Somebody please tell me

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by klmno, Apr 9, 2010.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    that my son told the truth about the nights out all night (well, enough of the truth that I could put 2 and 2 together) and the drugs and so forth, and that this whole thing really hasn't been a charade to cover a blooming situation of having sex with an 18yo confused young girl/lady in our neighborhood, that he spent an hour this evening telling me how she'd confided in him since his release that she was raped while he was in Department of Juvenile Justice and just now (at 11:20 pm) tried to call him because he texted her a few days ago and said this was his new phone number. He is supposedly in bed- he knows I'm staying up late to "guard" things and make sure he doesn't sneak out. His friend gave him a condom about a week after he was released. I think I'll ask to see that again tomorrow since he mentioned it again today.

    But then honestly- which situation really would be worse? He has done this kind of stupid cover-up before and keeps swearing that he thinks this drug test will come back negative. I doubt it- if he told the truth about all he did. Just answered my own question- the worst scenario would be doing both drugs and sex- without a condom.
  2. crazymama30

    crazymama30 Active Member

    K, I would not want him having sex with anyone, let alone an 18 yr old, but I sure would not want him having unprotected sex. I may get shot down for this, but if you think he would have unprotected sex, what about getting him a box of condoms and putting them somewhere where he will have access to them?
  3. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Well, he's 15yo now and just got released from state Department of Juvenile Justice custody on parole- he was incarcerated about 2 weeks after turning 14yo. So before he went in, I would not give him condoms at that age. Shortly before he got released I started talking to him about being able to date once his parole officer lets him off house arrest and loosens up on a curfew enough. I'd talked to him previously about morals but understanding all people can't/won't wait so the main thing is to be safe, however, since he has waited this long and not been careless in this area, I'd hope he would date a girl first and get to know her and make sure they care about each other, etc, then I would get him condoms to make sure they protected themselves and prevent an unplanned pregnancy. I sped it up a little about the time he was discharged and told him I would make sure he knew the appropriate way to put on a condom- by using something else of course. Anyway, it's not providing condoms that I'm so worried about- but my son has a bigger problem with telling too much than with keeping a lie for a long time, so maybe I can get what's going on soon. I am sure that he understands the importance of not having unprotected sex. It's just a matter of him revealing what is going on- even when I gave him the talk about dating a girl for a while and so forth I told him that under any circumstances, if he's in high school and she's in his age range so it's not illegal, just come to me to talk about it- I'd rather get them for him than end up in a very sad situation. I think he will. I'm not so sure though that an 18 yo is appropriate- honestly I don't. But she is a neighbor and they've confided in each other for about 3 years (minus time locked up) so I am not sure that's what's going on- maybe they are just friends but difficult child has fantasies- I don't know- she has some issues of her own- a broken home life, she's obese, if she was raped that's a biggie...

    I'm keeping a close eye on things the next couple of days and I will try to determine more. He's only been out 16 days I tthink so his mind is still teetering between a lot of things. I don't want him having unprotected sex either- I'm just hoping he'll wait but I'm ok with him carrying a condom around just in case.
  4. crazymama30

    crazymama30 Active Member

    I was under the impression that you were worried about him sneaking out to have sex. It sounds like it is that and drugs.

    He is sure digging himself a hole, isn't he?
  5. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    He's teetering a lot. That's understandable I guess- actually I am being told by PO that this is typical for boys coming out of Department of Juvenile Justice. Apparently, difficult child used to sneak out sometimes and talk to this girl- she lives across the street- a couple of years ago while she was still in high school. I knew she talked with difficult child then but I didn't know they were sneaking out and talking. I do believe that at that point, it was platonic friendship- for several reasons. But now, I'm not so sure that it isn't developing into something more. I had hoped, as difficult child portrays, that she's more of a mentor or advisor because she's a few years older than him and she does have her own life already in a sense.

    I'm definitely worried about his drug interest at this point. But there is only so much I can do- IOW, I can try to address it but I know I can't make that decision for him. The more I remind myself of that the more it keeps responsibility on his shoulders and the mopre effective all this Department of Juvenile Justice stuff is- really- I can tell a difference in difficult child when he knows it's his butt on the line, not mine.
  6. skeeter

    skeeter New Member

    klmno - please don't take this the wrong way, but I'm confused.

    Your son is on house arrest, corect?

    Instead of worrying about why he's sneaking out (drugs or sex) shouldn't the worry be that he IS sneaking out? Instead of worrying about why he stayed out all night, shouldn't the worry be that he DID?

    Instead of validating his behavior and breaking of rules, shouldn't the worry be that he broke the rules?

