Conners test results

[Malika]

J's teacher gave me back the Conners questionnaire today. Here is her assessment - there were four possible categories to check: not at all, a little, a lot, or an extreme amount. The teacher "invented" a new category of "between a little and a lot" - a medium amount?! - which she gave in response to quite a lot of the questions and which I translate as "quite a lot". Any views/insights gratefuly received (calling IC )

1. Agitated, moves around on his chair - a little.
2. Makes incongruous noises - here she has marked "a little" and written "sometimes whistles" - well, he has just learnt to whistle and is very proud of it, so...
3. Has to have what he wants immediately - a little.
4. Messes about - quite a lot.
5. Tantrums and unpredictable behaviour - not at all.
6. Over-sensitive to criticism - a little.
7. Distracted or fluctuating attention - quite a lot
8. Disturbs the other children - quite a lot.
9. Dreamer - not at all.
10. Sulks - a litle.
11. Rapidly and marked change of mood - not at all.
12. Likes to fight - quite a lot.
13. Accepts authority - quite a lot (I wonder if she misunderstood the question, which is rather clumsily worded, to mean "does not accept authority")
14. Agitated, always running about - a little.
15. Easily excited and impulsive - a lot.
16. Demands excessive attention from the teacher - a lot.
17. Seems poorly accepted by the group - not at all.
18. Lets himself be led around by other children - not at all.
19. Is a poor loser - a little.
20. Seems to lack the ability to involve or lead others - not at all.
21. Finds it difficult to finish what he has started - not at all.
22. Puerile and immature - not at all.
23. Denies his mistakes and accuses others - a little.
24. Difficulties getting on with other children - a little.
25. Not very co-operative with his classmates - here she has written "most co-operative with those younger than him"
26. Easily angered when he has to make an effort - not at all.
27. Learning difficulties - a little.


To me, this looks like the profile of impulsive/hyperactive ADHD. What do you think?

 

[BusynMember]

Has he ever taken the TOVA? I think that's more accurate than Connors. Many disorders come out high on the Connors...autism and bipolar are two other ones. Also, the Connors is the opinion of the teacher. The TOVA is a specific computer test that scores itself. I've taken the test. You have to be able to concentrate to do well on it.

My ADD daughter did terrible on the TOVA. She could not focus for the time it took to do the boring test (it has lights flashing and you have to press a button when a light flashes...hard to explain).

 

[TeDo]

I am not a doctor, nor do I play one on TV but in my very humble layman's opinion, it does sound like the responses would indicate ADHD.

 

[InsaneCdn]

Conners is more accurate if you have more than 3 perspectives... at least, that is the approach here.
And I agree that just scoring high on ADD/ADHD "flags" doesn't mean he is ADD/ADHD...

But, FWIW:

1. Agitated, moves around on his chair - a little. This could be Auditory Processing Disorders (APD). Or motor skills (posture problems can make sitting uncomfortable, for example). Or sensory-seeking. (or Hyperactivity)

4. Messes about - quite a lot. Organiztion is part of the executive function skills/abilities. Kids with ADD/ADHD tend to have executive function problems - but so do lots of other kids, and you can have this problem with no other diagnosis.

7. Distracted or fluctuating attention - quite a lot. Again, very common with Auditory Processing Disorders (APD). (or with ADD/ADHD, of course)

8. Disturbs the other children - quite a lot. Depends on "why" and "how"... could be a range of factors here.

12. Likes to fight - quite a lot. Depends on "why" and "how"... could be a range of factors here. "Fighting", per se, is not an ADD/ADHD "trait".

15. Easily excited and impulsive - a lot. This is executive functions, again.

16. Demands excessive attention from the teacher - a lot. This can be... Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) (not understanding what is needed without one-on-one interaction). Or, insecurity - attention seeking. Or Learning Disabilities - trying to find ways to get help for problems the child doesn't even understand themselves.

25. Not very co-operative with his classmates - here she has written "most co-operative with those younger than him" Immaturity IS a common problem with ADD/ADHD. Most kids with this ADD/ADHD socialize better with kids 2-4 years younger than themselves. It's just where their maturity level is at.

