Pretty sure my daughter is a pathological liar

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by Bean, Aug 29, 2011.

  1. Bean

    Bean Member

    This, going beyond just the normal lies a difficult child might tell.

    She lies about EVERYTHING.

    In a previous thread I said that she was moving to a city about an hour away. Had a shelter set up, yadda yadda. She's been staying there, looking for work, cooking, helping with cleaning, washing clothes. Took the bus home this week (the shelter "borrows" her money, with the agreement it will be paid back). Took the bus back, had panic attack, called me - suggested she should have talked to her doctor about this while she was here.

    Um... she's been LYING about living there. This whole time. For over a week.

    It took her a while to admit it. Twice now she's called with "medical emergencies" that I've had to talk her down off a cliff about. After I get no update, nothing. She calls one night says blood is shooting out of her behind, she feels sick, is afraid there is something seriously wrong with her. I'm distraught because she's "out of town" and I want to be supportive. She says she's going to urgent care. I hear nothing again for 18 hours. End result (she says) is that she got some Xanax. Great. What MORON doctor can look at her history and giver her Xanax.

    I just stopped taking her calls yesterday. I don't like being lied to and having smoke screens all over the place. I don't deal well with that and I've got other kids to raise.

    I don't think there's any kind of medication for pathological lying, so it's kind of sad that this might be the reality of her life.
  2. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Oh Bean...I just am so sorry. I can only imagine how hard this must be for you.

    The only hope I can hold out for you is that she may get a bit better as she matures
  3. keista

    keista New Member

    I'm so sorry this is your child you are describing. As much as I hold out hope for her like Janet does, that "bit better" may only be a very little bit. My husband is a pathological liar. The man I married was a figment of his own imagination. I see very little hope for these kinds of ppl. Intensive therapy can help, but getting them there is another matter.

  4. compassion

    compassion Member

    My daughter is very much like this. I see it as sx of her illnesses. I have learned to set boundaries and to not react to all the "crisises". I like the saying watch the walk not the talk and watch the hips , not the lips. I cannot reason with the unreasonable. I find that I tyy to put my energy into the prosocial (health,sobreity,sanity,prosocial activities). Most of the time she is not intersted in these. I have learned to not give her much attention for the antisoical including poor health which is consquences of her actions. Compassion
  5. PatriotsGirl

    PatriotsGirl Guest

    Oh hon you are not alone!! Remember not too long ago my difficult child lied about her big move to California? Oh yeah, even went so far as to call me during various "stops" on her trip and me bawling my eyes out thinking she was so far away. Grrr......

    Why do they do it? No idea. Mine has lied about everything and I mean absolutely everything. I have gotten to the point that I don't believe a word that comes out her mouth anymore. Why bother? :(

  6. dashcat

    dashcat Member

    Like so many others, I can completely relate to your anger, frustration and bafflement. My difficult child lies constantly .. about big things, little things, all sorts of things. She lies when she doesn't need to lie, she makes up huge story lies (once, she gave a witness at a church youth retreat .. not our church so she had a fresh audience... in this witness, she described physical abuse by a boyfriend, an eating disorder that landed her in the hospital, cutting the word "runaway" into her arm, and a dad who never said "I love you.". Every single thing was false. When confronted, she only fessed up to lying about the boyfriend, the dad thing and the ED. She still insisted she cut and even scraped some superficial wounds into her arm the next week. Ugh).

    She lies, gets caught and then lies about the lie.

    I struggle constantly with how to deal with this. Confrontation doesn't work. Going along with it doesn't feel right. Trying to speak the truth back at her falls on deaf ears.

    It is beyonjd frustrating.

    I know you've dealt with so much emotion with this recent situation. Her lying about all this has to be insanely frustrating for you.

    I know lying is a huge part of the whole personality disorder thing, but it is so diffficult to deal with.

    (and, PG, I remember the California debacle. What a mess)

  7. Mrs.McNear51

    Mrs.McNear51 Member


    You've been on my mind alot lately. Lots and lots of hugs for you. I have been in your shoes so many times. Know that I am keeping you in thought and prayer. Hang on to hope and don't let go.


  8. Star*

    Star* call 911


    I was thinking about you and daughter the other day. I don't know if this will make any sense - but rambling on..........

    You get a call, it's an emergency - they're suicidal. I wonder for anyone else what is the first thought that goes through your mind? Not MY mind, YOUR mind. Do we have the same immediate thoughts about the crisis, our children, the outcome? Part of me drifts into some pseudo-catatonic state and goes all arm chair psychiatrist, while the rest of me is hitting the ground on my knees thinking to myself "OMG why didn't I pray today about HIM? Did I forget about the madness because it was so quite for a while? Will my thoughts and prayers even be heard if I say them right now? Do I have time, I mean after all I do have a child that is threatening to (insert your weapon of choice) take a handfull of pills, and follow it all down with liquor......hates his life and regresses on the phone about how messed up HE is, his LIFE has become and how did he ever get here, what's wrong with him?"

