Therapist: the pain of FOO will last some degree


Well-Known Member
I saw my therapist today. My life is good but to be completely honest I still sometimes miss what I never had....a loving family and fun being with and accepted by my own mother and siblings. The wish that we were a loving, close group. A different family but with the same faces; softer though.

When I think of how I was treated, I feel sad and sometimes wonder if it wasnt all my fault even though my mother expressed not loving me as an infant. I still tend to go there and think it could be all me. It is normal for the scapegoat to take it all on but....

My therapist has heard all of my story many times and thinks it is the dysfunctional unit, not me But they all got along....doesnt that make it ME?. The mind can go around in circles sometimes.

My therapist told me something I had never considered but it sounds very possible since ALL of my particular DNA seemed to suffer intimacy problems.

Therapist believes that their relationships were and are probably not as warm and fuzzy as my wild imagination tells me. They were not The Brady Bunch with only Jan being ostracized while the rest of them loved on one another.

She thinks even today my siblings are not emotionally intimate people. She doesnt think either can get too close to another, and that there is a distance between the two of them.

Yes, they can love, my brother more than sister, but not in an intimate way. She also agrees that we all had intimacy problems. I know I largely learned to get past the intimacy problem I had. But, hey, not until lots of therapy and 40 years old.

But none of this was the main focus of our awesome discussion....therapist and me.

She told me that no matter how great my family of choice is, I will never forget those I grew up with, even if the memories are not all good. Frankly, they are not all bad either, especially my younger years with my brother. I smile at those times with my brother, not so many good memories with Sis. But bro and I were very close. I miss that. Therapist told me they will both be on my mind at times until forever. That is how it is. For almost all. We cant forget our past completely. Its frustrating! Live with it, sure. Forget it, no.

And no matter how much my brother and sister may never want to think about me, they will. The connections with people who shared our childhoods, even if we experienced the childhood differently, is a bond forever. We can all live until 100 and we will never stop thinking about one another and likely sometimes will miss one another. It isnt pervasive but it will always be there. Certain triggers will bring them back.

I believe my therapists thoughts. I miss them both sometimes although I wasnt treated great, especially by my sister. I miss my brother more, young me and my young brother. Inventing Fantasy Sports ;) I assume both are stuck thinking about me. Even though we wont meet again in this lifetime.

Kind of weird that my sister thought I would stick with her after my father died. Didnt she know that it was too late? That I was too hurt, rejected and done? That all the times I needed her and she wasnt there was not okay? That never once telling my mother that she loved me and not to be mean to me was not okay with me? That I would have done it for her??

She was proud and would not have asked me to step in for her, as I did not ask her for that. But I would have done it anyways because I would have known it hurt her and I try to stop bullying. It mattered SO MUCH to me that my siblings never told her to be nicer to me. No they didnt have to do so. No, it was not their responsibility.

But I would have done it. Of course they didnt want to take sides and only heard one side (hers) but I was different. I would have gotten in between to smooth it over the best I could. But I loved them both a lot. All I can think.of is that they didnt love me or one of them would have tried to change the game.

It was a "leave Somewhere out of the family" game. I wasnt even informed if a DNA member was gravely sick so I could send a card or call or at least know thei illnesses in my own DNA. I was like an adoptee from a closed adoption. i could not accurately tell my doctor what illnesses ran in the family.

A first cousin had colon cancer and died, an uncle had Parkinson's and dementia and died, my mother had a brain tumor I didnt know about...nobody told me.

Not until after my father passed did I finally get my sister to tell me what illnesses ran in our family. It was one of the last things she told me....finally.....before I cut her off.

How mean to keep all that a secret. What was the point??? It was info I needed.

God please forgive me, in a way I hate them all so much, although I try not to hate anyone. Instead I tell myself that although many in my DNA were book smart, they were ignorant in many ways about the right things to do. And I stick to that. They didnt know better. But as I type all this it is making me HAPPIER that I dont see them now!


My sister also never took any responsibility for her part in our problem. Maybe she thought she had no part. That calling the cops on me for nothing over and over again, even when I lived out of state, was a good, healthy way to teach me lessons. (Sarcasm) There is something very not right about her. Who DOES things like call the cops constantly just because the person is ticked off by an e-mail? To a sister???? I know her well and nobody knows how many times shes called the cops on me over nothing,not even her late in life therapist. She would have sounded crazy if she had admitted it. And I have a cop friend she called who would stick by me and say it was true because it was. But how could she tell her therapist or my brother or anyone that she did this and how often she did? Her therapist would have addressed it with her and not seen her as the stable one. The others would have looked at her as weird too. So nobody knows this cops secret but her and me and my one cop friend whom she called many times and who truly thought she was the end he didnt even respond to her calls by visiting us....just kind of laughed about it when we saw one another.

I had had Sis with her years ago. I felt she never gave a damn about me. And so this is how it had to end and she should have figured it out. How stupid did she think I am? My decision had been made for certain after I had been in a terrible car accident and she had whined that in my drugged state (combo of morphine and fentatyl) I had not called her and thanked her for sending me flowers. The truth is I wasnt with it and could not have told anyone my name. I couldnt call anyone. A month of my life was pretty much amnesia.

