So now the truth comes out ... ex-girlfriend is pregnant!

[TerryJ2]

I told husband and easy child this afternoon.
easy child was totally shocked, but husband wasn't as shocked as he could have been.
We *are* talking about difficult child, after all.
It's been a couple of hrs, so I had difficult child come home after errands and we are all going to sit and talk.
husband is mostly concerned with-difficult child getting a job and making money for his potential new life. And the fact that he should have been doing that all along ... but I told him I just want to be supportive at this moment. Details will come later. Just take it one day at a time.
And it seemed like husband was more upset about my not telling him immediately than about the "announcement"! Good think I only waited two days.
difficult child is upset that I told at all. He doesn't get how this impacts the entire family.
That's part of what will will talk about right now.

 

[TerryJ2]

We talked. difficult child sat with us for an hr or two, although he mostly moped.
He answered a few questions, but mostly said, "I don't know."
"I don't know how I'm feeling."
"I don't know what I see myself doing in a year."
"I don't know where girlfriend is going to live."
He did say that they both want to finish HS at the same school where they are, so that may give them some stability. It will also give the girlfriend's mom a huge babysitting job ...
girlfriend is at her biodad's. Haven't heard what he said. T (girlfriend's mom) got into an argument almost the moment they saw one another so she just left.

 

[pasajes4]

I feel for your family. This is the kind of nightmare that none of us want to deal with. My son told me that his girlfriend told him she was pregnant and he would never be allowed to see the baby the day she broke up with him. She was not pregnant. It was a rough few days. Her mother called and told us that she had lied about being pregnant.

 

[Nomad]

I'm so sorry. Sending positive thoughts. Off the top of my head, I would do what you can within reason to make sure she gets good medical care. Try to open lines of communication for adoption and a paternity test later. Step up mental care tx for your son...counseling, etc. review his options for vocational school and choices. And tell your husband ASAP. Start looking for a GOOD marriage counselor as back up. I understand a good one is hard to find. husband and I went when things were over the top with our Difficult Child adopted daughter. It prevented much heartache. We would go for perhaps two months. Then, not go for a long time. Then go for two weeks for a tune up. We were fortunate in that she was not greedy. She went straight to the heart of the problem and we worked on it and went forward. She did NOT bleed us dry. It was very helpful. A healthy and happy marriage is paramount and don't fool yourself, this stuff is very taxing. Blessings, my friend.

 

[BusynMember]

Difficult Child does not seem that interested in the pregnancy. That's not unusual...he's still a very young man and even younger emotionally.

A few years ago, a 12 year old fathered a child with a fourteen year old girl. You did read his age right. He was 12. She gave birth and pretty much her mom is raising the kid and the 12 year old is just going on with his life (he went to school with Jumper). He doesn't seem to ever see the child or be interested in him.Never talks about the child. Lives a normal teen life as if he'd never fathered a child.

You can't force Difficult Child to take an interest in the child and he isn't educated enough to support him and the girl is under the influence of her own family and doesn't have to listen to you at all. Not that she won't. I don't know her and I hope she does. However, it is unlikely that just knowing he will be a biological father will straighten out your son with all his many issues. I mean, I hope I'm wrong, but I don't want you to be disappointed just because he can't make himself ready yet. Unfortunately they can breed much more easily than parent.

 

[TerryJ2]

He did mention that, "I'm going to be a dad," so I know he has at least entertained the thought.
I just found out that he never showed up after school last week. The teacher emailed and diplomatically said she "can't remember seeing him."
Code word for: Liar.
I have no idea where he is right now. He should be home.
I meet with-the therapist by myself at 6:00.
We have a family session, by coincidence, at 3:00 tomorrow.
I wonder if he'll let me drink wine in his office?

 

[LittleDudesMom]

"We have a family session, by coincidence, at 3:00 tomorrow.
I wonder if he'll let me drink wine in his office?"

Terry, I have to say I am sorry that difficult child has put your family in this position. I imagine he himself is still in processing mode. It's tough to even begin to understand the concept of what having a child means with someone you didn't choose to be your partner in raising the family. It's not even conceivable to him yet what impact this really will have on the rest of his life, not to mention the lives of his parents. I'm sure his "I don't knows" and such are mixed with shock, embarrassment, and helplessness at this point. He is still wheeling as much as you all are...

