Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New profile posts
Latest activity
Internet Search
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Forums
General Discussions
Family of Origin
The win and the loss
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="New Leaf" data-source="post: 677006" data-attributes="member: 19522"><p>At some point as a child, and subsequent chapters throughout my life, because of how I grew up, I thought I was <em>broken, that something was wrong with me. </em></p><p>So, I am looking at this statement, in a way that <em>the right thing </em>becomes understanding that<em> it was not us. </em>In order to understand this, we do have to go back and revisit the past, to know <em>what really did happen.</em></p><p>So much is buried in layers.</p><p>Then, there is the concept of looking at it through our own eyes,<em> not </em>the eyes of our abusers.</p><p></p><p>Which is a tough <em>knot</em> to untangle, <em>not</em> only because it happened to me as a child, but also because I was told over and over, and am still told, that <em>I was too sensitive</em>, it <em>wasn't that bad, move on. </em></p><p></p><p>I think it is difficult to revisit this stuff, without cycling through different emotions, especially anger, because as a child, I was not allowed to be angry about it, feel or exhibit <em>any emotion</em>, I was supposed to ignore it.</p><p>That in of itself, is paradoxical. I can only speak for myself, but to me, a child should have a sense of protection, safety, security in their own home. I did not have that. I would never know when, on any given moment, the rug would be pulled from under me. Then, I was not supposed to cry.</p><p></p><p>That is my truth.</p><p></p><p>Yes, life is not all roses, it is not fair, many people grow up with difficult circumstances.</p><p></p><p>All we know, as individuals, <em>is the life we lived.</em></p><p> I believe this also. Face the truth of our own lives. It is not an easy thing to do, and write about. Especially, if one has been forbidden, it goes against the unwritten family law of secrecy. Loyalty.</p><p></p><p>It is a complicated tapestry, knowing something wasn't quite right, being taught to appreciate the goodness (and there are<em> fond memories</em> woven in) then delving back into the closet of my mind, to pull out that which has been hidden.</p><p></p><p>There is no right, or wrong, as far as the ideas presented that I have read here, because it is such a <em>personal experience.</em></p><p></p><p>I appreciate all perspectives.</p><p></p><p>You guys are a challenge to my brain.......</p><p></p><p>I have to admit, some of the content of this thread, is way over my head, and I have to do research,<em> the banality of evil,</em> is a whole different level of discussion, it does not come easy to my high school diploma, university of Google training.</p><p></p><p>The <em>banality of evil......</em></p><p></p><p>I looked into several articles on it, and one explained this of Arendt's treatise, as the coiner of the phrase-</p><p>"In a sense, by calling a crime against humanity "banal", she was trying to point to the way in which the crime had become for the criminals accepted, routinized, and implemented without moral revulsion and political indignation and resistance." One of the most interesting comments was that Arendt (on Eichmanns heinous nazi war crimes) "faults him for his obedience, his lack of critical distance, <em><strong>or his failure to think</strong></em>.</p><p><a href="http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/aug/29/hannah-arendt-adolf-eichmann-banality-of-evil" target="_blank">http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/aug/29/hannah-arendt-adolf-eichmann-banality-of-evil</a></p><p></p><p>I think this is very applicable in dysfunctional families. As we grew up in our roles, did our families promote and accept ill treatment, did we learn to expect it? Were we victimized, and then became victims of our own history laden insecurities as to what our role was in the world?</p><p>Did mistreatment become routine, ordinary? </p><p>Did we essentially, in some way or another, buy into the role, ourselves?</p><p>Dysfunctional families......</p><p>One can argue, also, what is a functional family?</p><p><em>Everyone </em>can point to some disturbing incidences in their FOO, I am sure.</p><p></p><p>Some folks, are farther along their journey in examining, remembering and questioning their lives with their FOO.</p><p></p><p>Some have arrived at the conclusion that looking back, changes nothing.</p><p></p><p>This is true, <em>it does not change the events that happened</em>.</p><p>I think the reflection can make a remarkable difference within ourselves.