
call 911........call 911
Hi there,
Don't know where in TN you are but thought I would start with this so that you aren't so guilt ridden about your daughters illness - it isn't something that you caused. It may be something that you have passed on genetically - but if you never got help for yourself from your family how would you ever know to get help for her? So I think we need to start with you first - then her. Maybe if you understood a little bit more about the disorder BiPolar (BP) and manic depression it would help - here's a little blurb I found because there is a TON of information on BiPolar (BP) that can snow you under - and like you said you're already overwhelmed - so you don't need a bunch of garbely gook to depress you further but you DO need to start with a good therapist for yourself so that you can see things a bit more clearly to work out issues THEN draw boundaries for your daughter.
AND the other thing I see because I've been there is if you are seeing a doctor AND maybe taking an anti-depressant that is putting YOU in a better frame of mind (if you so choose) you won't have to deal with "Well why aren't YOU doing it if it's so good?" from your daughter. I hate when they do that. Even at 32 years old - she'll do that you know.
Next you'll need to know where to go for FREE or NEXT to free - if you do not have insurance that will help with mental health exams and again since I don't know where you live - ALL COUNTY MENTAL Health clinics will see you on sliding scale fees or for FREE. It's a federal law. So they have to based on your income. You may live in such a small county that the combine counties - but they are there. ANd in some situations - if you live in a really small town - there are psychlogists and psychiatrists that may see you for a reduced fee if you ask. Some insurance companies have a maximum amount of visits they will allow. I have Blue Cross and gosh - lovely - they will let me have 4 visits. I couldn't tell them about the first month of my life in 4 visits...lol. (sounds like you couldn't begin to tell them about a day in your daughters life in 4 visits) so check with mental health for the freebie. (I like freebies cause I'm super cheap)
But to get the ball rolling with your daughter and disability? I think for now I would make a list of the things that I would personally like to see happen from bathing to job interview. If she's living in a small trailer with 4 dogs and a cat there is probably some hoarding issues going on with her that should be addressed not only for her health, but for the health of the animals. I would and have and will forever call the ASPCA on her. THey have to have tags, shots and she will have to produce records to prove they are being taken care of properly. That would do 2 things - Get the animal law enforcement involved in her care - keeping another set of eyes on her - and getting what you feel may be unsanitary conditions manageable for her.
Janet is BiPolar (BP) - so from a BiPolar (BP) point of view - she can give you tons of inside info on how they feel, and how they cycle and maybe some suggestions on how to help your daughter get on some medications and stay on them to manage her life. My son thinks he is a BiPolar (BP) and has all the ear marks of BiPolar (BP) and his biofather and his Mother were and self-medicated -not fun people to be around off medication and even MORE not fun to be around when they self medicate.
You can go on line and fill out the SS disability paperwork to get the ball rolling without any help - you sign up, get a casenumber (write that and your password down) and fill in the information that you can and you can also go through voc. rehab in your area (I think someone mentioned that here so ops to them
But like I said - First things first - and that's you lady - You first - THEN the kid - no matter how bad she's sinking. Getting her started on SSI is a life line -and admitting that you need help to stop enabling her is a HUGE step and you should be congratulated for reaching out.
SO.....CONGRATULATIONS! I think you are very brave and very wise and are on your way to helping your daughter in the very best ways!
Welcome to the board!
Don't know where in TN you are but thought I would start with this so that you aren't so guilt ridden about your daughters illness - it isn't something that you caused. It may be something that you have passed on genetically - but if you never got help for yourself from your family how would you ever know to get help for her? So I think we need to start with you first - then her. Maybe if you understood a little bit more about the disorder BiPolar (BP) and manic depression it would help - here's a little blurb I found because there is a TON of information on BiPolar (BP) that can snow you under - and like you said you're already overwhelmed - so you don't need a bunch of garbely gook to depress you further but you DO need to start with a good therapist for yourself so that you can see things a bit more clearly to work out issues THEN draw boundaries for your daughter.