Hugs of support.

Sharon

 

[tishthedish]

Terry, what a difficult time for your family. I can identify because my G F G2 and the girl he was dating for 6 weeks got pregnant. She was vacillating about abortion and I thing he influenced her not to do this. He didn't want it on his conscience. She went ahead with the pregnancy and my grandson was born. They were both drug users. Baby mama used while pregnant. (I found this out 3.5 years after GS was born.) They were both ill equipped emotionally and financially to deal with a child. As they were both 20 and in love they decided to make a go of it . Here's the thing...GS is a special needs child. He has neurological and genetic deficiencies and is not an easy child to raise. He's had surgeries, is in early intervention, has been thrown out of every day care in the county for acting out/running away and requires a one on one aide in any school/care setting. My son has straightened out (for the last several months) has full custody and is taking care of him 24/7. Baby mama is in and out of the picture, living with another guy and using drugs on and off. Son has low paying job and is dependent on government help for daycare costs and food stamps. Our state may be cutting those services and he will be in true trouble if they do.

Here's my point. I love my grandson and consider him a blessing, but if I had known he would be neglected as a baby when he needed the best possible parenting to live up to his full potential I would have really pushed for adoption. HARD. There was no amount of babysitting or intervening or monetary support my husband and I could offer that would have righted this situation. It is still difficult, DCFS is involved and monitoring our son's care of the little one. None of that is envisioned when the pregnancy starts.

I think with these kids that the biggest barrier to considering adoption is the stigma they experience from their family and friends. (How could you give away your sweet, precious baby?) When you meet as families, or when you speak to her mother, could you explore the possibility of her living with a relative during her pregnancy? Would she or your son see a counselor before making any permanent decisions? Or an adoption attorney? My nephew and his wife are adopting a child. They had to provide a full biography of themselves, grandparents, home environment etc. complete with pictures. Maybe if they know they will still have a measure of control it will influence them in the right direction. Her mom doesn't sound up to raising the child. I would be as frank as possible about that and please begin to determine what you and your husband's role will be.

Here's another thing I'd do differently. We said we'd help as much as possible and we did. We were taken for the ride of our life. Used, disrespected, dismissed, but still spent more time with the child than the parents did. I was SPENT. I am still recovering from denying my own needs while raising my difficult child sons then taking on the motherless baby mama then caring for my grandson. It almost ruined me. I am in recovery. I hit bottom hard. Once I said, "no more", it became evident that they were out of their league. We gave them a safety net and it was to everyone's detriment. We kept thinking, oh, they'll grow into this. They'll get the hang of it. No. Not difficult child kids. They don't. So the state is involved and we have made it clear that we are not able to raise our GS. We had custody of him last summer and at our age it was a real hardship. Let them know that if things don't work out this baby won't be at mom and dad's for them to stop by and see anytime they please. Tell them the next stop would be foster care. Speak frankly and calmly. This will add weight to your words.If they say they already love the child, tell them that love is a VERB. Are they ready to give up everything to raise this child? Since they don't have much how would that even be possible.

Please form a united front with your husband and don't give away your lives because of someone else's poor choices. My heart breaks for your family. But if she goes through with keeping the child, most of all my heart breaks for him/her.

Hugs and prayers coming your way. Read my older posts to see how ridiculously harrowing things got. My difficult child 2 is 26 now. My GS is 4. Things are better, but it's a tenuous peace. This is an ongoing, lifelong situation as my GS will never be able to live on his own. They need to consider all possibilities.

Now, after suggesting a million things to do, my disclaimer is you have to do what is right for your family.

