Trying to start difficult child on medications tonight for first time...

[susiestar]

Sweetie, every one of us has had to make decisions based on things that other people have little understanding of. I have long told our docs and "experts" that they know their field but they are NOT the expert on my child. I LIVE with the child, love him/her, and KNOW them as well or better than the doctor knows their field of expertise.

When push comes to shove, I trust my own judgment and even the wisdom of this board before I trust most of the docs. If my instincts say something and the doctor doesn't agree, well, the instincts win every time.

It really sounds like you are at or very close to the end of your rope. Do what you have to do. If the risperdal doesn't help then you really are going to need an out of home placement. She is already physically abusive and it can NOT be tolerated.

It may be that you will have to press domestic violence or assault charges on her. It will be hard to do, but it might open up a whole world of help to her and teh rest of you.

In the meantime I hope the medications help.

Hugs!

 

[Stella]

Grace upon Grace- yes I have told the whole team about the candle incident. They are very aware of all of her behaviours and I agree her lack of empathy can be very alarming. However she does have the ability to show empathy at times so it’s not non-existent.

If so, maybe if the medication gets her to a "reasonable and rational" point, the therapist can help

Klmo that’s exactly what I am trying to do. I am hoping that if the medications work she will get to a point where she will become a bit more rational and open to the therapy as at the moment she is very non compliant with everyone on her team. As regards me seeing a therapist I have been seeing one every week for the last 2 years and I find it is a great outlet to vent. I find I come up with some of my best ideas in the midsts of talking. I wouldn’t have kept sane this long without being able to talk, not just to my counsellor but to my few close friends who know the whole story. Talking about it really is what keeps me sane!

Idohope your difficult child sounds very like mine and if this strategy doesn’t work then the only other thing I can think of is an in-patient stay where they insist she take her medications. The only problem with that is there here in Ireland there are only 3 child psychiatric hospitals in the whole country and there are very few beds and very long waiting lists. It’s a farce! Last year I requested an in-patient stay for her but I was basically told there was no hope of that happening. I don’t know what she has to do before they consider her “bad enough” for an in-patient stay!!!

Susiestar as far as pressing charges go, I have actually called the police to my home before, explained the situation and asked them to talk to her which they did. They told me that I cannot press charges or do anything legally until she is 12 and she heard them say this. She has used this against me in the past and said” you can’t do anything until I’m 12”. I would definitely have no problems calling them when she turns 12 if she continues to trash my home.

As far as the medication taking is going, last night she pretended to take it with an Oscar winning performance! She scrunched up her face, cried that it tasted horrible etc etc. However, I was convinced that I caught a glimpse of a smirk on her face so when she left I inspected the room only to find the tablet crushed up on the floor. I really don’t know how she did it. I watched her take it!!! Anyway, I went straight outside and brought her in from playing with her friends and made her take another one in front of me and open her mouth after to prove she swallowed it. She cursed me and told me how much she hated me etc etc and that she knew what the tablets are “really for”. I told her well this is that the doctor has asked me to give her so I have to follow through on it and the doctor wouldn’t have prescribed them if she didn’t think she needed them. So, I’m pretty sure she does actually know what they’re for. I feel like I can’t go back on what I have said now though as that would just make matters worse. Also her psychiatrist is seeing this as a “2 week trial” so if they don’t work she won’t have to take them for too much longer.

Because of the incident last night I am not sure if she has really taken it the other two nights. I was trying to make the whole medications scenario too confrontational and trying to play it cool as the more insistent I am the more oppositional she becomes. However after this little incident last night I have no choice now but to stand over her while she takes it and make her prove to me that she has swallowed it each time. I anticipate a huge battle tonight but I need to follow through on this if it kills me!!!

Thank you all again for taking the time to reply to this. All your wisdom, experience and advice are invaluable.

Stella

 

[therese005us]

Stella, do they have a 'melting' form of thte medications your Daughter is taking? My son is non compliant with his medications too, so he's on an order now and has to have a risperdal consta needle. However, the equivalent in oral medication is a melting caplette. Like a host, it melts on the tongue straightaway.... just a thought.
You could maybe suggest to her, if she doesn't take the medications, the doctor might order something nastier - like a fortnightly needle??

 

[busywend]

Oh medication battles are NOT fun.

I do not think anyone was judging or crucifying you - I think they were just telling you what they were worrying about for you. Valid concerns. I do understand the single mom - have no where else to turn - feeling you have when it comes to parenting a difficult child. It certainly is hard when you have nobody to back you up.

