I dont know anymore~

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by standswithcourage, Mar 15, 2008.

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  1. standswithcourage

    standswithcourage New Member

    I guess this thread is what it is = I dont know anymore! I got another letter from my difficult child today. He says it makes him sad that we wont let him come home! I understand that and it makes my heart hurt but why cant he see it is for his benefit too!!! I told him he had to prove with actions that he wants to change. It is a slow process and long recovery I know. I cant change it or cure it. I just want the best for him. I asked him what his goals were - they are always to havea a car, girlfriend, job, apartment, etc. never to get sober. I asked him why none of his goals were to get sober - I will see what he says. I hat always to second guess everything and not to believe anything. I read the book by David Sheff Beautiful boy. It is very good. It is all about his son on meth. His sons book is good too. I am surprised he is still alive. It just proves their is hope.
     
  2. Big Bad Kitty

    Big Bad Kitty lolcat

    Susan,

    Remember to put it into perspective.

    What he is calling "you not letting him come home" is REALLY "him having used up all his chances and you are not putting up with his **** anymore."

    You can also tell him that his goals are great, but he has to take the correct steps to get there. And your house is no longer one of those steps.

    Stay strong!
     
  3. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    What I see is that you are often asking "why". Even if he told you, you will never understand any more than he understands you and your reasons. The only person you need to understand is yourself. Is your reason for your choice good enough for you? If so, move on.
     
  4. Suz

    Suz (the future) MRS. GERE

    He's sad he can't come back home?

    Poor baby (dripping with sarcasm here)........NOT!

    To tag onto Witz's thoughts.........

    I stopped asking "why."

    Think about it- when did it pay off for you OR HIM to ask why?

    If he gives you an answer, it is probably baloney or a lie anyway, which only exascerbates your frustration and gets neither of you anywhere.

    It is what it is, Susan.

    You say in your post that you are looking for action, but from where I sit it appears that you are still asking for explanations and promises first. I would urge you to stop relying on "whys" and explanations and promises and expectations. Stop the lectures, stop the inquiries, and watch his next step.

    For right now, enjoy this Sunday with the rest of your family. :)

    Suz
     
  5. trinityroyal

    trinityroyal Well-Known Member

    Susan,

    Suz, Witz and BBK are right.

    Asking "why" is a mug's game.

    1) If you ask yourself why, you're not the one with the addiction, you're not the one who made the bad choices. You're never going to be able to answer the question because you don't know what's inside your son making him tick and making him do the things he does

    2) If you ask your difficult child why, you're opening the door for him to manipulate you. He will tell you whatever has the best shot of getting him what he wants. It might be a lie or it might be the truth, or it might be some combination of both. Doesn't matter, because the purpose of whatever he tells you is to make you do what he wants you to do.

    Until you show yourself some respect, your son never will. Please enjoy your time with the rest of your family, and let your difficult child figure out the life lessons that he has to learn.

    Take care of YOU,
    Trinity
     
  6. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I always go back to my daughter's warning, "Never trust a drug addict." She should know, she is one, now sober. I wouldn't even bother asking him why. I'd go by his actions. When he is sober, he can come home, without the long dialogs. He won't tell you the truth anyway. And remember that most adults his age don't live at home anymore anyway. You sheltered him in his childhood, but he's a man now, whether or not he wants to own that label. You don't have to explain anything to him.
     
  7. meowbunny

    meowbunny New Member

    A favorite test in philosophy is to ask "Why?" Nothing more. Those who answered with "why not?" or "because" or even "I don't know" passed. Those who wrote paragraphs and pages didn't. The reasoning was quite simple -- some things don't have an answer, at least not one that is acceptable to someone else.

    Asking an addict of any type "why" is not going to give you an answer you'd understand no matter how it is phrased. Deep down inside, I believe you know this. Now, you need to pull those inner resources out and listen to them. Quit asking. Live your life. Make your son live his.
     
  8. scent of cedar

    scent of cedar New Member

    Those "why" or "I feel rejected" or "how can you do this ~ that is why I do what I do" conversations always did me in too, Stands.

    It helped me to keep my focus on the long-term outcome. Once I had acknowledged that the root of the problem was not poor parenting but drug use, I was able to go back to that truth again and again. From that place where I could understand how it all started, I could stand up and remember why I needed to say no, or why I needed to interact with my son differently. It never feels like the right thing, and our son never once said "Oh! NOW I get it."

    It felt very lonely to interact with him in that way.

    But once I understood where the behaviors that were destroying my son were coming from, and once I realized that it hadn't been some failure on my part, I understood too that taking the positions I took relative to our son were the only possible ways I could help him see who he had become.

    Your son is so much more than the person whose choices led him to be where he is, Stands.

    That is what you need to draw strength from.

    That is what helped me to be strong ~ remembering who my son was before he changed, and believing in the man he will become if he can beat the addiction.

