tishthedish
Well-Known Member
I've been there Copa. Sending positive thoughts your way.
I told my son to leave again. After 24 hours. What am I doing wrong?
- Thread starter Copabanana
- Start date
Copabanana
Well-Known Member
I need advice/Update
This is our interaction that just occurred:
Son: You can just consider the work that I did a repayment of money you have lent me.
Me: Are you not going to Big City?
Son: It is just too late. I cannot get done what I need to. I waited too long.
Me: That is your choice. Of course. (in a high pitched voice, tinged with exasperation.)
You do have time, in my view. Or if you had chosen to do so, this could have been accomplished this past Thursday or Friday.
I want you to know this. I will not participate with you if you choose either to give up without trying or to not work towards your goals and responsibilities. Your housing is your responsibility not mine.
He can pay an additional $250 to crash on a couch for the month, where he has no rights and even no key. He gets into these abusive situations where he in effect pays the entire rent. And then he gets thrown out.
If he chooses this, and prefers it, to securing some other alternative *after all he chose the option of the homeless shelter in the Big City, so be it.
I think the truth is that he would prefer to stay here, but does not want to state this affirmatively. He prefers to slide into it covertly, rather than tell me the truth upfront. This is manipulation plain and simple. There is time to enter the homeless shelter. He is lying to achieve a preferred end.
My SO thinks the reason he does not say his intentions directly is because he does not want to be in any way obligated. If he chooses something, he has to want it. To want it requires a commitment and investment. Why in the world would somebody want to live in this way?
His choice. Not mine. I have suggested he needs to think about returning to his other housing option.
I will wait and see what happens before I make a definitive statement about his need to leave. I trust and rely on you all so much. To say I am grateful is the greatest of understatements.
Do you think I am being too harsh??
PS He is back to doing the windows. Streaks. He just said: Is it okay if I pay for half of the train, and you the other half? Conciliation. I had said I would pay for it all. I did not say a word.
PSS Everything blew up when my SO came home. Another 14 hour day. My son went to him, behind my back. And then came to me and said this to me in English (M does not understand): M and I have talked it over and he agrees that the only solution is that I work with him. (Basically presenting me with a done deal, in opposition to what I had told him.)
I said the following. Nobody is going to go behind my back in my house, and try to take away my power, my voice. You may think that you have arranged things with M but you have lost a whole lot of ground with me.
So now M is mad at me and he said the following:
SO: If you make Son leave I am not going to go with you to get him back when you get sad. Either he stays or he leaves. But no staying and leaving. Leaving and staying.
Me: I will not be forced into an agreement that I did not make. I never said that SON could live here and I won't be manipulated into such a commitment. By anybody.
I left the room. And here I am. Color me sad and confused. I am channeling Lil here.
And it is even worse than I thought.
My son lied to M, my SO, and told him that I had made the commitment to him that he could work with him. And M got hysterical because he felt betrayed by me. So M thought that I had gone behind his back and made a unilateral promise to my son, that M could not keep.
M is calm now, and tells me to be calm. He knows now and so do I that my son lied to M. And then lied to me, in English, so that M would not understand what he was saying. He thought he could trick each of us, to doing what he wanted. It backfired.
My son condescends to me that my rationality is so limited, so compromised, that I misunderstood his above board and completely logical and correct intentions. He talks down to me. And attempts to make me the bad and wrong one. I am not talking to him, now.
He tries to strike an alliance with M based on their inherent masculine superiority, and ability to solve problems calmly and effectively, not hysterically like MEEEEEE. The goal being to marginalize me and shut me out.
Nice guy.
The end of the story is that my son asked me to buy the ticket to the Big City. My SO will take him to the train tomorrow morning before I get up.
__
Written before:
Of course he would prefer to stay here. Free food, he thinks. Easy living. He thinks. Clean. Safe. Secure.
But I will not put myself in the business of being a treatment center or a therapist for my own adult child. Period.
I have made it clear to him, home might be an option one day if he has clear cut goals, that he has dedicated himself to achieve.
Not as easy living.
Background: In exchange for doing some chores we said we would pay for his train to the Big City, so he could get his chest xray to enter the shelter where he had planned to stay for 3 months.
He had chosen this option as an alternative to couch surfing in our small city which he hates. He gets SSI so he has the means to afford a small apartment here. He does not have the money even to get a room in this Big City, nor does he want to participate in treatment there, which would be a way to subsidized housing. In short, he has chosen a temporary and dead-end option. His choice.