    I also am confused at not letting his PO know of every single instance of his non-compliance. But I will readily admit I've not been in your shoes with my kids.
  7. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I'm really hoping that what you are thinking might be isn't! I'm sorry you are having to stay up so late because he might sneak out. Hugs.
  8. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    Kids who are dysfunctional are always attreacted to other kids who are dysfunctional. I fought it for years with no avail. I understand your concerns and sympathize. Having "a special friend" who is not going to be judgemental (and often has even more severe problems) makes difficult child's feel "normal" and sometimes allows them to think that they are doing a wonderful thing by befriending someone who is alone. in my humble opinion you could put three hundred kids in a gym who were strangers and within an hour difficult children would be paired up with difficult children. Sorry you have that element to worry about also. DDD
  9. helpme

    helpme New Member

    It is illegal in some states for an 18 y o to have sex with a 15 y o.
    Also, if pregnancy occurs, all hell breaks loose for both parties.
    The 18 y o gets charged because the baby will most likely qualify
    for public assistance and thereby the charges come from the state.
    You would end up with the burden of child support for your 15 y o
    and you would need to represent your son in all issues involving
    the baby, unless your son became a ward of the state, emancipated,
    incarcerated, or married.

    I know of people who are registered sex offenders for doing so.
    His PO should be notified of this. Alleviate the responsibility, the
    sleuthing, the guilt, and let the PO know.
  10. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    DDD- I think you are right about that- I think it goes alnog with the temptation for sunstance abuse and the whole 9 yards.

    skeeter- PO does know about difficult child's violations. (There have been several preevious posts about this- it would have been hard for someone to keep up with them all so maybe you didn't see catch all that transpired last week??) He hasn't violated since last weekend (not that a week is a long time) but PO and I talked Mon and Tues to discuss these things and then I took difficult child in on Wed and he was violated. So when difficult child started talking about this girl yesterday my mind automatically went to "OMG, I hope there isn't more to this story". But no, he has not snuck out again- and I do want to be sure about that and that is why I'm staying up late at nights.

    If difficult child stays compliant until the middle of next week, PO has said he will probably take him off house arrest and give him a 6:00 curfew. Then we will watch and see how he handles that little bit of freedom- does he use the time for drugs, sex, or planning to sneak out in the middle of the night or does he use the time to socialize and use the word "no" to his friends when these opportunities come up.

    I am worried that he continues to break rules. I just don't want to have to worry about becoming a grandmother right now on top of all the other worries. And we are trying to guide difficult child (as much as his defiant butt will allow) not to a "all or nothing" situation, but more by telling him if he handles a small amount of freedom appropriately, hee will get more. As he works his way thru that process, (if he does), he will be allowed to start dating girls his age, appropriately, and do more typical teen things. It's not that he violated yesterday- he didn't- he was opening up and talking to me which is good however the way he was talking was more like the way he'd talk to guys he was in Department of Juvenile Justice with. I guess it's undersstandable given that he spent so much time with no alternative but to hear him last night, it sounded like he wouldn't make it 1 month without violating again. Right now, the question is "is he teetering between right and wrong" or "is he still plowing down the wrong path and anything that sounds like a good choice is manipulation and justification". Actions speak louder than words- that's all we have to go by.
  11. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    helpme- you snuck in while I was posting. If it starts looking to me more that they have had sex, you can bet I'll be letting other people (including PO) know about it. And yes, I have an issue about her being 18 and doing this. I think I'll be able to determine better after a couple of more conversations- just like about the drugs, I usually have a pretty good feeling what has happened before difficult child finally spills the beans. They did use to talk a lot a couple of years ago and I know nothing was going on then so it really might be that she's just chatting with difficult child to try to advise him better than his 15yo male friends- some things he's relayed indicate that could be it. And, I am remionding myself that 11:20 on a Fri night is not that late for an 18yo. I'm just not sure yet- I can see a strong possibility though that difficult child might be fantasizing about something developing and it might be the furthest thing from her mind. She does have her own set of age-appropriate friends to hang out with.
  12. LittleDudesMom

    LittleDudesMom Well-Known Member Staff Member

    The only thing I wonder about is his insistence that he will test positive for drugs (you have said that he mentions this often). What is to prevent him from daily usage if he thinks he will ultimately test positive and he continues to tell you that? Is he preparing you for what he knows the outcome will be or what he is afraid the outcome will be? Big difference.