AND the other thing I see because I've been there is if you are seeing a doctor AND maybe taking an anti-depressant that is putting YOU in a better frame of mind (if you so choose) you won't have to deal with "Well why aren't YOU doing it if it's so good?" from your daughter. I hate when they do that. Even at 32 years old - she'll do that you know.
Next you'll need to know where to go for FREE or NEXT to free - if you do not have insurance that will help with mental health exams and again since I don't know where you live - ALL COUNTY MENTAL Health clinics will see you on sliding scale fees or for FREE. It's a federal law. So they have to based on your income. You may live in such a small county that the combine counties - but they are there. ANd in some situations - if you live in a really small town - there are psychlogists and psychiatrists that may see you for a reduced fee if you ask. Some insurance companies have a maximum amount of visits they will allow. I have Blue Cross and gosh - lovely - they will let me have 4 visits. I couldn't tell them about the first month of my life in 4 visits...lol. (sounds like you couldn't begin to tell them about a day in your daughters life in 4 visits) so check with mental health for the freebie. (I like freebies cause I'm super cheap)
But to get the ball rolling with your daughter and disability? I think for now I would make a list of the things that I would personally like to see happen from bathing to job interview. If she's living in a small trailer with 4 dogs and a cat there is probably some hoarding issues going on with her that should be addressed not only for her health, but for the health of the animals. I would and have and will forever call the ASPCA on her. THey have to have tags, shots and she will have to produce records to prove they are being taken care of properly. That would do 2 things - Get the animal law enforcement involved in her care - keeping another set of eyes on her - and getting what you feel may be unsanitary conditions manageable for her.
Janet is BiPolar (BP) - so from a BiPolar (BP) point of view - she can give you tons of inside info on how they feel, and how they cycle and maybe some suggestions on how to help your daughter get on some medications and stay on them to manage her life. My son thinks he is a BiPolar (BP) and has all the ear marks of BiPolar (BP) and his biofather and his Mother were and self-medicated -not fun people to be around off medication and even MORE not fun to be around when they self medicate.
You can go on line and fill out the SS disability paperwork to get the ball rolling without any help - you sign up, get a casenumber (write that and your password down) and fill in the information that you can and you can also go through voc. rehab in your area (I think someone mentioned that here so ops to them
But like I said - First things first - and that's you lady - You first - THEN the kid - no matter how bad she's sinking. Getting her started on SSI is a life line -and admitting that you need help to stop enabling her is a HUGE step and you should be congratulated for reaching out.
SO.....CONGRATULATIONS! I think you are very brave and very wise and are on your way to helping your daughter in the very best ways!
Welcome to the board!
I'm soaking all this in trying to build my strength for this battle, and it will be a battle, I know. I went through trying to find income-based therapy or any help for her at all and exhausted myself in the process. I did find several places but they really were pretty unenthused and not so helpful. TN is not loaded with resources. Her primary care doctor retired and other than that I'm trying to think of anyone she's seen. It's been awhile. There was a therapist that was my daughter's caseworker at one of the facilities and she left there and went into private practice and I went to her for awhile. She might help. She also gave me the name of a man who helps with the disability filing. I realize he takes a cut but if I understand correctly he has more of a success rate in knowing the workings of applying for disability....that you pay his percentage, versus the alternative of perhaps a higher percentage of being denied and going through a lengthy appeal so am wondering if anyone has experience with that. I can't think clearly with the day-to-day barrage of calls, etc. I've had two calls already this morning: needs gas money for going to Goodwill to sign in and get job referrals. Should have had gas money from yesterday. I believe Goodwill is like voc rehab and if you don't follow their guidelines you are disqualified for a year. I cannot make her do these things and I know that yet on some level logic tells me she has to get to Goodwill. If I stop working today...not going to do that...but if I stop working today and do that and take her there, still she will more than likely not follow through at another avenue. I need to stop trying to keep her from being -- from being what?? Herself? You are right that I am no better than she is and in fact have probably kept her in this shape by my pathetic attempts to save her from herself. I need to have no contact with her since she refuses to respect my wishes. In any conversation she soon will talk over me, yell....just control the situation. Her father is penniless....does live with his wife but he's never been able to keep a job and he and my daughter rarely talk. When they do talk she ends up almost being arrested or some other issue..on Father's Day she talked to him and ended the day by cutting her arm with a butcher knife and landed in the emergency room. I'm going to try to get myself together and try to organize a plan after I regroup.