This is our interaction that just occurred:
Son: You can just consider the work that I did a repayment of money you have lent me.
Me: Are you not going to Big City?
Son: It is just too late. I cannot get done what I need to. I waited too long.
Me: That is your choice. Of course. (in a high pitched voice, tinged with exasperation.)
You do have time, in my view. Or if you had chosen to do so, this could have been accomplished this past Thursday or Friday.
I want you to know this. I will not participate with you if you choose either to give up without trying or to not work towards your goals and responsibilities. Your housing is your responsibility not mine.
He can pay an additional $250 to crash on a couch for the month, where he has no rights and even no key. He gets into these abusive situations where he in effect pays the entire rent. And then he gets thrown out.
If he chooses this, and prefers it, to securing some other alternative *after all he chose the option of the homeless shelter in the Big City, so be it.
I think the truth is that he would prefer to stay here, but does not want to state this affirmatively. He prefers to slide into it covertly, rather than tell me the truth upfront. This is manipulation plain and simple. There is time to enter the homeless shelter. He is lying to achieve a preferred end.
My SO thinks the reason he does not say his intentions directly is because he does not want to be in any way obligated. If he chooses something, he has to want it. To want it requires a commitment and investment. Why in the world would somebody want to live in this way?
His choice. Not mine. I have suggested he needs to think about returning to his other housing option.
I will wait and see what happens before I make a definitive statement about his need to leave. I trust and rely on you all so much. To say I am grateful is the greatest of understatements.
Do you think I am being too harsh??
PS He is back to doing the windows. Streaks. He just said: Is it okay if I pay for half of the train, and you the other half? Conciliation. I had said I would pay for it all. I did not say a word.
PSS Everything blew up when my SO came home. Another 14 hour day. My son went to him, behind my back. And then came to me and said this to me in English (M does not understand): M and I have talked it over and he agrees that the only solution is that I work with him. (Basically presenting me with a done deal, in opposition to what I had told him.)
I said the following. Nobody is going to go behind my back in my house, and try to take away my power, my voice. You may think that you have arranged things with M but you have lost a whole lot of ground with me.
So now M is mad at me and he said the following:
SO: If you make Son leave I am not going to go with you to get him back when you get sad. Either he stays or he leaves. But no staying and leaving. Leaving and staying.
Me: I will not be forced into an agreement that I did not make. I never said that SON could live here and I won't be manipulated into such a commitment. By anybody.
I left the room. And here I am. Color me sad and confused. I am channeling Lil here.
And it is even worse than I thought.
My son lied to M, my SO, and told him that I had made the commitment to him that he could work with him. And M got hysterical because he felt betrayed by me. So M thought that I had gone behind his back and made a unilateral promise to my son, that M could not keep.
M is calm now, and tells me to be calm. He knows now and so do I that my son lied to M. And then lied to me, in English, so that M would not understand what he was saying. He thought he could trick each of us, to doing what he wanted. It backfired.
My son condescends to me that my rationality is so limited, so compromised, that I misunderstood his above board and completely logical and correct intentions. He talks down to me. And attempts to make me the bad and wrong one. I am not talking to him, now.
He tries to strike an alliance with M based on their inherent masculine superiority, and ability to solve problems calmly and effectively, not hysterically like MEEEEEE. The goal being to marginalize me and shut me out.
Nice guy.
The end of the story is that my son asked me to buy the ticket to the Big City. My SO will take him to the train tomorrow morning before I get up.
__
Written before:
Of course he would prefer to stay here. Free food, he thinks. Easy living. He thinks. Clean. Safe. Secure.
But I will not put myself in the business of being a treatment center or a therapist for my own adult child. Period.
I have made it clear to him, home might be an option one day if he has clear cut goals, that he has dedicated himself to achieve.
Not as easy living.
Background: In exchange for doing some chores we said we would pay for his train to the Big City, so he could get his chest xray to enter the shelter where he had planned to stay for 3 months.
He had chosen this option as an alternative to couch surfing in our small city which he hates. He gets SSI so he has the means to afford a small apartment here. He does not have the money even to get a room in this Big City, nor does he want to participate in treatment there, which would be a way to subsidized housing. In short, he has chosen a temporary and dead-end option. His choice.
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Copabanana
Well-Known Member
My SO, M, says this. We need to dedicate the rest of ours lives if we have to to shaping SON into a man of morals and responsibility.
