Praise God

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by AmericanGirl, Nov 18, 2012.

  1. AmericanGirl

    AmericanGirl Guest

    I asked a minister who does a weekly service at the sober house to go see difficult child in jail. He did and passed along a message from me.

    difficult child called afterward. He asked how he got back to sober house the other night, etc. Obviously, he had blacked out. Told me he had been drinking for two weeks and had two bottles of vodka the night he left the sober house. I think him saying that is a good sign.

    I asked if he wanted to return to recovery. He said yes but his ego and pride wouldn't let him return to where he was. (Don't care because he isn't going back there.) I told him about the place where I got him preadmitted. I also said the insurance isn't done so I may not be able to do it. I have contacted a rehab near where he is and he can go there. My insurance will pay but - that is the last time.

    At one point, he stopped to say, "But I have to make some money." I don't know why he said that. Maybe because he was gaining some independence and then oops, he is back under my wing.

    difficult child asked if I was coming tomorrow. I said I was and I wanted him to stay where he was until I could get him into a rehab. He obviously doesn't want to do that. A friend suggested later that I might take him on a trip out of town until a find a rehab if the court won't keep him. Thoughts? I could get a room where he is and take him to meeting after meeting over Thanksgiving. He'd be away from triggers, people, etc. here and with people in recovery. Thoughts?

    I know he will want to drive but his car is here. Besides, I am not an idiot. I found out Friday his license has expired so that would be my reasoning plus his car isn't there. Make sense?

    (If you haven't figured out my brain is fried by is.)

    I will sleep better tonight after talking with him.

    Keep them prayers coming please!!
  2. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    I think taking him on a trip until you find a rehab will be very stressful on you....I have been in that situation with my difficult child and it is stressful. What will you do if he decides to go out at night (even if he walks), you wont be able to keep him inside if he doesnt want to be there. You know before he goes to rehab he may well want to go and have one last fling...

    I am very glad he called you and I think all that is good.... but he is still so recently been so manipulative that I think he will do what he can to manipulate you to get what he wants, and that will be surely true if you take him on a trip by yourself.

    Still it might be better than just having him home.

    Not an easy situation. I so feel for you.

  3. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I think you are hugely more invested in his recovery than he is. Why on earth would you take him on a trip when he just got himself kicked out of a sober house for drinking and he just got released from jail??? I know it looks different when you are going through the crisis, but this makes zero sense to me. There will be NO WAY to make him go to meetings all weekend. He would be vastly more likely to take your money/credit card/whatever and go party while you are asleep or in the shower or whatever.

    He is a legal adult. I know he is your child, and that you love him, but that is not a reason to go through with this trip plan. The biggest obstacle to his sobriety is not the people around him, his surroundings, meetings he does or doesn't attend or having you to mother hen over him for a long weekend. The biggest obstacle to his sobriety is between his ears and the excuses and manipulations that you buy into with him.

    I urge you to NOT invest in this rehab. Yes, it IS cold. Yes, it IS miserable to not have a home when it is cold. But miserable is part of realizing that you do NOT want to live like this and unless you are miserable you are NEVER going to dedicate yourself to recovery. I don't care if you shackle yourself to him with handcuffs or unbreakable metal chains. It still won't keep him sober. Save the insurance benefits for rehab until he has a few months of miserable homelessness/couch surfing under his belt. Let him truly fall and then when he shows you with his actions that he wants recovery, send him to rehab.

    This is HARD and UGLY and NO FUN. it is also pretty much the ONLY way he is going to get his life turned around. Until he is as invested in his life as you are, there sn't going to be anything you can do. This trip is, in my opinion, a bizarre reward for going to jail and getting kicked out of the sober house. Do you really, honestly want to reward those things???

    Admitting he has been drinking for two weeks is a good thing. Okay, I guess maybe it is. but that is NOT the same as wanting to be in recovery. There are programs where he can find FREE help. the whole "I am too proud to go back to the sober house I was kicked out of" is a giant neon sign that says "I want you to support me and I have zero zip zilch intention of being sober and/or clean!" When you are truly ready to get clean and sober you will crawl over glass shards and beg on your knees for help. Until he is ready to do that, to put pride aside, he does not want to be clean and sober. It is just a fact, a reality even though we don't like it.

    How many times have you told him that it is the last time you will pay for rehab/sober living/expenses?? What would make him believe that you truly mean that if he relapses he is on his own? I guarantee that taking him on a trip is not going to get that message across to him, regardless of how badly you want it to work. I am sorry, and I know this is incredibly painful, but it is also reality.

    Why not pull up all of your posts about his sub abuse issues and see how many times you have said that it is the last time, that if this doesn't work then he is on his own? You may be shocked at the number of times. Good shocked in that it was only once, or bad shocked because it was much more than one time. either way, stop and think about the things you have said about a 'last chance' or 'one more chance' and then think about whether it is time to spend more money on treatment that he is in no way committed to?? or to save the $$ so that when he does truly hit bottom you can still afford to provide help for him.

    One of the saddest experiences was listening to parents at alanon meetings as they remember how many times they enabled sub abuse by paying for a rehab or sober house that was the 'last time' and how now, a few years later, their children were actually at what really seemed like rock bottom and they were fighting and accomplishing sobriety but the parents couldn't help them because they blew all of their savings, retirement accounts, etc... on previous attempts. I can stll see the faces of two couples. One couple was in their sixties and instead of retiring they were now working 2 jobs because they blew everything on sub abuse and mental health help for their kids. They looked so worn down and tired, and they truly regretted buying into the early promises to get clean time and time again after being kicked out of various programs. They said that had they waited until their chldren were more invested in their own sobriety than the parents were, that rehab would have been more effective. Sadly, they didn't wait, they were way more invested and their kids used rehabs and sober houses to use and to not have a job.

    If and when your difficult child truly wants to be clean and sober, they will find a way even if you won't help them. They are so resourceful and manipulative that they find hundreds of dollars a week to spend on their sub abuse and they could use that money to fund recovery just as they can use it to fund sub abuse. You refusing to pay for a sober house or rehab will not keep them out of recovery, regardless of what anyone tells you. You will know that they truly are ready for a clean and sober life because they will be taking steps on their own to find it, not waiting for you to drag them to meeting after meeting over a long weekend and then to put them in rehab the way you put them in school when they were little.
  4. AmericanGirl

    AmericanGirl Guest


    Thank you for your honesty.

    I am not planning a trip. I am thinking of a cheap ($45 a night) hotel near where a lot of 12 step meetings are located.

    It beats bringing him back here to wait for a bed.

    I truly don't know what to do. If he asks for rehab, and they release him, I cannot leave him on the street at that point and drive 90 miles home.

    He has been to rehab once. The insurance paid all but $1100 and some co-pays. I did pay for temp housing while he was in PHP and IOP. I did pay for the sober house for most of his stay there ($140-145 a week).

    He's relapsed once. There was about $125 one time charge for extra monitoring at the sober house. That's all I've invested.

    I'll be the first one to say he has been rude and hateful to me on numerous occasions. He is guilty of verbal abuse.

    This trip to rehab would again be covered by insurance. I do not know what the co-pay would be. I can tell you one thing for certain. I will not endanger my financial stability because of his addiction. There is ZERO chance of that.

    In fact, I plan to sell his car in the spring when prices are higher (as my former dealership owning friend advised) and use those funds to repay myself for what I have spent.

    The professionals have told me over and over that at his age, relapse is almost 100% certain.

    He is crafty and sly but the chances of him finding a rehab in area where hardly any services exist is close to zero.
  5. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    OK here is my take on paying for rehabs etc etc. Susie you are right in many respects.... but I know part of my own moving to a different place was knowing I had done everything I could to help my son. That got me clear of my own feelings of guilt...and to be honest if my son gets to a place where he really wants help and asks me for it I would probably help him again.

    I am not sure if before this I could have let my son be homeless travelling the country in the cold doing who knows what, and been at peace about it.... because as a parent if something happens Occupational Therapist (OT) your kid and you did not do all that you could it would be such a horrible feeling. So MY feeling of peace right now is because I did do all I could and I did help him in rehab all those times.... yes maybe it enabled him but in the end it also helped give me peace of mind.

    So AG I support you helping him get into rehab again... hopefully he really will want it and it really will work. Recognize that it might not but do this for you and your peace of mind.

    And yes being in a cheap hotel near 12 step meetings may be better than him being at home.....however I think it is likely to be a really hard trip for you.

  6. pasajes4

    pasajes4 Well-Known Member

    I think if it helps YOU to jump through hoops then do it. If on the other hand helping him causes you enormous hardship, resentment, or is a threat to your peace,think really hard before you make a decision.
  7. Calamity Jane

    Calamity Jane Well-Known Member

    You're smart, and you know when/if you're being played. I just want to wish you luck with whatever you choose, and I hope and pray difficult child commits to recovery and sobriety for his own sake. Safe travels.
  8. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    AG whatever you do we will all support you, you know that. This community knows the chaos we all live with and the awful decisions we are forced to make. Susie has many good points. I got one of those responses from her at one point and after I picked myself up off the floor and started breathing again I got it. She is like our conscience, in hindsight we know what to do but we are afraid to do it.

    I am very very torn here. On one hand I completely get that you want to do everything you can to help him get into treatment. On the other hand if he wants treatment he should be doing the work. It does not sound like he is serious about treatment or he would go back to the original place and either make it work or wait for a bed elsewhere.

    Can you ask the prosecutor or judge to keep him in jail until a bed is available? If you don't bail him out they won't release him will they? If you explain that he was in treatment and relapsed and that is the cause of his current trouble I would be surprised if they didn't work with you. Keeping him hidden away in a cheap hotel is not going to keep him from drinking. And if he does drink so what? It's not the end of the world. My difficult child went our the night before going into treatment for one last fling. While husband and I were mortified and very angry the treatment center was use to that.

    What are the consequences of bringing him home for a few days until a bed opens? If he runs he runs. Then you will have your answer. He will be choosing homelessness. What if you pay for a hotel room for him for a few days and leave him there? Then he is truly making the decision himself whether to go to treatment.

    In the end this has to be his journey and I'm just afraid that you are more invested in this than he is. I certainly was with my difficult child. She wanted to get sober for me and that is not a good reason and that is why she is relapsed now.

    We are all behind you no matter what you do and don't be afraid to say what you are thinking, we may not always tell you what you want to hear but we all want the same result.
  9. AmericanGirl

    AmericanGirl Guest

    Nancy, I already have a letter to the DA asking him to recommend difficult child be held until I can get a bed.

    I realize he isn't likely at bottom. Going to take him a letter at jail prior to court telling him this is it. I walked away from my own mother years ago bc of her alcoholism and I will due the same with him if he chooses to screw me over. His life, his choice but I'm not giving mine up for him.

    Thank you all for caring enough to tell me exactly what you think.
  10. PatriotsGirl

    PatriotsGirl Guest

    I was told relapses are a part of recovery if they use it to move forward in their sobriety. I was also told that honestly is HUGE. I totally understand where you are at. If there is a glimmer of hope that they will get back into treatment, you are willing to do whatever it takes to get them there. I would say to do what makes YOU feel better. (((HUGS)))
  11. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    Are you physically fit? Not trying to be funny. I took difficult child#1 out of State to spend a long weekend at easy child's house in Ga. Around eleven I "knew" that difficult child was not settling in for the night. When he said "I'm going to stay up and watch movies for awhile, Mama." Hmm...I got my coat, keys, and wallet ready. Sure enough about thirty minutes later I heard him head for the door. About a New York minute later I was out the door behind him. I don't know how far we walked with him a half block in front of me the whole way. He had spotted an all night liquor store two days before when we arrived.

    Long story short. As he stood looking at the liquor store (and making sure I was still alive, lol) I spotted a pizza joint. I hollered out "Why don't we get a pizza?" He hollered "I do NOT want a pizza." I hollered "Maybe it will make us both feel better?" We ate the pizza and drank soft drinks. We walked back to easy child's side by side.

    I "think" I "saved him" for one more night. I KNOW I did not inspire him to join AA. That story is part of his "Legends of my Mama" series. I have always done what I thought I had to do at the time. Think thru your options and possible results. Be true to yourself AND don't put yourself in danger tailing him in the wee hours. I understand.
    Hugs DDD
  12. AmericanGirl

    AmericanGirl Guest

    DDD, good thing I just lost about 45 pounds, huh? difficult child was a cross country runner.

    Talked to court clerk. difficult child's court date is his hearing, not bail. She thinks he is likely to get his fines and be released.
  13. Signorina

    Signorina Guest

    AG- I don't have any advice. The only advice I can give you is the same one thing that I tell myself - DO WHAT YOU WHAT FEELS RIGHT, and screw the rest. Sometimes you need to come to this board or talk to a professional or sleep on it to figure out what feels right. So I totally applaud that you are seeking opinions. That is exactly what I like to do because sometimes it lights up a better path.

    But in the end, CHOOSE YOU and that means do what you feel is best, no recriminations and then stop second guessing yourself. So in the end - if it enables him more - so what? If you make him sleep in the cold? So What? If he comes to your house and it doesn't work out? Live and Learn. You tried your best; this is not your fault and you can't fix him. And you do NOT NEED TO FIX YOURSELF. You need to live with yourself. This is you CHILD. Not a sibling, not a spouse, not a friend. As moms, we have a maternal obligation and a parental instinct to help our children survive. Sometimes that obligation involves THROWING them out of the nest. Sometimes, that obligation involves welcoming them back into the nest, wrapped in cotton batting and feeding them off our own plates even when they completely don't deserve it and they hate us for it.

    Yes, we often lose sight of the trees in the forest. I come here for reality checks when I need to. That is part of my maternal obligation and my mother's intuition. And I have often been gently OR firmly pointed in the right direction - and that's usually because the right direction is so blatantly apparent to everyone BUT me. And that's why I love it here.

    But I also love it here because we all bring different life experiences to our posts, I like the advice of people who have taken those various paths. None of which have ever been perfect. The one thing we ALL share in common is that we are careful and dedicated mothers who want what's best for our kids. If we weren't, we would be content to do this blindly and without second guessing ourselves.

    So do what feels right and then don't agonize over it. Trust yourself. I trust you to make the right decision for YOU and for him.


    And on an aside note...when you said he stopped to say, "But I have to make some money." I don't know why he said that. Maybe because he was gaining some independence and then oops, he is back under my wing"

    . initial thought is he OWES someone some money. Just a hunch.
  14. AmericanGirl

    AmericanGirl Guest

    Sig, I needed this tonight so very badly. Thank you!