Star*
call 911........call 911
J,
I think you need to see our Detachment 101 guidelines and read, read, read. They have saved a lot of us from certain parental pitfall.
I know exactly what you mean when you say I have to take off work because if I don't she won't go to get a job that she needs because if she doesn't get a job then I will have to keep supporting her - and there's the rub. You WANT.....and that is the beginning of YOUR end. It was also nearly my end. Belive me to some degree I think I would still be doing it with my son at 18 - but last year I had a stroke and then well - lets say I had to rethink how badly I wanted to keep doing this dance and for how long. Even after that? I still did some things....but not to the degree I did before the stroke.
It's like you sit there and think to yourself "What would she do without me?" Then your mind races from - Well she would kill herself which makes us very sad to - she would find a way and go on- and that just made me personally furious ( which, and I don't know why because it was what I wanted all along) to think that after all I've done - my kid would manage without me. I guess that was the realization or epiphany I had to come to so that I could let go and detach or begin to save myself. It was like HOW DARE HE go on without my help. Which on a very basic level was very convoluted thinking. Then I talked it out with my therapist and I said "How messed up is that?" then I cried and then I laughed, because I realized how crazy it must have sounded.
I want my son to be independent - I want him to grow up, have a life, a job - be self-supporting, but when I thought about him doing it all on his own without me in his life - it made me angry. That's when I knew I was too involved and needed to detach. So I began working on that point. It didn't mean I couldn't love him, or help him financially or couldn't buy him things when I saw them and WANTED to. But it DID mean that I wouldn't be manipulated into doing things for him that I couldn't afford or were beyond my financial means or strapped me to the point of not paying my own bills, or being TOLD to buy him things or being FORCED to give him money or being bullied into handing him a $20 for movies when I was trying to figure out how to make ends meet. It meant letting him go hungry a few nights and walk a few miles and swing a few hammers and sweat a few days at hard labor - and appreciate a hard days work and NOT making excuses for HIS disabilities when there were kids out there with no legs and no arms and no eyes and no ears that were doing things every day and thankful to be able to do so.
I stopped feeling sorry for him and myself all in one day and never looked back. I started expecting MORE out of him and so he started expecting more out of himself - and I stopped expecting the world to treat him like an emotional cripple - and more like everyone else - and so by doing so - he started to do more for himself.
He still has his moments of (misplacing his brain) - we all do. He still has his good days and his bad. We all do. He still has the ability to do good and make choices for himself....and until he can't? I expect him to do the best he can for himself - and rely on himself because someday I'm not going to be here - and he'll go on - and I'll be GLAD for that. Not angry -lol. And if at this point in time I felt he could not? I think I'd be talking to someone at a state level hospital that would be providing for his care so that when I was gone - he would be taken care of.
I do not envy you your task j - this is hard......but you've found a soft place to land - and a lot of fine feathered friends for support.
Many hugs.
I think you need to see our Detachment 101 guidelines and read, read, read. They have saved a lot of us from certain parental pitfall.
I know exactly what you mean when you say I have to take off work because if I don't she won't go to get a job that she needs because if she doesn't get a job then I will have to keep supporting her - and there's the rub. You WANT.....and that is the beginning of YOUR end. It was also nearly my end. Belive me to some degree I think I would still be doing it with my son at 18 - but last year I had a stroke and then well - lets say I had to rethink how badly I wanted to keep doing this dance and for how long. Even after that? I still did some things....but not to the degree I did before the stroke.
