What next......

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by April, Dec 6, 2007.

  1. April

    April New Member

    Ok, this week has been just one thing after the other for our guy....Monday he opened the door of a moving vehicle, his reasoning...he had to get rid of that pencil...he didn't even want it in his house...the garbage can in the garage wasn't good enough. Last night I went to check on him and found him sitting on the end of his bed (naked because he refused to put on PJ's)with masking tape wrapped very tightly around his mouth, chin, head, and part of his nose. I only heard him because I could hear him trying to get it off. I think he got scared because it was harder to breathe. Obviously our first priority was to get the tape off, he fought us the whole way because it hurt...I was more concerned with making sure he could breate first then we could go slower and get the rest. My husband had to hold him down so that I could do it. His reasoning...he wanted to make sure he didn't talk for the rest of the night?! His face and neck are all bruised (from how tight he had it), and his face is swollen and irritated from the tape.

    The case managers won't allow us to get us a neuro evaluation, or more intensive therapy, that was reccommended by his current therapist/psychiatrist. Hopefully this will be the even that spurs them to allow the evaluation. I contemplated calling 911, but he wasn't in distress. Looking back I probably should have because they would have placed him on phych hold, and prompted the evaluations (I think, but not sure...)

    I haven't had a chance to update my sig yet...he isn't on zoloft anymore.
  2. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful


    I would've taken him to the ER. (pushed the idea he could've smothered)

    One question: Why do case managers get to decide your child's care? That doesn't make much sense to me since it's you who are with him 24/7 and are going to see the bulk of his symptoms/behaviors.

    Can you at least put a call in to the psychiatrist? It surely doesn't seem that his medications are working.

  3. April

    April New Member

    In Indiana kids who are still wards of the state, for what ever reason (in this case adoption not final)the case managers have the say, unless we can prove negligence...which is what we are working on. The psychiatrists can't do anything other than talk to him. This is a case of hind sight is 20/20...we will call 911 the next time and they have to hold him for 72 hrs (I think) and the evaluation is then required.
  4. Star*

    Star* call 911........call 911

    Are you adopting him? How long has he been yours?

    If he is a danger to himself (taping my breathing holes shut should qualify) I think that if you had rushed him TO the ER for a check up it would qualify - what does Indiana want you to do call them before 911?


    Did he say WHY he didn't want to talk to you?
    Does he know it is ABSOLUTELY okay to talk to you ANYTIME?

    Poor kid.

  5. April

    April New Member


    That is the plan, however it is on hold...we are making sure that all his services will remain in place before finalization.

    Hind sight is 20/20...we should have called 911 and pushed the issue, but he could still breathe, it was just harder and he was getting scared...he wasn't in distress YET...

    Indiana just won't allow us to get more indepth evaluations with out case manager approval...we are to protect them at all costs...we weren't sure whether to chalk this one up to the idiocy of 9yo males across the globe or to his disorders.

    He didn't say he didn't want to talk to us...he said he just didn't want to talk and to make sure he didn't he taped his mouth shut...kind of like being on a diet and getting rid of all the cakes and candy...

    He knows he can tell us anything at anytime, the problem is that 99% of what he says is a lie.
  6. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    in my opinion that was very dangerous behavior. I would have taken my son to ER before calling the caseworker regardless (I fostered my son before we adopted him).
    I'd seriously wonder what was wrong with that child and could I deal with it. I wish you luck. The system isn't fun. Sometimes you have to do what you know is right.
    This is NOT in any way normal nine year old behavior. This, from a mom of five, who raised all five way past nine. I would really be concerned about serious mental illness and attachment disorder (possibly even alcohol effects). And I'd want him 100% evaluated before finalizing the adoption.
  7. slsh

    slsh member since 1999

    Oh April, how scary!!

    First off, I'd go through your home with a fine-tooth comb, removing all tape, plastic bags, balloons, sharp objects, anything that could possibly be dangerous. Be inventive as you're searching. Put the stuff you need (bags, tape, whatever) in a secured place. We lived out of toolboxes with combination locks for years. Please don't take this as criticism because it's not at all. Your kiddo obviously has a creative mind and what would be an innocent object in another kid's hands might not be in his.

    Can you send a certified letter to case mgr's supervisor relaying therapist/psychiatrist's recommendations for more intensive therapy and additional evaluation, and case mgr's refusal to allow it? That has to be one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. It is absolutely *not* in the best interest of the child. Do you have an atty involved in the adoption? Can he/she press the issue, especially in light of this incident?

    His reasoning for the tape sounds really off to me. I would worry about if maybe he was hearing someone/thing talk to him and he was trying not to respond, or maybe it's PTSD-related? Regardless of the reason, neither the taping nor the reasoning behind it would be in my definition of typical 9 y/o goofy behavior.

    And lastly, hon - never ever *ever* ask "what's next?" because sure as shooting, the kids will show you! :wink: Hang in there!
  8. I'm going crazy!!!

    I'm going crazy!!! New Member

    Hey April

    I'm so sorry ya'll had to go through that I'm not sure I would have rushed him to the ER either being as he wasn't in distress. As far as being dumb 9 yo behavior maybe I've known some really dumb boys over the years and they have done really stupid things just to see what would happen but the reason he did it is strange and worth looking into and in my opinion points to more than just 9 yo behavior. Hope you are allowed to get him the help he needs. Ya'll are in my prayers!!!!!
  9. see30

    see30 New Member

    april- first of all you should be applauded for taking on the task of raising these two children. second- DONT FEEL GUILTY FOR NOT KNOWING WHAT TO DO!!! third- you did exactly what you should do- you turned to a supportive community, i can't believe that people are posting messages telling you what you should have done rather than googling child welfare laws in indiana and helping you figure out what you're next move should be.
    stick with this child, he needs you. look for support where ever you can find it, but, if it becomes too much or you feel that he is a danger to himself or others, don't hesitate to have him placed in a residential facility. i have such respect for you and your husband. i'm a case manager myself and i'm sorry to hear about my "colleagues" in indiana, you and those kids deserve better.