Is this ok?

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by RN0441, Mar 29, 2016.

  1. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    My 20 year old son is at sober living in Florida and seems to be doing okay. Doing what is required of him, working etc. He has been there since March 16th. We text almost daily and have had a few brief conversations.

    He likes the place he is at and likes working but says "peeing in a cup is getting old" a few days ago during a phone conversation. When I put in my two cents he said he didn't like where this was going and wanted to get off the phone. I'm not sure why this upset me so much but I felt like it was a slap in the face somewhat since he is there because of his behaviors and bad decisions and he NEEDS to pee in the friggin cup! While I have been happy he is there and enjoying our peaceful home, I was up half the night thinking about the true meaning of what he said. Probably overthinking it I don't know.

    Hubby and I have a planned trip to Florida about 2.5 hour drive away from where he is the end of April. We plan to get up early, drive to see him, buy him a nice meal, look around, shop for anything he may need, whatever and go back to our condo 2.5 hours away the same day. He wants us to spend the night there and he can stay with us at a hotel so we can "do more stuff".

    We don't want to do this for a few reasons. It's expensive to stay in a hotel there; we want to keep the visit short and sweet. Sometimes he says or acts in ways that get me upset and I'm on vacation and don't need it. We like to have cocktails at night and won't in front of him right now. I think he needs to DO what he needs to DO and us being there overnight just not something I'm ready for until he really changes and who knows when, if ever that will be. As it stands right now I told him his dad will check hotel prices.

    Since that conversation, we have decided we just don't want to stay overnight. I feel some guilt for this and just wondered what others think. Is this rejecting him? I don't want him to feel badly because he is trying it seems. It just all feels icky.
  2. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    That alone is reason enough to say no. You get to choose how you spend your money.

    You have the right to boundaries. You don't have to put yourself in the situation where you know the chances are higher of him upsetting you.

    His life isn't your life, and your life isn't his life. You need to be at liberty to do the things that are YOUR life.

    Sounds like an honest assessment to me.

    Red flag. BIG red flag.
    Why would HE need to be staying there with YOU? He isn't a little kid. He has a place to stay. If you were to stay in a hotel at all, it would be for YOUR comfort. NOT so he can "do more stuff"... a.k.a. drink or do drugs.

    Just my opinion, but I think your gut feel is right. Don't say overnight.
  3. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    If he is afraid to pee in a cup,which is no big deal, and if it were my child, id think he was hiding drug use. Why else would it bother him? I would think he is trying to get out of not using. As one who had a drug user, relapse is common and drug users are sneaky. My two cents? I think youll be sorry if you get involved in his treatment in any way. He probably will go out and use if you let him stay with you. Thats sadly what they do. Been fooled myself.

    I hope he is trying. Always be leery of a drug user. He is not your boss. You are his parents. You decide what you do during the visit. If you put your son in charge or if you seem wishy washy or act guilty, you will harm his hopeful recover. Best to stay home than to give your son so much control. I feel they need us to stand strong, like a brick wall, not cave in to their demands.

    I do wish him...and you...all the luck in the world. Hugs.
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    Last edited: Mar 29, 2016
  4. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Thanks ladies.

    He isn't afraid of the peeing but I think he doesn't like not to be trusted and he shouldn't be trusted yet.

    He said he has no desire to use drugs or alcohol at all. He is much happier in his new environment and working and being around people his own age that are trying to do something with their life. He wants to work and go to school and get on track. I have no reason to believe he isn't being truthful about having goals now. He cannot hide drug use trust me. It takes him over. He isn't able to do that if he wanted to.
  5. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Maybe. Maybe not. Id be leery. He, and all drug users, shouldnt be trusted. Their own bad choices make them have to pee in cups. If it were my kid I probably would have said, "well.thats too bad." That would not make me feel badly at all. You earn trust back and it can take years.
  6. mybleedingheart

    mybleedingheart New Member

    Keep your clear boundaries but with love just say no that won't happen this time xx
  7. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    SWOT Oh I did say too bad trust me!! I don't care that he doesn't like to pee in a cup at all. He also does a breathalyzer every night. Good accountability!
  8. toughlovin

    toughlovin Well-Known Member

    I think you are smart to keep the visit short....the complaining about peeing in a cup is a red flag..... And the wanting to hang out in the hotel with you is also questionable. It may all be ok.... But stay wary.
  9. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I have always found if I end up doing something that I don't really want to do just to make my daughter happy, I end up resenting it and her. Being upset and resentful is no way to spend a vacation.

    Sticking to your boundaries is really important right now since he is testing you to see if you can still be manipulated.

    Just my take on it.

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  10. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    I almost think a visit end of April is too soon. Not a great idea. He will be less than 2 mos. in sober house. I'd be concerned that a visit with you 2 could somehow not turn out great...upset him, or somehow upset the apple cart (-->him being sober, moving forward)? Where he might want to self-medicate?

    I don't know, maybe I'm projecting as this is something I could see my own son doing, (I seem to always upset him[emoji30], somehow, no matter HOW hard I try!) and maybe it's totally not something your son would do. In that case, ignore this:).