27. Learning difficulties - a little. Ah Ha. Actually acknowledged, even if not "a lot". Which might partly explain the "attention from teacher" problem... esp. if the learning difficulties are bigger than the teacher thinks. But... learning difficulties are not uniquely tied to ADD/ADHD... If you have ADD/ADHD, the chances of that being the ONLY diagnosis are actually quite low. ADD/ADHD kids may have motor skills problems, sensory issues, learning disabilities, APDs, etc. BUT... so can Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) kids. And "learning difficulties" can exist without other dxes, too.

What does THAT all mean?
Well, here (Canada), it would just be a flag that more testing is needed to address some of these red flags.
Nobody would diagnosis ADD or ADHD based on a single Conners survey.

Does J have some challenges? Yes.
Severe? Doesn't sound like it.
Should he have accommodations/interventions? Probably.
Which ones? (loop back... that would take more testing...)

 

[Malika]

Thanks, all. Yes, IC, I think the more complex and unknown portrait of possibilities you paint (there's an alliterative sentence) is probably more like where it's at. And no hope of getting such testing round here, though in Toulouse, perhaps. The psychiatrist said that she would also ask me to fill out a Connors questionnaire and I don't think there's any question of a diagnosis being based on this alone... As J is a borderline/uncertain case of ADHD, I don't think she could base it on this questionnaire anyway - which points to hyperactive ADHD but has some pointers away from it also.
Learning difficulties... or is the teaching style just not right for him?

 

[TerryJ2]

Gosh, I'm no expert ...
I remember when my difficult child took it (3X now, 3 diff schools) and for the most part, ea teacher recorded completely different responses. He is quite particular about the way the material is presented and who the teacher is.

Good question as to whether it's learning difficulties or/and whether the teaching style is not right.

The more you know, the less you know. These tests can make you crazy.

 

[Malika]

Yes, I agree.
It would be good to have J do this TOVA at some point. Knowing J, he will want to "perform" and do well on it but... would be good at least to have a LITTLE objective data.

 

[DDD]

The Connor form was completed by the primary teacher, a supplemental teacher or school day caresupervisor, extended family member, parent and sometimes a close friend or neighbor. The varying perspectives gave a wider picture. What is hyperkinetic behavior to one person is a sign of energy and enthusiastic living to another. What is inappropriate motormouthing to one person can be seen as happy self confidence that sometimes is a bit excessive.
And then, of course, the behaviors found with ADHD are also very similar to the behaviors found with Gifted.

I hope you find a comfortable place soon. No matter what the label may or may not be, research will lead you to a family pattern that works best for you and your much loved son. Hugs DDD

 

[Malika]

Yes, but in a way you need to take the "worst" scenario, I think. If I asked one of J's childminders, for example, she would not check any of the things the teacher did - as far as she's concerned, he's an adorable,cute little guy and she can't believe (seriously) anyone thinks he's hyperactive. But that doesn't mean anything in the wider scheme of things, really. He still has all the issues in other circumstances and situations.
For me, I have realised, the label is about lending weight to my plea for J to be treated somewhat differently than the norm - because the norm just doesn't work with him, as so many of us here know. I am, frankly, beginning to berate myself for having left J with this teacher for so long... she makes all the right noises about understanding he needs a different approach - and in reality goes after him like a devil from morning to night (I have been told this by one of the teaching assistants). She doesn't have a f***ing clue about ADHD or positive reinforcement or how to work with someone with special needs AT ALL. However, if she had been given the label... she would have had to take it seriously, I think - and there would have been a team of people helping her understand how to work with him. She has resisted that label like crazy... could it be because, precisely, she doesn't want those people involved in her classroom? This is a woman who nearly lost her job some years back because of the way she treated a severely dyslexic pupil... I have lost ALL respect for her and realise that my talks with her, lending her books, all that, have actually had no real effect whatsoever - she has just carried on messing J up regardless...