When he saw the look of horror on my face, he added, how would it feel for you to die now, with SON like he is? Drifting and poorly able to negotiate his way? He can be taught. He is learning. Would you not die happy, knowing that he was responsible and secure?
It is clear that M, my SO, has not gotten the detachment parenting memo.
Thoughts?
My son seems to recognize that he made a mess of things. M is more sanguine than am I about his two-faced behavior. He thinks 98 per cent of people try to trick others, only his Mother and I, do not.
While it is true I do not trust anybody but him I had no idea it was because others were not trustworthy. I thought it was because I am damaged and therefore do not trust.
I trust you. Do you think there is a correlation between trustworthiness in parents, and having Difficult Children? Do our children become confused by the discrepancy between the world as it is, and their honest and responsible parents? Do they learn from their experiences outside the family that their parents are easy marks?
This is too horrible to believe.
M closed with his favorite line: Love the Cow, Love the Veal. In Spanish. This is his way to tell me we are in this together.
When he saw the look of horror on my face, he added, how would it feel for you to die now, with SON like he is? Drifting and poorly able to negotiate his way? He can be taught. He is learning. Would you not die happy, knowing that he was responsible and secure?
It is clear that M, my SO, has not gotten the detachment parenting memo.
Thoughts?
My son seems to recognize that he made a mess of things. M is more sanguine than am I about his two-faced behavior. He thinks 98 per cent of people try to trick others, only his Mother and I, do not.
While it is true I do not trust anybody but him I had no idea it was because others were not trustworthy. I thought it was because I am damaged and therefore do not trust.
I trust you. Do you think there is a correlation between trustworthiness in parents, and having Difficult Children? Do our children become confused by the discrepancy between the world as it is, and their honest and responsible parents? Do they learn from their experiences outside the family that their parents are easy marks?
This is too horrible to believe.
M closed with his favorite line: Love the Cow, Love the Veal. In Spanish. This is his way to tell me we are in this together.
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Echolette
Well-Known Member
Ugh. These are bad times. When our Difficult Child's become desperate they ramp up, and many of them, like your son, are good at what they do. What your Difficult Child does is split and manipulate, and boy, is he good at it.
But you know what he does.
It gets so confusing, doesn't it? Trying to figure out each infraction, realign the rules and expectations, start over, adjust adjust adjust
When my son was at a therapeutic boarding school (for 15 months) they had a rule about being "sketchy". That was all it was. They didn't have to catch the kid, or name the infraction...just if the Difficult Child was behaving in a way that made people uncomfortable, or needed too many meetings, or too many adjustments...sketchy. And that called for privileges being taken away.
That was SOOOO helpful to me. I don't have to put my finger on it, argue points, debate, convince. You know when Difficult Child is being sketchy, nad so do I. Sketchy is when it is streessful to be with some one. Your son is being VERY sketchy.
I'm sorry about SO and the splitting. It is hard to be on two pages. But...you have already dedicated your life to your son's independence and growth, right? and it didn't work. If you could have fixed him with all your love, effort, money, and time...he would be fixed by now. He has to fix himself.
I love your SO...I love that phrase. Love the cow, love the veal. What a great way to start the day!
Echo
But you know what he does.
It gets so confusing, doesn't it? Trying to figure out each infraction, realign the rules and expectations, start over, adjust adjust adjust
When my son was at a therapeutic boarding school (for 15 months) they had a rule about being "sketchy". That was all it was. They didn't have to catch the kid, or name the infraction...just if the Difficult Child was behaving in a way that made people uncomfortable, or needed too many meetings, or too many adjustments...sketchy. And that called for privileges being taken away.
That was SOOOO helpful to me. I don't have to put my finger on it, argue points, debate, convince. You know when Difficult Child is being sketchy, nad so do I. Sketchy is when it is streessful to be with some one. Your son is being VERY sketchy.
I'm sorry about SO and the splitting. It is hard to be on two pages. But...you have already dedicated your life to your son's independence and growth, right? and it didn't work. If you could have fixed him with all your love, effort, money, and time...he would be fixed by now. He has to fix himself.
I love your SO...I love that phrase. Love the cow, love the veal. What a great way to start the day!
Echo
Echolette
Well-Known Member
and..no.