    The other thing that helped me ~ maybe the thing that helped the most ~ was to refuse to entertain the feelings attending any interaction with my son.

    I have posted about that before Stands ~ for me, that is the point where I began to be able to pick myself up emotionally.

    It helped me to remind myself that there were no easy answers and there were no short cuts, and that what was happening in our family was truly tragic.

    Somehow, thinking like that enabled me to give the pain its limits.

    And that enabled me to function despite the overwhelming pain.

    Wishing you well with this part, Stands.

    You know I believe you can do all that you need to, to see this thing through.

    Barbara
     
  9. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I never ask why anymore. Its futile. I think I actually understand why my kid does what he does. He is an idiot...no doubt about it. When I do say something to him its more of the stating of facts...which he may not like much. Even now when he is going to jail I dont ask him why he did all this BS. I simply say...gosh Im sorry you made all these bad choices, I feel badly for you.
     
  10. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    I thought about you and your situation last night for a while, Stands. To me, the two of you seem very co-dependent. I have asked before, but I don't think I ever got an answer - are you seeing a therapist? Your issues today are pretty much the same as they were when you first came here. The only real difference is that your son is in jail. Given the amount of time he's been in jail it is disheartening that you haven't made more movement away from your co-dependency.

    So, are you in therapy? You have some very real issues of your own that you should look at. You can't fix him. You can only fix yourself. I wonder if that is why you aren't in therapy - you would have to look at what it is in you that keeps this unhealthy relationship alive and feeding his addiction instead of wondering "why" he is the way he is. There's a lot - too much - of you involved in the why of him. He's 24 years old. It's not about him anymore, it's about you. If you're unhappy a lot of it is because of the choices you make about where your thoughts are - with him.
     
  11. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Susan,

    Please listen to Witz. We are NOT therapists here, but parents with kids or other family members with similar problems.

    YOU really need therapy to investigate WHY you are clinging to your co-dependent relationship with your difficult child.

    Please pick up Co-Dependent No More, go to AlAnon, and find a therapist skilled in working with codependency issues.

    Otherwise, you will still be asking the same questions in 10 years, and your difficult child will have taken over your life.

    We care, but we can't give you everything you need. If you have a therapist, please ask her about helping with CODEPENDENCY. It is important.

    Hugs,

    Susie
     
  12. Fran

    Fran Former Site Owner

    In my mind, he is where he is because he didn't learn from his parents how to live in the adult world. Now he is learning from those who are less tolerant. You did your job. Now you get to be a cheerleader when he makes good choices and progresses along on his life's journey.
     
  13. CrazyinVA

    CrazyinVA Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I agree.. the "why" question will drive you insane. There is no answer, not one that you can comprehend, anyway. You will never be able to convince him of your own "why's", either. And guess what? You don't have to convince him of anything. Spend your energy on fixing YOU, not him.
     
  14. standswithcourage

    standswithcourage New Member

    I understand. The codependency thing is a thing I try and work on all the time. I do go to Alanon and talk to those people. They say I have come a long way from the beginning. I know I have but there are days that I just want to huddle in the corner and wonder what went wrong. I am afraid for the future sometimes because I dont know what will happen but I know I cannot chose to go back to the past again. Thanks for helping.
     
  15. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    I honestly think that you need at least a few sessions with a professional to work on your co-dependency issues. Al-Anon is a good start, but the fear and anguish in your posts say that you need more than we or a support group can offer.
     
  16. CrazyinVA

    CrazyinVA Well-Known Member Staff Member

    The book "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie really helped me years ago, combined with seeing a great therapist who happened to be a substance abuse counselor. I would agree that one-on-one might give you more insight into your specific situation. Al-Anon helps us feel less alone, as do these boards, but they can only go so far.
     
  17. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    A long time ago I read a book called "Toxic Parents." THAT helped me A LOT. It made me realize I lived my own life through my kids. I don't remember the authors (Mitch and Laurie were the first names), but I still see it on shelves in the self-help/psychology section. It changed my outlook forever.
     
  18. Big Bad Kitty

    Big Bad Kitty lolcat

    MWM is right; "Toxis Parents" is another good book to read.

    And Witz is right too. AlAnon is a very good start.

    BUT...

    I also believe that you need some one-on-one WITH a PROFESSIONAL who went to SCHOOL to learn how to HELP people DEAL with these THINGS.

    So, answer me this. Would you be willing to do that? See a counsellor?
     
  19. standswithcourage

    standswithcourage New Member

    Yes - I have been seeing one but I missed an appointment and they charged me for it so I am going to pay $120.00 and go back!!! I need it. thanks
     
  20. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Glad you see the need for professional help. Have you seen a psychiatrist to see if maybe medications can help you break the cycle? It might be very helpful.

    It would be WORTH so much more than $120 to be free from the fear and anger. Please go back soon.

    Glad you are attending AlAnon. It is a wonderful thing.

    Hugs,

    Susie
     
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