 

[TerryJ2]

Thank you, Tish.
I wholeheartedly agree.
I must tread carefully, because if I push too hard, too soon, I will push them both away.
The key is to have them think it's totally their decision.
The mom will be no help in the decision-making process. She says one thing and does another, and ultimately, caves to what her daughter wants. Maybe I can be the strong one, and volunteer to go to appointments with them, but I suspect the mom won't want me to. I can only offer, and then be her support to prevent her to caving to her daughter.
This girl does not use drugs. So far. But she is clearly depressed, which I think is both genetic and situational. Given my son's issues, I have no doubt that this child will be special needs. My heart breaks. Every. Minute. Of. The. Day.

 

[TerryJ2]

I walked into the therapist's office, and his wife saw me through the glass partition. She came out and greeted me with a tray with chamomile tea, Lindor chocolates, and a sweet note about how this might make things better. She gave me a great big hug.
I really had to work hard not to burst into tears.
therapist took copious notes.
I gave husband the rundown.
We've decided to let difficult child have the session entirely to himself on Tuesday. There is nothing to say at this point that we haven't gone over. And therapist has some very good insights, not to mention he's not The Overshadowing Parent, so difficult child will listen to a bit more and, I hope, process a bit more.

difficult child and I talked for a looooong time today. He is right on the edge of falling off the cliff. Gangs. Drugs. Despite the fact he says he wants to step up as a dad and get a job, the kids he's hanging out with (and some adults) all smoke pot and hang out in a horrid neighborhood where people carry at least one gun, if not two. These people have jobs, but the minute they get off work, they get together and smoke. I asked why they weren't home with the kids? He said, "Well, actually, I was at one person's house and there was a baby/toddler, and they sent him to another room." Sheesh. It's still illegal in VA. That could get this kid taken away by CPS. Just saying.
So husband and I are making plans to keep difficult child much more occupied. That means meeting difficult child halfway, so he doesn't just walk away from us. I told him he could have the car on weekends when his grades came up from Fs to Ds. (husband was mad--"I said Cs, not Ds!!!!) My goal is to cut back on the time spent with-these people, slowly reel him in, but if we just tell difficult child to stop, he will laugh, walk away, and spend MORE time with them. It's a tightrope walk.
He is shooting himself in the foot. "I'll show you!" (I'll move out without a job, no home-cooked meals, no A/C, no privacy, no car, friends who use illegal substances, and I'll be way better off. Uh-huh.)
The lithium is really helping. But he is still deluded and extremely angry. I honestly think that some of it is Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD). But some of it is the Aspie thing of wanting to be in charge. And some of it is the bipolar thing of exaggerating everything and thinking like a god. "I am a black and white thinker," he said.
"The world is not a black and white place," I said. "It's shades of gray until you get too far to the other side."
"That's just what I am. I see that now. And I can see that I've made mistakes all of my life, I've been angry all of my life, and I am an adult, and I am going to move forward. If I please you and dad in the process, so be it. If not, so be it."
He intends to stay in school, but he also intends to smoke pot when he can. He said he doesn't do it anymore, but then he hangs out with friends who do. All I can say is that actions speak louder than words. (Also, he said he stayed after school to do English, but then said he went to the library with-H and did English, which is why the teacher didn't see him. It just never ends.)
One thing that the therapist is going to talk about is the end of difficult child's childhood. And that includes pot. I hope he gets through to him.
If his urine test (which he hasn't taken yet) is positive, the psychiatrist will stop his Adderall. He really, really needs it. But at least he can stay on his lithium.
Oh, and the therapist is going to tell difficult child he MUST tell H about the situation before she finds out by herself. That's going to be rough, because difficult child puts everything off until it's too late. His anxiety ramps up, and he can't see how much worse it will be when he doesn't face the issue.
That's how he lost his job at McD's. That's how he and D got pregnant.
I told him to not even THINK of having sex with-H until this is all over. And if he does, she's got to be on the pill. And I will pay for it and give it to her every day if I have to. (Actually, I mentioned that to D's mom, in a nicer way, 2 yrs ago. She blew me off, just like her daughter did. ("Oh, THAT won't happen. I'm home with her all the time.")

 

[TerryJ2]

Forgot to mention, that the biodad wanted to have difficult child arrested for statutory rape.
T, the mom, said, "Don't even go there. They've been together for over two years."
I heard that from difficult child.
She texted me that she and her ex got into a fight almost the moment they saw one another, so I bet that's what the fight was about.