There is no rhyme or reason for Difficult Child's. No correlations, except, sometimes, genetics. Your goodness and kindness did not lead to his Difficult Child dom. Nor did any of your badness. He chose this. You chose your way. Let it go.
Echo
tryagain
Active Member
So glad, Copa, that you have peace about the situation. It is so hard to arrive at a place of peacefulness when the things we wish would happen, simply don't. You are able to look at the situation realistically and adhere to boundaries without giving in to the "mother emotions" that we all have. That is awesome and is something I am still striving to get to.
BusynMember
Well-Known Member
No, just the ones who have problems to begin with. Plenty of adults are walking around that have had trustworthy parents and are trustworthy themselves.
What M. doesn't get is that you can't force him to adapt any of your thinking. He does seem to need to learn to detach. You can't drill anything into anyone's head. They have to be open to haring it first and your son doesn't seem to be that person...
You and M. need to have good rest-of-your-lives. Don't waste it trying to make your son become somebody he will probably never become.
JMO. Hugs!!!
The rest of your lives?
JMO here, but NO WAY.
My kid is quite a bit younger than yours. And we are "dedicating our lives" to try to shape him as he continues to grow up. But we know that we only have about 5 years left in which to have any major influence, and even THAT is only because our kid happens to be at least marginally open to being "helped" - he's medications compliant, willing to SEE and talk to a therapist, and follows the basic rules of the house (although we keep them few and simple).
Unless the person being helped is willing to BE helped... all you do is burn out trying to "help", and in the getting in the way of them figuring it out themselves.
Sorry, M. Copa is right on this one.
Lil
Well-Known Member
Oh Copa, I'm so sorry you are going thru this. It sounds like 2 on 1 at times, with M enabling your son.
This actually makes a bit of sense. I mean, YOU have to develop boundaries and stick to them. He is in and you give him some latitude until he's violated the rules or he's out. But once he's out, he needs to stay out until you see REAL, POSITIVE CHANGE.
HEY! I resemble that remark.
But, you have read me the riot act a few times for it...so back at ya! Really...if it were me writing your post and you responding, what would you say to me. We all know the answers Copa...we just have such a hard time applying them to ourselves. 
Now I see the resemblance. You know, when all this started with my son, I wondered if it wasn't because Jabber and I loved each other too much! If we hadn't been so into each other, would our son have been happier and better adjusted.
Really? Did my son turn out poorly because of how much I loved my husband. That's kind of nuts.
There are actually a LOT of trustworthy parents in the world. Most of them have trustworthy children. A parent doesn't make their child "confused" by showing them honest, hardworking, responsible, honorable examples.
It occurs to me your differences with M on the subject of your son may be cultural. Some cultures give "kids" a lot more latitude and consider them children a lot longer. I'm sorry, I don't remember how old your son is, but could it be that M still sees him as a "young" man...one that still needs to be taught and shaped into an adult?
I hope this gets better for you Copa.
This actually makes a bit of sense. I mean, YOU have to develop boundaries and stick to them. He is in and you give him some latitude until he's violated the rules or he's out. But once he's out, he needs to stay out until you see REAL, POSITIVE CHANGE.
HEY! I resemble that remark.
But, you have read me the riot act a few times for it...so back at ya! Really...if it were me writing your post and you responding, what would you say to me. We all know the answers Copa...we just have such a hard time applying them to ourselves. Now I see the resemblance. You know, when all this started with my son, I wondered if it wasn't because Jabber and I loved each other too much! If we hadn't been so into each other, would our son have been happier and better adjusted.
Really? Did my son turn out poorly because of how much I loved my husband. That's kind of nuts.
There are actually a LOT of trustworthy parents in the world. Most of them have trustworthy children. A parent doesn't make their child "confused" by showing them honest, hardworking, responsible, honorable examples.
It occurs to me your differences with M on the subject of your son may be cultural. Some cultures give "kids" a lot more latitude and consider them children a lot longer. I'm sorry, I don't remember how old your son is, but could it be that M still sees him as a "young" man...one that still needs to be taught and shaped into an adult?
I hope this gets better for you Copa.
Childofmine
one day at a time
I love this. This cuts through the clutter, doesn't it? I don't know about you, Copa, but my mind can be so filled with clutter and fog and being unsure, that i don't know which way is up.