    Long story short? Being that he hasn't been sober long, I would worry that somehow the visit would upset him and then he would think about using again and I would not want to in any way contribute to that. But again my son is VERY reactive to me, maybe yours is not. Thus no worries for you:).

    And I agree with the others- having him sleep over in hotel is a bad idea. A decent hotel in Boynton or Delray will cost you, at minimum, 125/night.
  11. GoingNorth

    GoingNorth Crazy Cat Lady

    I'm not a drug abuser, but I am dependent on 2 kinds of benzo. It is critically important that my usage not increase, nor my schedule change.

    I had to sign a controlled subtances contract with my psychiatrist who keeps track of ALL the controlled substances I take, such a the tramadol I take for back and neck pain.

    I just got called in to pee in the cup. Got busted for having lower levels of one benzo than I should've, and NONE of the other benzo. The reason was that my BFF who died back in Dec's wife was dying of bone and liver cancer. (she passed Sunday AM) and I wasn't taking the benzos as prescribed because I was doing a lot of driving. I missed a dose of one completely, which I didn't realize until I started to go into withdrawal.

    Anyway, I got chewed out, and had to go home and bring my pill bottles in to have the pills counted to make sure the proper amount were there making allowances for the missed doses.

    I've been taking these medications for many years and this is the first time I've had to go through the whole "druggie" rigmarole. I don't like it, but I see why they're doing it.

    I'm using county services here, and a high percentage of patients are addicts. According to my psychiatrist, I am one of the very few patients she would consider prescribing benzos to for 30 days at a time. Usually, if she prescribes, she prescribes one-day pickup, where you go to the pharmacy once a day and pick up that day's doses.
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  12. Ohemgee

    Ohemgee New Member

    Well done for sharing and being honest addiction is hard
  13. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    This was a vacation planned and paid for well before my son ended up in Florida. I had NO CLUE at that time he'd ever end up in sober living in Florida. If you had told me that, I wouldn't have believed it! Mainly because the thought of our son not living at home with us was just so foreign and did not seem possible. I have a different mindset now thankfully.

    We wouldn't think of not seeing him for a short visit when we are there. He is actually in intensive outpatient at this point and goes 3 days per week which they organize. I probably won't see him again until Thanksgiving (I don't get a lot of vacation time) and my husband will drive down there to get him into the dorm in Fort Myers in August if all goes as planned.

    We have always been very close to our son. He is the result of our union although we both have another son from our former marriage. I think he wants to show us how good he's doing. He couldn't wait to tell us about his job when he got it and I want to ride that positive wave for this visit too. He does not want to be home which is good. He misses us and the dogs but doesn't really seem to be homesick at all. It would be awful if he was.

    GoingNorth thanks for sharing. I think that is very responsible for your doctor to prescribe one day at a time to most. My son is on Effexor and says it helps but obviously nothing works as well and fast as a benzo but he knows he cannot handle them and that is his weakness and his battle. I can't stop him; he has to stop himself.
  14. New Leaf

    New Leaf Well-Known Member

    RN, Been following along and reading through your thread. I don't have any experience with the whole rehab, or sober living thing with my two (still hoping). I was thinking about this.....
    .......Thinking that what 20 year old wants to be told anything, monitored, or whatever?
    He is there.
    Hopefully he is successful this time.

    I think it is good advice to go by your gut instincts and not spend the night.
    You know your situation with your son the best.

    Coming from my perspective with my two who are repulsed and cringe at the idea of rehab or sober living, he is in a good place right now.
    Perhaps you are the only one he can vent to about peeing in a cup?
    At least, he is not complaining about other things?
    At least, he is saying that he wants to be clean.
    Maybe I am naive, but I think that thinking positively and speaking that way is important.
    It must be an incredibly hard journey he is on now, a new place, new people, resisting cravings and so much more.

    I am proud of him.

    I would hate peeing in a cup all the time too.

    Maybe I am silly, but trying to think like a 20 year old who has been abusing substances off and on, who wants to be clean and the biggest complaint he has is peeing in a cup.

    I think what he probably needs to hear is how much faith his mom and dad have in him and how glad you are he is there and trying and that he can do this.
    One step, one day at a time, just like his parents are.
    That's just my opinion.

    I am thinking about Viktor Frankls Ted talk about raising the bar, projecting in our minds and thoughts not man as he is, but what his potential is.

    For all of us.

    So your son has the opportunity to change his life around, and you have the opportunity as his parents to work at lovingly detaching, living your own lives, fulfilling your dreams no matter what the outcome.
    Isn't it just simply amazing at how things turn out at times? And here you are.

    These are all good things. I think you have much to look forward to RN. I am glad for you and your son and sending up prayers that things continue to be good. I think it is wonderful to think positively and ride that positive wave.
    That is faith.
    Keep the faith and hope, and continue to build yourselves up for whatever may come.
  15. GoingNorth

    GoingNorth Crazy Cat Lady

    RN, My dependence is courtesy of an idiot shrink who either didn't know or didn't care that benzos are only supposed to be prescribed for short term use.