  13. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    You confused me on that one, LDM. He thinks this test will come back negative but he has a little worry about it. He has already admitted to me and discussed with his mentor that he did do drugs last weekend- and PO already does know this. And PO and I discussed what they do if they think a kid is trying to beat a test- I won't go into those details here in case any sneaky teens lurk. LOL! I'm not too worried about some continuous drug usage developing and not being detected while on parole- it will be- maybe every time won't get detected if he starts down that road, but I think we'll know before the arraignment. Now prevention- I am currently weighing how much I can do or make him do, etc to aid in keeping him off drugs like most parents of teens want to do but as we all know, there is only so much we can do if the kid is determined.
  14. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Sadly I know lots of situations where the girl was 18 or so and slept with a boy your sons age. Keyana's mom was 19 when she slept with a 14 year old and had her first child. I think he turned 15 right before the baby was born. He never had much to do with Cameron and I am not completely sure about the whole child support situation but I dont think he had to pay until he was 17 or so and got a job. She is also older than Cory but at least he was over 18. Actually, thinking back...she met him when he was 18 and about to turn

    I wouldnt be surprised if it was both sex and drugs. The call for both those things is very strong at that age to do those things to fit in with some crowd. It was for me. The popular "good" crowd didnt want me, the jocks didnt want me, I wasnt a cheerleader, I was smart but didnt fit in with the geeks, so the stoners was where I fell in. They accepted all the misfits with open arms.
  15. LittleDudesMom

    LittleDudesMom Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Sorry for the confusion. What I was saying is kinda like the line from Shakespeare, "Me thinks the lady doth protest too much!" In other words, are his words "I know my drug test will come out positive" driven by his desire to prepare you for what he knows is coming or honest worry on his part.

    Anyway, one of easy child's friends in high school had an older sister who had gotten in trouble with pot use. Her mother purchased a case of peepee drug tests (not sure if that words will make the sensor, but you get the idea - do your business in the cup) and if her mother even suspected she was smoking, she told her to hit the bathroom! The daughter never knew when it was coming and teens are just lazy enough to not prepare for a drug test all the time!!

  16. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    At this point, difficult child now knows that PO already knows he did the drugs and difficult child told me himself he did so it's just a question of whether or not the test will come back positive. That is probably a question in difficult child's mind because, as he admitted to mentor and me, he tried to flush his system and he's probably interested in finding out if it works or not. The discussion between PO and me about what to do about it is covered in my thread about substance abuse on the WC so I won't write all that out again here.

    I just talked with difficult child a little about the sex question- I feel better now- I'm convinced nothing has actually happened yet with anyone. Also, he said since I had confiscated his cell right before the meeting with PO, he had texted all his friends before giving me the phone and told them our home number and said he would get back with them to let them know if he'd been allowed to come home. I hadn't thought about the fact that his friends are probably assuming or interested in finding out if he was put in detention Wed. Why is she calling late at night? because she has a life and goes out with her friends and just chats with me sometimes after she comes home. He still has the condom. We'll have a couple of more conversations about the inappropriateness of an 18yo and 15yo being "good friends" if this doesn't fade away after a couple of days. Since she's a neighbor and they did chat before, I can see that people would want to talk to him after his release- I hadn't even told anyone where he was or what had happened. So, "acquaintances" I have no problem with- "good friends" or more, I'll discourage that as much as possible at this age.

    Oh- I had thought she was out of high school because she's 18 but difficult child says she just turned 18 and is a senior this year. Apparently she's been giving him the scoop on high school life and she told him to be careful what friends he chose because she had thought some "cool" people were her friends but it turned into a bad story. He told me that last part last night but it didn't start to add up until I put it with a couple of things he told me this morning.
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2010
  17. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I hope you can get a decent night's sleep sometime soon with-o worrying about what difficult child will do. He sounds so impulsive! Sex at his age is just so scary to think of, as a parent. Esp if he is not using protection!! How do you feel about providing some condoms for him?

    I am sorry you are kind of in limbo waiting to see what he will do, what he has done, and what the PO will do or have to do.

  18. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Oh- I'm not up all night. I'm just staying up later than I was before spring break, then we're both sleeping later so that part isn't too bad. And difficult child is carrying a condom- and it hasn't been used yet- LOL- what I'm trying to say is that I checked and he still has it, so obviously it hasn't been used. Sheww...I think I got that out correctly! My concern was that since I know he did drugs, he might have had sex that night. He hasn't had opportunity to do anything since last weekend. If he has a condom, I think he would use it. If he ends up having sex, I will provide him more just to stay on the safe side- I'm just still hoping I can prolong that a little longer until his head is on a little straighter and it's someone he's been dating and they care at least some about each other. But when the girl called, I guess my mind immediately wondered if he'd had sex the first and second nights he was out- and he only had one condom- I don't know- when he flies thru A, B, and C so fast, I guess I'm ready to jump to believe he did D and E, too.

    He's still saying that now that he only kept going with his violations last week because he really believed that the first one would automatically get him recommitted so he thought he might as well do whatever he wanted until he was locked up, but now that he knows it doesn't work that way and he has a good chance of not getting locked up if he does what he's supposed to now, he will try. All I can say is that it does appear that he has tried last week and so far thru this weekend. We do have some tense moments and difficult conversations- you know we are still working thru a lot of emotional baggage with each other and he has his own teetering thoughts to work thru and I have my parental worries as a result- not a normal life for either of us, but probably normal to be going thru these processes under the circumstances.