Here are a few more clutter-cutters (hey, I made that up, sounds pretty good, doesn't it??? : ):
1. No is a complete sentence.
2. I'm 51%, he's 49%.
3. My son is 26 years old. My son is 26 years old. My son is 26 years old. If not now, then when?
4. Keep quiet. Don't say a word. Let time go by. I don't have to respond to everything he does and says.
5. My son(s) will never live here again. My home is my sanctuary, and besides, God didn't intend for us to live with our adult children. Especially in this generation.
6. People make choices. Then, they have to live with the consequences. Them, and us.
7. People change only when they are completely, completely...read that...completely...sick and tired of their current situation.
8. Closing the door here helps my son get to completely sick and tired faster. Keeping the door open here keeps my son living in la-la land. Adults can't live in la-la land.
9. We agreed on rules and consequences. You broke them. You get the consequences. Only in this way can people learn that actions have consequences.
10. We have to be consistent way way way more than we ever imagined. Way more. The more we are inconsistent...well, maybe...this time...new information...yada, yada, yada...the more we delay their growing up.
11. The highest and greatest love for our own children is letting them go to experience life on life's terms. And to deal with it all.
Just a few thoughts. I'm not saying any of this is easy to do. It takes years and it takes tons of practice, and tons of THEM teaching US that the other way doesn't work. We love them so much we actually won't believe other people---even the people on this forum---until WE LIVE IT. I was one of the slowest learners there is.
My son has been "acting up" since 7th grade, and went off the cliff when he was 19. Now, at 25 (last June 2014), he started changing, it appears. It appears. I enabled him until about three years ago, and even then, I was inconsistent, until, over time, I became more and more consistent.
It takes time to change. For us, for them. As my husband says: It took a lot of time to walk into the forest. It's going to take the same amount of time to walk out of the forest.
We can help by staying out of the way.
Warm hugs, Copa. This is very hard stuff.
Scent of Cedar *
Well-Known Member
In this time when good work is so hard to find, M offered training and a job which would have prepared son to make his way anywhere in the world.
Son did not do it.
I understand and commend M's willingness to help. I found it wonderful. But son showed his hand the first morning. He did not go to work with M.
Maya Angelou wrote: "Believe them, the first time they tell you who they are."
Then, son did all he could to come between you and M ~ including speaking in front of M in a language he does not understand; including trying to form an "alliance of men" between himself and M against you.
This cannot just be swept under the rug, Copa.
"Believe them, the first time they tell you who they are."
Son needs to learn that you and M mean what you say but more importantly, you and M need to learn that you mean what you say.
You and M need to be on the same page.
It would be good to discuss the exact techniques son used to undermine your and M's relationship, and to manipulate you both.
We have to be wise, Copa. We have to be wary and suspicious and tough because addiction is tough. We need to give ourselves time to learn what we think is the right thing to do. No one knows how to do this. No one has the right answer for himself, let alone for anyone else. You are learning; M is learning. Son is learning, too. He is learning how to get what he wants without having to change his lifestyle.
You love son; this makes you vulnerable. That is okay. You are learning how to do this very hard thing: How to love someone who is self-destructing without being destroyed ourselves.
I am sorry this is happening to you and your family, Copa. I wish this were not happening to any of us. But it is happening. All we can do is the best we know. You are doing that, you and M. It doesn't feel like success Copa, because son is still in danger and that is hard. You and M are doing the right things. You have no control over son's choices.
Protect your relationship to M by keeping on the same page. Discuss every part of what happens with son, discuss how it feels and what needs to happen next so you can present a united front when son comes back. Discuss the vulnerable places and how to face them, together. Express compassion for one another. This is a very hard and human thing, this business of loving a self-destructive child.
We are all only human, Copa. Cherish the warmth there is between you and M; laugh, smile, go to dinner, eat Chinese and watch something funny in bed together.
Life is so short, Copa.
***
It helped us to know what we would need to see from our son before we would help in any way. It would be best to say that unless son is ready to reclaim his life, he gets nothing.
Nothing.
Son will not like this; he will redouble his efforts to dominate you both. If son were honest, he would have gone to work with M.
All work is honorable.
There is no guilt for you or M there, Copa.
This is easy to say when we are discussing someone else's child. When it was our daughter homeless and addled and addicted, we (D H) gave her money every week. Later, we learned it went for drugs and booze and "street cred", and that she was being beat whenever we did not put that money into her account.
D H could not stand to know his daughter was homeless and penniless.
She would not come home, so D H sent money.
It was what he needed to do for himself, Copa.