    He put me on them for sleep and anxiety. My dose never increased, nor did my frequency of use while under his care.

    I didn't realize I was dependent until I was talking to my new psychiatrist and mentioned that I was having panic attacks about7 hours after taking the lorazepam.

    She informed me that those weren't panic attacks, they were withdrawal.

    I was furious, especially as benzo withdrawal can be lethal and can take two YEARS or more. We have not decided at this point whether I will just stay on benzos for the time being, or if we will try to do a long, slow taper. I'd like to be off the medications, but I also don't want to lose my marbles during withdrawal, which is an actual possibility.

    by the way, I am not considered an addict because I don't crave the drugs. I'm in the same boat as an opioid user who becomes dependent on Vicodin or Percocet after having been prescribed it, except that, for some reason, I never progressed to abuse of my drugs.
  16. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    I'm so sorry, GoingNorth! That doesn't sound fun. I have taken xanax in the past, for sleep actually, not really anxiety (it makes me so tired). But, the times I have taken it for several nights in a row...I noticed on the next day that I had NOT taken it the night before, I was really, really, really mean and irritable. After this happening several times, in the same order....I tied the crazy mood change to the xanax. I guess my body was wanting another dose? I'm scared of the stuff now.

    I hope that your psychiatric and you, find the best solution for you! ;)

    RN0441- I am so happy to read that your son is doing well! Are you getting any type of phone updates from son's counselor or house manager? Or, since he's an adult, maybe that doesn't happen....not sure, but curious.
    How does he get to his job? Does he have independent freedom all day, but only with a curfew?

    I bet as end of April comes, you will be getting excited to see him! :thumbsup:
  17. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Leafy your post made me cry. Thanks for letting me have hope.

    GoingNorth; my son was prescribed benzos in high school (age 15 the start of our "nightmare") after being in rehab for weed which he was using to self medicate his anxiety. I know he does have horrible social anxiety; have seen it. I was so naive. Had no clue about drugs at all. He immediately abused them. I hid it, locked it up, he'd find it. Oh what I went through with those damned pills. The only thing I didn't do is put it up my butt to hide it (that's a joke but true). He found it no matter what I did. It was insane.

    The doctor kept giving it to him when he'd promise he would do better and said they helped and I like a dummy I did too. Finally stopped that madness. We then forbade them but he did get a hold of them 2x in the past 2 years and went on a binge each time. Luckily not frequent but he is now not in our home due to last binge and him being 20. He had to go to detox for a few days each time but was okay. Some doctors since have said they would never give anyone that drug period. I agree now but I am now an educated mom!

    So good you never abused. Not sure what made him abuse. A bad gene? I don't know.
  18. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Rebelson - he walks to work. It is only 1/2 mile. He has breathalyzer test each night and urine test 2 or 3 times per week. He has 3 all day intensive outpatient meetings to attend per week (either day or night depending on work schedule) and a few groups that he is required to go to weekly. There is a lot of accountability but they have freedom too. I think a perfect mix. He has to be able to "live" without the pills.

    He's a homebody type really (like my husband) so never stays out late. Seven of the boys went to see a movie on Easter and the facility paid for it. They are just great there. I'm so relieved.

    I have been in touch with his house manager 3x since he's been (March 16) there and gotten good reports. He said my son is very polite and quiet but he is now becoming more outgoing and making friends. All good. I don't want to be a helicopter mom so trying not to bombard they guy but he is really sweet. LOL
  19. so ready to live

    so ready to live Active Member

    Hi RN.
    I so agree with Leafy-gosh he's 20=they know everything;)...and if not, sounds like he's still in the best environment for him at this time. Trying to figure out the true meaning of what he said (for half the night) is what many of our nights are made of, isn't it? ...and yet if sleepless nights "figured it out" none of us would be here.

    It sounds like a good plan to only go for the day. It really seems like that is your desire. You can see him, touch base but on your terms. This will keep you much less likely to become entangled.... need a vacation. I'm afraid taking him overnight would leave you sleeping with one eye open to "monitor him" or worse yet, if he again "doesn't like where the conversation is going", then you are stuck with him in a hotel room. That stress does not resemble vacation. I am so very hopeful for your son, may he "make it" out of the darkness this time. Have a peaceful vacation. Prayers.
  20. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Please be aware that effexor can cause really weird things for some people. It starts after the first dose increase if it is going to be a problem. MANY docs don't listen if you complain because the thimg are really odd. Brain zaps, social anxiety sometimes to the point of agoraphobia, and more. The brain zaps are feeling like you are getting an electric shock inside your brain. Sometimes you feel like your brain is still moving after your head stops if you turn your head. I don't think everyone gets it but my doctor laughed at me when I complained. I got a new doctor and off that medication because I was curling up in a closet for most of the day. I have NEVER been afraid of leaving my house but i was on that medication.

    I do think he is trying to manipulate you and you should do what YOU want not what he wants. He has not yet EARNED a vacation, has he?