It didnt take long....

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by toughlovin, Feb 13, 2012.

  1. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    Hi all,

    Well it didn't take long for my son to now be kicked out of the down and out sober house!!! You all knew this was coming and I did too.... although I thought it wouldn't happen until Wednesday. And of course my son conned me again... he texted me this morning asking me to text him when I had added money to the grocery card. I took the sober house guys advice and only put $25 on and texted him that and said I would put the rest on it on Thursday assuming he was clean. Well then I got a call from the sober house guy.... they found paraphanalia, and some spice in his things. He has been converting the grocery card to a shell station card (where I bet he can buy spice even though it is illegal there). And he has been stealing others food!!! So he is out of there. Sigh. I told the guy no way are we paying for another sober house. At this point we will only help him with treatment. Oh and he told the sober house guy he is not an addict!!! Really??? Come on you have now been kicked out of 3 sober houses because of using!!!!

    So I felt resolved not to help him out at all until he really wants treatment. I did check with the grocery store hoping I could put a stop to that $25... but it was too late. So I feel conned and taken advantage of once again. I am so fed up and disgusted and wishing I had gotten tougher sooner!!!! However I remind myself we all have to go through this process our own way. My husband is there with me. So we are resolved to just let him live on the street even though our big fear is he won't make it.

    I was thinking about abandonment issues. I think these are particularly acute for adopted kids... and for us parents. I am so aware of the issues of abandonment that i am bending way over backwards for him not to feel abandoned!!! Over doing it I am sure.

    So the sober house guy told me he would have another guy at yet another tx center call me. And he did.... he himself was an addict and also lost a brother to addiction... which of course scares me.. and he commented that spice can kill you. Great!! Anyway i did look up the program on the internet and it looks like a good program and given that it is the start of the year maybe our insurance would cover it.

    Anyway I gave him my sons number and he is going to call him. I figure I am not setting up anything for difficult child... but I will give his number out and maybe if he gets desperate enough he will listen to this guy. Who knows.

    So that is where we are at.... I suspect we wont hear from difficult child until he is going into treatment. Wonder how long that will take?

    I am ok... trying to hold it together for the sake of my daughter right now.

  2. Signorina

    Signorina Guest

    Oh sweetie, I am so so sorry.

    I can't think of anything helpful or otherwise to say - I just ache for you and I pray for you both.

    and please stop thinking of abandonment issues and try to stop searching for a reason why ... you won't find one. And it hurts and it will only make you hurt more. Hold on tight to your daughter and your h and the love you have for each other.

    a million hugs {{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}
  3. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member


    I am very sorry. But I hear you getting stronger and that's good. Yes you now understand that there is no possible way you can give him any money because it goes straight to drugs and he will lie faster than you can blink your eyes. You did the right thing by checking into the treatment center and having them contact him. They will listen to their own before they listen to us and even if he isn't ready now he will have the contact.

    I am so with you on abandonment issues and I know a lot of my difficult child's struggles are because of the adoption. Just look at how many on their board have adopted their difficult children. I have a lot of thoughts on this but that is for another time.

    Spice does kill, it is far more dangerous than pot. I hope and pray your difficult child reaches out for help.

    But in the meantime stay strong. I sense you have finally decided enough is enough.

  4. Calamity Jane

    Calamity Jane Well-Known Member

    I'm so sorry for your troubles. This is the first I've ever heard that a grocery card can be exchanged for a Shell card. I give my son grocery cards, thinking he will use them as intended. How stupid of me! If they could only use their resourcefulness in a non-bizarre way, it would be a marvelous thing.
    I hear you when you write about adoption and abandonment issues. My husband has a real hangup about that, and I think that's why he's given him a pass every time, because husband says we need to "walk a mile in his shoes." I disagree, but my husband says we weren't adopted, so we can't truly understand where difficult children coming from. on the other hand, my son has ALWAYS said he never felt abandoned, and never felt that we weren't his family. difficult children therapist said he has seen countless adoption/SA issues due to abandonment issues that may be repressed, but my son said it was bunk. Go figure.
    In my son's case, this may sound odd, but I think he finds decency and clean living boring. He despises authority, and I believe he gets a kick out of conning people, esp. family. Where that comes from, I have no idea.
    We continue to try to detach, but like Michael Corleone says in the Godfather, "Every time I think I'm out, they keep pulling me back in."
  5. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    Yes Nancy I have reached that enough is enough stage. I am done until he gets treatment. I did text him today to let him know we are done paying for sober houses... he didn't get the text... I wonder if he somehow blocks me but anyway I have decided I wont text him again. I will wait to hear from him and know it may be awhile. I bet he has found some druggies to hang out with for awhile.