What do you and M need to do to survive this in one piece? What do you and M need to do so that you can meet your own eyes in the mirror even if he does die.
Those are the kinds of decisions we have had to make regarding our children too. We did not stop enabling, did not stop having one or both kids and any pets and children home with us as needed until our kids were in their early thirties.
Now, both are in their early forties.
I'm sorry, Copa. At least we have one another, here on the site.
I would not have come through it, I don't think, without this site.
Holding you and yours in my thoughts and prayers this morning, Copa.
M, too.
:O)
Cedar
Copabanana
Well-Known Member
I wish I was better at this.
It seems as if for me the illness and the cure are both intolerable.
This is what I have learned:
I have learned to respond when he breaks agreements and how to do so. I have learned to not respond to emotional blackmail. When I can spot it.
I have not learned this: to WAIT BEFORE I RESPOND and TO LIMIT MY RESPONSES to No, Oh, and So, when I do not know what is happening or what to do. I have not yet learned to wait.
There are alternatives to reacting, based upon emotion and confusion.
I can give myself as much time as I need to learn what other information I need to know, to truly understand what my needs and interests are. I can decide to respond when and how and if I choose. I can take all the time that I need to understand what is going on. To talk it over with M, my SO. I can do what ever it is in the world I want, and choose to not react. To wait. Because if I do react, I will do so based upon emotional triggers controlled by and designed by my son, according to his priorities, his understanding of his immediate interests.
Because my son uses all types of covert geuririlla tactics and strategies to confuse me to achieve his ends. It is worse because we speak two languages when my son is present, and M my SO does not understand English. My son when he wants to, deliberately excludes M by speaking English to me. He betrays M by misrepresenting what M has said to him, deliberately telling me things opposite to what M has told him or wanted. And he will take M aside and lie to him about what I have said or not said.
We end up angry at each other. Because my son had told each of us the opposite of what we said and want. So, we each feels betrayed by the other. Based upon my son's deceptions, we have each lost control of ourselves. Together we have lost control of the situation.
My feelings as a result are grief, hopelessness and fear.
At first I was angry. I became hostile and rejecting: "I will not be tricked by you. I will not allow you to destroy my peace. I will not allow you to come between M and I. You will not live here. I never said you could."
I went farther than I wanted to. I went further than is good for me. I wanted to stay connected to him.
More than this, I have abdicated the role of parent. I have become my son's victim. I am reacting based upon emotion. I am not responding or deciding.
I go to a place that I do not want to go.
Because I love my son. Because I worry about him when I do not know how and where he is. I do not want to reject him. I want him in my life.
Before this happened I felt good. I felt positive. I felt hopeful. In large part, because my son was near me. I believed that I could function, again.
Today it feels just horrible.
My son got his foot in the door, and did what ever he could to trick us into letting him stay here. He did not succeed. But the aftereffects cost me dearly.
PS I do not feel quite so horrible. Because I just found out that my son is telling people that I am a friend he met in the Big City. That his mother and father are dead. This is a half-truth, because his birth-parents are dead. But it seems he has killed me off, too.
This is so painful. But it is a different kind of pain. Not the pain of earlier that came from the sense that I did something wrong. That I am the bad guy.
I am dealing with a child that on some level has eliminated me because I do not do what he wants. Because I do not tolerate however he treats me. There is no way to interpret this except for hostility pure and simple, that informs his treatment of me.
That he invents a biography is not a new thing. But in the circumstances I find myself in with him, this feels very, very hurtful. It feels and seems as if we have a one-sided relationship.
That I am the designated provider of all. And that my son is the designated taker who turns into an avenger, if all that he wants is not provided, in the way he wants it, when he wants it.
Sounds like a losing game to me.
I fear just as much if not more, is that my son has killed me off as his mother, because he feels I have rejected him as my son. That he needs more from me or from someone that I have been giving and willing to give.
SWOT is right, my son has not behaved in some of the ways that many of our difficult children have done. No real anti-social or aggressive behaviors; no criminality; no hard drugs. He just calls the cops on us, wanting to put us in jail.
It seems as if for me the illness and the cure are both intolerable.
This is what I have learned:
I have learned to respond when he breaks agreements and how to do so. I have learned to not respond to emotional blackmail. When I can spot it.
I have not learned this: to WAIT BEFORE I RESPOND and TO LIMIT MY RESPONSES to No, Oh, and So, when I do not know what is happening or what to do. I have not yet learned to wait.