</p><p></p><p>Recalling certain events for me, from my<em> adult</em> inner child viewpoint, has made a difference in my outlook on <em>how to be in the present, how to move forward.</em></p><p></p><p>What I find changing for me, is the way I am looking at my life, growing up. I understand why I acted out in my teens. Why I made some very bad choices. Why I have had, and <em>have a hard time</em> - completing certain tasks, being with people at times, reading intent, or misreading it.</p><p></p><p>Looking back, I find helpful, to move into a place of better understanding of myself. Stop being overly critical, stop negative self talk and quell fears of vulnerability. It is not so much about blaming others in my FOO,<em> I want to stop blaming myself</em>. I want to stop falling into the old patterns and responses that were ingrained into me.</p><p>It was wrong.</p><p>I was mistreated, and misjudged.</p><p>I want to think on that.</p><p>I need to think on it, because it has affected the way I think and feel about myself.</p><p></p><p>It will also be helpful for me, when I go back home again, to help my Mom. I will be faced with those old dynamics, and I shall have to be brave. One thing I have found, where sis is concerned, that if I "dare" to move away from the role she thinks I am supposed to be in, then there will be trouble.</p><p>Old patterns are hard to break. She will be expecting the old me.</p><p>I am not as malleable, as I used to be. I think.....I hope.</p><p>This will not bode well with my sister.</p><p>What I have found in the most recent exchange with her, is that I am not supposed to have my own opinions, or exhibit real feelings.</p><p>Huh. I am not supposed to be me.</p><p>Still.</p><p></p><p>My Dad always said "It is what it is." True.</p><p>I find that this whole trip with my two d cs, the craziness of it all, the final wake up slap of it, detachment, reached deep down into my psyche, and dredged up a lot of unfinished business with my past.</p><p>Raised a lot of questions, it did.</p><p>"It is what it is."</p><p>But, when you can't even trust the stuff that pops up in your brain as a memory, nightmare, or am I just <em>a too sensitive big ole cry baby</em>......</p><p>then "it is what it is"</p><p>kinda of turns to "what the <img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/2012/censored2.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":censored2:" title="censored2 :censored2:" data-shortname=":censored2:" /> was it?"</p><p>Which leads to trying to find out.</p><p>Which leads to a weird swirly whirly all over again</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/emoticons/twister2.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":twister2:" title="twister2 :twister2:" data-shortname=":twister2:" /></p><p>Which leads to this</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Graemlins/919Mad.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":919Mad:" title="Mad :919Mad:" data-shortname=":919Mad:" /></p><p>and this</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Graemlins/9-07tears.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":9-07tears:" title="crying :9-07tears:" data-shortname=":9-07tears:" /></p><p>and this</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/2012/hamwheelsmilf.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":hamwheelsmilf:" title="hamwheelsmilf :hamwheelsmilf:" data-shortname=":hamwheelsmilf:" /></p><p>this</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/2012/allalonesmile.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":allalonesmile:" title="allalonesmile :allalonesmile:" data-shortname=":allalonesmile:" /></p><p>this</p><p></p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/2012/beafraid.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":beafraid:" title="beafraid :beafraid:" data-shortname=":beafraid:" /></p><p>some of this</p><p><img src="/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/2012/eggonface.gif" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":eggonface:" title="eggonface :eggonface:" data-shortname=":eggonface:" /></p><p></p><p>Well, you get the drift.</p><p></p><p>I have no witnesses. I cannot speak of this to my FOO.</p><p>I can only trust what I remember.</p><p>I am learning it is okay to trust that.</p><p>Reading along here in FOO, and the discussions I have participated in, have helped tremendously, and I thank you all for your patience, kindness, and time.</p><p></p><p>But you know what guys? I am not angry right now, I am puzzled. I don't know what the win is, in trying to control someone, hurt them, deny it.</p><p>I come up empty on that one.</p><p>Shunning, stalking?</p><p>Mistreatment of ones children.</p><p></p><p>The <em>banality of evil.</em></p><p></p><p>It is everywhere.</p><p>Every day.</p><p></p><p>That is the<em><strong> loss</strong>.</em></p><p>Denial of someone's rights to just be.</p><p>The right to live at peace, with ones surroundings, relationships, with ones concept of self, ones beliefs.</p><p></p><p>The<strong><em> win</em></strong>, in knowing, thinking, understanding, is one is able to determine the good, (or the right) use the bad (or the wrong) as a lesson, and try like hell to make things better.</p><p>Try to move away from the old patterns, and discover our real potential and purpose.</p><p></p><p>Forgiveness?</p><p></p><p>I think forgiveness starts within ourselves, stripping away whatever notions were beat into that child, that were false.</p><p>Forgiving ourselves for whatever our reactions were, or are, for that matter, to how we were treated.</p><p></p><p>Forgiveness.</p><p></p><p>Seeing the past for what it was, learning the truth of it.</p><p>Living in the present with peace of mind.</p><p>Finally finding acceptance of who we are,</p><p>realizing that we have truly been brave,</p><p>all along.</p><p></p><p>Thank you for the discussion.</p><p></p><p>If I have offended anyone with my comments, or views,</p><p>please forgive me.</p><p></p><p>leafy</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="New Leaf, post: 677006, member: 19522"] At some point as a child, and subsequent chapters throughout my life, because of how I grew up, I thought I was [I]broken, that something was wrong with me. [/I] So, I am looking at this statement, in a way that [I]the right thing [/I]becomes understanding that[I] it was not us. [/I]In order to understand this, we do have to go back and revisit the past, to know [I]what really did happen.[/I] So much is buried in layers. Then, there is the concept of looking at it through our own eyes,[I] not [/I]the eyes of our abusers. Which is a tough [I]knot[/I] to untangle, [I]not[/I] only because it happened to me as a child, but also because I was told over and over, and am still told, that [I]I was too sensitive[/I], it [I]wasn't that bad, move on. [/I] I think it is difficult to revisit this stuff, without cycling through different emotions, especially anger, because as a child, I was not allowed to be angry about it, feel or exhibit [I]any emotion[/I], I was supposed to ignore it. That in of itself, is paradoxical. I can only speak for myself, but to me, a child should have a sense of protection, safety, security in their own home. I did not have that. I would never know when, on any given moment, the rug would be pulled from under me. Then, I was not supposed to cry. That is my truth. Yes, life is not all roses, it is not fair, many people grow up with difficult circumstances. All we know, as individuals, [I]is the life we lived.[/I] I believe this also. Face the truth of our own lives. It is not an easy thing to do, and write about. Especially, if one has been forbidden, it goes against the unwritten family law of secrecy. Loyalty. It is a complicated tapestry, knowing something wasn't quite right, being taught to appreciate the goodness (and there are[I] fond memories[/I] woven in) then delving back into the closet of my mind, to pull out that which has been hidden. There is no right, or wrong, as far as the ideas presented that I have read here, because it is such a [I]personal experience.[/I] I appreciate all perspectives. You guys are a challenge to my brain....... I have to admit, some of the content of this thread, is way over my head, and I have to do research,[I] the banality of evil,[/I] is a whole different level of discussion, it does not come easy to my high school diploma, university of Google training. The [I]banality of evil......[/I] I looked into several articles on it, and one explained this of Arendt's treatise, as the coiner of the phrase- "In a sense, by calling a crime against humanity "banal", she was trying to point to the way in which the crime had become for the criminals accepted, routinized, and implemented without moral revulsion and political indignation and resistance." One of the most interesting comments was that Arendt (on Eichmanns heinous nazi war crimes) "faults him for his obedience, his lack of critical distance, [I][B]or his failure to think[/B][/I]. [URL]http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/aug/29/hannah-arendt-adolf-eichmann-banality-of-evil[/URL] I think this is very applicable in dysfunctional families. As we grew up in our roles, did our families promote and accept ill treatment, did we learn to expect it? Were we victimized, and then became victims of our own history laden insecurities as to what our role was in the world? Did mistreatment become routine, ordinary? Did we essentially, in some way or another, buy into the role, ourselves? Dysfunctional families...... One can argue, also, what is a functional family? [I]Everyone [/I]can point to some disturbing incidences in their FOO, I am sure. Some folks, are farther along their journey in examining, remembering and questioning their lives with their FOO. Some have arrived at the conclusion that looking back, changes nothing. This is true, [I]it does not change the events that happened[/I]. I think the reflection can make a remarkable difference within ourselves. Recalling certain events for me, from my[I] adult[/I] inner child viewpoint, has made a difference in my outlook on [I]how to be in the present, how to move forward.[/I] What I find changing for me, is the way I am looking at my life, growing up. I understand why I acted out in my teens. Why I made some very bad choices. Why I have had, and [I]have a hard time[/I] - completing certain tasks, being with people at times, reading intent, or misreading it. Looking back, I find helpful, to move into a place of better understanding of myself. Stop being overly critical, stop negative self talk and quell fears of vulnerability. It is not so much about blaming others in my FOO,[I] I want to stop blaming myself[/I]. I want to stop falling into the old patterns and responses that were ingrained into me. It was wrong. I was mistreated, and misjudged. I want to think on that. I need to think on it, because it has affected the way I think and feel about myself. It will also be helpful for me, when I go back home again, to help my Mom. I will be faced with those old dynamics, and I shall have to be brave. One thing I have found, where sis is concerned, that if I "dare" to move away from the role she thinks I am supposed to be in, then there will be trouble. Old patterns are hard to break. She will be expecting the old me. I am not as malleable, as I used to be. I think.....I hope. This will not bode well with my sister. What I have found in the most recent exchange with her, is that I am not supposed to have my own opinions, or exhibit real feelings. Huh. I am not supposed to be me. Still. My Dad always said "It is what it is." True. I find that this whole trip with my two d cs, the craziness of it all, the final wake up slap of it, detachment, reached deep down into my psyche, and dredged up a lot of unfinished business with my past. Raised a lot of questions, it did. "It is what it is." But, when you can't even trust the stuff that pops up in your brain as a memory, nightmare, or am I just [I]a too sensitive big ole cry baby[/I]...... then "it is what it is" kinda of turns to "what the :censored2: was it?" Which leads to trying to find out. Which leads to a weird swirly whirly all over again :twister2: Which leads to this :919Mad: and this :9-07tears: and this :hamwheelsmilf: this :allalonesmile: this :beafraid: some of this :eggonface: Well, you get the drift. I have no witnesses. I cannot speak of this to my FOO. I can only trust what I remember. I am learning it is okay to trust that. Reading along here in FOO, and the discussions I have participated in, have helped tremendously, and I thank you all for your patience, kindness, and time. But you know what guys? I am not angry right now, I am puzzled. I don't know what the win is, in trying to control someone, hurt them, deny it. I come up empty on that one. Shunning, stalking? Mistreatment of ones children. The [I]banality of evil.[/I] It is everywhere. Every day. That is the[I][B] loss[/B].[/I] Denial of someone's rights to just be. The right to live at peace, with ones surroundings, relationships, with ones concept of self, ones beliefs. The[B][I] win[/I][/B], in knowing, thinking, understanding, is one is able to determine the good, (or the right) use the bad (or the wrong) as a lesson, and try like hell to make things better. Try to move away from the old patterns, and discover our real potential and purpose. Forgiveness? I think forgiveness starts within ourselves, stripping away whatever notions were beat into that child, that were false. Forgiving ourselves for whatever our reactions were, or are, for that matter, to how we were treated. Forgiveness. Seeing the past for what it was, learning the truth of it. Living in the present with peace of mind. Finally finding acceptance of who we are, realizing that we have truly been brave, all along. Thank you for the discussion. If I have offended anyone with my comments, or views, please forgive me. leafy [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forums
General Discussions
Family of Origin
The win and the loss
Top