    Jane your son and my son sound very similar. My son has always worked to get around or break the rules, all rules everywhere... and he also has major issues with authority. He will be very charming and likeablel to authority and then do something to break the rules where it is not always obvious. I don't think he sees anything wrong with stealing what he wants when he wants it.... If he doesnt go for tx it probably wont be long until he is arrested. And he is far away from us so there is no question of us posting bail and going to pick him up.

    I do think however that adoption issues are big for him although I am not sure he is very in touch with those feelings.

    Who knows... in many ways i don't really feel I know my son. I know the little boy who was a challenge but also wonderful.... this young man I really dont know and to be honest don't like very much either.

    I cant tell you how much all of your support and solidarity means to me, This board is an emotional life saver for me.

  6. AmericanGirl

    AmericanGirl Guest


    I am so very sorry. Praying this will help him get to the point where he realizes he has a problem.

    Please don't be hard on yourself. You thought you were giving him money for food. If you knew this was a possibility, you wouldn't have done it. There is no way we can predict every possibility....especially with addicts. They are cunning and clever.

    They banned spice last year in my state. The stories about it are awful. Before all this with difficult child stated, I went to a seminar held by the ATF people. I'm glad you realize the seriousness of this substance even though I know it terrifies you.

    The book I just posted about is really helping me. Setting Boundaries with Your Adult Children. Although you are past the stage of deciding what to do, if you are spiritually inclined, it helps to find some peace with the process.

    Glad you have found an option for him. Praying he accepts.
  7. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    At this point, I don't even think I'd mention the ",,,except for treatment" in re to not helping him. It floors me because although I haven't kept up with you and your son completely, I really thought he was on the right track- but now it appears he's letting you pay for these places just so he won't be sleeping on the street. If he turned around in 2 days and said "well, ok, I'll go to inpatient rehab or detox", I wouldn't believe that he'd be going because he really wants to change....but that's just me. Maybe I'm just angry and feeling betrayed with you and for you.
  8. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Well, the worst has happened and now you have to deal with it. For me, it was a relief when that happened because I finally knew what I was dealing with and could go from there.

    i think you are handling this perfectly. If he turns down rehab, then he is on his own. At least you know that he has a place to go when he is ready.

    You have given him chances over and over again. It's his turn now to deal with his drug problem. The first step is when he admits he has a problem and it is evident that he is not there yet. I know that you are worried about him and I can't promise that nothing bad will happen but I have found that our difficult child's are survivors.

    {{{Hugs}}} to your entire family.

  9. Mama Raygun

    Mama Raygun New Member

    Jane, what you said about clean life being too boring doesn't sound odd at all, infact it is spot on. That was something I used to say all the time before I got clean. Unfortunately addicts are addicted to the lifestyle just as much as the drug. There is a lot of thrill and excitement with living on the edge like that. At Least in the beginning, eventually you get worn out and exhausted.
  10. buddy

    buddy New Member

    Thinking of you TL, I am so sorry this happened....
  11. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    Thanks all. Well it didn't take long for him to call us. LOL. So he called and gave us a similar story as last time.. he hasn't been smoking, they didn't drug test him, the problem was he and the house manager "clashed". God you want to believe him but I am past that, I just don't. We basically said this is the 3rd sober house you have been kicked out of, we can't do this anymore.... so we are not willing to pay for another sober house. At this point the only thing we will help with is treatment! He mumbled something and hung up on us.... which is what he does when he knows he has to stay polite but doesn't like what we say.

    Kimno.... I kind of had the same thought as you until I talked to this guy at the tx center... he scared me both about spice and the fact that his brother died... and of course the whole Whitney Houston thing has gotten to me too. And there are people who finally get it when they go to tx even when they don't want to go.

    If he goes to tx now it wont be because he wants treatment it will be because he has no other place to go... however if it is a 90 day program (which I am hoping for) and some extended options. I really think at this point he needs longer tx than 30 days.

    Anyway I give him a day or two at the most and then my guess is he will go to tx.... lets hope it rains down there tonight. LOL.... is that awful of me or what?

    My husband did mention tonight that spice can kill you and difficult child said well some people have siezed but it is very unusual. Great so he knows the risks and keeps doing it anyways.

    While I was writing this he texted me and asked "how long in treatment?". I said "Whats it going to take? 90 days?" So now is he going to start bargaining about that?

    Well this is live... his response was "A week?'. OMG really? So I just said I didn't think a week would make any difference and maybe he needs to be on the street for awhile before he is serious about getting help.