    And I think right along with him, fading in and out of hoping I say the exact right thing to prevent hearing a gunshot at the other end of the line or the proverbial last word from a hung up or smashed cell phone that in essence? I'm being emotionally blackmailed. So I sit there.....listening quietly while tears run down my face and I try not to sniffle or give myself and my emotions away - that on the other end of this phone is a person who is disturbed/manipulative.......disturbed/manipulative..........disturbed/manipulative. My brain at this point goes into parental auto pilot and remembers the lessons it learned in therapy about how NOT NOT NOT to allow the child to make you feel guilty about the last 21 years - even though the first 3 should be deducted because during that time his care was exemplary. Then my brain clicks to the words as he is angry about his life and reminisses on group homes, abuse, foster care reminding me that he was PRACTICALLY raised in those places, but it was because (and gives HIS rendition of why he couldn't be raised more at home than in Residential Treatment Center (RTC)'s) and I think WAIT a MINUTE.......I did the best I could......and I'm still listening to him rage on and on about his pathetic, miserable life and how it's not REALLY anything to do with me "I did the best I could blah blah blah." and the other part of me jumps up to defend myself thinking 'damn right I did the best I could." WHAT is your problem now? WHY am I listening? Should I have just hung up? **** I wish I hand't answered the phone.....then again, had I not would he have REALLY done it to himself this time? Then I exhale at the indicision I have because MOST of me wants to scream at him "YOU SELFISH #(%)*($)(*ard. Can't you see that I've done all I could and the answer for YOU is in a doctors office somehwere......just GET THERE..... holy crud if I felt like this I'd be booking passage to the ER."

    But I listen, I don't call 911......I hear more coherent words as I'm sure the booze is wearing off and it's apparent because the anger is more intense......but the life? The life I value so very much, the one I invested my entire life in, the one I love, the one I'd do anything for? Is being talked about as if it were something you could carelessly toss into a shallow grave - and by the way -if there is a funeral, since we know I am so poor......could I at least leave the grave open so his friends could dump on him before he's buried. WELL WHY NOT.

    At this point? I gotta tell ya Bean.....I'm not sure if I'm upset, scared witless, tired, exhausted, worried to pieces over NOT EVER getting another phone call - and there is that nagging part of me that is kicking myself going YOU SHOULD HAVE JUST HUNG UP,,,,,,,,why didn't you just hang up? Send him a know Tough Love......and then he starts in on his health, and his living situation.......and all of a sudden it's like I'm being told I COULD NEVER understand...and I think......"Never? MY life was absolute hell.......I understand this better than you know -------13 years worth....with beatings and torture, and a child....." Then I'm back to furious dare he tell me I don't know what this life is like.

    Then we do health issues, and may as well just die.....and you know part of me wants to at this point just say -------WELL THEN GO AHEAD AND .......and the other half of me sits there peeved that I even have to consider this BS because I've already had a stroke, and my hair is gone.......and I'm old, tired, and have enough of my own problems.

    So what did I do? I listened, I played psychiatrist with minimal interference.......I refused to talk to his fiance because at this point? If she hasn't figured out this will be her life and her kids life - she's in need of more counseling than I can help with, and I did the I love you, crying---------sobbing softly that this is what it is. Three steps forward......two steps back and so much like his bioslob poppa I just want to scream.

    But I didn't,,,,,,I just didn't sleep all night. Went to work the next day.......Thought about him from coffee to key in the ignition at 5:30........praying I'd get a call, a text FROM HIM and not 911 or the sheriff. Bceause part of me still thinks it's possible he'd do it. How unstable is he really. He admits he needs help but won't go......won't take pills......and wants to feel better. Yup........exhale sadly ------play with the dog try to forget it for 5 minutes......

    So after all that went on? I called two days later to see what I could do to help.........Then? After life is all haha and ho ho and Oh you should see .........I BLASTED HIM. I told him what I thought from top to bottom and that if there were going to be a next time to just go ahead and do what he was going to do......I'm here for advice and hugs, and understanding....NOT abuse. THIS JUNK he did? NOT HAPPENING.....I haven't felt like that in years and years and I'll be dipped in tar before I'll go back down that road again. So I let him have it with both barrels - Mr. Laughing tonight about silly things........because for the last three days? I haven't laughed at anything. I considered life insurance....and then HOW MUCH? If something happened would I be able to use a dime of that money? NO. So why bother? Oh that's right the funeral he thinks his friends will all grave, poo and all. UGH.

    After the call? I was really REALLY so over the BS I couldn't tell you, but I let him know there won't be a NEXT time he falls apart, and calls to say his life sux and he's ending it - and he hates everyone and wants to (whatever it was he said all the crazy talk) and that if it persisted? I just may beat him to it because I can NOT take another three days like this because he refuses to seek help. NOT, can't....will NOT......period.

    IT.MADE.ME.NUTS. NUTS.....with a capital Cashew.