My difficult children biggest complaint was that the medication changed the taste of the drink she took it with forever. When she first took the medications she took it with water. But, then she could never drink water during the day because all she could taste was the medication. Weird, huh? Imagine the battles I had when I was out of the specific drink she wanted to take her medications with that day - oh that specific drink changed all the time - not too specific, huh??!! But, it was never water again.

Flashbacks!

 

[klmno]

After reading some other responses, it made me wonder about a couple of things. 1) Are you sure it is the idea of taking medications at all or could it be something like hating to swallow a pill or the taste it leaves in her mouth? 2) Can you talk to the dr about getting something in a liquid form (I can't remember which one, but I think a couple of these medications come in liquid). Otherwise, the only thing I can think of is trying to hide the pill in something to sneak it down her, like we do our dogs.

I feel for you. Also, I wanted to add that when things are in crisis mode and I feel my son's or someone else's safety is at stake, yes, I would lie, and have lied, to get him to a psychiatric hospital or to a crisis center. Maybe that is similar to your current situation.

I'm also wondering if in-home therapy is an option for you and if it would help- if they have a type of therapy like this where you can call someone for help any time there is a crisis. And, if "arresting" her is out, do the courts have something like our CHINS where you can get court involvement to get backup for making a child comply with treatment?

 

[Stella]

oh I get relate to the specific drink that lol! difficult child took the medications up until now once she had her specific drink but last night she refused to take it no matter what i tried. She says she knows what it's really for and she's not taking it. Im worried now that she has missed one night...im going to try giving it to her now during the day so it will be a matter of her taking her or she doenst get to go out to play. I just have to check with psychiatrist that this is ok as it does say to be taken at night. So far there has been no change in her anyway but she is still on 0.25mg to be increased to 0.5 tonight so hopefully then i will start noticing a difference!

There is a liquid form but its very expensive about €100 per bottle and she pushes it away so many times that it ends up on the floor so it's a waste.

Klmno there are no services like those that you mentioned that i know of but i do have a very good friend who lives just aroudn the corner who actually works with kids on the spectrum so if things get really out of hand she can call around and help out. She's see in it all!

 

[TerryJ2]

So sorry I'm late to this.
Klmno, you beat me to it! I was thinking the same thing, that difficult child doesn't have a clue as to what her real condition is, but she's terrified that she might choke or just gag on the pills. IOW, once she learns how easy they are to take, she won't put on the show that the pills are for her behavior, etc.
It took a psychiatric hospital visit to get our difficult child to swallow pills and once he got home, it was a completely different world.
These kid overreact about everything. To them, smacking you across the face, breaking a chair, and breaking a window is no big deal, if it will get them out of taking a pill or doing a chore they don't want to do.
Also, kids are very clever at NOT taking pills. I love your description of your daughter's face, the sour look, etc., and then she never took it!
We found pills in my son's bedroom between the mattress and box spring; in the urns in the livingroom; in between the cushions on the couch, you name it. I think he swallowed only 50% of what he was given.

Best of luck! I feel for you.

 

[Stella]

Oh God I hear ya! I have found a few of them crushed up on the carpet now and some of them have miraculously gone missing. Like you Terry I have found them in bizzare places , even in between the seats of the car!!! Even though she takes them in front of me and i asked her to open her mouth afterwards i am convinced she is not actually swallowing them as there has been NO improvement in her behaviour, in fact if anything she seems a bit worse. I don't know how she is managing to fake taking them though as her mouth is empty when i asked her to open it. hmm....she's defintely up to something though...

 

[graceupongrace]

Even though she takes them in front of me and i asked her to open her mouth afterwards i am convinced she is not actually swallowing them as there has been NO improvement in her behaviour, in fact if anything she seems a bit worse.

Stella,

Given her pattern of behavior, she may not be swallowing them. However, I wouldn't expect to see positive behavior changes right away, either. Doctors usually start with a small dose and then gradually increase it until it reaches a therapeutic level. The first medication you try may not be effective at all for your difficult child, even at that level. Or it may be effective for a while, and then you'll need to try something else. Most of us here have been through many episodes of trial-and-error. And beyond that, the medications won't "cure" the behavior. They'll help, but there's a behavioral component that she will need to work on. Ideally, the medications will give her the ability to do that.

If she seems worse, let the doctor know.

I don't mean to discourage you. I just want you to have realistic expectations. It's a long journey. But you have lots of support here.

Hugs.

 

[TerryJ2]

How about if you give it to her, then tell her to stick her tongue out so you can see it on her tongue? We did that with-my difficult child for a while. If it was on the front of his tongue, he could easily hide it somewhere. If it was way back, it would sometimes go down by itself b4 he could take it out.
Just a thought.
Also, we occasionally still give our difficult child a treat after he's taken his pill. Do you offer your difficult child a reward?