 

[Childofmine]

Oh Terry, I am so sorry about all of this. I have been reading along from out of town and now am back. I wanted first to say I am so glad that you are going to therapy. Keep going for YOU. You need the support and the outside voice listening to you.

I just went through a variation of what you are going through now. In early December girlfriend facebook messaged me on a Saturday night---first time she ever contacted me in any way---to say that she was pregnant, not sure when difficult child is going to tell you, but don't worry, we will probably get an abortion. I remember getting extremely dizzy and having to sit down immediately. I waited a while. Thank God I waited. Then I decided not to respond. Not to talk to difficult child about it, not to do anything.

About eight weeks later she had a miscarriage. He called me to tell me all of it after they went to the ER in the middle of the night. He had known about the FB message but he didn't say anything and neither did I. They talked about an abortion, but she didn't want one, and he didn't push it.

She miscarried at their apartment, and it was traumatic for the both of them.

I was relieved. That's all I can say. I was very relieved.

He answered a few questions, but mostly said, "I don't know."
"I don't know how I'm feeling."
"I don't know what I see myself doing in a year."
"I don't know where girlfriend is going to live."
He did say that they both want to finish HS at the same school where they are,

This resonates with me. For so many years, difficult child would say this about everything. Even now, if I fall into my old patterns of hammering him with questions (I don't do it often, but sometimes I do it), he will resort to this. Maybe he doesn't know. Who knows? I used to get so frustrated by this response that I would scream in his face: Well if you don't know, who does? It's YOUR life.

That didn't make him stop saying it either.

My heart breaks. Every. Minute. Of. The. Day.

I think in this situation, there is no way around the heartbreak. We know how hard parenting is, in the best of circumstances. We know what it takes, every single minute of every single day. And then we look at our difficult children, and their gfs, and we think, no way. No freakin' way.

It is the stuff of heartbreak. Terry, we already know so much about heartbreak. We know what it is so very well.

I walked into the therapist's office, and his wife saw me through the glass partition. She came out and greeted me with a tray with chamomile tea, Lindor chocolates, and a sweet note about how this might make things better. She gave me a great big hug.
I really had to work hard not to burst into tears.

I love this. I am so thankful you have this. And you have us.

Terry, during all of this, my first concern is about You. You. How are you doing with all of this? I hope you can keep some measure of distance as a self-protective measure for yourself, through all of this. When we are dealing with difficult children and their issues, the way to peace for us, is to create a space, a measure of time and distance and waiting, to allow them to step up and claim their own lives, however messy and chaotic and stupid it looks to us.

That is the only way forward, really. Because if we don't allow them a chance to do this, we are right back in the thick of it. We are trying to live their lives for them. And that NEVER works. Never.

I know right now you are in the "right up to the minute" action. When you can, take a deep breath, step back, and think about what you want, what you are willing to do, what you are able to do, and realize you can't make all of this right.

If your son and his girlfriend continue with this pregnancy, there could be many good things that come from it, and there also could be many hard things. This is what I realized when I was going through it. I decided I was not going to get in the middle of it all and try to orchestrate and "help" and "make something happen." How in the world can I know what is best? I know it isn't optimum by any stretch of the imagination, but I can't know the future for any other person. I can't know what their journey must be.

So, my best thought and prayer for you in all of this is make time for YOU. Take time to be kind to yourself and take a giant step back from them and their situation as best you can.

We are here for you through it all. Warm hugs today, Terry.

 

[TerryJ2]

Thank you so much, Childofmine.
That really helps.
I did not remember that you had gone through that. Or if you had, it would have been so much more abstract to me.
It worked itself out for them.
I am amazed and impressed by your calm and self composure. I hear you.

 

[BusynMember]

Terry, one thing you'll find out is that it is hard to have much control over the activities of a kid his age, even if he is very young maturity-wise. It is probably not a good idea to give him the car. Won't that just allow him to go to these bad neighborhoods? I'm sure you don't live in one...lol. I mean, to me smoking pot, alcohol use and bad friends make driving dangerous to the person and to others. I'd never allow him to have the car if he were mine. Not for a day. Not for any reason. I have a feeling you are going to regret that decision in a very car-related way.90% of Princesses drug escapades with bad friends happened in cars. Before we got wise to her, she used to fill our van with druggie kids and they'd drive crazily all over and get high and get into trouble. She got into trouble after we took the car away, but at least it wasn't our car, thus not our problem anymore.