It's like you sit there and think to yourself "What would she do without me?" Then your mind races from - Well she would kill herself which makes us very sad to - she would find a way and go on- and that just made me personally furious ( which, and I don't know why because it was what I wanted all along) to think that after all I've done - my kid would manage without me. I guess that was the realization or epiphany I had to come to so that I could let go and detach or begin to save myself. It was like HOW DARE HE go on without my help. Which on a very basic level was very convoluted thinking. Then I talked it out with my therapist and I said "How messed up is that?" then I cried and then I laughed, because I realized how crazy it must have sounded.
I want my son to be independent - I want him to grow up, have a life, a job - be self-supporting, but when I thought about him doing it all on his own without me in his life - it made me angry. That's when I knew I was too involved and needed to detach. So I began working on that point. It didn't mean I couldn't love him, or help him financially or couldn't buy him things when I saw them and WANTED to. But it DID mean that I wouldn't be manipulated into doing things for him that I couldn't afford or were beyond my financial means or strapped me to the point of not paying my own bills, or being TOLD to buy him things or being FORCED to give him money or being bullied into handing him a $20 for movies when I was trying to figure out how to make ends meet. It meant letting him go hungry a few nights and walk a few miles and swing a few hammers and sweat a few days at hard labor - and appreciate a hard days work and NOT making excuses for HIS disabilities when there were kids out there with no legs and no arms and no eyes and no ears that were doing things every day and thankful to be able to do so.
I stopped feeling sorry for him and myself all in one day and never looked back. I started expecting MORE out of him and so he started expecting more out of himself - and I stopped expecting the world to treat him like an emotional cripple - and more like everyone else - and so by doing so - he started to do more for himself.
He still has his moments of (misplacing his brain) - we all do. He still has his good days and his bad. We all do. He still has the ability to do good and make choices for himself....and until he can't? I expect him to do the best he can for himself - and rely on himself because someday I'm not going to be here - and he'll go on - and I'll be GLAD for that. Not angry -lol. And if at this point in time I felt he could not? I think I'd be talking to someone at a state level hospital that would be providing for his care so that when I was gone - he would be taken care of.
I do not envy you your task j - this is hard......but you've found a soft place to land - and a lot of fine feathered friends for support.
Many hugs.
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
Hi there. Welcome to the board.
I am mentally ill and have bipolar and trouble working. I did not ever abuse drugs though. Although it's sad to see your daughter making no progress, as one who knows, this is really your daughter's fault. I had terrible reactions to medications to, but I kept on trying them because I wanted to get well. She could be listening to her doctors. A path for someone with bipolar is never easy, but if she won't take the steps, she won't ever get better, no matter if you sacrifice the rest of your life for her. in my opinion, you must be up into the late 50's or 60's and deserve to have a peaceful retirement rather than looking after this daughter. If she is disabled to the point where she can't care for herself, get social services involved. There are group homes for adults. The ones around here are terrific and even drive the people back and forth from sheltered workshops. Many of the workers are also mentally ill, but the adults HAVE to be doing their treatment to get the services.
Your daughter may be sick, but she has the choice of being more functional. She should actually call for SSI herself. I doubt they'll let you do it for her. I had to apply on my own and go down to the office. I got it on the first try, BUT I'm very compliant with my treatment. Ditto for trying for low income housing. She needs to do it or she will NEVER get stronger. YES, you can functnion with bipolar. I'm in a support group of adults with bipolar. We are all functioning. Some of us are on disability, but we are living lives, doing things, some are working, we have hobbies, we do clean our house, etc.
in my opinion, as one with the disorder, the more you pay her bills, take off work for her, baby her etc. the less incentive she has to move and do things to make herself better. If she is in a depressed state of mind, it takes a lot of motivation to get moving so you are, in a kind way, actually enabling her to do nothing. I know that forcing myself to do something when I am depressed always makes me feel better. Of course, I do take my medication.