There are alternatives to reacting, based upon emotion and confusion.
I can give myself as much time as I need to learn what other information I need to know, to truly understand what my needs and interests are. I can decide to respond when and how and if I choose. I can take all the time that I need to understand what is going on. To talk it over with M, my SO. I can do what ever it is in the world I want, and choose to not react. To wait. Because if I do react, I will do so based upon emotional triggers controlled by and designed by my son, according to his priorities, his understanding of his immediate interests.
Because my son uses all types of covert geuririlla tactics and strategies to confuse me to achieve his ends. It is worse because we speak two languages when my son is present, and M my SO does not understand English. My son when he wants to, deliberately excludes M by speaking English to me. He betrays M by misrepresenting what M has said to him, deliberately telling me things opposite to what M has told him or wanted. And he will take M aside and lie to him about what I have said or not said.
We end up angry at each other. Because my son had told each of us the opposite of what we said and want. So, we each feels betrayed by the other. Based upon my son's deceptions, we have each lost control of ourselves. Together we have lost control of the situation.
My feelings as a result are grief, hopelessness and fear.
At first I was angry. I became hostile and rejecting: "I will not be tricked by you. I will not allow you to destroy my peace. I will not allow you to come between M and I. You will not live here. I never said you could."
I went farther than I wanted to. I went further than is good for me. I wanted to stay connected to him.
More than this, I have abdicated the role of parent. I have become my son's victim. I am reacting based upon emotion. I am not responding or deciding.
I go to a place that I do not want to go.
Because I love my son. Because I worry about him when I do not know how and where he is. I do not want to reject him. I want him in my life.
Before this happened I felt good. I felt positive. I felt hopeful. In large part, because my son was near me. I believed that I could function, again.
Today it feels just horrible.
My son got his foot in the door, and did what ever he could to trick us into letting him stay here. He did not succeed. But the aftereffects cost me dearly.
PS I do not feel quite so horrible. Because I just found out that my son is telling people that I am a friend he met in the Big City. That his mother and father are dead. This is a half-truth, because his birth-parents are dead. But it seems he has killed me off, too.
This is so painful. But it is a different kind of pain. Not the pain of earlier that came from the sense that I did something wrong. That I am the bad guy.
I am dealing with a child that on some level has eliminated me because I do not do what he wants. Because I do not tolerate however he treats me. There is no way to interpret this except for hostility pure and simple, that informs his treatment of me.
That he invents a biography is not a new thing. But in the circumstances I find myself in with him, this feels very, very hurtful. It feels and seems as if we have a one-sided relationship.
That I am the designated provider of all. And that my son is the designated taker who turns into an avenger, if all that he wants is not provided, in the way he wants it, when he wants it.
Sounds like a losing game to me.
I fear just as much if not more, is that my son has killed me off as his mother, because he feels I have rejected him as my son. That he needs more from me or from someone that I have been giving and willing to give.
SWOT is right, my son has not behaved in some of the ways that many of our difficult children have done. No real anti-social or aggressive behaviors; no criminality; no hard drugs. He just calls the cops on us, wanting to put us in jail.
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Lil
Well-Known Member
I hate that you're going through this. A few thoughts...
Clearly your son speaks Spanish, or he couldn't take M aside and lie to him...so why don't you just refuse to speak English in M's presence? It's rude anyway, if you all speak Spanish.
Oh I so understand this. I've had to stop myself more than once from saying more than I want, like "If you walk out don't EVER come back!" When he cursed me Monday, I came very close to sending a text that said, "Never speak to me again!" Jabber stopped me from saying "You are no longer our son." during a fight.
It's tempting, to go to the extreme. I can, at times, just want to hurt back. It's an awful thing, and very human.
I can't even imagine how much that hurts. I'm so sorry.
Clearly your son speaks Spanish, or he couldn't take M aside and lie to him...so why don't you just refuse to speak English in M's presence? It's rude anyway, if you all speak Spanish.
Oh I so understand this. I've had to stop myself more than once from saying more than I want, like "If you walk out don't EVER come back!" When he cursed me Monday, I came very close to sending a text that said, "Never speak to me again!" Jabber stopped me from saying "You are no longer our son." during a fight.
It's tempting, to go to the extreme. I can, at times, just want to hurt back. It's an awful thing, and very human.
I can't even imagine how much that hurts. I'm so sorry.