    What worried me so much when I started this thread was him talking about not seeing what would be wrong with him doing pot when he gets off parole because it's not addictive and he thought he could do it and not end up doing harder drugs. Oh yeah sure, son, that will be fine. NOT Well, let's just hope he makes it to a day of getting out of this system and off parole. And that by that time he's seen how stupid that approach would be.
  19. jannie

    jannie trying to survive....

    I am sorry that he is still pushing buttons so much. I am confused...What does house arrest mean? What is he allowed to do? school ? work? friends? Isn't there some type of computer/gps type chip that he is supposed to wear? I guess I thought someone on house arrest truly had to stay mostly in the hosue. I thought that the computer/gps chip was monitored by PO? It seems like he is still causing you serious stress--I would have hoped he'd be on his best behaviors for quite some time especially after being locked up.....sneaking out and having sex doesn't sound to good to me
  20. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    I'm almost 100% certain he didn't have sex now.

    House arrest for juveniles can mean three things here:

    1) The strictist is thru the detention center when a kid is allowed to return home after an arrest but is put on a certain program (not all allowed to return home are put on this program) and they put an ankle bracelet on/gps and it is monitored 24/7 by one of the guards at the detention center. Parents have to call a couple of days ahead of time to ask permission to take the kid anywhere- grocery shopping so they can stay supervised, the dr, etc. The kid is allowed/required to go to school but no social events or family time outside of the house. They also have people come by unexpectly about 3 times a week. Thru any of this- if the kid is not where he's supposed to be, someone is sent right away to pick him up and the permission to remain free before trial is revoked.

    2) The next is thru probation (not parole)- and the kid is put on an ankle bracelet with a monitor but it isn't watched 24/7. The kid goes to school and if the parent wants/needs to take the kid somewhere, they just call and leave a message with the probation officer that they are taking the kid wherever. The probation officer gets emails from someone (??)) if the kid has left the zone of the monitor and maybe where the gps was (not sure) but the probation officer can verify those times with the parent's message so they know the kid wasn't out in the middle of the night or whatever. It would be a violation of probation and handled however that person decided.

    3) The third, and least strict, can be either by a probation officer or parole officer. And it's just verbal. Sometimes they allow the parent to take the kid places; sometimes they don't. They always have let me take difficult child simply because I'm a single parent and with his age and charges over the past few years, we all feel more comfortable with him going places with me versus staying at home alone. And they go to school. On parole, it's up to the PO whether or not to violate the kid- obviously they can't let infractions go on too long or be major. But, if it's an official parole violation, it has to back to the judge, which means court.

    On probation, I don't think that's the case. But it might depend- probation is ordered for one of two situations- either it's the first or second offense for a kid who's never been sent to Department of Juvenile Justice and the judge orders probation for a year- if the kid does everything he's supposed to, when they go back to court at the end of the year, those charges are dropped. The other way- being put on probation is part of the punishment and can last until the kid is no longer a juvenile. The PO in that case "monitors" (keeps track of) the juvenile's progress and completion of any other court order the judge issued at sentencing plus the PO can order more if they want and can take the juvenile back to the judge if the kid isn't doing good enough. If the kid is arrested again while on probation, the judge gives a lot of weight to the PO's recommendations. difficult child had been on probation under the second scenario and reoffended, and then was sent to Department of Juvenile Justice.

    Parole is for kids who have been committed to Department of Juvenile Justice but have been released from Department of Juvenile Justice custody (a state juvenile prison), meaning the kid still "belongs" (for lack of better term) to Department of Juvenile Justice but is no longer incarcerated. On one hand, the parole officer is supposed to help get services to help transition the kid back to mainstream living, but on the other hand, the parole officer has to keep track of how well the kid is doing- are they adjusting, are they on the right track for continued progress, are they still re-offending, etc. The idea is to help the kid transition and prevent a re-incarceration- this appears to be more important to them when it's a juvenile because it looks pretty bad when the kid comes home worse than when he went in and it also looks bad if he they send him home because he was supposedly rehabilitated but he's not, and it looks bad when this is the punishment the state officials decided will help the kid but they really made his future worse. At least, this is the way it appears to me. They seem to care a whole lot more about difficult child doing well on parole than they did about him doing well while on probation. (If they cared more about getting better probation officers, they could prevent a lot of committals to Department of Juvenile Justice though.) And- there is a light at the end of the tunnel. difficult child could be off parole in 6-9 mos if he does well- it depends on the level of parole they are assigned and I don't remember the exact terms but difficult child's was in the middle.

    I'm sure that was a lot more info than you wanted to know. I wish I didn't know it.