You deserve to have a life. You didn't cause this. My parents didn't cause this, except for maybe passing along some bad genes. My parents made me do everything myself. They didn't really believe I was sick so I was out of the house at eighteen. I'm glad. It made me learn to take care of myself without their help. By thirty-two, I was married with three kids and working part-time. Things were not perfect then, but I was forced to learn to deal with my illness. Your daughter has the ability to do that as well. But you can't make her do it and paying her bills, even if you feel bad, in my opinion is not helping her.
Glad you dropped by. Let us know how it goes
I am mentally ill and have bipolar and trouble working. I did not ever abuse drugs though. Although it's sad to see your daughter making no progress, as one who knows, this is really your daughter's fault. I had terrible reactions to medications to, but I kept on trying them because I wanted to get well. She could be listening to her doctors. A path for someone with bipolar is never easy, but if she won't take the steps, she won't ever get better, no matter if you sacrifice the rest of your life for her. in my opinion, you must be up into the late 50's or 60's and deserve to have a peaceful retirement rather than looking after this daughter. If she is disabled to the point where she can't care for herself, get social services involved. There are group homes for adults. The ones around here are terrific and even drive the people back and forth from sheltered workshops. Many of the workers are also mentally ill, but the adults HAVE to be doing their treatment to get the services.
Your daughter may be sick, but she has the choice of being more functional. She should actually call for SSI herself. I doubt they'll let you do it for her. I had to apply on my own and go down to the office. I got it on the first try, BUT I'm very compliant with my treatment. Ditto for trying for low income housing. She needs to do it or she will NEVER get stronger. YES, you can functnion with bipolar. I'm in a support group of adults with bipolar. We are all functioning. Some of us are on disability, but we are living lives, doing things, some are working, we have hobbies, we do clean our house, etc.
in my opinion, as one with the disorder, the more you pay her bills, take off work for her, baby her etc. the less incentive she has to move and do things to make herself better. If she is in a depressed state of mind, it takes a lot of motivation to get moving so you are, in a kind way, actually enabling her to do nothing. I know that forcing myself to do something when I am depressed always makes me feel better. Of course, I do take my medication.
You deserve to have a life. You didn't cause this. My parents didn't cause this, except for maybe passing along some bad genes. My parents made me do everything myself. They didn't really believe I was sick so I was out of the house at eighteen. I'm glad. It made me learn to take care of myself without their help. By thirty-two, I was married with three kids and working part-time. Things were not perfect then, but I was forced to learn to deal with my illness. Your daughter has the ability to do that as well. But you can't make her do it and paying her bills, even if you feel bad, in my opinion is not helping her.
Glad you dropped by. Let us know how it goes
I'm so sorry you had to endure all this and a stroke. How ironic, I keep thinking something traumatic will happen to her to get her to see the light...just like when I finally got the courage and strength to *save* her and her sister when I was divorced/escaped from their dad....that *trauma* seemed to finally change him, so it will probably be me that has the traumatic event that causes me to change and not her....I never thought of that before. Just another twist in all this I guess. I do hope you're okay. I don't know if I'll be p'd once I realize she'll be able to make it without my help...I can't even fathom that thought yet. I do need to detach...I know this...know it....but putting it into practice..well, you know how hard that is. I have difficulty just making it through the morning...money for gas, how will I get the 20 miles to wherever, etc., and I just keep throwing that money at her. I'm sure your son is better now and I imagine my daughter will be if I stop this. I long ago realized if she wanted something, had to do something, if you didn't do it relatively soon you'd learn to regret it big time. From the time she was little. She eventually, whether it takes an hour, a week or a month, will get what she wants and that pattern was so reinforced by me and my mother that we've done her no service. Sometimes I'd do things just to keep her from hurting her little sister. She has had difficulty for a long time...but you're right...I so need to stop becuase it's not helping. I will check out the detachment area. You're so right in what you said about wanting your son to be independent, to not feel like you have to give him money, but get to the point that just when you want to do something for him you do, and not be forced to. That is what is ruining our relationship the most I think. If you can do this I hope I can. I imagine it didn't happen overnight but what a relief it must be.
