Summer Vacation is killing ME!

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by lesleyneile, Jun 24, 2008.

  1. lesleyneile

    lesleyneile New Member

    :confused: Hi everyone!

    I need some help! My 8 year old daughter has always been a very difficult child to manage. I have read SO many parenting books and most recently tried incorporating Love and Logic into my daily regimen. I am hoping if I list some of her behaviors, etc ......someone can help me and lead me in the right direction with medical help! Thank you in advance!

    Never takes a "no" as NO!
    Constantly argues with-mom and dad
    Doesn't seem to understand her actions
    Appears as if she is not listening
    Likes to annoy others.....smiles!
    Needs constant attention/activity
    Bullies younger sibling
    Never admits to mistakes/bad behavior ~ blames others!
    Hates to lose
    Not interested in anything examples...summer camp, sports,etc...
    Has headaches often
    Obsessed with- Fairness
    When told "no" she will often say " I am doing it anyway" and slam a door/cupboard, etc.
    Throws items when mad
    Tells me she hates me, an idiot, a brat
    Often refers to herself as a stupid idiot
    Steals items from school
    Controls friends.....never open to their ideas
    Always bored........eats a lot!!! Like all day!

    Not sure if this is ODD???? Maybe???

    Please help!
  2. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Welcome-glad you found us-this is a very supportive group! This sounds very similar to my difficult child in some ways. II know you have read a lot of books-one that has been helpful to many of us is The Explosive Child by Ross Greene.

    What do the doctors say? Has she been evaluated by a neuro-psychologist or seen a child psychiatrist? Sorry to start off with so many questions.

    The title of your post got me-I remember hating summer vacation a few years because of my difficult child (gift from God-the child that brings you here) and I'm a teacher!

    You are no longer alone-we are here for you!
  3. Andy

    Andy Active Member

    Good Morning - I am not as knowledgeable about the medical world as others are but I wanted to touch on the headaches.

    I would suggest having a pediatrician neurologist check these out. We are working with a pediatrician neurologist to differentiate between migranes and seizures. My difficult child was prescribed Gaterade and Vitamin B-2 to prevent migranes. We have found that when he gets dehydrated, he gets headaches. He will dehydrate before he feels thirsty so he needs to drink gaterade and water often (was allowed to carry throughout the school day). For my difficult child, we are pretty certain he has a migrane variant. He is coming off a seizure controlling medication and has not had any migranes/auras so I am feeling better that they are migranes and not seizures. We will still keep watching this though.

    I just read the book, "The Manipulative Child". My kids have a lot of the behaviours you have listed regarding not obeying. I learned that with some children, the less explanation you give the better. During the moment, focus of the issue at hand, don't explain why you want her to pick up her clothes, just repeat that she needs to do so. These kids (mine included) will use explanations as ammunition to change the subject. For example, "clean up your room so it will look nice". Our kids will reply, "But no one is coming over so it doesn't need to look nice." Explanations are important so you can give it after the action is done. Once they get you to change the subject, they have gotten your attention away from what you really wanted. So, with my kids, I have started to pay attention to how they "argue". I am working on keeping a calm voice and everytime they bring up a different subject (and they are experts at diversion), I will calmly but firmly repeat what I want, "You will clean up your room now!" "But mom, I want to watch Sponge Bob 1st." "You will clean up your room now!" "I am really hungry, can't I wait until after lunch?" "You will clean up your room now!"

    Others will give more info on the medical side.
  4. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I would take him to a neuropsychologist. ODD rarely stands by itself and is usually behavior due to another disorder. Sounds like possibly something neurological or psychiatric or both are going on beyond the scope of just ODD. NeuroPsychs do very intensive evaluations--hours and hours--they tend to catch things that others miss. I have a few questions:
    1/Any psychiatric or neurological problems on either side of the family tree? Substance abuse?
    2/How was early development--speech, imaginative play, eye contact, peer interaction, any strange play with toys or quirky habits? Obsessions? Does he transition well? Any sensory issues--sound, touch, avoiding certain foods? Did he like to cuddle as an infant?'
    3/How is she doing in school both academically and socially? Does she have social skills? Life skills? Does she seem smart in some ways and clueless in other ways?
  5. LittleDudesMom

    LittleDudesMom Well-Known Member Staff Member


    I would like to add my welcome to the others this morning. As you can see, we usually have a lot of questions for newbies!!!

    One thing that would help, please take a molment to do a profile sig like you see at the bottom of our posts. If you include information like your daughter's health history, any diagnosis she may have, medications, family history of mental issues, etc., it will give us a little more look into what may be happening and we could offer you a little more suggestions.

    I'm not sure whether your screen name is your full name (first and last), first and middle name, or just a made up name; but if by any chance that is your actual name, you may want to change it. This site is read internationally and protecting your identity is important.

    Lesley, glad you have joined us. You have found a place of great support and some very enlightened members!

  6. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Welcome. We can't diagnose here - only a health professional can do that, and even then, they need the child available to examine. However, we can help with suggestions on how to cope.

    "The Explosive Child" is a darn good book. I'll have to read "The Manipulative Child" before I criticise, but the title has be concerned that assumptions could be being made and a child may not be actually deliberately manipulative, even when they seem to be.

    Often we a re critical of out children and ascribe motives that actually may not apply at all. People may say, "She is deliberately trying to annoy me," but this may not be the case. It may well be that her behaviour is very annoying and pushes all your buttons, but it is very easy for a difficult kid to do this unwittingly. Even a child being disobedient isn't necessarily choosing to do it BECAUSE it will annoy you, but often IN SPITE of knowing it will annoy you.

    An example I've given before - my sister's daughter as a toddler. We were at a family gathering, a backyard barbecue. This little mite was standing beside the garden bed, looking intently. She would bend down, pick up a clod of earth (high clay soil) and then drop it on the garden path. The clod of earth would smash and bits of dirt flew everywhere. She then would bend down, pick up another, and do it again. I was watching her, fascinated. The little girl was oblivious to anyone else.
    Her mother called her to come and have some lunch. The girl did not respond, but merely picked up another clod of earth and dropped it. The more repeated the call to come and have her lunch; the girl briefly responded, then continued picking up dirt and dropping it.
    I turned and said to her mother, "She's experimenting. And in her mind, what she is doing is more important than obeying you this instant."
    Her mother & I are very similar; she understood. However, she knew she would have to fetch her daughter and do it gently. Meanwhile another sister got very exasperated with me. "Don't be ridiculous! She heard, alright. She's just being disobedient; deliberately defiant. The Terrible Twos - they do this sort of thing just to try it on. And she's only a toddler - don't put things in her head that aren't there. Experimenting, indeed!" Very scoffing.

    As a general rule, kids want to be good. They want to please you. But when they get frustrated, or have a short fuse because the world for them is a confusing place, of they feel life isn't fair because rules are followed differently by different people in different situations, they get very angry and lash out.

    A lot of what you describe sounds very familiar to me. Your daughter could have a one of a number of possible conditions but it will take an expert (people here recommend a neuropsychologist) to assess and diagnose. Once you understand why she is like this, it will be easier to manage her.

    The apparent obsession with a"fairness" - is she very bright? If so, boredom is going to be a big problem, you will find you need to keep her mind busy to get best results.

    Kids always have a reason that makes sense to them. Finding out that reason can also make it easier to know how to handle them.

    Welcome, keep us posted on how you get on. Read Explosive Child, see if it feels familiar.

  7. lesleyneile

    lesleyneile New Member

    Thank you all very much!