But she whined about her flowers and my lack of manners. Flowers my husband, who never left the hospital, swear never arrived. I believe him. But maybe they went to the wrong room. Who knows or cares?

My family of choice loathe her and want me to stay away from her and I promised to never go near her again. And brother too. If I dont talk to her, so he wont talk to me either. He finally took somebody's side :).

Even sickness and death, theirs or mine, is no reason for us to ever contact one anothet again and I wont and they better not. I dont want to know this time. And I wont tell them either. So in the sense of earthly contact we no longer exist to one another.

But I will still think about them sometimes. That is just how it works out.

I had a very interesting session today and feel better knowing that missing them at times is normal and wont ever totally cease. And they feel the same, I am sure.

Too bad it had to end this way. But....hey, I had long ago known it had to end this way. It was planned. It is over.

Have a great night!!!
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Tired out

Well-Known Member
SWOT, It is sad that you FOO was so awful. I would be more worried if you didn't ever miss them.
Not all sisters are besties. I have 3 sisters. I am besties with my oldest sister. The other 2 I get along with fine (not always the case with the youngest, she was a difficult child from 14-35!! then she decided to get real) I am also very close to my oldest sister's daughters and their daughters. We don't live near our families. We relocated years ago-when my kids were little. My oldest sister winters in Florida and we go hang with her there. My nieces and their kids come here--a couple of years we had a house full for Thanksgiving, extra mattress and sleeping bags they all stayed at our house it was chaotic and fun. Everyone came for Jill's wedding and then on the wedding night we brought the party back to our house and everyone crashed here. It was so much fun. I wish it happened more often.
So many things in a family change it's dynamics. My mom died when I was in my 20s. She was the glue. Dad passed 10 years later he was the duct tape. After he passed Hubs was offered a job out of state and we relocated. He would never consider it when my dad was alive. Yes, Hubs has a family too but, they weren't a consideration. They didn't/don't have he same bonds. I really like 1 of his sisters the rest, eh.
I think Ben inherited more of his father's family emotional feelings than mine. I wonder if he didn't need me at times, would I ever hear from him. But then I will see him, take him to breakfast (1x/month or so, when he has a later start time) and he will always thank me and tell me he loves me. My biology can't just say bye, have a nice life.


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Mine can, usually. I dont think DNA is important. I was never close to it.

But I lived exerperiences with them since I was a baby. My experiences were different than theirs but we did share some. We were treated very differently but we all knew our parents were lacking. Or my sister knew. My brother was the golden, beloved child. I was the scapegoat. My sister was the forgotten child, not a good role.

I am determined never to see or speak to them again. That doesnt mean I dont wish it had been different. Apparently, whether it is love or hate or in between people keep their siblings in their minds for all of life. That doesnt mean we can see them or that we know them for life.

Now that I understand this, I wont get mad at me for a memory or a wish. But reality dictates that I do not talk to them or even read their social media ever again. Im sure I will be on their minds too. I feel stupidly better knowing this. Fair is fair :)

I do have a loving, close family of my own now. My family of my choosing are amazing.My sister of choice (BFF) was family until she died of cancer. And I was my mothers mothers (grandmas) favorite grand until she died when I was I did have her thankfully. She told me I was her special grand. She loved me best and said so often. I cherish her words to this day.

I am glad you have a loving family. I think if I live to be 93 i will die wondering why most of my FOO didnt love me. But I believe without a doubt that our spirit and consciousness live on eternally and we experience reincarnations for the evolution of our soul.So this life is not so important.

I never forget that either.

Thanks for responding,!!
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Tired out

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SWOT, I really hope and pray my son knows we (including his dad) love him. I hope he doesn't really think his dad has a lifetime problem with him. The only problem his dad has with him is that he quit jobs, was disrespectful and stole. His dad felt violated. His sister has run into him at the grocery store and they have spoken (amicably) briefly.

For you. You know what is best for you. I can't help but wish it was different for you.


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TiredOut, thanks. I am not the only one who who is picked on in a family as the bad guy and.... it has made me strong! I mean that! I am the rock to all who needs me.....and I dont know if I could have been that person any other way. But I am happy to be strong.

Your son wont think you didnt love him because you do,!! My family would have let me go, not worried, not cared if I died. My mother disinherited me. She left me $ it was an "I hate you" from the grave.

I didnt care sbout the money. The snub hurt. Nobody in my family even tried to comfort me. So my feelings for them is they didnt love me and I think of them sometimes, but I dont feel love...not like I love my husband, kids, grands and brother and sister in law and neice and my son in law to be. Its more of a wistfulness that I daydream had been different. But its sadness, not love. I did love them once.

I am positive you have no plans to hurt your son now or from the grave. He knows you love him. He will always know because you will make sure. Please dont worry about that! Even at his worst, he knows you love him!

Love and light!
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Well-Known Member
Swot. Did you ever consider this: that your sibs loved you but that because they are each so damaged that they don't know how to love in a way that feels right or enough...

And because you were always healthier than they were you knew intuitively what love should feel like...knew instinctively that what your foo could give was not enough..

And searched and searched for help and never gave up until you were able to build a family where you could give and receive love like you needed. Healthy, real love.

Did you ever think that maybe your family was not enough because they were so damaged and you weren't? And that this is the real kernel of truth here...

But that you were the powerful one and the whole one was too scary to you (after all you were a baby) you accepted their labeling...(false) but that everybody in their deepest selves knows the real truth... That you are the together one. And that you were a difficult baby only because you were in distress, you knew what you needed and knew you were not getting it...and you protested....
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Copa, your post is so potent it will take me days to process. Wow, the brilliant psychologist really came out there, and a lot of it was more on target than any psychologist I ever saw and more than I ever figured out on my own.

The only thing a I dont see is that I was the healthiest. I was born with something it Aspergers or something else on top of a childhood anxiety,/mood disorder. Something was off. I needed love and help. I got neither. I begged for it.

Although most people can not remember their lives before five, I can. I have clear memories of about two walking with my dear grandmother down a street, holding her hand, wearing some white bonnet and a jumper with black background and pink flowers. I remember visiting my mother at work. She had her own dance studio. Cool huh? I could never dance :) She quit working after my brother was born.

I also remember shaking in my bed and the rumbling in my tummy for no reason other than I was born to have anxiety. And later on I remember not saying the right things to school peers and being shunned for it. Teachers got mad at me too. They would tell me "Dont you ever say that!" I didnt know what I had said wrong.

My social skills and learning disabilities made me an outcast at school as well as at home. My brother was also an outcast for poor social skills and other things that I dont know. He got sick at 12 with Crohns Disease so he looked ill and got meanly teased for that and had few friends before that too. At that time we were both loners. I still rather be just with my family and i am basically a loner. Did I ever tell you I was a writer? I used to write for hours at home. Way into the night. I was known as a good writer and a good singer and very creative at school, even though I was disliked.

My brother and I were both sports fans and played together and were very close. I miss that part of us. He moved out East and we grew apart.

My sister seemed the healthy one. Although I realized later it was an act. She can still put on a healthy, nice mask. I think she is the least healthy though.

I digress.

I was very damaged as a child. I needed a mother to help me with my problems that scared and puzzled me and, no, she didnt and, no, she wasnt enough. And she would call me horrible names for acting disturbed or just because she could, and I started to resent her early although I loved her so much. But not without resentment. That started early. I used to call her out on being a biotch to me in high school and she would retaliate with worse.

My Dad was absent and not that caring but I always loved him. He didnt play favorites to the end. For that alone I will.always adore him. I always loved him more than my mother.

I see every member of my family as very distirbed including me. I got healthy later, after years of therapy. After I married T.

My ability to unconditionally love has always been deep, maybe because I got that love from my grandmother. We were both able to deeply love and we were so close.

What my sister offered me was certainly puzzling, an on and off relationship, not enough. It never lasted before she got angry again and called the cops, which was so vicious. It is not something me or most people would have thought of. I never would have thought of cops because I wanted to stick it to her lol. Who does that? She did ...over an email. Often. I remember the cop would come over looking bored to tell me not to send her any more emails. She is very not okay.

While she CAN do the right things, I dont think her heart is very big or that her heart is always in her deeds. I often think she sometimes does the right thing for show. She likes to be admired. We wont even get into her anorexia which is a mental illness borne of vanity. She is 58 and still thinks she is beautiful. You think she would get over herself by now.

She is so skinny my ex ran into her then asked me if she had a grave disease. Never outgrew the anorexia. I truly never remember her sitting and eating a meal. Ever.

My brother is nice but also damaged in the intimicy department. It is rare for anyone to have reached 60 years old without ever having lived with a SO. He never has had one.

My parents were both intimacy challenged.

When I talk about this to T, my hub, which isnt often, he always says the same thing. "if you were not nice I would not be here 23 years later and your kids love you." I am the only one out if my siblings and mother to have had a long loving marriage. And we do. You would think T would get on my nerves a bit or vice versa now that we are retired, but we are BFFs. We enjoy being together. In our entire marriage we had maybe three bad fights. And nice reconcilliations! But we never fight.

So I cant think my FOO is my fault. Nobody at all would like me if it were my awfulness, and I have no doubt that my family of choice loves me and my volunteer friends like me too.

I guess my family I picked can love deeply enough for me to be satisfied arend I can love them back without expecting a fight or a snub. And I do need that. I am fortunate enough to live near two kids who I am very close to. Princess is a best friend who texts all the time. Bart calls every day. I do ferl the love. So why do I worry about FOO?

I think we all do sometimes.

I think your analysis was the best I ever read. I am going to print it out. I will never get that degree of wisdom again.

I thank you, Doctor. You are a doctor, rigjt? Of psychology?

I would give you the biggest hug ever if you were here.

G-d bless. Update us on your situation with J. I hope things are better!!
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Well-Known Member
Swot. That we are different can be a gift as well as a curse. I am referring here to the "something" you were born with to which you refer. . It can bring with it deep capacities as well as vulnerabilities. And the vulnerability can be a gift too because with it can come sensitivity, empathy, intuition, creativity, access to deep knowing.