I've still not made it to the detachment section. Yes, I'm late 50s, and I do feel like I deserve a peaceful retirement It's good to hear your point of view. My daughter needs your commitment and logic it seems to me. I'm glad of where you are and how you've worked through your issues and you are hopefully empowered by that, and should be. Also, I have trouble dealing with the *fault* of this. I don't think it's my fault for her condition...although I know I contributed, and I don't know that I think it's her fault....but it really is what it is...What I really have a problem with is why is this different than would I treat a physically ill person the way that I must treat her? I can't get a grip on that one. but then again, I struggle with issues just right off the bat of our contact for the day. Like now...she just showed up downstairs...I did know she was coming....I work from home. She's waiting down there for the gas money I mentioned earlier. At first though she'll want to go out and get something to eat. I dont necessarily have a problem with that....often see it as a way to break up my day from working at home, as in going *out to lunch* like I did when I worked outside the home. So anyway, we'll start off fairly pleasantly, sometimes not, have something to eat, then she'll need the money for gas to get to Goodwill. I say no...I usually make the mistake of saying I don't have it which of course she knows I usually do, these small amounts anyway...but if I don't give it to her she'll be well, fine, I'll just sit here all day and the rest of the day will be total hell. Badgering, slamming doors, if she's lying and has gas in the car to get home she'll storm off. I have lost before I even begin. Okay, to the detachment area.
It's good to hear your point of view. My daughter needs your commitment and logic it seems to me. I'm glad of where you are and how you've worked through your issues and you are hopefully empowered by that, and should be. Also, I have trouble dealing with the *fault* of this. I don't think it's my fault for her condition...although I know I contributed, and I don't know that I think it's her fault....but it really is what it is...What I really have a problem with is why is this different than would I treat a physically ill person the way that I must treat her? I can't get a grip on that one. but then again, I struggle with issues just right off the bat of our contact for the day. Like now...she just showed up downstairs...I did know she was coming....I work from home. She's waiting down there for the gas money I mentioned earlier. At first though she'll want to go out and get something to eat. I dont necessarily have a problem with that....often see it as a way to break up my day from working at home, as in going *out to lunch* like I did when I worked outside the home. So anyway, we'll start off fairly pleasantly, sometimes not, have something to eat, then she'll need the money for gas to get to Goodwill. I say no...I usually make the mistake of saying I don't have it which of course she knows I usually do, these small amounts anyway...but if I don't give it to her she'll be well, fine, I'll just sit here all day and the rest of the day will be total hell. Badgering, slamming doors, if she's lying and has gas in the car to get home she'll storm off. I have lost before I even begin. Okay, to the detachment area.
N
Nomad
Guest
I would hesitate (big time) to take off from work unless it is a dire emergency. Consider telling her that from 9-5 or whatever hours you work are totally off limits with reference to her coming to the house. Additionally, you might tell her that other times she is only to come over if you guys agree upon it first. AND don't let her come over before work hours, 'cause she might not leave at the proper time. If she refuses to "play along," then don't answer the door when she comes over. Let her bang on the door until she get tired and moves on. If it gets ugly, then call the police and have her escorted off your property. Buy yourself ear plugs. You can offer some help when and where it is appropriate. Don't ever let her hurt you. She can take it or leave it. If she doesn't want the help you provide (YOUR terms) then she can make her own way the world without your help. Her choice, not yours. You, can not be abused. No one deserves that. You have choices, she has choices. Chose to do this differently. Protect yourself. Lock the door. Put on some nice music. Set up some boundaries. Read the detachment stuff!
Last edited:
