Now he's trying to make false accusations to the judge

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Gabi Gabs, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    We live in a small town. You can walk right into the judge's office to make a complaint. No appointment necessary.

    My son tried to run away again on Tuesday. Hubs sent out a big crew and he was found before managing to leave town (which is what he normally does).

    According to the "responsibilities for privileges" system we have set up with the psychiatrists, he loses the privilege to work for two weeks when he runs away.

    He got very angry today when he realized that this meant he wouldn't be able to sell food at a community festival this Saturday. He makes big money doing that, and money enables his running away. So it was a definite NO.

    Then he came out with this story that I had written to the festival organizers from his account to say he couldn't work, accusing me of "identity theft" and that he was taking it to the judge.

    So, I said I was going to the judge too, for psychological violence (which I could, but don't, because he'd get raped in a second in the jails here). He needs to know that if he hurts me (he already tried to kill me by putting mercury in my glass of water), that he will be held legally responsible.

    I went ahead of him, after making sure that my mom could then accompany him to the town-hall, under that pretense. Really, I just went to show the judge and the police a letter I have from the psychiatrist, explaining his condition.

    Now the doctors are saying that I jumped the gun, shouldn't have done that, should have tried to talk it out. AAAAAARRRRRGH!!! We'd been trying to talk it out for two hours already, and the last thing I need is to have to go to court over false accusations. My husband is barely working anymore because he's either running around town looking for our son, dealing with crises, or going to therapy sessions with us. We can't start spending time and money on this kind of craziness.

    I'm so tired.
     
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  2. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Wow. I am so sorry and shocked. I don't know where you live or what your laws are, but he tried to KILL you. There is nowhere else for him to live? Nowhere for the mentally ill who are dangerous? Do you have younger kids that he might hurt?

    I hope you have some choices here. Trying to poison you is far far beyond the realm of just a troubled boy. I know the options in the U.S. I don't know if you even have options. And it is sad about the jails. Is there foster care, like we have? Therapeutic homes for children who need round the clock help?

    I am very sorry for this. I hope you have some choices for your son. There are some kids who are truly too dangerous to live in a family and can be parented from a distance with mental health workers caring for them. Can you take him to another country if there is nothing?

    Lots and lots of empathy, love and light. Hang in there and stay on guard.
     
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  3. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    Nothing like that here. We had him in a private psychiatric hospital for a week, but it was crazy expensive. There are two places like that and the rest are all less than recommendable.

    Fortunately, we do not have other children. So at least we only have to worry about ourselves and our pets, although I don't think he would hurt them. All his rage is directed at me, the person who has loved him and cared for him the most. We used to be two peas in a pod. We used to do everything together.

    Taking him to another country is just way beyond our financial possibilities. We might put him back in the psychiatric hospital, just to get a break and see if they can figure him out more.
     
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  4. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Ah. I see. I don't have lots of money myself but many here seem to have means...but I couldn't travel to another country either. Just survive the best you can and dont let your son get you food or drink.

    Much luck to you!
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  5. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    Gabi. You are in an impossible situation. The way the situation is set up and the rules put you in handcuffs with a gag tied to the train tracks...while trying to parent.

    Your son seems empowered by your helplessness. To me the doctors are like a Greek chorus undermining you further. Nobody. I mean nobody could do this right.

    I will tell you what I think: the rules need to be changed. Somehow you need to get your power back. Your son is working the system. Taking control of the whole game. To his peril. He must know you cannot or will not follow up with your threats.

    A disempowered parent cannot help a child heal. We have all been there.

    I think I might send him back to the hospital if only to buy time to come up with a plan. The doctors need to help you. Clearly the situation is volatile. He is not safe unless he is contained.

    If only one of you had citizenship or residency in a country with more of a social services network and the means to relocate. I do not know what you are supposed to do when any response to curb him leads to his victimization. PS. I think you did exactly right in going to the judge.
     
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  6. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    Thank you both.

    Copabanana, you have put into words all of my frustration. Very insightful. Thank you so much.

    I'm very frustrated with the doctors who so easily give me instructions but have no idea what it's actually like in our home.
    My son has mastered the art of manipulation to the point where he has had the psychiatrists fooled.
    They eventually see the truth, but not fully.

    Even my husband, who's been my rock throughout these 8 months, and who is always ready to drop everything to do whatever needs to be done, and my mom, were shocked with my son's poker-faced lying today. It shocks me that they are still shocked by it, and it makes me feel like they're still several steps behind me in really understanding where he's at.
     
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  7. newstart

    newstart Active Member

    GabiBabs, There is nothing so frightening and so heartbreaking to witness a good child turn into a child that you dont even know anymore. My daughter was like that. My grief over my deceased son is overwhelming and sorrowful but my grief over my daughters behavior feel worse in many ways. If I was to messure the agony and pain I would say that it tilts in favor of my daughter.
    I know it is easy to give advice when it is not your child but after reading your posts I think I may just let him run away. The lifestyle on the street is rough and he is young, he will have to do everything himself like find food, shower etc it maybe eye opening for him. My daughter was not as young but at 28 I made myself completely invisible to her, no contact for 3 months, I did not answer the door when she knocked, I did not answer my phone, took my voice off the answering machine, she tried to call me from other peoples phones, I did not allow her to see or talk with me. Me doing this made some major changes within her. It was the hardest thing I ever had to do but it was the message I got during deep prayer because I had tried everything else and nothing was working.. Life out there without family support is not easy, maybe he needs to feel what that feels like. I know you are worried to death that he may die. I had to give that up and believe when its your day it is your day. I send you love and compassion and I feel so bad that you have this awful situation. Only listen to your heart it will guide you into doing what is right for your son. I had to learn to cut my daughter off and with it does come peace, it is hard, I cried everyday 3+ times a day but at least that felt better than her constant abuse.
     
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  8. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    Thank you, Newstart. I do think it's our only way out of this horrible situation sometimes - to not go after him the next time he runs. Maybe it will be easier once we have a really solid diagnosis. With there still being so many questions as to what he really has, it's hard to think of him being out there if he's really ill. But psychopaths, from what I understand *do* know what they're doing, and so far, it's what seems to fit his behavior the most - from my limited understanding and research anyway.

    I get what you say about losing your child to death vs. them becoming a monster. Sometimes it feels like my son died on that hospital bed (when he tried to kill himself). Like he never really came back. I am mourning that loss, and it is heartbreaking, but the torture of living with what he is now is so unbearable. I just hope that he wakes up one day.
     
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  9. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    Gabi. He is way too young to be diagnosed as a psychopath. And his use of drugs, even marijuana, really could cloud the diagnostic picture even for an older person.

    As far as the running away, I would agree if you were here in the states. But. If he is in grave danger arrested in your country I can imagine the risk on the streets. But the thing is there is a reality here: you cannot stop him and you have no real support. Your hands are tied.

    If he is running, just where does he intend to go? What is he seeking? Does he have a destination?

    Can you help him get there? I mean. If where he wants to go is reasonable, that is safe...could a foster type situation be arranged and treatment arranged there? Of the 3 adults you have mentioned, is son better with your mom or husband? Could somebody accompany him?

    If you cannot contain him, if you have no recourse, maybe the strategic thing is to help him go the direction he wants...in a controlled and protected way.

    I mean. These doctors. Are they helping?
     
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  10. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    My mom is bipolar and would just let him do whatever he wants.

    I think he's just trying to run away from himself. He doesn't make friends easily, and when he does, he doesn't really invest, so the friendships don't really go anywhere.
    He has this fantasy about going to his biological father, who was absent most of his life and now has two young children. He might take him, but I feel it would be irresponsible to let him go there with the two littles in the house.

    He thinks he can make it on his own out there, because when he ran away for the longest time (2 weeks) he was able to get jobs.

    I think the doctors are mostly trying to help us do this without hospitalization because they know we can't afford the good ones, and the bad ones are too bad.

    The good thing is that he knows a lot of people (my friends) and has a large network of people who would help him out.
     
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  11. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    If son did "whatever he wants" what would that be that he would do? More marijuana? Or worse?

    It could be that you are a trigger for him right now. That he would be compliant with treatment and other expectations absent a power struggle.

    Would son be safe with your mom? Would she do it?

    Look Gabi. Is this working out, this combat? For him or you?
     
  12. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    Last time he was "out and about" he stole really expensive phones. The psychiatrist worries that he'll get into prostitution. I'm worried that he'll end up in jail. And then there's always the fear that he'll try to kill himself again if things don't go the way he wanted. But that's always a possibility while he's here too.

    No emancipation, but still liability. Plus, if he gets picked up, he goes to a terrible place where kids get raped, trafficked and sometimes killed.
    It's super tricky. If we were in a safer place, I'd have given it a go from the start. I didn't know he had a disorder then though.
    And maybe he doesn't. And maybe it's cannabis-induced psychosis (please, please, please let it be that!).

    Combat definitely isn't working out.
     
  13. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Gabi, I have been in your shoes. Those who are not in your shoes every day are always a few steps behind you in understanding him and how bad things are.

    Why not go ahead and fly him to the US and get him into a hospital here? Into some situation here where things might be better or at least could be monitored for a while? How could it be worse? I know things are bad in Spain and you want to avoid the repercussions there, but your son is ramping up and you might not be able to save him if you don't do something fast. He is trying to kill you. Seriously attempting to murder you. Think about it. Hard.
     
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  14. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    I agree with Susie. You can see no good and likely outcome in your situation as it is, at least where you feel safe and not so anxious both about him and as importantly yourself. You are boxed in by the situation. You do not see a solution perhaps because there is no solution in the current guise. I think that is what Susie is saying. There feels to be no way out because there is no way out, where you are. Because there are not the resources for any person or family who is not rich.

    You keep tasking yourself to solve this. Who could?

    What needs to happen in order to access resources that would or could solve it? That is the question.

    Is son's dad in the states or someplace where son could get real help? What about laying the cards on the table? Which is to say: what would be the options if son left where you are? Would dad help? Or could you and your husband bring him?

    I read real concern in Susie's post. She is typically right on and does not overreact. And she has weathered a similar threat. Gabi. You might be in a kind of shock or denial. Is there the possibility of finding real support for yourself... With an eye to coming up with another more radical plan and pausing the parent training for right now if need be.

    Your boy's real dad has got to step up here.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  15. Littleboylost

    Littleboylost On the road unwanted to travel

    I do not have a lot to add to the wise advice you have been given. Please take this threat to your life seriously.

    I know how difficult it is to deal with this situating. I am living it. Now that my sone has been away from heavy drugs his mental state has improved significantly. 4 months ago I would have sworn he has severe mental illness. Drugs can do terrible things to the mind.
     
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  16. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    If you can't afford to travel, you can't. I could not have. No matter how dire the situation, I had nothing for plane fare let alone a hospital in another country. If somebody can help you out, great. But I get it if you really can't. Then you have only the resources in your country or letting him run.

    Although it is unlikely you will get a psychopath diagnosis at his age, some kids have those traits early. In the US it is called Conduct Disorder. Your son tried to kill you. That is dangerous no matter his age.

    I hope you do find viable options to get him help and to be safe yourself, but not everyone can afford to get help abroad. I get it if you can't. And it's too bad but not your fault.

    But I do hope you can find resources to help you out that you can afford. You don't want to end up dead.
     
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  17. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    Thanks, everyone. I am listening.

    The biodad has never helped financially, but if my son keeps insisting on a paternity test, he might have to.
    But it would be a lot of legal stuff on top of all of this. Nevertheless, money would help.
    He is in another country, but the system is better there.

    He has been diagnosed with Conduct Disorder by the doctors. But one of the doctors told me that if I didn't act quickly, best case scenario was that he grow up to be a psychopath. That's what got me reading up on it, and it fits more closely than what I read about CD.

    Are there good (affordable or free) places in the US for kids like him, where he won't get hurt, even if we don't have insurance? I do have some distant family there, but no insurance. We both have dual citizenship.

    This community is saving my sanity and my life. Thank you all so very, very much.
     
  18. Baggy Bags

    Baggy Bags Member

    The other option we have is to put him in one of the good, private psychiatric hospitals here.
    We could drain our pockets and put him there for a month, but afterwards, we wouldn't have much left over for anything.
    So, the question here would be, should we put all our money down for that and hope for the best, or save the money for longer-term treatment options?
    I've heard of stories where a month of hospitalization can totally turn someone around, but I know there's no guarantee.
     
  19. newstart

    newstart Active Member

    GabiGabs, If you think your son is a true psychopath and no matter what type of diagnosis he gets, I believe mothers know their children better than anyone else and we as mothers would never call our child a psychopath unless we feel deeply in our hearts that that is what they are, no matter what kind of treatment he gets there is no cure at all for psychopathy. Since I have studied psychopathy deeply, thinking my daughter is one, but after studying it, I have come to the conclusion that she is a psychopath only while manic. You had mentioned your son was a sweet child, I think you would have picked up psychopathy in your young child and you would not have seen any genuine sweetness. You would know in your heart or hearts if he was full on psychopath. There are articles about 'almost psychopath or part time psychopath but in reality it is all evil. I suspect my daughter has tampered with my food. I believe she tampered with an orange drink she brought me once, I got very ill afterwards. Just knowing a person is capable of trying to harm you through poisoning is one of the worst feelings in the world. While manic my daughter does the worst things.
    When she comes off of her mania is can be an ok person. But by the time she gets off her mania the damage she has caused is so deep, wide and expensive, there is no trust afterwards.

    My daughter has received many labels, ADHD, bipolar/borderline, ODD, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD), psychopath etc etc. I think so many of these disorders over lap one another and I think she fits fits and pieces of many of these and on top of that she is highly intelligent.

    The pain of trying to help them and getting beat up at the same time is horrifying.. Total disregard and disrespect is what I got from my daughter. I had spend thousands of dollars on her therapy, hours of time taking her here and there, most of my life working on helping her full time and yet she is still an ass. She will be 36 very soon and I need to detach totally and I am working on it.
    Looking back I did not have the knowledge or strength or guidance on how to help her and me to a balanced life. I gave in too much, I let her walk all over me, ruin our home, ruin our finances, ruin our reputations, she lied about so many things and had I not had friends in the school district that knew me well I could have been arrested over her lies. She is a *F* nightmare.

    If I could go in a time machine and go back in time and know what I know now, I would have given her the heave ho right out of the nest and dusted off my sandals. Tolerating her just made her worse. I feel so deeply sorry for you and your journey, it is very steep and rocky but I am going to tell you something that you may not believe just yet but I am telling you once you give that 'heave ho' with it comes deep down peace. My prayers are with you.
     
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  20. BloodiedButUnbowed

    BloodiedButUnbowed Active Member

    Gabi,

    Your son is very dangerous.

    He needs to live elsewhere before he harms or kills you, your husband or your pets.

    He is escalating and I fear your story may make international news if you do not get him out of your home and far, far away from you.

    Love will not save him or cure him.

    He wants to kill you. Take him seriously. Eventually he will succeed.