  12. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    My difficult child went into rehab because she had nowhere else to go and went in saying that she didn't have a problem and came out calling herself an addict. Of course, the jury is out about my difficult child but my point is that some people do "get it" while in treatment even if they go in under duress.

  13. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    You are doing well. He may try to bargain but your party line is however long it takes. And you are right, at least 90 days in rehab and then to 1/2 house. And you are right, they dont have to want help to get helped. I just read that today, it's not true that they have to want it. Addicts get helped all the time even if they are forced by families or courts.

    It's good that he is talking even if he thinks he can bargain.

  14. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    I hear you TL- and in all honesty, if it was my son I'd probably do the same as you. I just had an angry reaction when I first read this thread because I'd beleieved in him and I felt duped, too. I wouldn't be able to handle my son living on a street - although there was a night he snuck out of the hous at 13 (I think) and around 1:30am, I locked the doors and woke up at 6:00 to find him on the front porch and saying he'd slept in the doghouse in a friend's backyard. Yeah- he was in the doghouse alright but my heart still aches that he spent the night that way. It's such a fine line when they are in the age group of transitioning from the older teen years to adulthood.
  15. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    Well we are continuing to have a good text convo.... I told him I didn't want to argue about the length of time because to me that is really not the issue. So we are getting a bit deeper into the issue... he seems to feel it is about being away from home (and the girlfriend I bet) and I am pointing out to him that something would have caused him pain here, and when he is in pain he turns to drugs. Until he does the hard work of dealing with his pain this stuff will keep happening.

    He doesnt seem to get it though.. he is now telling himself it would have been different if he had stayed here... and yet here he ended up in the hospital, went back and used...

    At least we are having a good conversation... thats a start.

  16. exhausted

    exhausted Active Member

    TL, this is tough. You are doing all the right things. It would not matter what you had done about the card-they have ways of getting what they want. And yes, living on the edge is a part of the appeal. My difficult child loves the drama of the edge. She isnt alive unless she is gaming, scheming, or doing something to break a rule. Our lives are just too boring. Have I heard that over and over?

    I'm glad he is talking. And yes no matter how he goes in, there is a chance that it will make a difference. Thinking of you. ((Hugs))
  17. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    Well I guess he didn't like the last thing i said because he has stopped responding. Oh well at least we were able to have the conversation. It amazes me though how easily he can get my head swirling and me doubting myself!!! He is a master at that. So now he is making it sound like being out of state and away from the area is the problem... and somehow I feel he is implying this is my fault. (He did not say that). And that if only he could come back things would be ok. (I know that is not true). Anyway he is obviously doing the if onlys and he is headed me on that path too.... which I just have to stop. It is what it is and he needs to figure it out.

    And you know the confounded thing, which I can't bring up or he will really shut me down, is that it is the darned girlfriend. When he first went down there she had dumped him and so he knew and wanted to be away from her... but now they are on again off again and so he wants to be back up here. I wish she would just break up with him once and for all!!!!!! Darn her. He doesn't know I have that one figured out by looking at the phone records.

    And of course all of that junk is just obsucring the fact that the kid whenever he has a hard time turns to drugs...

    That is the issue I need to keep focusing on... because really if you are a drug addict not in recovery, it doesn't matter where you are you will still be a drug addict... and it will still get you into trouble.

  18. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    Most importantly I want you to know that I'm thinking about you and hoping for the best. I had to smile reading the thread. Would any one of us choose to be friends with our difficult child's if we just met them in the world? Sadly, and with a resigned smile on my face, I have to say "I don't think so." As strangers we might find them attrractive or funny or in rare cases bright but ... friends? No way. Everyone knows how much I love difficult child#1 but realistically...I like people who have goals, work hard, are honest etc. and also fun. For some reason I never consciously thought about it until this thread. LOL! I would avoid "my baby" like the you know whattin plague :) if he wasn't "my baby". Bet most of you feel the same way.

  19. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    TL, difficult child's are masters of manipulation. They can twist us in knots and that is exactly what your son is trying to do. He would be using drugs wherever he was. Don't fall for it. If he wants to come back, he can find a job, earn some money, and move back. The problem is that he can't do that because he isn't sober.

    So, the alternative is go to rehab, get clean, then get a job and move back. Tell him 90 days minimum if you can afford it. No negotiations. Period. He really isn't in a position to negotiate.

    Stay strong.

  20. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    Thanks Kathy...... now he is focusing on having had to go to detox when he didn't "need" to detox. All of this of course is being done TO him. I just told him the issue is he keeps using even though the consequences of doing so are serious. I think actually in our conversation I am dong a good job staying on focus and trying to keep pointing out the issue of his using despite the problems it is causing him.

    Hopefully this convo is making him think too.