My Jumper is about the best kid in the world (my opinion, of course), but I don't try to tell her what to do at all anymore. I couldn't. As good a daughter as she is, she wouldn't listen. If she truly wanted to go crazy and suddenly do drugs and party and hang with the gang, I couldn't stop her. I could only take her car away from her so she doesn't drive while high, but I couldn't stop her from going that way. And you can't really stop your son anymore. The more you try to hang onto him, my experience has been the more they pull away. He has already out of control and you've tried very hard to keep a close eye on him.

To me, he seems way too social to be an Aspie. I don't know any Aspies who have girlfriends except for the ones that are so high functioning that they can actually do college and work and pretty much figure life out. He does sound to me as if he may have inherited a defiant personality.

The only real ammo you have over his head is the car, which I still don't think he is safe in, and your home. If he doesn't care, you have nothing to hold him. If he decides to turn things around, it will be his decision, not because you kept him away from certain people. You can't.

Here's hoping for the very, very best. I know there is good in him. He has shown a soft and sensitive side constantly throughout the years and he used to have a desire to please you. I think it's still there. They just get older and even if they want to please you, like Jumper does, they will choose NOT to please you if you really take a hard stance against something they want to do. At this age, we are playing defense. All we can do is react to what they do and react in our own ways. We can't really stop it.

Hang in there!!!

 

[InsaneCdn]

To me, he seems way too social to be an Aspie. I don't know any Aspies who have girlfriends except for the ones that are so high functioning that they can actually do college and work and pretty much figure life out

Well... I have met some that do have girlfriends and are not extremely high functioning... as in, got their grade 12 and are working, not college material. Teen aspies sometimes get attached to other aspies... or are "used" by "normal" kids for their own ends, not necessarily a "true" or healthy relationship.

 

[HeadlightsMom]

TerryJ2 -- Wow. First, let me say that I'm sending all the good vibes I can for positive outcomes for everyone. I don't presume to know what that will mean for your situation Really........sending all the best your way!

Second, our son got his ex-girlfriend pregnant (although they'd just broken up days earlier, so she was barely an "ex"). They got back together and, well, that was a disaster and short-lived. Our son was 20 and his girlfriend was 21 -- both adults.

Third, we got lucky -- we absolutely adored his ex from the get-go. She gave birth to that little boy........who is now our 4-yo grandson and a gift beyond compare in our lives. Ironically, we've grown much closer to our son's ex and to all of her family. Your situation is different in ways -- especially in that they are so young -- minors. Such a tough start for a baby in this world.

Fourth, while I'm glad our son's ex kept their baby, I am also an advocate of adoption -- as I, myself, am an adoptee. It is clear to me that adoption was the better road for me and, often, the better option for many babies.

What a maelstrom of a time trying to sort through. TerryJ2, my thoughts are with you all.........sending those vibes for most positive outcome possible.....whatever that is for your family! Take care....

 

[TerryJ2]

Commenting on the Aspie idea, I recently saw this link, which was posted by some members of the CD board. THIS is definitely my son. http://www.autism.org.uk/about-auti...a-pathological-demand-avoidance-syndrome.aspx

It's still on the autism spectrum, but not totally Asperger's.
I've often said that I don't care what it's called as long as he gets a 504 and other svcs.
(And yes, there is bipolar involved. That's the other side of the family.)

In regard to friends, he had very few over the yrs, and then usually burned them by stealing from them or somehow damaging the relationship.
Sometimes, he would just leave someone's house and not tell them that he was leaving.
Most of his friends are also Aspies. They talk about it. They do not have good eye contact. They do not greet people with "Hello" or "Goodbye" or "Thank you" unless specifically asked to. These friends come and go.

