TEACHer needs help...


New Member
I copied and pasted all my other posts from another section...

Any suggestions for an extreme case of conduct disorder with ADHD??

Yes, this child has an IEP. He has been in BD for two years. This is my first teaching job... I'm fresh out of college. The parents are not helpful at all. They do not want to give medication or any type of outside service help. They believe that there is not a problem. I had him evaluated again because of his extreme behavior. I really want to help this child. I will try reading that book... The Explosive Child...

He is ten years old.

He shouts and yells at anything you ask him to do or just anything... He hits and kicks at desks and chairs... Throws his papers across the room... At times he has taken off his shoes and launched them at me... Thrown a couple of chairs... He has broken my window in my room...

He is on a detailed IEP and behavior plan but everything I try does not work... Right now I am using an incentive chart that he can earn points for things that he likes to do... Like line leader, reading to the 1st grades, clean the boards, and on Friday if he has enough points I have a box with special toys that I know he likes in it that he can have but I still get this aggressive and hostile behavior.

I only have two students in my room and a couple that have improved enough to stay in a regular class all day long..

I just do not know what else to try...

Wow! Thanks guys...

I will try breaking down the work. He is a really smart boy but he really has problems. He has been diagnosed with ADHD, conduct-mood disorder, and extreme depression. When I had him reevaluated, the MD, I guess he really threw a fit in the MD's office because he now has to go to the psychiatrist at Prestera once a month- mandatory. I have not got the formal report but she fax me some stuff- like he has zero authority or respect for women.

I know that he has a terrible home life. His mother left when he was like in 2nd grade because of domestic violence. (Any relation to the MD's comment above??) His grandparents are not together because of the same problems. He watches movies and plays video games that are not for a child of his age. (Halo, South Park, Beerfest...)

I know that I am young but I cannot believe what this child has been through and seen at his age. I just wish that his father would open his eyes to the situation.

I have been teaching out of the Behavioral Survival Guide and Ways To Tame Your Temper. And I try to talk to him about things... but... his child tells wild tall tales. Everything that comes out of this child's mouth is not true. I have called him out on it before and he really thinks his stories are true. It is scary.

I don't know....



I gather that you received replies on some other thread??? I have been out of town and haven't read the General Board for a week or more...

I used to train ED/BD teachers. It takes a certain type of non-confrontational person who has no investment in "winning" to teach kids such as you describe. Reading The Explosive Child is a good idea in my opinion. It is written for parents and is somewhat negative toward school demands--particularly homework, but if you understand the concepts, it will help you stay out of power struggles.

Another reference that I use with my current grad. students is Life Space Crisis Intervention by N. Long, et al. This procedure is very suitable for use in schools and provides a template for de-escalating kids in crisis. The book is very clear but it usually requires instruction and supervised practice to use these techniques effectively. However just reading the book would be helpful I think.

I don't get what you mean when you say you asked for a "reevaluation." Legally, this should be an IEP team decision and unless the parent has signed an explicit release, the psychiatrist should not be talking, let alone faxing information to you.

I am neither pro or anti medication. I know that some schools push parents toward medications that are unwarranted and there are other parents who refuse medications that most people would at least give a trial. However, the 2004 revision to IDEA explicitly forbids schools from requiring parents to authorize medications as a condition of school attendance. That provision may not be in every child's best interest but that fact that it was written into law is clear evidence of the direction that the pressure is coming from.

Please remember that this boy did not choose his family life. Some parents are not doing a good job. Many parents on this site have been trying for years to help their child but are still blamed for their child’s problems. This is a sensitive topic here.

It is very important in my opinion to suspend judgment and remember that this little boy goes home to live in a situation you would not create for your (future, I assume) children and a situation I would not have created for mine. However, he cannot change that--all you have to work with is your time with him, and I commend you for trying so hard to help him.



New Member
Martie, thank you for saying what I id not know how (been trying to think how all day) and doing it so well.
Thank you Teach for wanting to help, and bless this little boy.


In case you didn't find it, there is a thread in the archives entitled "ODD in the classroom / "Handout for Teachers and Administrators."


New Member
I do not know if they still have it but Children and Adolescent Bipolar Foundation used to have something on their site about ? educating those with bipolar? I am no longer sure of their url, becuz it has changed. You could google it and check?


New Member
I should have explained more on the evaluation...

The boy was out in in school susp. for a violating the safe schools act because he brought a weapon to school. He is in in school susp. for 10 days, which was in my room. I had another teacher though to help. In that he could return to my room, BD room, he would have to have a psychiatric. evaluation paid from the school. That is why I got a copy of all the work. We had an emergecy IEP meeting with everyone to determine what should be done...

I am really not for medication either... I am undecided about it. I did have one sweet child who was a terror when he was not on medication but when he was on medications... My words cannot describe how wonderful he was... But I saw the down side also.. When on medications he would not eat or go to the bathroom ...

But anyways.. To add to the drama.. My child got kicked off the bus yesterday because of a fight, then in his rage of anger... hit my aid...