    SO - if you think you are alone in this phone call about health issues, and no calls, and hang ups and then pop ups and everything is roses while you're left to spread manure? You're not - never were.

    IF I WROTE A BOOK???????? I couldn't publish it - they have no BS category. Short of an alien invasion? I swear it was a body snatcher.

    (((((((PRAY FOR GAMMA RAYS))))))) arggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh.

    Yeah - something like that but I promise - he may have more crisis' in his life? But I'm bowing out of being a part of them. It's too much.......too much.....and after I said that? I felt LOTS better - told him I didn't care HOW he felt about it......really didn't. Thought his call was selfish, shallow, self-serving, narcissistic - manipulative and if he needed help - GET SOME. I'm support........NOT help. To this there was MUCH silence. And a thought in my head of "we shall see."

    Maybe it makes sense to you - maybe not, but after I had said "Maybe I'll beat you to it. then didn't hear from him? I sent a text that said Call home asap-------and about 30 mins later the phone rang off the hook ------he thought DF had sent the text....and something happened to me. WELL.........WELLL........I just wanted to know how he was feeling - and him? Why did he get so upset? HE THOUGHT there was something wrong with me.......plan backfired on account of Mom not so stable? Oh no......plan just stupid from the get go---------Mom just can't text much on her cheap phone.

    Anyway............thought it may help to know you're not nuts. Or alone in your nutty thoughts........providing you have them, and if you have a difficult child? You have them. I'm sure of it.

  9. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Cory lies a lot but not as bad as he used to. Mostly about stuff he just doesnt want me to know. If its big he just tells me anyway. Even if he knows Im not going to like it. I havent had the threats thank god. He has gone off a few times but its more of a ranting and raving thing that I just have to let him get out of his system and then he is done and he is ready to listen to reason. He is much like me in that respect. We rail at the world and then calm down.
  10. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    Katie lies nearly non stop. Drives me nuts.......but now I just assume she's lying until proven otherwise. Not much else I can do.

    Nichole did the threats a few times, and there was a period when she was borderline suicidal. I was lucky and she was underage and I could drag her to both a psychiatrist and therapist. But I had a mantra that I lived by during that period. Those who are serious about suicide never talk about it, never give any indications of their plans, they just do it. All the rest? Is either a cry for help, manipulation, or attention seeking. Do the rest sometimes succeed? Yup, but for the vast majority it's purely by accident. I learned that working a psychiatric ward for 2 years. It prevented Nichole from using it for either manipulation or attention seeking..........while I had the majority of what Star described going on in my head, the mantra let me stay stone faced and calm on the outside. The threats stopped when it got her no response.....except an extra visit to the psychiatrist.

    Still, either is hard to deal with day in and day out. The lying just makes you furious if you let it get to you and the threats keep your nerves raw if you let it get to you.

  11. Star*

    Star* call 911

    My Great Grandmother used to say - Liars have to have fantastic memories. For years...and YEARS I assumed that EVERYTHING that came out of Dudes mouth? A lie. Even if I could see him doing whatever he said he was doing - I assumed it was a lie. This annoyed him to no end. We were told to follow him around and did for six weeks......for EVERYTHING that he did matter what - follow him. If he said "I'm going to the bathroom. We got up and followed him. Calling him on it over and over helped us a lot.

    My Mother still maintains if his lips are moving - he's lying. No gray area there.
  12. Bean

    Bean Member

    Gosh, you guys. I'm sitting at work choking back tears. I'm touched. It is SO good to know you aren't alone and the pain you feel, the thoughts you've had have been experienced by someone else. But then, on the same hand I'm sad, sad, sad that anyone else has to feel some of the misery and pain that I've been going through. It's a toss up. But I just read through these posts and ate them up, savoring each word. It really means a lot to me.

    With school starting and other things to put my energy in, I really have been trying to focus on that, rather than on my daughter and her (real and/or imaginary) issues. I was truly disgusted at myself and my husband when we both had one solitary day off together and most of it was spent dealing with our daughter's crisis moment. It took days to recover from that physical and emotional stress. We were both so taxed. Honestly I'm not sure if we've recovered since the wound never heals. I didn't speak to her for days. My husband fielded calls for me - so grateful for that. I told her I just couldn't deal with the lies and manipulation. She kept coming up with reasons she needed to talk to me, but I just wouldn't take her call. Yesterday I spoke with her for about 3 minutes. She told me about a job interview. I kept it short, didn't commit that I believed or disbelieved. Proof is in the pudding, far as I'm concerned, though. And the past few days hasn't been enough, really. I feel guilt upon guilt for not talking to her, and fears because I know each day is a gift. But I also know the way I've been functioning has been miserable. The way she has been manipulating has been out of control. It may be an ongoing issue with her (oh gosh, I hope it gets better though); in that case I'll really need firm boundaries.

    The weird thing about the lying is I still fall for it at times. It's so unnatural to disbelieve everything that comes out of someone's mouth.