Also, difficult child had other issues, Sensory Integration Disorder (SID), for example, with bowel movements and urinary issues, (and used to fill Coke cans with urine and line them up in the middle of the night), as well as an iron deficiency. When we went gluten-free, it resolved. Autism is very gut-related.

In addition, I've met his bmom and bgrandma. The Grandma is stereotypical female Aspie. Extremely bossy. Loud. Socially clueless. For example, she walked into an event sponsored by the adoption agency we used, and tracked in dog poop. We pointed it out and she continued to walk all over. When we again pointed it out to her, she shrugged her shoulders. There were free items for babies (difficult child's bmom had a baby who is one yr older than difficult child). Moms could take a few items. Bgrandma grabbed 4 bagfuls and dragged them out to her car. People just stared at her in shock. She left and never said thank you to the woman who hosted the event--in her own home.

When difficult child was a yr old, he was fascinated with-my vacuum cleaner. Desperately wanted to vacuum, but it was way too big for him. For Christmas, my mom bought him a kid's vacuum (no plug, of course). She joked about child labor laws. I repeated the story, talking about the fascination, the gift, and the joke, to the bgrandma, and she had a fit.
"Child labor? CPS? How much vacuuming is he doing? Why are you doing this to him?"

Very literal.
Any more questions?

 

[BusynMember]

Hmmmmmmm. Well, he sounds like he has traits and could have it. Who knows? As for the gut-related, that isn't proven and is just a theory. We've been in a parent group for ASDers since Sonic was little. About half the parents had their kids on special diets. Half did not. Sonic was higher functioning than most of the kids there, including those diagnosed with Aspergers as far as he did not act inappropriately. Every month we had a "social" gathering with the ASDers at a pool. We used to laugh at the word "social." Sonic didn't socialize...none of them did, except with their siblings...but he didn't scream anything out loud like some or yell inappropriate stuff at the lifeguards. A few were sprouting some very sexual stuff to the ladies and their parents were trying to stop them. Some were adults. Some were little. It was a very interesting "social group" since none of them socialized. At any rate, not convinced any diets really help...a lot of the kids who were on diets were really symptomatic. They are learning as they go, I guess.

At any rate, by the time they are eighteen, it doesn't really matter what their diagnosis is because we can't force them to stay in therapy, take medication, do the stuff we could make them do when they were younger. My concern is that you think you can control these kids and the pregnancy and even afterward and unless they let you do that, you can't. Also, you will find you have little to no control about who they choose to hang out with. I still think ever giving him the car is a very bad idea and have no understanding why you would want him behind the wheel.

But you know him better than the rest of us. I hope I am wrong and the car does not cause him additional problems. But it sure was a factor with Princess. Everything got way worse once she got her driver's license and we finally decided not to be a part of that wild ride (pun intended) so we took and hid the keys. We didn't want to be liable for anything that happened in our vehicle. Kids who are immature and irresponsible, like ours, are not the ones who look for a designated driver when they are wasted. They are the ones who get DWIs, have accidents, and go places that are dangerous when they have the wheels to transport them there. And Princess did all of those things. I hope your son is smarter than she was about that and I want you to have the heads up that we didn't have before she almost blew our car's engine up two state's away when she decided impulsively, and with a van full of kids, to go on a road trip. Yeah, we got a phone call at midnight from Minnesota. "Um, I almost drove off the road. The car is on fire!!! But...we're all right!"

I almost said, "You won't be when we see you again."

The van never worked again. Too badly damaged. The posse from our van were stranded in Minnesota. overnight at some guy's house that we never met. And Princess never touched our vehicle again. Do take this warning seriously.

 

[Jabberwockey]

Everything got way worse once she got her driver's license and we finally decided not to be a part of that wild ride (pun intended) so we took and hid the keys.

Thinking back on it, that should have been a warning sign for us as well. Our son didn't get his license until he was 17 but not long after that was when he went from spiraling out of control to plummeting. The more of these posts I read, the more I'm convinced that our son is a higher functioning Aspie. Need to read up on that some though.

 

[pasajes4]

I have to agree with MWM. It does appear that the car has been front and center in some of his more troubling behaviors.