I really pray that I or anyone can help this child. He is so smart and just wonderful when he is not angry...



As a parent of 3 special needs boys not only do I commend you for what you're trying to do with this child but I have to say that this child is too far gone to be in a mainstream public school setting. Many hospital shave what is called a partial day program. The children are in this program from something like 9 to 5. They get their education in this setting from qualified Special Education teachers. Also in this setting are therapists, aides to restrain violent children (so they don't hurt themselves or others), quiet rooms (aka padded rooms) to give the child a chance to regain composure in a safe room, psychiatrists, nurses to administer medications, etc. The point of this is to give the medical people a chance to observe this child for a period of time. They can then recommend something to help the child. What I am saying is that this child is too far past any chance for you to make an impact. He needs a psychology/ psychiatry environment, not an educational one right now. Think of it as a child with diabetes (my favorite illness to compare to mental illness). If a child is in diabetic shock, or has sugar levels varying significantly frequently, the child is not ready to listen to academics or to learn. The child needs to have the medical condition stabilized before he/she can learn from the best teacher in the world.

As I said in the other post, best you can do for him educationally is to learn more techniques to handle him and to request a FBA and BIP. But in my humble opinion the best teacher in the world doesn't have the skills to handle a child this ill. And I still believe what I said in the other post about safety.

I understand that the parent doesn't see that this child's future, if he isn't killed in gang violence or OD's from self-medicating with drugs and alcohol is prison. I have a son with the same prognosis who has been receiving treatment 24/7 for 4 years with no change in prognosis. Though thankfully, mine has no interest in guns, knives, gangs or anything else of that nature. But my head is not buried in sand. Reemeber that to us as parents, to admit that our child is ill is to either acknowledge that we are a lousy parent or to admit that we also are mentally ill. Thus why so many parents live on that river in Egypt. You cannot change that. But what you can do is get the child some help in one of two ways.

First, you are a mandated reporter. If you believe that this child is being neglected you are legally obligated to call child services. While it is something of a gray area to some people, for those of us knowledgable of mental illness, to let this child go untreated is medical neglect.

Second option you have is to have this child transported by the police to a psychiatric ER for evaluation when he explodes and is violent. There are two sub categories here. One is that you call police to file assault charges against the child yourself based on physically assaulting you. You can do this at any time. The best time though is in mid-rage. The police will not deal with a child like this, they will take him to the ER. Second sub-category is to call police and ask for assistance controlling a violent child. Again, a mainstream school is not responsible for restraining a child who is violent. The correct protocol is to call the police because it is an unsafe condition.

I wish you well in whatever you choose to do. I pray that someone intervenes in this child's life in time to change his fate.


New Member
Thank you so much for your support..

I totally understand the situation when you were talking about the parental situation.. I, myself, feel like I am failing as a teacher because I cannot truly do anything with this child. So I can see the parents side of the story also..

Again.... Thanks... It is nice to chat with someone that can see both sides of the story.. I feel a little better already..



YOU are not the problem here. We know that just because you're trying, you reached out, on your own time, etc. Sure, none of us are perfect and we can all improve and learn new things. But from what you have said this child needs more help than an educational setting can provide, and the SD is not being fair to you to put you in this position.

Just take one day at a time and do the best you can. You can't move mountains and you may not be able to make the parent see what is clear to outside eyes. Keep researching and trying new things. Do the best you can to get help from your superiors. Remember that you can't save every kid, no matter how hard you try. Only you can choose how to procede, we've given you some ideas. There is no right answer here.

Dreamer mentioned this article and it's a good read for you. We understand that the child does not have a BiPolar (BP) diagnosis. But he clearly has a lot of the hallmarks and there's a huge % of BiPolar (BP) kids who are diagnosis ADHD in childhood. In early childhood the symptoms are similar. But diagnosis is not your issue. This article talks about testing that can be done which would help identify the specific LDs so you can try to address those. Many of the Learning Disability (LD)'s common to BiPolar (BP) are also common to ADHD.


This is a related site that may also be helpful to you.


Don't know what sites you have been to or know about. The home page on this site has a links and an articles section which is very good. This is my favorite Learning Disability (LD) site, lots of great articles for teachers and for parents.



Active Member
in my humble opinion , you have to win his trust, he has to feel understood and see you as a help.
You have to ' unconditionally teach ' him , meaning encouragement yes , trying to manipulate him with behavior mod , stickers NO. He gets from you because you love him and really care about him despite what he does. You have to connect and bond and help him become part of the solution, no condemming , no judgement. Dialog , getting him to speak , you listen , directing the conversation with dialog questions , helping him to take perpectives , problem solve promotes so many cognitive skills.
Thinking skills , taking perspectives and empathy are so interconnected

Check Alfie Kohn's site especially articles on education starting with ' Unconditional Teaching'. Ross Greene the author of the explosive child recommends everything which Alfie Kohn writes

http://alfiekohn.org/ see articles , interviews etc

Education is a process , hang in there